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Posted: 12/23/2003 3:31:29 AM EDT
msnbc.msn.com/id/3775771/

I'm surprised they didn't start "screening" cargo a long time ago.  Like after the Lockerbe (sp) Scotland incident.  Time to stay off acft for a while.

Pre Edit Edit:  Sorry for the link.  C/P'ed the article, but it's too long and I don't have time for two posts.  
Link Posted: 12/23/2003 4:12:50 AM EDT
Excuse me while I whip this out [BS].

And climb up on my [soapbox]

Sorry but I have no faith whatsoever that [b]al-Qaida[/b], as a group are anything close to what those in the media and our government are saying they are. I don't believe the wimps could whoop their way outta a paper bag, much less be the BIG, BAD, BOOGY MEN that the media claims.

I suspect the Houston AR-15 crew could stomp the crap outta them in no time should they be willing to show themselves (not that we're all that bad, but we are well "armed") and am in NO WAY buying into the FEAR the talking heads are trying to dispense. They (our government) NEED someone for the sheeple in this country to be afraid of and they have chosen [b]al-Qaida[/b].

It might be nice if those "who created al-Qaida" in the first place, the [b]US government[/b] back when OBL was "our guy" and the Taliban were placed in power there in Afghanistan by the same, [b]US government[/b], admitted that fact. Instead they continue to use their own creation, in the form of [b]al-Qaida[/b] to frighten the sheeple.

Articles like this make me sick, it's pure propaganda, shoveled by our own US brand of PRAVDA, don't buy into it!

As to the Lockerbe incident, check who was on the plane and what they were carring for the real story behind this incident. You might be suprised what a little research will reveal.

rant mode off,
Mike
Link Posted: 12/23/2003 4:48:51 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/23/2003 4:50:23 AM EDT by raven]
If terrorists are having such a tough time getting on commercial flights, I wonder why they dont just BUY an old cargo jet, like an ancient 727 or something.  They only cost like $500,000 or so.  And you could load them with anything you want like chlorine /phosgene gas, ammonium nitrate, maybe just straight diesel fuel for a cheapo instant firestorm. Load 'em up in Canada, a very terrorist-friendly country, fly over the border and hit just about any city within 1500 miles of the take-off point.

That's what I would do.  If they loaded up one of those with ANFO, it'd be like a freaking daisy cutter. Imagine a daisy cutter going off in Times Square on New Years.  Or into the GOP convention at Madison Square Garden.
Link Posted: 12/23/2003 5:00:55 AM EDT
It doesn't matter. We will prevail in this war! They can knock down some buildings kill thousands, dont matter, we will find the leaders and kill them all. Another attack will only seal their fate that much more. I have faith in AMERICA and AMERICANS!

I does make me think of why people in other countries hate each other so much (IE: Israeli-Palestinian) When I see a certain race of people now, I hate them and suspect them. They (by color) are selling junk at the mall and I cant help but think, "Could be financing terrorists" and I dont even want to acknowledge them other than a mean look!


COZ

Link Posted: 12/23/2003 5:02:29 AM EDT
Originally Posted By raven:
If terrorists are having such a tough time getting on commercial flights, I wonder why they dont just BUY an old cargo jet, like an ancient 727 or something.  They only cost like $500,000 or so.  And you could load them with anything you want like chlorine /phosgene gas, ammonium nitrate, maybe just straight diesel fuel for a cheapo instant firestorm. Load 'em up in Canada, a very terrorist-friendly country, fly over the border and hit just about any city within 1500 miles of the take-off point.

