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Posted: 8/24/2005 6:38:46 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/24/2005 6:39:55 PM EDT by shop_rat45]
From our daily news letter at the Lake Orion GM Assembly plant I work at:


One American Car Company is Beating the Japanese Car Companies…
General Motors and its UAW members produce more top quality vehicles overall than any other global automaker except Toyota and beats them in many product segments, according to J.D. Power Initial Quality Study survey. General Motors engines and transmissions all out performed Toyota in total quality and performance. GM has the most fuel-efficient product portfolio in the world, with 59% more 30mpg models than Toyota, Honda or DCX. About one million Americans build, supply, and sell GM vehicles. In total, Toyota employs only 30,000 workers in the USA. 82% of a GM vehicle is American made, while Honda is only 49% and Toyota and other Japanese and Koreans are drastically less. GM’s contribution to the American gross national product is 4 times that of Toyota. Toyota touts the fact that it has 8 manufacturing plants in the USA today while GM had 8 manufacturing plants in 1911.

GM’s investment in America: Charitable giving- Over its nearly 100-year history, GM has poured hundreds of millions of dollars into communities all across America. Not to mention the fact that millions of more dollars are donated every year to various national charities (Make-A-Wish, American Cancer Society, Etc.) and other great causes. Most recently, GM and its employees donated $2 million to the Asian Tsunami victims. This monetary help and emergency vehicle support went to a cause over 5000 miles away.

When you consider your next vehicle purchase, first think about how many communities, parks, hospitals, colleges, and museums have been created and maintained by grants from the foreign car companies.



Just remember all of this when you support driving a Toyota.
Link Posted: 8/24/2005 6:42:37 PM EDT
I will only buy AMERICAN!!!
Link Posted: 8/24/2005 6:43:19 PM EDT
I tried to buy domestic, but found out it had a German engine and a French transmission and tires.

And today my domestic made electrical system went on the fritz.

Next time I will buy a Honda made by my cousin in Ohio.
Link Posted: 8/24/2005 6:44:10 PM EDT

So you still want to buy a foreign car?


Yes, as a matter of fact, I do.

It's a Chevy Silverado, made in Mexico, by Mexican laborers, using Mexican-made parts.
Link Posted: 8/24/2005 6:44:25 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/24/2005 6:45:45 PM EDT by sgtar15]
GMC and Quality?


Ahahahahahhahahahahahahah­ahah



Sgatr15
Link Posted: 8/24/2005 6:44:44 PM EDT
I bought American!



Proudly made in California
Link Posted: 8/24/2005 6:44:48 PM EDT

General Motors engines and transmissions all out performed Toyota in total quality and performance.


I find that hard to beleive.
Link Posted: 8/24/2005 6:45:04 PM EDT


One American Car Company is Beating the Japanese Car Companies…
General Motors and its UAW members produce more top quality vehicles overall than any other global automaker except Toyota and beats them in many product segments, according to J.D. Power Initial Quality Study survey. General Motors engines and transmissions all out performed Toyota in total quality and performance. GM has the most fuel-efficient product portfolio in the world, with 59% more 30mpg models than Toyota, Honda or DCX. About one million Americans build, supply, and sell GM vehicles. In total, Toyota employs only 30,000 workers in the USA. 82% of a GM vehicle is American made, while Honda is only 49% and Toyota and other Japanese and Koreans are drastically less. GM’s contribution to the American gross national product is 4 times that of Toyota. Toyota touts the fact that it has 8 manufacturing plants in the USA today while GM had 8 manufacturing plants in 1911.

GM’s investment in America: Charitable giving- Over its nearly 100-year history, GM has poured hundreds of millions of dollars into communities all across America. Not to mention the fact that millions of more dollars are donated every year to various national charities (Make-A-Wish, American Cancer Society, Etc.) and other great causes. Most recently, GM and its employees donated $2 million to the Asian Tsunami victims. This monetary help and emergency vehicle support went to a cause over 5000 miles away.

