I asked about the Kel Tecs in another thread, and got some good info. Now, how about the Seecamp .32...
Keep in mind I'm looking for a micro pistol. I already have a G26, and feel its a bit too big for 'just in case' carry...
I don't know about those, but I hear the Seecamps are ammo sensitive.
do you really want to carry the same weapon howard stern carries?
If it's good, yup...
I'm not sure why that would bother you... Do you feel some sense of shame knowning that you have an AR, when the DC Snipers used one too? I thought not...
They come in 380 now. Much better then anemic 32 unless you got nothing. Then that will do!
Can you put one on a keychain?
Seecamps are generally excellent, if overpriced handguns. They are also hard to come by. I don’t know what the wait is nowadays if you order directly from Seecamp, but it used to be something like 18+ months.
A few points:
They are designed solely for Winchester Silvertips (I forget the grain weight).
They don’t have sights.
They have a decidedly bizarre design where the slide cannot be fully retracted without a magazine in place. I don’t know the intent, but the result is you have to clear it by dropping the magazine only slightly, then ejecting the live round from the chamber, then fully removing the magazine. (IIRC, the state of Maryland has prohibited sale of Seecamps because of this.)
The above design also acts as a magazine safety (you can’t pull the trigger with the magazine out of the pistol).
They are actually a delayed blowback, not a straight blowback, as a result of a ring cut in the chamber.
They have a heel mounted magazine release.
I don’t know what the ballistics are, but given that you’re shooting a .32 ACP out of a really short barrel I doubt it’s impressive.
IMHO, it’s certainly better than a rock, but if you can get away with carrying a five shot .38 instead you are far better protected.
I believe they are now also being made in .380, but I don’t know anything about it in that caliber.
Edited to add: The .32 Silvertip bullet weight is 60 grains. Also, it’s my understanding that the .380 is the same size.
I have fired one owned by a AR15.com member. It was 100% reliable with Win silvertips, but we only shot about 45 rounds.
No sights, just a point and shoot pistol. I prefer a J frame or even a Beretta 950BS / 21A.
I shot a pair of matched Seecamps about 5 years ago. Wonderfully made pistol. At 5yds, point and shoot, rapid fire, with one in each hand, all shots in torso! Very instinct point and shoot, at least for me. I think with other alternatives available(Kel-Tec) the wait is much shorter than it used to be. Wish I had a couple. If you have the $ around, Seecamp>KelTec.
Found this regarding ammo sensitivity
New LWS 32 Ammo Recommendation from the L.W. Seecamp Company
We have recommended Winchester Silvertip ammo since we first introduced the LWS 32 back in 1985.
Experiences with some recently produced Silvertip ammo has caused us to reevaluate that recommendation. Pistols that have been functioning flawlessly for years are suddenly experiencing a rash of feeding problems.
32 Silvertip ammunition has undergone a design change. Bullets are harder and shinier. They now have small expansion cuts at the nose tip. While they look prettier, without exception those we have examined slide into the case when shooting. Unlike the old Silvertips, the bullets are not crimped into the case.
The new Silvertip bullets slide into the case even when they are still inside the magazine. As the gun recoils to the rear, inertia causes the bullets to collide with the front of the magazine wall with sufficient force to seat the bullets deeper into the case. When the bullets hit the feed ramp, an additional sliding into the case takes place that often causes jams.
The slide assembly on the LWS 32 is only 2.5 ounces. Because of its relatively small mass its forward momentum on returning to battery position is easily upset by an obstruction along its course. When bullets slide into their cases much of the forward inertia of the slide is lost.
I shall cite one example of a recent “repair”. A fairly new pistol was sent to me which had jamming problems. Prior to test firing, the gun was gone over with a fine tooth comb. The feed ramp was reworked and all parts related to smooth cycling were repolished.
Four magazines of Hydra-Shok were shot, followed by two magazines of old style Silvertips without a hint of failure. Then two magazines of new style Silvertips were shot. Both magazines had failures. The unfired rounds still in the magazine were measured. From a start length of about .912 they had all shortened. The shortest was .901 -- this after only two rounds had been fired from that magazine. The two rounds that jammed were also measured. One measured .894 and one measured .887.
To verify that nothing had changed with the pistol, it was again extensively fired with old style Silvertips and Hydra-Shoks without incident.
It has since been brought to my attention that some recent manufacture old style Silvertips not properly crimped may also have this problem of bullets sliding into the case.
The new redesigned Silvertip ammunition is NOT the ammunition we have been recommending for close to 20 Years. The harder bullets take away any advantage there might have been with increased deformation due to softness, and what we have seen thus far with the new ammo does not make us happy. We would hope this is a temporary problem and not a sign of things to come.
LW Seecamp Company
April 19, 2004
That looks like a Scott McDougal custom job, is it??
