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Posted: 8/30/2010 3:12:21 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 9/3/2010 4:36:42 AM EDT by sq40]
http://www.wsoctv.com/news/24809223/detail.html


MORGANTON, N.C. –– A 17-year-old boy was killed in an officer-involved incident in Morganton.

Morganton public safety officers responded to a noise complaint at Independence mobile home park, located on Air Park Drive, just after midnight on Monday.
The teenager answered the door and was armed with a long gun, officers said.

Family members said Michael Sipes, who was a Freedom High School student and a member of the ROTC, died after being hit by gunfire.
Two officers responded to the disturbance call, but only one fired his gun.

Area resident Korey Forneysaid he never heard the officers identify themselves as police, but said he heard at least four gunshots.
“They didn't identify themselves as police,” he said. “That's why he came outside. But he had (the gun) in a position where he wasn't going to fire.”
Mark Tolbert, chief of Morganton Public Safety, said the officer did identify himself when he knocked on the door.
Family members said they are left with many questions.

“He was going to go in the army next year," Sipes’ stepmother, Angie Cook, said. “He was a good kid. He didn't bother nobody. He tried to help everybody he could.”
Public safety officials said they have been called to the home before. Tolbert said he thinks the officer who fired feared for his life.

“I do believe the officer did feel threatened,” Tolbert said. “The proximity, … the weapon presence, his recognition of the weapon at the outset.”
Agents with the State Bureau of Investigation are helping with the investigation. Until it is completed, both officers are on paid administrative leave.




*UPDATE on Pg 25 with more Info*
Link Posted: 8/30/2010 3:14:08 PM EDT
Jail time for the officer. End of discussion
Link Posted: 8/30/2010 3:14:59 PM EDT
fucking sucks
Link Posted: 8/30/2010 3:16:18 PM EDT
Damn...
Link Posted: 8/30/2010 3:16:20 PM EDT
oh well
Link Posted: 8/30/2010 3:16:28 PM EDT
Well at least the officers made it home safely!!!!
Link Posted: 8/30/2010 3:17:07 PM EDT

Originally Posted By SMWeinbrenner:
Jail time for the officer. End of discussion


Link Posted: 8/30/2010 3:17:27 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/30/2010 3:20:37 PM EDT by valheru21]
Presence of a weapon =/= a lethal threat to the officer let alone justification for use of deadly force. If you can't (or won't) wrap your brain around that, hang up your badge.
Link Posted: 8/30/2010 3:17:35 PM EDT
Originally Posted By SMWeinbrenner:
Jail time for the officer. End of discussion


witnesses are a bitch.

Link Posted: 8/30/2010 3:17:46 PM EDT
it will be interesting to see how this turns out in the end for the officers
Link Posted: 8/30/2010 3:18:05 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/30/2010 3:18:47 PM EDT by imq707s]
Originally Posted By SMWeinbrenner:
Jail time for the officer. End of discussion


You derived that from the all of the info (100% correct I'm sure) from the small little news article?

Link Posted: 8/30/2010 3:18:08 PM EDT
Should be interesting.
Link Posted: 8/30/2010 3:18:20 PM EDT


so did they just open fire or did they order him to drop it and he didn't?

Link Posted: 8/30/2010 3:18:43 PM EDT
Sounds like the cops did everything right, according to the cops quoted in the story.
Link Posted: 8/30/2010 3:18:53 PM EDT
Very sad
Link Posted: 8/30/2010 3:19:27 PM EDT
Very sad
Link Posted: 8/30/2010 3:21:31 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Thom101:
it will be interesting to see how this turns out in the end for the officers


I'm shure they will be just fine.
Link Posted: 8/30/2010 3:22:28 PM EDT


Another fine example of how trigger happy and stupid some police officers can be.






Link Posted: 8/30/2010 3:22:39 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Another_Dude:
Sounds like the cops did everything right, according to the cops quoted in the story.

Also sounds like the cop shot needlessly, according to the witness quoted in the story.

I guess it just depends on what you do for a living where your bias lies.
Link Posted: 8/30/2010 3:22:52 PM EDT
Originally Posted By imq707s:
Originally Posted By SMWeinbrenner:
Jail time for the officer. End of discussion


You derived that from the all of the info (100% correct I'm sure) from the small little news article?