When you consider your next vehicle purchase, first think about how many communities, parks, hospitals, colleges, and museums have been created and maintained by grants from the foreign car companies.



Pathetic groveling
Link Posted: 8/24/2005 6:46:21 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Sabretooth:

General Motors engines and transmissions all out performed Toyota in total quality and performance.


I find that hard to beleive.



It's true.......as long as you don't START the motors.

Sgat1r5
Link Posted: 8/24/2005 6:46:51 PM EDT
I just got rid of an '02 Explorer. The truck was a lemon and Ford couldn't care less. They treated me like a pest that they wish would just go the fuck away from the very first issues. I paid $32,000 for it and I am not rich. This was my second lemon from Ford in 10 years. Perhaps some people are wealthy enough that they can afford to continue to buy vehicles that fall apart every fucking time, unfortunately I am not one of those people.
I recently bought a Subaru assembled in Indiana IIRC. That's the best I can do right now.
Link Posted: 8/24/2005 6:46:53 PM EDT
Link Posted: 8/24/2005 6:48:07 PM EDT

Originally Posted By shop_rat45:
From our daily news letter at the Lake Orion GM Assembly plant I work at:


One American Car Company is Beating the Japanese Car Companies…
General Motors and its UAW members produce more top quality vehicles overall than any other global automaker except Toyota and beats them in many product segments, according to J.D. Power Initial Quality Study survey. General Motors engines and transmissions all out performed Toyota in total quality and performance. GM has the most fuel-efficient product portfolio in the world, with 59% more 30mpg models than Toyota, Honda or DCX. About one million Americans build, supply, and sell GM vehicles. In total, Toyota employs only 30,000 workers in the USA. 82% of a GM vehicle is American made, while Honda is only 49% and Toyota and other Japanese and Koreans are drastically less. GM’s contribution to the American gross national product is 4 times that of Toyota. Toyota touts the fact that it has 8 manufacturing plants in the USA today while GM had 8 manufacturing plants in 1911.

GM’s investment in America: Charitable giving- Over its nearly 100-year history, GM has poured hundreds of millions of dollars into communities all across America. Not to mention the fact that millions of more dollars are donated every year to various national charities (Make-A-Wish, American Cancer Society, Etc.) and other great causes. Most recently, GM and its employees donated $2 million to the Asian Tsunami victims. This monetary help and emergency vehicle support went to a cause over 5000 miles away.

When you consider your next vehicle purchase, first think about how many communities, parks, hospitals, colleges, and museums have been created and maintained by grants from the foreign car companies.



Just remember all of this when you support driving a Toyota.



Not to be cruel or anything but don't you think it might be slightly bias being that it came from a GM plant. Don't you think this might lean a little towards propaganda to boost moral.
Link Posted: 8/24/2005 6:48:21 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/24/2005 6:48:51 PM EDT by BSheppard]
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
General Motors engines and transmissions all out performed Toyota in total quality and performance.

HA HA HA NOT
Link Posted: 8/24/2005 6:48:35 PM EDT
Link Posted: 8/24/2005 6:48:45 PM EDT
Over 20 years as a GM, Olds, Pontiac owner.
Link Posted: 8/24/2005 6:49:58 PM EDT
I have a 99 Malibu with 3.1 V6 at 50,000 had to have the intake manifold gasket replace. Leaking coolant into block $800. From what I hear this is a very common problem.
Link Posted: 8/24/2005 6:51:15 PM EDT
If that 59% counts the same car that they market under 8 different brands, then I find that believable. For me I will only buy BMW, Audi, Volkswagen, Toyota, Lexus, Nissan, Infiniti, Honda, Acura, or Porsche.
Link Posted: 8/24/2005 6:53:15 PM EDT

Originally Posted By HighCaliber:
If that 59% counts the same car that they market under 8 different brands, then I find that believable. For me I will only buy BMW, Audi, Volkswagen, Toyota, Lexus, Nissan, Infiniti, Honda, Acura, or Porsche.



