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9/22/2017 12:11:25 AM
Posted: 12/8/2003 7:19:14 PM EDT
Does anyone know what kind of training in the use of small arms is standard in the Navy? I’m not talking about the SEALS here, just for an average sailor.
Link Posted: 12/8/2003 7:30:27 PM EDT
I went to RTC Great Lakes In Feb 1986 and 1 yes 1 entire day was spent on the range. More advanced training came when I arrived onboard my first ship. My duty station was security force. Running around with loaded weapons yelling at people to get down!
Link Posted: 12/8/2003 7:51:03 PM EDT
i was in navy boot in july 2003. all we did was a small arms simulator with the m9 and the mossberg shotty...it was some air powered crap. then a few weeks later we shot about 30 live rounds from the m9...about two hours of safety total and the range people were fuckin psychos. pretty much, it sucked
Link Posted: 12/8/2003 7:53:57 PM EDT
Not much from what I heard. I have aguy at work who is in the Naval reserves after 7 or 8 years active and he told me last time he fired a weapon was in 1999 when he was qualified with 1911 and M16. He said he never even touch a weapon since.
Link Posted: 12/8/2003 8:24:48 PM EDT
OK where to start. Boot Camp: Not much small arms training here, basic marksmanship stuff. There just isn't the facilities in Great Lakes. Fleet Training: Basically, the fleet small arms instructors go for basic weapons training. How to load, field strip the weapon, and qualify on a course of fire to demonstrate competance with the weapon. The purpose here is to get people qualified to stand watches. There is a push to get firearms simulators, PRISM, FATS, Beamhit systems, etc., to the fleet. Also the requirement for qualifications has increased, meaning we have to shoot more. This is where training can get really good if you have some creative Gunner's Mates and a CO who doesn't mind shooting alot. Schools: This is where the Navy is doing better. There are currently two shooting schools and one tactics school meant for the average sailor. One shooting school focuses on refining marksmanship. The other school is a stressor course. The tactics school is probably the most practical in that it's force on force using Simunitions or paintballs depending on the facilities. The last two years has seen the Navy moving in what I think is the right direction. The argument will always be that we can do more, but the whole picture must be taken into account. The Navy, by and large, employs systems when going to war. We don't employ many individuals to engage in actual combat. Of course those individuals that do get much, much more small arms training. As it stands now most fleet personnel get just as much or more firearms training than most police officers in the country.
Link Posted: 12/8/2003 8:50:12 PM EDT
dport has it right. Unless you're a ship's Master-at-Arms (cop) or part of the Weapons Department (they do armament security and access security) you're not going to see much. The guys who stand Officer-of-the-Deck (OOD) qualify with pistol for watch standing but really, if we're using small arms something is wrong. On shore duty we have plenty of Marines, MAA's, or even civilian cops to stand protection watches. Small to me is the .50 caliber, the 25 mm Bushmaster chain guns or the 20 mm Phalanx CIWS.
Link Posted: 12/8/2003 9:02:17 PM EDT
Back IN 1980 we didn't get much in Boot Camp, If I remember Correctly, it was only about a days worth. I was an Aviation Ordnanceman/ Naval Aircrewman after that we got all the small arms training we wanted and then some.
Link Posted: 12/8/2003 11:06:43 PM EDT
It must be getting better. When I sttod OOD we never shot. I guessed they assumed we learned somewhere. Reserves if we bought our own ammo, then we shot pistols about every other year. Rifles once in 14 years, M-14s and that only after our gaining command yelled about if we showed up after SHTF one of the other jobs we would do was Provisional Rifle Brigade. M-14s are fun, but the ladies that had never held a rifle before were a little overwhelmed.
Link Posted: 12/8/2003 11:35:40 PM EDT
Small arms training in the Navy...
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...is a joke.
Link Posted: 12/9/2003 7:40:06 AM EDT
sounds a lot like the Air Force? not much firearms training unless it's part of your AFSC or MOS.
Link Posted: 12/9/2003 7:48:38 AM EDT
Originally Posted By Paul: dport has it right. Unless you're a ship's Master-at-Arms (cop) or part of the Weapons Department (they do armament security and access security) you're not going to see much. The guys who stand Officer-of-the-Deck (OOD) qualify with pistol for watch standing but really, if we're using small arms something is wrong. On shore duty we have plenty of Marines, MAA's, or even civilian cops to stand protection watches. Small to me is the .50 caliber, the 25 mm Bushmaster chain guns or the 20 mm Phalanx CIWS.
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That's about the size of it.... Hell, you spend more time learning how to fight fires and control flooding than you do learning how to fight your ship so it doesn't get hit in the first place!
Link Posted: 12/9/2003 7:50:01 AM EDT
Originally Posted By Thunderbolt: sounds a lot like the Air Force? not much firearms training unless it's part of your AFSC or MOS.
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I think youre 100% correct in this assessment. I mean, at my command we had to frigging PAY to get weapons quals...But Ill leave this to the older guys, since i havent even seen sea time yet [:)]
Link Posted: 12/9/2003 8:09:03 AM EDT
By small arms training in the Navy do you mean little midgets running around jerking off sailors? How are they scored?
Link Posted: 12/9/2003 8:46:14 AM EDT
No No NO , that's short arm training. there's always the 10% that don't get it.
Link Posted: 12/10/2003 9:25:08 AM EDT
Boot camp 1971, San Diego, we shot the M1 Garand and the .45. Never touched another U.S. firearm during the next 4+ years.
Link Posted: 12/10/2003 9:29:07 AM EDT
Small Arms training? in the Navy? [lol] I was at RTC San Diego in 1991. We shot 30 rounds of .22 through a mock-.45. If you're going in to be an MAA or something, you'll get more, but the plain vanilla sailor got jack squat in arms training. Scott
Link Posted: 12/10/2003 10:30:56 AM EDT
From what I remember my dad telling me, when he was in the extent of his small arms training was the M1 Garand initially. He also had some training in the .38Special revolver & nightstick when he was assigned to SP duty & the M16 when he was attatched to the SeaBees when the went to VN.
Link Posted: 12/10/2003 11:00:15 AM EDT
Like I said earlier it depends on your command. Last year my command expended over 30,000 rounds of 25mm/40mm and smaller for training. The command has 30 people assigned to it. 1,000 rounds per person per year isn't that bad considering the command before that I shot ~100 rounds per year (48 9mm, 10 12ga, and the odd .50 or 7.62mm here and there). Some commands refuse to ask for more NCEA. I haven't been told 'no' yet.
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