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Posted: 2/1/2011 3:25:15 AM EDT
[#1]
Uh oh...
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Posted: 2/1/2011 3:25:46 AM EDT
[#2]
I am sure that is true. I am equally sure I still don't like them. |
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Posted: 2/1/2011 3:29:15 AM EDT
[#3]
Another study showed that simply flashing the yellow light during the transition from gree to red was far more effective on reducing crashes and people running the red.
But hey, there's no revenue in flashing yellow lights. |
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Posted: 2/1/2011 3:32:01 AM EDT
[#4]
Fatal t-bone type crashes I would expect. The doors of a car and restraints inside are designed for head on.
That said, I bet there's more "fender bender type following too closely guy in front doesn't want a ticket" type crashes. Of course, none of this would matter if people would just chill the hell out when they are in their cars.
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Posted: 2/1/2011 3:32:09 AM EDT
[#5]
I'm sure I'm in the minority here when I say I like them. I don't run red lights, and don't particularly relish the thought of some dickhead in an 8K pound SUV impaling me on his bumper while I am bicycling or riding a motorcycle.
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Posted: 2/1/2011 3:33:46 AM EDT
[#6]
Bullshit.
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Posted: 2/1/2011 3:34:31 AM EDT
[#7]
And gun control saves lives..
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Posted: 2/1/2011 3:34:57 AM EDT
[#8]
So would driving 5 MPH everywhere you go.
Drop the speed limit to 5MPH , its for the chilrens |
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Posted: 2/1/2011 3:38:01 AM EDT
[#9]
I like em. Just another tool for cops that can't be everywhere to enforce law.
I also like those speed deals where they set up a radar and photograph plates. Don't like it? Change the law. until then Don't break the law. |
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Posted: 2/1/2011 3:43:18 AM EDT
[#10]
Quoted: I like em. Just another tool for cops that can't be everywhere to enforce law. I also like those speed deals where they set up a radar and photograph plates. Don't like it? Change the law. until then Don't break the law. Yea we should have CCTV everywhere cause you know cops can't see everything. England has the right idea. |
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Posted: 2/1/2011 3:44:37 AM EDT
[#11]
 Quoted: I like em. Just another tool for cops that can't be everywhere to enforce law. I also like those speed deals where they set up a radar and photograph plates. Don't like it? Change the law. until then Don't break the law. |
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Posted: 2/1/2011 3:44:40 AM EDT
[#12]
More studies have shown that by just keeping the yellow light lit longer and a little more time before changing the cross traffic light to green also prevents crashes.
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Posted: 2/1/2011 3:46:06 AM EDT
[#13]
Realy the last survey I saw said "rear impact crashes increased" where there is a known camera, and a yellow light is really a grace period...
But hey big brother is watching..........and it's really all about the auto insuranse cos. they fund that stuff ,and radar, so they can raise your rates....... |
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Posted: 2/1/2011 3:51:18 AM EDT
[#14]
Big surprise there its put out by the Insurance Institute
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Posted: 2/1/2011 3:51:29 AM EDT
[#15]
Quoted:
Quoted:
I like em. Just another tool for cops that can't be everywhere to enforce law. I also like those speed deals where they set up a radar and photograph plates. Don't like it? Change the law. until then Don't break the law. Yea we should have CCTV everywhere cause you know cops can't see everything. England has the right idea. Laws that are not enforced or with lack enforcement are not worth paper they are printed on and we slip into lawlessness. If technology enables better enforcement it's win for rule of law. Indeed I have no problem with CCTV in public spaces either, |
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Posted: 2/1/2011 3:58:16 AM EDT
[#16]
Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: I like em. Just another tool for cops that can't be everywhere to enforce law. I also like those speed deals where they set up a radar and photograph plates. Don't like it? Change the law. until then Don't break the law. Yea we should have CCTV everywhere cause you know cops can't see everything. England has the right idea. Laws that are not enforced or with lack enforcement are not worth paper they are printed on and we slip into lawlessness. If technology enables better enforcement it's win for rule of law. Indeed I have no problem with CCTV in public spaces either, Yea and they should put CCTV into peoples homes because they could be smoking pot in them.. I mean we wouldn't want to slip into anarchy! |
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Posted: 2/1/2011 4:08:19 AM EDT
[#17]
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Posted: 2/1/2011 4:16:35 AM EDT
[#18]
Quoted:
Big surprise there its put out by the Insurance Institute Hardly an impartial study - more tickets/points on driver's licenses, more revenue. |
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Posted: 2/1/2011 4:19:08 AM EDT
[#19]
Quoted:
The study concludes that the cameras have reduced the rate of fatal crashes by 24 percent in 14 large cities that introduced red light cameras between 1996 and 2004. http://www.foxnews.com/us/2011/02/01/study-finds-red-light-cameras-cut-fatal-crashes/?test=latestnews They used bad data. Read about Car and Drivers report showing how the yellow light duration is cut shorter than is safe to trap more motorists. |
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Posted: 2/1/2011 4:21:34 AM EDT
[#20]
studies : They can be manipulated .