That's what I would do.  If they loaded up one of those with ANFO, it'd be like a freaking daisy cutter. Imagine a daisy cutter going off in Times Square on New Years.  Or into the GOP convention at Madison Square Garden.
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My guess is that they would shoot down any plane they couldn't identify within minutes of crossing our border, before being a threat to any major populated area... but you bring up some good (scary) points.
Link Posted: 12/23/2003 5:08:21 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/23/2003 5:10:02 AM EDT by raven]
Originally Posted By dawg_killer:


My guess is that they would shoot down any plane they couldn't identify within minutes of crossing our border, before being a threat to any major populated area... but you bring up some good (scary) points.
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How hard s it to set up a business license?  Get registered with the FAA, do some phoney trial runs, file flight plans and schedules for your new cargo company?  Set a routine and scheduling that will eventually coincide with the State of the Union Address, or the Olympics, the Superbowl, or what have you.  Dont deviate from the flight plan until the last possible moment.  Targets around Washinton DC  mmight be heavily defended enough to respond with a few minutes warning, but cities like NYC wouldn't.

It would take about 3 years to organize, I think it took at least that long for al-Qaeda to organize 9/11.
Link Posted: 12/23/2003 5:09:09 AM EDT
I wonder how all those private airports are secured...I can picture them stealing some small planes and loading them up with poison and flying them into sports centers or what have you.   Crop-dusting Giants Stadium with some nerve agents.

Link Posted: 12/23/2003 5:42:38 AM EDT
Bring it on
Link Posted: 12/23/2003 2:14:37 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/23/2003 2:15:55 PM EDT by Backstop]
Originally Posted By mr_wilson:
They (our government) NEED someone for the sheeple in this country to be afraid of and they have chosen [b]al-Qaida[/b].

As to the Lockerbe incident, check who was on the plane and what they were carring for the real story behind this incident. You might be suprised what a little research will reveal.

rant mode off,
Mike
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The only reason I posted this was I was kind of shocked that they hadn't werent' screening cargo more closely.  Don't misunderstand me.  When I C/P'ed the article, I highlighted that same section.  

Are you saying our gov't is using AQ to further its own goals - perhaps the NWO?  Or, to what end do you think they are doing this?

Well I did a search and got way too much stuff.  If ya don't mind saving me some time, just exactly who was on that acft and what were they carrying? Or do you have a link?
Link Posted: 12/23/2003 2:48:44 PM EDT
Originally Posted By mr_wilson:
... Sorry but I have no faith whatsoever that [b]al-Qaida[/b], as a group are anything close to what those in the media and our government are saying they are. ...
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I suspect Al-Quida has killed a lot more of us than we have of them.

IMHO, lose respect for your enemy and he will kill you!
Link Posted: 12/23/2003 3:00:45 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/23/2003 3:25:13 PM EDT by warlord]
Originally Posted By dawg_killer:
Originally Posted By raven:
If terrorists are having such a tough time getting on commercial flights, I wonder why they dont just BUY an old cargo jet, like an ancient 727 or something.  They only cost like $500,000 or so.  And you could load them with anything you want like chlorine /phosgene gas, ammonium nitrate, maybe just straight diesel fuel for a cheapo instant firestorm. Load 'em up in Canada, a very terrorist-friendly country, fly over the border and hit just about any city within 1500 miles of the take-off point.

That's what I would do.  If they loaded up one of those with ANFO, it'd be like a freaking daisy cutter. Imagine a daisy cutter going off in Times Square on New Years.  Or into the GOP convention at Madison Square Garden.
View Quote


My guess is that they would shoot down any plane they couldn't identify within minutes of crossing our border, before being a threat to any major populated area... but you bring up some good (scary) points.
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What happens if those fvckers fly the plane so low that our radars can't see it until its too late. You know like one of those cruise missle's ground following radar techniques.
Link Posted: 12/23/2003 3:02:25 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/23/2003 3:03:15 PM EDT by 199]
…al-Qaida seems particularly interested in Tappahannock, Va., a tiny town of 2,016 people with no military base or major infrastructure….
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I’m trying to imagine the reaction of those folks upon reading this article!!! [:O]

I think there’s like one stoplight in the entire town!  
Link Posted: 12/23/2003 3:20:51 PM EDT
It's not that easy to buy a used commercial jet aircraft.

It's not that easy to get it FAA inspected and registered.

It's not that easy to get a commercial pilots liscense and to set up a company.

However.....