Probably just his opinion.... We still are entitled to that right?
Link Posted: 8/30/2010 3:22:52 PM EDT
Wow. That hits close to home. Only about ten minutes from me.
Link Posted: 8/30/2010 3:23:09 PM EDT
According to the responses on the news site (and take those with a huge grain of salt); He was shot 4 times in the back.
Link Posted: 8/30/2010 3:24:13 PM EDT
I wonder if they get medals

Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile
Link Posted: 8/30/2010 3:25:53 PM EDT
Negligent homocide at least.
Link Posted: 8/30/2010 3:27:39 PM EDT
So, the mere presence of a firearm is grounds for shooting civilians? Just bang, bang, before they can get a word in?
Link Posted: 8/30/2010 3:27:41 PM EDT
Paid administrative leave. Poor bastards, at least they went home safe and get to paid to do nothing until this is resolved.

Serious jail time, is the only thing that will make the fuckers think twice.


Link Posted: 8/30/2010 3:28:18 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Another_Dude:
Sounds like the cops did everything right, according to the cops quoted in the story.


Uh, so if everything is done right, the nice kid gets killed? This is a manslaughter case from what I read. As a retired police officer I usually give the LEO's some room, but you have to call the bad ones out. I'd be curious if the LEO's here attended an agency/paid or private police academy.....
Link Posted: 8/30/2010 3:29:24 PM EDT
did his dog survive?
Link Posted: 8/30/2010 3:29:30 PM EDT
How come when it is an innocent person involved all shots hit their mark, but when its a dickbag cop killer involved its 130 shots fired and 2 hit, non fatal?
Link Posted: 8/30/2010 3:29:39 PM EDT
I was drawn down on in a similar fashion once. Someone rang my doorbell at 2-3am and (to me) sounded as if they were trying to force the side door. I came out the front door with a 12 ga, held low in one hand at the center of balance, nothing that could even be considered low ready, and made my way over. I found no one at the door, but saw a car peel away from the driveway. I went back inside and 10 minutes later got a call from the Sheriff's office. "Can you please come outside unarmed? There is an officer out there waiting to speak to you." So I go out the same door, he was apparently expecting me at the other door and I surprised him. Gun, light in my face, hands up, I thought "fuck." But he saw I was unarmed and quickly holstered. Long story short it was the paper delivery guy, he accidentally banged the door and door bell. 5am? I would expect that. 2-3am? WTF.
Link Posted: 8/30/2010 3:30:41 PM EDT
Originally Posted By HommieDaKlown:
How come when it is an innocent person involved all shots hit their mark, but when its a dickbag cop killer involved its 130 shots fired and 2 hit, non fatal?


Simple, the Dirtbag is firing back at the police and they are running for cover or behind cover.

Link Posted: 8/30/2010 3:31:00 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Another_Dude:
Sounds like the cops did everything right, according to the cops quoted in the story.

Except for the part where they killed a kid that was no threat to them.
Link Posted: 8/30/2010 3:32:52 PM EDT
If I dont see you on the monitor and I dont hear you when I ask you to announce yourself on the intercomm I dont open the door period. If then you identify yourself as a LEO then I doublecheck the DVR to see your squad car, if all that checks out I will ask them to step outside the screen porch so I can come outside and close the door behind myself to talk to them. If after all that one screws up and shoots me at least I have video and audio to have posted here so there is no doubt what happened.
Link Posted: 8/30/2010 3:34:01 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/30/2010 3:37:14 PM EDT by Leisure_Shoot]
The father should be allowed a free pass for whatever he might need to do.
Link Posted: 8/30/2010 3:34:18 PM EDT
Link Posted: 8/30/2010 3:34:34 PM EDT

Originally Posted By TerribleTom:

Originally Posted By Another_Dude:
Sounds like the cops did everything right, according to the cops quoted in the story.

Except for the part where they killed a kid that was no threat to them.

I think you guys are missing the importance of the second half of Another_Dudes statement.
Link Posted: 8/30/2010 3:34:45 PM EDT


This is a fine example of why it's better to answer the door with a concealed pistol than a long arm too.





Link Posted: 8/30/2010 3:34:49 PM EDT
Originally Posted By flyfishnepa:


so did they just open fire or did they order him to drop it and he didn't?