I was the one who originally suggested the seecamp to you..... you said you wanted something smaller than a glock 26, so I was thinking really small.... which the seecmap is. I have not personally ever owned or fired a seecamp, and from what others, with actual knowledge of these guns, have said, I wouldn't buy it if I were you. It obviously limits your ammo choices and is an extremely close range gun. Not very good for protecting yourself beyond spitting distance it seems.
What about the NAA Guardian in .32 or .380.
NAA Guardian 32 acp With tritium night sight
Specifications: Caliber: .32 Acp--- Action: Double Action Only--- Stock: Black Plastic Grips--- Capacity: 6+1--- Sights: Ft: XS Big Dot Tritium Rr: White Stripe Express--- Barrel Length: 2.49"--- Overall Length: 4.75"--- Weight: 18.72oz---
The only drawback to this gun from what I've heard is that it doesn't hold open after the last round is fired... in fact it is supposely prone to stove pipe on the last round fired; NAA actually made a statement that they wished that this last round fired stove pipe would occur for every magazine of ammo fired- that way it would act, in a way, like a slide lock for when the last round was fired.
Other than that... they seem to be a neat little gun... maybe you should check out this option... and see what others think about it (those that actually own it and have fird it).
Springfield armory has also come out with a micro compact .45 that I read and article on that is suppose to be very accurate and an awesome little gun,; the fact that it has .45 stopping power is also a very big plus.
Item #: PX9801L
Description: SPG 1911A1 MC 45AP PST B/SS NS
Manufacturer: Springfield Armory
Model #: 1911A1 "Loaded" Micro Compact
Type: Semi-Automatic Pistol
Finish: Stainless Slide & Matte Blk Hard Coat Alloy Frm
Stock: Slimline Cocobolo Grips
Sights: Novak Patented Low Mount Tritium & Dovetail Frnt
Barrel Length: 3"
Overall Length: 5.7"
Packaging: Lockable Plastic Case
Additional Features 1: Ext'd Ambi-thumb Safety, Delta Ltwt Hammer
Additional Features 2: Ltwt Speed Trigger, Extreme Carry Bevel Treatment
Action: Single Action
Holy shit! A thread about guns in the GD!
I think a pocket gun should be able to fire while inside your pocket (repeatedly). And if you want something to stick in someone's ribs (and to really inflate their thoracic cavity), you can't beat:
Caliber: .357 Magnum®/.38 S&W Special +P
Capacity: 5 Rounds
Barrel Length: 1-7/8"
Front Sight: "Light Gathering" HIVIZ® Green Dot
Rear Sight: Fixed Notch
Grip: Hogue Bantam
External Safety: N/A
Finish: Black/ Grey
Overall length: 6-5/16"
Material: Scandium Alloy Frame, Barrel Shroud and Yoke, Titanium Cylinder, Stainless steel barrel liner
Weight Empty: 12 ounces
beretta .32 tomcat
Mag capacity: 7 rounds
Barrel length: 2.4"
Overall length: 4.9"
Overall Width: 1.1"
Overall Height: 3.7"
Sight Radius: 3.3"
Front Sights: Fixed blade (Except 320105 - Tritium)
Rear Sights: Drift adjustable
Safety: Manual, thumb operated
Finish: Matte Black, Blue, Stainless or Titanium
Grips: Plastic Grips
Weight: 14.5 oz. (Except 320600 - 16.9 oz.)
mustangs are much bigger. you guys comparing 5shot revolvers are friggin insane. seecamps are TINY.
i had sn911.
waited a year for it
kept it for 10 years
mags were $45
anything other than silvertips didn't work. magsafes blew some guys extractor off. eventually silvetips didn't work.
pretty much uncontrollable after first shot
weird operating system.
sold it for $585 about 7 years ago. felt like i ripped the guy off, but people kept calling on the shotgun news ad for weeks telling me how much more they would have paid.
i have a keltec 32 now. it's longer, but thinner. it weighs 1/2 as much, but is much easier to control, and is not ammo sensitive. i'm much happier.
i would have a keltec over a seecamp regardless of $. YMMV
The few people that I've known that like the Seecamps really like them...but they are pricey. The NAA Guardian is priced along "average" gun prices and is similar in size (in .32, 380, and NAA's necked down .32 NAA). The triggers on the NAA Guardian's I tried were quite heavy. I looked into trigger jobs and while I haven't seen an NAA Guardian with a trigger job, from what I've read it works out quite well.
Another possibility in the tiny gun area is the new Rohrbaugh. Very pricey though...$1000. But it's very tiny (5.2") and fires 9mm ammo. My wife looked into tiny guns a few years ago, she had been carrying a Kahr K9 since they first came out. She now carries a Kahr PM9. Not as small as the Seecamp, but those PM9's are quite the little gun.
Having carried a gun professionally every day since June 12, 1989 I have learned a 5-Shot .38 revolver is the smallest reliable self defense weapon made. Anything smaller is too slow to score good repeat hits with, or not sufficiently powerfull to end the fight with two center mass hits. With proper training and good tactics a 5-shot revolver is enough gun to survive with.
+1 Another vote for the .38 / .357 snub