GM's F body cars of the 90's/early 00's, e.g. the camero were made in Canada. Wonder how many American Patriots bought those and didn't know?
Link Posted: 8/24/2005 6:54:23 PM EDT

Originally Posted By AssaultRifler:
I bought American!

tacoma4x4.no-ip.com/AR15s/Tacoma.jpg

Proudly made in California

\

Tundra's soon to be made in San Antonio.
Link Posted: 8/24/2005 6:55:29 PM EDT
Let's see...my toyota was made in california. I bought it second hand from a (native citizen) dealer.

Money in the hands of:

American workers (Cali Toyota. Are they UAW?)
Former owner (american resident, very likely native citizen)
Small business owners, as above

I'll level with you, I fill it at the local stop n' rob, owned by first generation immigrants.

Other than that....my car has another 250,000 miles of life in it, conservatively, after 115,000

Let me know when you get to half of that quality.

Next car...scion?
Link Posted: 8/24/2005 6:55:34 PM EDT
I have worked on enough cars to know that anyone can put out a lemon, and the quality difference between foreign and domestic cars is not that great. I have a 90' shadow with one of the best motors ever put in a car, and I will drive it until the yards are dried up of usable parts.
Link Posted: 8/24/2005 6:56:16 PM EDT

Originally Posted By AssaultRifler:

Originally Posted By HighCaliber:
If that 59% counts the same car that they market under 8 different brands, then I find that believable. For me I will only buy BMW, Audi, Volkswagen, Toyota, Lexus, Nissan, Infiniti, Honda, Acura, or Porsche.



GM's F body cars of the 90's/early 00's, e.g. the camero were made in Canada. Wonder how many American Patriots bought those and didn't know?



I know it. My previous F-bodies were made in Cali.

It still is America.
Link Posted: 8/24/2005 6:56:48 PM EDT
side topic: duzenberg. Discuss.
Link Posted: 8/24/2005 6:57:31 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Ben70:

I'll level with you, I fill it at the local stop n' rob, owned by first generation immigrants.



probably with Middle Eastern ROP gas too, you're supporting terrorists!
Link Posted: 8/24/2005 6:58:12 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/24/2005 6:58:52 PM EDT by raven]
Fuck yes I'll buy a foreign car. Best cars I've owned were foreign (Jap and Swede)

Worst car? American. 83 Olds.
Link Posted: 8/24/2005 6:59:31 PM EDT

Originally Posted By AssaultRifler:

Originally Posted By HighCaliber:
If that 59% counts the same car that they market under 8 different brands, then I find that believable. For me I will only buy BMW, Audi, Volkswagen, Toyota, Lexus, Nissan, Infiniti, Honda, Acura, or Porsche.



GM's F body cars of the 90's/early 00's, e.g. the camero were made in Canada. Wonder how many American Patriots bought those and didn't know?



They were some of the junkiest cars ever built by GM.

BigDozer66
Link Posted: 8/24/2005 6:59:56 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/24/2005 7:02:21 PM EDT by ARDOC]
That 30000 figure is incorrect. With all the suppliers and dealers etc., they employ over 200000 Americans. Toyota has a tech center in Ann Arbor, MI that alone employs several thousand white collar employees and engineers. It has purchased another several hundred acres to build more testing facilities.

My Avalanche was made in MEXICO by non UAW Mexicans. The drivetrain and tranny came from the US but the rest from God knows where.

Hyundai just opened a plant in the US and has built a tech center in Ann Arbor.

ETA: My BMW was built in Spartanburg, SC. The tranny and drivetrain from Germany. So whats the difference between that and my Avalanche?
Link Posted: 8/24/2005 7:00:58 PM EDT

Originally Posted By captainpooby:

Originally Posted By AssaultRifler:

Originally Posted By HighCaliber:
If that 59% counts the same car that they market under 8 different brands, then I find that believable. For me I will only buy BMW, Audi, Volkswagen, Toyota, Lexus, Nissan, Infiniti, Honda, Acura, or Porsche.