eggs are BAD http://www.sciencecentric.com/news/10110207-1-egg-yolk-worse-than-kfc-double-down-when-it-comes-cholesterol.html eggs are GOOD http://www.suite101.com/content/eggs-improve-health-and-weight-loss-a206204 |
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Posted: 2/1/2011 4:22:30 AM EDT
[#21]
Quoted: Another study showed that simply flashing the yellow light during the transition from gree to red was far more effective on reducing crashes and people running the red. But hey, there's no revenue in flashing yellow lights. |
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Posted: 2/1/2011 4:46:25 AM EDT
[#22]
Realy its a "win-win" for the auto insurance companies....and people have shot the cameras, that's a win/lose.....
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Posted: 2/1/2011 4:51:54 AM EDT
[#23]
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
I like em. Just another tool for cops that can't be everywhere to enforce law. I also like those speed deals where they set up a radar and photograph plates. Don't like it? Change the law. until then Don't break the law. Yea we should have CCTV everywhere cause you know cops can't see everything. England has the right idea. Laws that are not enforced or with lack enforcement are not worth paper they are printed on and we slip into lawlessness. If technology enables better enforcement it's win for rule of law. Indeed I have no problem with CCTV in public spaces either, Getting a blowjob in some states is still illegal, what are you gonna do about that?? 
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Posted: 2/1/2011 6:17:12 AM EDT
[#24]
Quoted:
I'm sure I'm in the minority here when I say I like them. I don't run red lights, and don't particularly relish the thought of some dickhead in an 8K pound SUV impaling me on his bumper while I am bicycling or riding a motorcycle. I agree with you, I get sick and tired of self important asswipes running red lights. |
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Posted: 2/1/2011 6:23:30 AM EDT
[#25]
Quoted:
I'm sure I'm in the minority here when I say I like them. I don't run red lights, and don't particularly relish the thought of some dickhead in an 8K pound SUV impaling me on his bumper while I am bicycling or riding a motorcycle. Count me on this as well. |
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Posted: 2/1/2011 6:23:58 AM EDT
[#26]
It is irrelevant whether red light cameras do or do not save lives. They are intrusive devices which place machines in control of humans. Use of technology in this way needs to cease.
The government could decide any manner of things have some sort of health benefit and force us to use them. Where does it end? Control, that's all it is. |
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Posted: 2/1/2011 6:26:06 AM EDT
[#27]
But some disagree.
Gary Biller, executive director of the National Motorists Association, a Wisconsin-based drivers' rights organization, disputed the institute's finding that the cameras have reduced deaths. He cited previous studies — questioned by the institute — that found that the cameras increase crashes, including rear-end collisions. As for calling the cameras a low-cost solution, Biller added: "They're not low cost to the motorist."
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Posted: 2/1/2011 6:27:54 AM EDT
[#28]
Quoted:
It is irrelevant whether red light cameras do or do not save lives. They are intrusive devices which place machines in control of humans. Use of technology in this way needs to cease. The government could decide any manner of things have some sort of health benefit and force us to use them. Where does it end? Control, that's all it is. If they ban fast food restaurants we would not have so many overweight people. They could fine you for not eating homemade meals every day. Think of the children!!!! |
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Posted: 2/1/2011 6:29:34 AM EDT
[#29]
Quoted:
It is irrelevant whether red light cameras do or do not save lives. They are intrusive devices which place machines in control of humans. Use of technology in this way needs to cease. The government could decide any manner of things have some sort of health benefit and force us to use them. Where does it end? Control, that's all it is. My hometown installed 3 a couple years ago. In the first 9 months they had already generated over one million in revenue. 
