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Posted: 10/7/2002 5:35:46 AM EDT
i got to thinking about this, & from what i & many of you have read, the terrorists have it in their plan for this type of shooting terror, i belive it is designed to cause our politicians to dissarm us........ BUT !! before that happens, do any of you plan on carrying your weapons ? i do not mean little pop gun pistols, i am talking real fire power !! what defensive measures are you taking..., if any ?? i have a "Colt Carbine", that i carry in my vehicle & 5, 30 rnd mags filled, plus a 9mm handgun that i carry concealed...... in Arizona we are allowed to carry.., in different ways.., we are the "Old West" !!
Link Posted: 10/7/2002 5:41:36 AM EDT
Originally Posted By CactusJack: i got to thinking about this, & from what i & many of you have read, the terrorists have it in their plan for this type of shooting terror, i belive it is designed to cause our politicians to dissarm us........
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Ummmmm, so who are the "terrorists"?? Who benefits most?
Link Posted: 10/7/2002 5:45:11 AM EDT
Yeah, drive around with a rifle [b]WHEN THE COPS ARE LOOKING FOR A BG WITH A RIFLE[/B] That doesn't sound like a plan to me.
Link Posted: 10/7/2002 6:18:18 AM EDT
Originally Posted By fight4yourrights: Yeah, drive around with a rifle [b]WHEN THE COPS ARE LOOKING FOR A BG WITH A RIFLE[/B] That doesn't sound like a plan to me.
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So you are saying that since cops are looking for someone with a rifle, that you would rather be a victim than protect yourself and others?
Link Posted: 10/7/2002 6:23:02 AM EDT
Fight- Cactus Jack (like myself) is in Arizona.. Worst case, we might encounter a transfer officer from Kali, or the east coast who has a problem with citizens owning firearms.. I haven't changed my carry habits, because of some incident on the east coast.(Draw conclusions accordingly) Meplat-
Link Posted: 10/7/2002 6:25:46 AM EDT
i realize you are in Pa. & next door to the current shootings, so you apparently are ignorant of our laws here..... also the purpose is to be prepared when the SHTF, & it is going to hit the fan in a big way..., according to the terrorists... i do not plan on being unarmed when some terrorist is shooting my fellow Americans, you may run, hide & duck.., but i plan on fighting back, i am also certain that IF anything happens in the area i am in & a cop is pinned down & all he has is 9mm Glock he'd shure as hell appreciate my assistance...... with more than a million terrorist in this country, i belive street fighting is a possibility & i do not want to be 20 or 30 miles away from my protection when they start shooting.....
Link Posted: 10/7/2002 6:29:27 AM EDT
... WTF [b]CactusJack[/b], were in Arizona, we always carry our weapons with us. On a more serious note, using cell phones, , CCW, and proven surveillance tactics and zone partitioning like the "BULLSEYE" technique organize and just [b]DO IT[/b]. Beg for forgiveness later after us law abiding citizens turn over the purp to authorities hog tied in iron cuffs.
Link Posted: 10/7/2002 6:31:25 AM EDT
Link Posted: 10/7/2002 6:36:47 AM EDT
Originally Posted By CactusJack: i realize you are in Pa. & next door to the current shootings, so you apparently are ignorant of our laws here.....
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I just fled Maryland after living 11 years there. You aren't aware of the situation in Maryland. They were confiscating guns and arrest folks for no real reason BEFORE this occurred. You can't be driving around with an AR-15 in Maryland. You couldn't before this, and you'll probably be killed if you try it now. They shot a kid in the face with an M4 for complying with a FBI agent's demands awhile back. Maryland is a WHOLE OTHER WORLD. I probably wouldn't even go to the range right now. You get pulled over with a AR-15 in the trunk and I'll bet it gets confiscated for ballistics testing (and you won't get it back) and you'll be in handcuffs.
Link Posted: 10/7/2002 6:37:30 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 10/7/2002 6:39:03 AM EDT by BigT]
Originally Posted By Paul: SO in an urban situation while going about your business exactly how does one protect himself with a rifle from a sniper?
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Exactly. You're riding around with all your firepower waiting for a run in with a sniper and the next thing you know your brains are dripping off of your windshield.
Link Posted: 10/7/2002 6:45:26 AM EDT
About all you can do is be very aware of your surroundings. Look for anything that does not look right, trust your instincts and get the hell out of there.
Link Posted: 10/7/2002 6:45:36 AM EDT
Originally Posted By CactusJack: i am also certain that IF anything happens in the area i am in & a cop is pinned down & all he has is 9mm Glock he'd shure as hell appreciate my assistance......