GM's F body cars of the 90's/early 00's, e.g. the camero were made in Canada. Wonder how many American Patriots bought those and didn't know?



I know it. My previous F-bodies were made in Cali.

It still is America.



I had one of those F body Camaros. Damn sucky these days but it was the shit in high school.
Link Posted: 8/24/2005 7:01:04 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/24/2005 7:01:30 PM EDT by TheCynic]
I really like my Ford Ranger, but my next
car will probably be an Acura.

I've yet to see an American car that has
the styling and ergonomics of a Japanese
or German car.

In fact, once I buy that foriegn car, I'll
drive it to the packie for some Irish beer
and some Russian vodka. Then I'll head
over to WalMart to by some cheap ChiCom
shit and some ammo for my Warsaw Pact,
commie guns.

Just to piss you guys off.
Link Posted: 8/24/2005 7:01:13 PM EDT
Is this info skewed by lumping in GM's goofy European-only models (tiny cars that'd fit you, a poodle, and a cantaloupe)?

Link Posted: 8/24/2005 7:03:34 PM EDT

Originally Posted By leakycow:
Is this info skewed by lumping in GM's goofy European-only models (tiny cars that'd fit you, a poodle, and a cantaloupe)?




Yup, none of their small econo boxes are made or sold in the USA. And those vehicles are made in their respective countries NOT the USA.
Link Posted: 8/24/2005 7:04:43 PM EDT

Originally Posted By shop_rat45:
From our daily news letter at the Lake Orion GM Assembly plant I work at:


One American Car Company is Beating the Japanese Car Companies…
General Motors and its UAW members produce more top quality vehicles overall than any other global automaker except Toyota and beats them in many product segments, according to J.D. Power Initial Quality Study survey. General Motors engines and transmissions all out performed Toyota in total quality and performance. GM has the most fuel-efficient product portfolio in the world, with 59% more 30mpg models than Toyota, Honda or DCX. About one million Americans build, supply, and sell GM vehicles. In total, Toyota employs only 30,000 workers in the USA. 82% of a GM vehicle is American made, while Honda is only 49% and Toyota and other Japanese and Koreans are drastically less. GM’s contribution to the American gross national product is 4 times that of Toyota. Toyota touts the fact that it has 8 manufacturing plants in the USA today while GM had 8 manufacturing plants in 1911.

GM’s investment in America: Charitable giving- Over its nearly 100-year history, GM has poured hundreds of millions of dollars into communities all across America. Not to mention the fact that millions of more dollars are donated every year to various national charities (Make-A-Wish, American Cancer Society, Etc.) and other great causes. Most recently, GM and its employees donated $2 million to the Asian Tsunami victims. This monetary help and emergency vehicle support went to a cause over 5000 miles away.

When you consider your next vehicle purchase, first think about how many communities, parks, hospitals, colleges, and museums have been created and maintained by grants from the foreign car companies.



Just remember all of this when you support driving a Toyota.



The JDP Initial Quality Survey covers THE FIRST THREE MONTHS OF OWNERSHIP.

To claim that your cars are among the best in the world over what happens in the first three months of ownership is A FUCKING JOKE.

Link Posted: 8/24/2005 7:04:54 PM EDT

Originally Posted By shop_rat45:
From our daily news letter at the Lake Orion GM Assembly plant I work at:


One American Car Company is Beating the Japanese Car Companies…
General Motors and its UAW members produce more top quality vehicles overall than any other global automaker except Toyota and beats them in many product segments, according to J.D. Power Initial Quality Study survey. General Motors engines and transmissions all out performed Toyota in total quality and performance. GM has the most fuel-efficient product portfolio in the world, with 59% more 30mpg models than Toyota, Honda or DCX. About one million Americans build, supply, and sell GM vehicles. In total, Toyota employs only 30,000 workers in the USA. 82% of a GM vehicle is American made, while Honda is only 49% and Toyota and other Japanese and Koreans are drastically less. GM’s contribution to the American gross national product is 4 times that of Toyota. Toyota touts the fact that it has 8 manufacturing plants in the USA today while GM had 8 manufacturing plants in 1911.