The fine is $75.00 with the cith only getting $25.00 of it. They have since installed close to a dozen more and are adding them as fast as they can. Houston on the other hand decided to remove all of theirs in 2010. BigDozer66 |
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Posted: 2/1/2011 6:33:32 AM EDT
[#30]
Quoted: Quoted: It is irrelevant whether red light cameras do or do not save lives. They are intrusive devices which place machines in control of humans. Use of technology in this way needs to cease. The government could decide any manner of things have some sort of health benefit and force us to use them. Where does it end? Control, that's all it is. My hometown installed 3 a couple years ago. In the first 9 months they had already generated over one million in revenue. The fine is $75.00 with the cith only getting $25.00 of it. They have since installed close to a dozen more and are adding them as fast as they can. Houston on the other hand decided to remove all of theirs in 2010. BigDozer66 A town here installed them a year ago for safety. A couple weeks ago there was an article in the paper saying 2 of them had to be moved because they were not making enough money. The same article also said that fatal crashes went down a bit while rear enders went up drasticaly in these intersections. |
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Posted: 2/1/2011 6:36:12 AM EDT
[#31]
We have them here.
We had speed vans here but not sure if they are still around. |
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Posted: 2/1/2011 6:50:32 AM EDT
[#32]
Speed vans are unmanned and just FULL of expensive equipment.
Paintball guns are accurate enough to hit a speed camera lens at a good distance. People in the UK are setting speed/cctv/redlight cameras on fire with gasoline. Machines cannot (yet) fight back, just like you can't fight them in court. I don't like them because the operating companies make so much money off them. I am not particularly sure that they serve any safety purpose because I see all sorts of unpredictable behavior at these intersections and unpredictability causes crashes and death. |
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Posted: 2/1/2011 7:07:13 AM EDT
[#33]
A recent study finds that traffic cameras reduce freedom in the United States.
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Posted: 2/1/2011 7:10:32 AM EDT
[#34]
tag
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Posted: 2/1/2011 7:14:05 AM EDT
[#35]
Quoted:
A recent study finds that traffic cameras reduce freedom in the United States. How so? |
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Posted: 2/1/2011 10:13:43 AM EDT
[#36]
Redlight cams would be tolerable, but the speed, seatbelt, cellphone, exhaust noise, broken windshield, nose picking big brother tickets need to go. There is so much extra shit they can add on to these cams. Lets say you pass one cam and get to the next a second too quick.................
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Posted: 2/1/2011 10:25:27 AM EDT
[#37]
Very scientific. Fatal crashes go down so it must be the red light cameras responsible.
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Posted: 2/1/2011 10:28:05 AM EDT
[#38]
Quoted:
Quoted:
A recent study finds that traffic cameras reduce freedom in the United States. How so? Conceptually, it is because we are being treated like children by our elected authorities. Freedom is not simply having rights, it is also exercising them. People become mindful of small things - traffic cameras, code enforcement, petty fines, etc. - and extrapolate it to larger things. It is only by way of significant education that people even realize they retain as many rights as they do. Gun laws are a perfect example. Have you ever had anyone ask you, "Wow, is that legal?" in reference to a rifle, accessory, or feature? They don't know about it, and so the average person simply assumes it is illegal. They maintain an "ask permission first" mentality when it comes to all things government. Legislation and policy which serve primarily as means of supplemental revenue generation reinforce a subject mentality within the general population, leading to a de facto loss of freedom via inaction. |
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Posted: 2/1/2011 10:29:55 AM EDT
[#39]
I wonder if adding another 2 seconds worth of delay between light changes would have similar results.
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Posted: 2/1/2011 10:38:24 AM EDT
[#40]
Quoted:
The study concludes that the cameras have reduced the rate of fatal crashes by 24 percent in 14 large cities that introduced red light cameras between 1996 and 2004. http://www.foxnews.com/us/2011/02/01/study-finds-red-light-cameras-cut-fatal-crashes/?test=latestnews There are no words in the English language that accurately describe how little I care. No fucking cameras. 