That would be one of the many, many pieces of information that are missing from the story, which would be needed before passing any reasonable judgment.

Link Posted: 8/30/2010 3:35:21 PM EDT
Originally Posted By HommieDaKlown:
How come when it is an innocent person involved all shots hit their mark, but when its a dickbag cop killer involved its 130 shots fired and 2 hit, non fatal?


It's easy to shoot accurately when there is zero chance bullets coming back down-range.
Link Posted: 8/30/2010 3:35:21 PM EDT
Another reason every single cop on patrol needs to have a personal video recorder, no excuses.
Link Posted: 8/30/2010 3:36:01 PM EDT
Link Posted: 8/30/2010 3:36:08 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Izzman:

Originally Posted By TerribleTom:

Originally Posted By Another_Dude:
Sounds like the cops did everything right, according to the cops quoted in the story.

Except for the part where they killed a kid that was no threat to them.

I think you guys are missing the importance of the second half of Another_Dudes statement.

Oh. Now I see what you did there.
Link Posted: 8/30/2010 3:36:24 PM EDT
Tragic.
Link Posted: 8/30/2010 3:37:02 PM EDT

kid must have shopped at Costco or live near a VA hospital.


Link Posted: 8/30/2010 3:38:09 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/30/2010 8:01:21 PM EDT by Tango7]
Originally Posted By sq40:
According to the responses on the news site (and take those with a huge grain of salt); He was shot 4 times in the back.


He was probably just resisting. Why would an innocent person resist?

<Comment removed - T7>

You want to condemn the individual officer who fired that's completely understandable.

Please don't cross over into blanket cop-bashing.
Link Posted: 8/30/2010 3:39:06 PM EDT
Originally Posted By brothermike:
If I dont see you on the monitor and I dont hear you when I ask you to announce yourself on the intercomm I dont open the door period. If then you identify yourself as a LEO then I doublecheck the DVR to see your squad car, if all that checks out I will ask them to step outside the screen porch so I can come outside and close the door behind myself to talk to them. If after all that one screws up and shoots me at least I have video and audio to have posted here so there is no doubt what happened.


Watch out for the audio in your security cameras... that can be considered eavesdropping or wiretapping, and require consent of both parties.

I don't know how it is in Florida... you might want to double-check on that, otherwise your evidence can get thrown out in court, and a bad guy could walk.
Link Posted: 8/30/2010 3:39:49 PM EDT
Whoa, I usually answer the door with my weapon in my back pocket...
Link Posted: 8/30/2010 3:40:55 PM EDT
If I shoot a cop that comes to my door, will I go to jail, or will I be put on paid vacation until the investigation and inevitable trial is over?
Link Posted: 8/30/2010 3:40:56 PM EDT
remember all you have to be, is scared for your life. guess it helps being a scared cat.
Link Posted: 8/30/2010 3:42:53 PM EDT

Originally Posted By TheGrayMan:
Originally Posted By brothermike:
If I dont see you on the monitor and I dont hear you when I ask you to announce yourself on the intercomm I dont open the door period. If then you identify yourself as a LEO then I doublecheck the DVR to see your squad car, if all that checks out I will ask them to step outside the screen porch so I can come outside and close the door behind myself to talk to them. If after all that one screws up and shoots me at least I have video and audio to have posted here so there is no doubt what happened.


Watch out for the audio in your security cameras... that can be considered eavesdropping or wiretapping, and require consent of both parties.

I don't know how it is in Florida... you might want to double-check on that, otherwise your evidence can get thrown out in court, and a bad guy could walk.

I would think that a sign posted at the front door that you are being recorded on vid with sound would take care of that.
Link Posted: 8/30/2010 3:42:56 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/30/2010 3:48:44 PM EDT by valheru21]
Originally Posted By LOW2000:
If I shoot a cop that comes to my door, will I go to jail, or will I be put on paid vacation until the investigation and inevitable trial is over?


The guy in Va Beach who had a plain-clothes cop and his buddy try to break into his house (via a botched no-knock-ish raid based on the word of a CI with a grudge against the suspect who was told to break into the suspect's home to find evidence of an MJ grow operation - which turned out to be Japanese Maple trees) in the middle of the night and fired to defend himself got sent to jail for 10 years. It is abundantly clear that civilian use of force is held to a MUCH stricter standard than police use of force.
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