GM’s investment in America: Charitable giving- Over its nearly 100-year history, GM has poured hundreds of millions of dollars into communities all across America. Not to mention the fact that millions of more dollars are donated every year to various national charities (Make-A-Wish, American Cancer Society, Etc.) and other great causes. Most recently, GM and its employees donated $2 million to the Asian Tsunami victims. This monetary help and emergency vehicle support went to a cause over 5000 miles away.

When you consider your next vehicle purchase, first think about how many communities, parks, hospitals, colleges, and museums have been created and maintained by grants from the foreign car companies.



Just remember all of this when you support driving a Toyota.



Bullshit.
Ever heard of piston slap ? www.pistonslap.com
You couldn't give me a newer Chevy. My 1990 Suburban though is another story. Built when they were still trucks not soccer mom wagons.
IF and when GM ever figures out what Toyotas doing they will be a force in the automotive industry but they haven't gotten it yet and they sure don't seem to be trying to.
Link Posted: 8/24/2005 7:09:17 PM EDT

Originally Posted By SPECTRE:

Originally Posted By shop_rat45:
From our daily news letter at the Lake Orion GM Assembly plant I work at:


One American Car Company is Beating the Japanese Car Companies…
General Motors and its UAW members produce more top quality vehicles overall than any other global automaker except Toyota and beats them in many product segments, according to J.D. Power Initial Quality Study survey. General Motors engines and transmissions all out performed Toyota in total quality and performance. GM has the most fuel-efficient product portfolio in the world, with 59% more 30mpg models than Toyota, Honda or DCX. About one million Americans build, supply, and sell GM vehicles. In total, Toyota employs only 30,000 workers in the USA. 82% of a GM vehicle is American made, while Honda is only 49% and Toyota and other Japanese and Koreans are drastically less. GM’s contribution to the American gross national product is 4 times that of Toyota. Toyota touts the fact that it has 8 manufacturing plants in the USA today while GM had 8 manufacturing plants in 1911.

GM’s investment in America: Charitable giving- Over its nearly 100-year history, GM has poured hundreds of millions of dollars into communities all across America. Not to mention the fact that millions of more dollars are donated every year to various national charities (Make-A-Wish, American Cancer Society, Etc.) and other great causes. Most recently, GM and its employees donated $2 million to the Asian Tsunami victims. This monetary help and emergency vehicle support went to a cause over 5000 miles away.

When you consider your next vehicle purchase, first think about how many communities, parks, hospitals, colleges, and museums have been created and maintained by grants from the foreign car companies.



Just remember all of this when you support driving a Toyota.



Bullshit.
Ever heard of piston slap ? www.pistonslap.com
You couldn't give me a newer Chevy. My 1990 Suburban though is another story. Built when they were still trucks not soccer mom wagons.
IF and when GM ever figures out what Toyotas doing they will be a force in the automotive industry but they haven't gotten it yet and they sure don't seem to be trying to.



Ah, the fabled piston slap, so says GM. But then why are the quietly replacing the 5.7 V8s? First they said it was normal and that it was only noise. Then when engines wore out prematurely and then failed in large numbers they started replacing them. But very quietly.
Link Posted: 8/24/2005 7:10:13 PM EDT
Hahahahaha
Link Posted: 8/24/2005 7:10:22 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/24/2005 7:10:56 PM EDT by Pangea]
I'll buy what the fuck I want with MY MONEY and no UAW socialist is going to tell me what to do. Stick your COLLECTIVE barganing up your comrad.
Link Posted: 8/24/2005 7:10:35 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/24/2005 7:12:40 PM EDT by dugedug]
My wifes Mercedes Ml320 is assembled in the U.S. But the fine german parts make up for the monkeys putting it together.