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Posted: 2/1/2011 10:38:27 AM EDT
[#41]
Quoted: I like em. Just another tool for cops that can't be everywhere to enforce law. I also like those speed deals where they set up a radar and photograph plates. Don't like it? Change the law. until then Don't break the law.  |
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Posted: 2/1/2011 10:40:44 AM EDT
[#42]
Quoted: I like em. Just another tool for cops that can't be everywhere to enforce law. I also like those speed deals where they set up a radar and photograph plates. Don't like it? Change the law. until then Don't break the law. Three cheers for private companies enforcing the laws with little or no oversight! Three cheers for the assumption of guilt, and you as a private citizen under the burden of proving innocence to pay a private company in lieu of actual law enforcement!!! Yay freedom! BTW, in Ohio every single municipality that has put the red-light scams to a referendum have voted them out. Every. Single. One. Apparently, and appropriately, people don't like to be fleeced by RedFlex and their local government. Luckily there are more people like me than you. Otherwise, this country would really fucking suck. |
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Posted: 2/1/2011 10:49:10 AM EDT
[#43]
Unintended Consequence
$$$$ was the motivation What a conundrum for cities that are dropping them because they're not very $$ productive after all I saw where one city was going to keep them and give their paltry share to charity.!!!!! To prove it was public safety and not revenues. http://articles.sfgate.com/2011-01-31/news/27093496_1_red-light-camera-charity-idea-local-charities |
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Posted: 2/1/2011 10:51:28 AM EDT
[#44]
Glad they got rid of them in N.C. (at least in Charlotte)
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Posted: 2/1/2011 10:52:01 AM EDT
[#45]
I believe in the UK they've found that speed cameras and red light cameras have caused accidents to increase.
In any case, I don't care if they cause some barely statistically significant decrease in accidents...camera based traffic enforcement is fucking evil. Traffic enforcement as a means of producing revenue is fucking evil. Bob's speeding ticket inc. interested in handing out as many tickets as possible is fucking evil. |
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Posted: 2/1/2011 11:25:13 AM EDT
[#46]
Quoted:
Quoted:
I'm sure I'm in the minority here when I say I like them. I don't run red lights, and don't particularly relish the thought of some dickhead in an 8K pound SUV impaling me on his bumper while I am bicycling or riding a motorcycle. Count me on this as well. I love the guys on this board who basically say, "DON"T TOUCH MY 2ND AMENDMENT RIGHTS...... but you can have all my other rights, I don't need them and I want the .gov to protect me!" .....
pathetic... |
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Posted: 2/1/2011 11:27:14 AM EDT
[#47]
How much $$$$ did the Insurance Institute for Highway Safety get paid to publish that pile of steaming shit?
ETA: The reason that fatal crashes were less common at these intersections is because people are driving around them, and having their fatal crashes elsewhere. |
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Posted: 2/1/2011 11:41:01 AM EDT
[#48]
Quoted: How much $$$$ did the Insurance Institute for Highway Safety get paid to publish that pile of steaming shit? ETA: The reason that fatal crashes were less common at these intersections is because people are driving around them, and having their fatal crashes elsewhere. Pay? They probably funded it. They benefit GREATLY by harsher enforcement by way of rates. They jizz their shorts when LE has a new mousetrap, it's better for them than you and I. |
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Posted: 2/1/2011 11:46:36 AM EDT
[#49]
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
It is irrelevant whether red light cameras do or do not save lives. They are intrusive devices which place machines in control of humans. Use of technology in this way needs to cease. The government could decide any manner of things have some sort of health benefit and force us to use them. Where does it end? Control, that's all it is. My hometown installed 3 a couple years ago. In the first 9 months they had already generated over one million in revenue.
The fine is $75.00 with the cith only getting $25.00 of it. They have since installed close to a dozen more and are adding them as fast as they can. Houston on the other hand decided to remove all of theirs in 2010. BigDozer66 A town here installed them a year ago for safety. A couple weeks ago there was an article in the paper saying 2 of them had to be moved because they were not making enough money. The same article also said that fatal crashes went down a bit while rear enders went up drasticaly in these intersections. Yeah, ours were installed for safety. When a local judge ordered them turned off the city's main argument in the appeal was, you guessed it, that the city stood to lose a huge amount of money from them being shut off. They're back in action. |
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Posted: 2/1/2011 11:48:14 AM EDT
[#50]
They're NOT red light cameras they're MONEY cameras! Ever go through an unfamiliar intersection? Ever see the light change yellow and be caught right at that moment where you're not sure to slam on the brakes or mash the gas?
Now say you decide to mash the gas as you're right on top of the intersection. BUT.... Holy crap that's gotta be the shortest yellow light ever!!! Then flash... flash... You now know why that yellow was so short. You just got yourself a ticket comming to you in the mail. Sorry guys. I hate these things with a passion. Want to reduce accidents at high incidence intersections? Make the yellow duration LONGER... |
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