June 26, 2003
American Piloted Missing African 727

By Arturo Weiss
Newswriter

As the mystery of a missing African airliner lingers, more details of its disappearance, and a U.S. connection, are surfacing. The missing plane has been the subject of an international search since it vanished after departing Angola on May 25. The last known flight of the Boeing 727 was recorded shortly after it had been repossessed from Angola Air, which failed to make payments on the jet, according to the South African news service News24. A Florida family now claims a relative of theirs was the pilot hired to retrieve the aircraft. According to them, 51-year-old Ben Padilla had been contracted by a Miami-based firm to repossess the jet. They discount suggestions the aging airliner was stolen for criminal purposes. The family fears the jet crashed somewhere in the African continent. Stay tuned...

July 10, 2003
Missing Jet Found In New Colors

By Arturo Weiss
Newswriter

You may recall AVweb's recent coverage of a missing African airliner believed to be in the hands of criminals or terrorists. Well, the Boeing 727 has reportedly been located -- with a new paint job. The Guardian reports the jet turned up last week in Guinea after disappearing from Angola's main airport more than a month ago. The missing plane had been the subject of an international search since it vanished from Angola on May 25. The last known flight of the jet was recorded shortly after it had been repossessed from Angola Air. Bob Strother, a Canadian pilot, reported finding the aircraft, which had been re-sprayed and now sports the Guinean registration of 3XGOM. However, the last two letters of its former tail number, N844AA, were still showing. While the plane is said to be owned by a member of West Africa's Lebanese business community, Strother finds the registration change a bit too expeditious. "Whoever owns it must have some important friends to get it re-registered in two days: going by the book, the whole process usually takes a couple of months," he told the Guardian.
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Link Posted: 12/23/2003 3:25:03 PM EDT
al-Qaida operatives would hijack foreign airliners and fly them into targets in the United States.
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Don't most commercial aircraft only carry enough fuel to reach their anticipated destination (plus a little extra for reserves)? I was under the impression that overfueled tanks are regarded as adding needless extra weight, and thus are avoided whenever possible.

If so, many foreign flights would arrive here with very little fuel remaining in their tanks (thus making them much less effective as flying bombs).
Link Posted: 12/23/2003 3:34:27 PM EDT
Originally Posted By KA3B:
[snip] According to them, 51-year-old Ben [red]Padilla[/red] had been contracted by a Miami-based firm to repossess the jet.
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Padilla.  Padilla??  Wonder if he's any relation to the possible [url=http://www.whoisjohndoe2.com/]John Doe number 2[/url] and Al Qaeda operative [url=http://www.rotten.com/library/bio/crime/terrorists/jose-padilla/]Jose Padilla[/url].
Link Posted: 12/23/2003 4:10:28 PM EDT
Alot of babbling - sure hope this is a fraud.

[url]http://mensnewsdaily.com/archive/r/reynalds/03/reynalds122303.htm[/url]

Is al Qaeda Threatening a Nuclear Attack?

December 23, 2003

by Jeremy Reynalds

A letter to the Bush Administration containing a list of demands from an alleged representative of the Islamic Jihad Brigade Black Death Squad says failure to fulfil those orders will have deadly consequences.

The document reads in part (sic), "We will give you a prior few minutes notice before our blessed attack so that you will be able to watch your destruction with your own satellite, as we would be by then have passed the skies of the seventh sky to heaven and your nation to the fires of hell."

While this document, written by alleged al Qaeda operative Daleel Almojahid, appears to indicate some sort of nuclear attack, it does seem to mirror closely other terrorist information that is being broadly circulated. On Friday Reuters reported the White House said it had warned security personnel to be on the look out for terror attacks during the Christmas holiday season.

U.S. authorities said they were concerned by what they called the volume of terrorist threats at home and overseas.

"The Department of Homeland Security has sent out several bulletins...(to) security officials and law enforcement personnel, urging all to continue be on heightened state of alert especially as we enter the busy holiday season," Reuters reported Scott McClellan, President Bush's spokesman said.