If anything has more than 30 20 moving parts, let the germans deal with it.
Link Posted: 8/24/2005 7:14:12 PM EDT
I don't recall Ford or GM calling an American workforce untrainable. I'm on our side.
Link Posted: 8/24/2005 7:15:14 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Rabon:
I don't recall Ford or GM calling an American workforce untrainable. I'm on our side.


Trust me, they are.
Link Posted: 8/24/2005 7:16:00 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Pangea:
I'll buy what the fuck I want with MY MONEY and no UAW socialist is going to tell me what to do. Stick your COLLECTIVE barganing up your comrad.



Pangea, please tell us how you really feel about UAW vrs Toyota.
Link Posted: 8/24/2005 7:20:49 PM EDT
GM has had it's fingers in Toyotas ass for almost
20 years . Several years ago they announced plans
to build 12 new models in a joint venture .

It never happened because the other manf's
bitched and moaned to the govt that GM/Toyota
would have an unfair advantage because the cars
could be sold in Japan without the tariffs imposed
on other so called imports .

Besides , would you really buy a Toylet
Link Posted: 8/24/2005 7:22:33 PM EDT
I bought an "American Made Car" for my wife, a Chevrolet Avao.
Made in Korea by Dawoo, manufactured by Koreans with Korean parts.

Link Posted: 8/24/2005 7:26:05 PM EDT
My parents had Olds, Buick 20 some years ago and they sucked. I gave Chrysler another chance 5 years ago and they still sucked. Until Toyota and Honda starts sucking as bad as the big three, I'll continue buying them. But hey, who am I to argue against an article written by, no other than, someone with an interest in GM
Link Posted: 8/24/2005 7:26:39 PM EDT
After owning Toyotas for 12 years, figured I'd take advantage of my brother-in-law's GM discount and bought a '97 Z71. Tranny blew at 860 miles (yes, 8-HUNDRED-60). Biggest POS I ever owned. Sold it before the warranty expired, figured lightning can't strike twice, bought a '99 Z71. Second-biggest POS I've ever owned.

Went back to Toyota after all that.
Link Posted: 8/24/2005 7:31:01 PM EDT
I find GM hit or miss
as for new cars all I have bought is GM
my 96 vette was great ( but it was the last year of the body style)
My 02 S10 ZR2 was great ( next to last year of body style )
My 04 Colorado is OK at best couple of little issues at 30K miles (first year of body style)
From what i have seen with my cars and my folks DO NOT GET THE FIRST YEAR OF A NEW MODEL/BODYSTYLE
as for used cars i do not care who made it is already here and made its impact on the economy good or bad
Link Posted: 8/24/2005 7:32:25 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/24/2005 7:32:51 PM EDT by DK-Prof]

American car manufacturers have been SHUTTING DOWN plants, and shifting work to Mexico, putting American workers out of work.

Japanese car manufactures ahev been BUILDING new plants in the U.S., hiring American workers.



Tell me again how GM is so wonderful?

And if GM is so fucking great, how come their bond status is JUNK ??
Link Posted: 8/24/2005 7:38:12 PM EDT
So what is an American vehicle - the definition has changed a few times over the years to deal with assembly, parts count, etc.

When I worked at a Ford dealer in the 80s, the Bronco II transmissions were French.

The trans in my '88 Mustang LX 5.0 was made by Mazda.

My Avalanche was assembled in GTO, Mexico (wherever that is...)

My Wife's 4 day old Accord was built in Marysville, Ohio. I have driven by that plant once - what a monster! The Accord has only 15% Japanese content (the transmission) and it specifies that the engine is U.S. made.