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CJ, Im sure you have a good relationship with the local PD, just as I do. I shoot with many of them on a regular basis, even gave them a Carbine Class right after 9/11. They even Jokeingly refer to me as their "Swat" team. The problem with talking about this on a internet site is that someone may just start carrying, then there is an incident, and when they pull out their AR and go to take up a support position the cops think they are a bad guy and shoot them instead. There is the West, smalltown America and the East, way different animals
Link Posted: 10/7/2002 6:48:19 AM EDT
Have to stick w/ Fight's point on this one boys, we don't need anymore bad publicity at this time. It's not a good idea to pack your AR around, if something happens around you and your locale the best thing you could do it attempt to identify the suspects and inform the authorities, not go off half-cocked. You may know your a good guy but the second a cop pulls up and sees some yahoo exiting his vehicle w/ an AR, [b]what's he gonna think?[/b] Better to do everthing you can to get a positive ID on the perpetrators and pass it on to the police. I can and do carry concealed everyday and while a 45acp is no match for a rifle let's not get so paranoid that we forget our common sense. Given the threads posted recently about all the vistors surfing the site what sort of impression do you wish to make on them? That we're a bunch of paranoid gun nuts? I hope not. I am fully aware of the carry options in AZ, but please use some smarts about what and how we post and in this instance Fight was only pointing out the obvious, when the cops, Feds and every LEO on the eastern seaboard is looking for ARs in vehicles, suggesting folks tote one makes little sense at all. My 2, Mike
Link Posted: 10/7/2002 6:57:11 AM EDT
I mentioned from a previous thread last friday right after the VA shooting that my co-worker here in my office heard that her sister was barely 3 yds from the lady shot in front of the Michaels parking lot. Unfortunately, i wasnt able to get anymore details then but i did talk to my coworker this morning - so here are some observations that might help: This lady(my coworker's sister) happens to be married to a Spotsylvania County PO, coincidentally. She was actually in the line of fire (ie closer to the shooter) but just by the luck of the draw - she wasnt the target. The bullet passed by her by maybe 3 ft or less. The shot was fired from a Pizza Hut store(either from inside a vehicle or on foot - they dont know or not telling) which was across the parking lot and across a road(assume a mall type access road). The police did recover a 223 brass casing (semi auto or bolt action will do that)- but i dont know if from the parking lot tarmac or alongside the pizza hut structure itself. It seems that the shooter(s) has really good knowledge of tactics-for it apprears that he/she/they being across the road and parking lot had a clear way out on the other side of the pizza hut. In the confusion, with cars accelerating away in the parking lot itself, nobody really was focused that far way across the road and behind another structure(Pizza Hut). These sickos are good. It's orange for me everytime i'm outside. DD
Link Posted: 10/7/2002 7:00:45 AM EDT
Link Posted: 10/7/2002 7:03:34 AM EDT
Link Posted: 10/7/2002 7:15:11 AM EDT
I think until this blows over, the whole .223 thing you know, we should have lever action .30-30s in the trunk. Not as threatening appearence, more than enough to take out a sniper at 200 yards. And it's not going to be mistaken easily for a .223 semiauto (unless it's some IDIOT). Having a .223 semiauto in the trunk and getting caught with it is going to put you under suspiction. A .30-30 probably wouldn't. Or a .45-70 for you power freaks. Just my two cents.
Link Posted: 10/7/2002 7:30:27 AM EDT
Wear camouflage, pack 1911, stay low, and keep moving at all times when exposed.
Link Posted: 10/7/2002 7:39:14 AM EDT
Originally Posted By Forest: 1) Wear dark color shirts (preferably black) - unless the sniper has an illuminated reticle it will make it harder for them to get a precise sight picture.
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Clever - hadn't occurred to me.
Link Posted: 10/7/2002 7:45:21 AM EDT
Originally Posted By CactusJack: what defensive measures are you taking..., if any ??
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Hiding in closet, fetal position, wetting pants.
Link Posted: 10/7/2002 7:48:58 AM EDT
"Snipers Shooting In Your Home Town, what will you do ??" we HAD our local sniper. he killed 5 people. we didn't do shit. they caught the guy and put him in jail.
Link Posted: 10/7/2002 8:04:18 AM EDT
Bit of a long story, but it is appropriate so here goes. As I reported in another thread regarding the Maryland shootings, my intention was to carry my AR during this time of random terror attacks. (Carrying a loaded weapon of pretty much any type is legal in NM as long as it is in your vehicle.) I have been following through on this intention, everytime I go anywhere in my truck. On Sunday, I took the truck to northern New Mexico and packed my AR with my golf clubs and off we went. As an unintended consequence of installing oversized tires on my truck, my speedometer was low by about 7mph and my 85mph indicated speed was actually 91mph, a fact that was pointed out to me by a New Mexico State Police officer after he pulled me over.[;)] As he came to the passenger side window, he asked if I was armed. (I later found out that he noticed the AR15.com liscence plate ring!) I answered yes and that I had an AR, and then I pointed to it as it was under my legs in front of the front seat. He made no mention of the weapon at that time but asked me why I was armed. I answered that I believed in the 2nd Ammendment and the RKBA and that I did not trust my or my family's safety to anyone else. His only response was a hearfelt 'excellent', kind of like a good teacher will do when a student answers a difficult question correctly. Anyway, he asked me to hand him my rifle, and I did so with a bit of hesitation, he took my baby back to his car as he checked the S/N. The officer then pu my rifle in his cruiser and came back to my truck with a ticket. He changed the speed for me to get a bit of a lowered fine and saved me $40.00! But he still had my rifle! I was beginning o get worried when he came back to the window and asked me to come back to his car. OH SHIT!!! I've seen every episode of COPS and things are never better after going to the cruiser with a cop! We get to his car and he hands me my rifle and compliments it then points to the M4 he has nest to his seat. Anyway, we swap info on the merits of different add-ons for different tactical scenarios, and after several minutes, I am free to go. I told him about AR15.com and hopefully we will see one of the most professional and courteous officers I have ever dealt with here on the boards!
Link Posted: 10/7/2002 8:12:50 AM EDT
Find a big flat rock to hide under!!!!!!!! But given the chance I would shoot back.
Link Posted: 10/7/2002 8:58:39 AM EDT
If he were to miss me; I would go home, get my Weatherby 30-06, check to see if he is still around, find his hiding place, chamber a round, line his head up in the cross hairs, breath, relax, aim, squeeze slowly. Of course, this is assuming there is no police presence, and TSHTF. If there is a police presence, I'll ask permission first if there is no swat team. More than likely, there is no swat team in Palmyra, New York.
Link Posted: 10/7/2002 9:20:55 AM EDT
Offer to provide surveillance assistance even if it is just sitting on a rooftop with binox and radio. They're failing and need all the help they can get.
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