Almojahid wrote that even though the Bush Administration knows well the demands being made by al Qaeda (sic), "We will put them down again so that the world will forgive us for what will happen soon due to your arrogance and childish acts of dictatorship and your love of being under the Jewish rule being slaved under them under all kinds of names."

Alleged al Qaeda demands made in the letter include a demand that the United States cease "invading" Islamic lands anywhere in the world and return all "stolen" Muslim money, "in gold not in any kind of money note."

Other demands read (sic), "The returning of the old borders known to you and we press on the northern borders, the release of all our prisoners in your jails whom you know and we know only. The dismantle of the so called (United Nations and its council) in an international decision."

Almojahid said his group understands the importance of water and oil and is willing for the current situation to stay as it is, with a qualifier. "The pricing of oil is left to us and we promise you to make it available at a reasonable price for poor and for rich nations."

Almojahid wrote that while the situation is critical it is not too late for the Bush Administration to change the course of impending disaster. However, if the Administration fails to give in to terrorist demands, then his group's apparently predetermined plans will go into effect.

He commented (sic), "We have given you the solution, so either you are with us or against us ... But we know that you are not with us but you will be forced to be (and we have warned). It is not in our morals to attack you with such a big attack without a warning. We won't do what you did to us times and times before ..."

Almojahid continued (sic), "And the outcome of the attack will be unbelievable and unexpected to you ... Any wrong move the administration takes in directing its policy will lead you to the (cave of darkness)."

Almojahid apologized to the American people and the European community for what he claimed will be an imminent attack, writing "The coming operation ... will ... destroy them forever, although we apologize from now to the human race from the hardship that will affect them as an aftermath to the attack. It is a less hardship for us than to see continents slaved, we apologize in advance to the American people and to the European communities but you have stood hand in hand with your governments and let the Jews take control of the rest of the world."

Almojahid appeared to imply that there are al Qaeda sympathizers scattered around America in strategic places. He wrote (sic) "We can tell you that we are people from you and with in you, planning with you and have knowledge of all your planes. We warn you that time is running fast so fast that it's getting harder to turn out the led fire in the wire."

Almojahid made an urgent plea for quick action by the Bush Administration, writing " It is insane avoiding reading the following words without having a clear, wise and fast decision. As soon as possible because time is a critical element in the coming attack and is more important than any time in human history. We can tell you that the wire has been led up and it's in its final stages and nothing will stop it but God and the wisdom of the Arab rules and the non Arab rules,

In an additional e-mail to this reporter he added, "It's time to start taking some back up to save your life. I send you this in respect to the words we have shared."

Jeremy Reynalds
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Link Posted: 12/23/2003 6:08:54 PM EDT
Originally Posted By KA3B:
It's not that easy to buy a used commercial jet aircraft.

It's not that easy to get it FAA inspected and registered.

It's not that easy to get a commercial pilots liscense and to set up a company.

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What do you mean by "Not that easy"?  Doesn't John Travolta have his own 727, I'm sure it's not THAT hard.  There are quite a bit of jets listed for sale online, so it wouldn't be hard to find one.
Link Posted: 12/23/2003 11:27:42 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/23/2003 11:30:17 PM EDT by raven]
Originally Posted By SNorman:
Originally Posted By KA3B:
It's not that easy to buy a used commercial jet aircraft.

It's not that easy to get it FAA inspected and registered.

It's not that easy to get a commercial pilots liscense and to set up a company.

View Quote


What do you mean by "Not that easy"?  Doesn't John Travolta have his own 727, I'm sure it's not THAT hard.  There are quite a bit of jets listed for sale online, so it wouldn't be hard to find one.
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Plus, those news articles say that these al-Qaeda pilots are thoroughly trained and qualified to fly commercial jets, the fear is that they're freaking employees for a legit company.  If the terrorists founded their own company and did their own scheduling, they could coordinate the simultaneous attacks that are al-Qaeda's hallmark.  I'm sure the requirements are easier for just cargo, rather than passenger craft.  And if the FAA denies Camel Jockey Air Cargo from getting ok'd, the terrorists can just go to CAIR or file a lawsuit against the government for discrimination.
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