I love Harley-Davidson - unlike other companies who can't run out of the U.S. fast enough, HD has actually built new plants in the U.S. But even American HD uses foreign parts - Showa (Honda) suspension, Japanese electronics and carbs, and I believe one of the F.I. systems is european (not positive, one is U.S. - Delphi)

Bottom line is it's damn hard to tell what constitutes an American vehicle - Foreign manufacturers have been investing in the U.S. market for decades - Mazda, Honda, Toyota, Kawasaki, BMW, and I'm sure others have plants here, offices here, distribution here - All employing Americans. To me, that beats the shit out of building a vehicle employing foreign parts, foreign labor, shipping it to the U.S. with it's "domestic" badging and trying to wrap itself in the flag of Americana. Who are they kidding? And to top it off, they pocket the savings from the cheap costs outside the U.S. - no savings to the consumer and no wages in American workers pockets.
Link Posted: 8/24/2005 7:39:19 PM EDT

Originally Posted By NotMrWizard:
After owning Toyotas for 12 years, figured I'd take advantage of my brother-in-law's GM discount and bought a '97 Z71. Tranny blew at 860 miles (yes, 8-HUNDRED-60). Biggest POS I ever owned. Sold it before the warranty expired, figured lightning can't strike twice, bought a '99 Z71. Second-biggest POS I've ever owned.

Went back to Toyota after all that.



There's nothing like that sinking feeling... "I just bought a POS!" You tend to get this when you hit repair number five in as many months of ownership, and they can't even fix the first problem you brought the car in with. Good God, that's a crummy feeling, knowing your stupid lemon's gonna rot away your bank account seven minutes after the warranty expires. There's nothing like that panicked feeling of "I gotta get rid of this POS! Everybody knows it sucked except me! "

Those experiences are almost always brought to you courtesy of the fine engineers and union professionals at General Manglers.

Funny, I've never had that problem with any Japanese car I've owned except a Mitsubishi truck from the 80's that was the WORST POS I have ever even HEARD of!

My current BMW isn't too bad, but weirder problems you've never had with a car! The big stuff on a Bimmer is always mega-reliable (ze fate of Der Reich depends upon you driving ze slave workers HARDER, Hans!), but the little foibles are wicked expensive to repair.
Link Posted: 8/24/2005 7:41:00 PM EDT
American car companies need to stop relying on the "American-made" bs to sell cars. Buying something simply because of the location of the company's HQ is ignorant at best. Unless of course you can afford to spend 20k+ on something based on principle, especially a weak principle such as an "American" car.
Link Posted: 8/24/2005 7:41:49 PM EDT

Originally Posted By TodaysTomSawyer:
So what is an American vehicle - the definition has changed a few times over the years to deal with assembly, parts count, etc.

When I worked at a Ford dealer in the 80s, the Bronco II transmissions were French.

The trans in my '88 Mustang LX 5.0 was made by Mazda.

My Avalanche was assembled in GTO, Mexico (wherever that is...)

My Wife's 4 day old Accord was built in Marysville, Ohio. I have driven by that plant once - what a monster! The Accord has only 15% Japanese content (the transmission) and it specifies that the engine is U.S. made.

I love Harley-Davidson - unlike other companies who can't run out of the U.S. fast enough, HD has actually built new plants in the U.S. But even American HD uses foreign parts - Showa (Honda) suspension, Japanese electronics and carbs, and I believe one of the F.I. systems is european (not positive, one is U.S. - Delphi)

Bottom line is it's damn hard to tell what constitutes an American vehicle - Foreign manufacturers have been investing in the U.S. market for decades - Mazda, Honda, Toyota, Kawasaki, BMW, and I'm sure others have plants here, offices here, distribution here - All employing Americans. To me, that beats the shit out of building a vehicle employing foreign parts, foreign labor, shipping it to the U.S. with it's "domestic" badging and trying to wrap itself in the flag of Americana. Who are they kidding? And to top it off, they pocket the savings from the cheap costs outside the U.S. - no savings to the consumer and no wages in American workers pockets.



I see you get it.
Link Posted: 8/24/2005 7:42:51 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/24/2005 7:43:02 PM EDT by DK-Prof]
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