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9/22/2017 12:11:25 AM
Posted: 5/10/2002 12:26:53 PM EDT
Should we toss the Bill of Rights? In recent times "we"baned guns because the way they look, here we stop discussion because "we" don't like the direction the conversation is going. Should any club or directors of the club have that kind of power?
Link Posted: 5/10/2002 12:32:12 PM EDT
We already have.....but to be serious, I have been thinking about this lately. Why do people as employees have less rights than prisoners? When did business become the entity talked about in "We the people....". And seriously I do not understand why any organization has the authority to override my BOR rights.....but just wait...I smell a lawyer coming and he can tell you-----money----right Eric Hunny----the people with the most make the rules......
Link Posted: 5/10/2002 12:34:08 PM EDT
Link Posted: 5/10/2002 12:41:21 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 5/10/2002 12:42:55 PM EDT by 308wood]
why are the first ten amendments to the constitution called the bill of rights? they don't give rights. they outline that the government can't lawfully take away certain rights. shouldn't we call them "the amendments for controlling the government".
Link Posted: 5/10/2002 12:50:29 PM EDT
Link Posted: 5/10/2002 1:05:34 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 5/10/2002 1:10:36 PM EDT by hound]
"The BOR has nothing to do with.." I am sorry but that doesn't figure...can you give me legitimate constitutional reasons for the suspension of the BOR on this board? Articles 9 and 10 specifically. I may not have the protection against congress as stated in amend 1 for free speech, because as far as I know Goatboy is not a member of congress...but where does it say that a corporate entity or other body can infringe on the God-given rights--- And please do not take this as an attack on this board. I follow Goatboys rules because it is polite to do so and I thank him for this club house. But saying that anyone can take responsibility for my rights and go beyond what is written is ludicrous. Specifically big business and their you can't do these things....
Link Posted: 5/10/2002 1:06:42 PM EDT
I would like to thank ARgon raf 308 and es...for helping to decide on my sig-line.....smoochies.
Link Posted: 5/10/2002 1:15:38 PM EDT
Link Posted: 5/10/2002 1:19:56 PM EDT
Link Posted: 5/10/2002 1:27:29 PM EDT
Raf...I got that argument and I agree(I hope GB spanks me first)...but does that mean here I am rightless? !st amend is rather tangled but let's take the second...if this place were physical...is goatboy's club covered by shall not be infringed or no? And to your last line---what restricts GB from doing anything he wants to me? laws passed by gov't? see it is a circular argument. Es same question...what stops me from making sure ya don't come to my house and KTSOOM?
Link Posted: 5/10/2002 1:46:21 PM EDT
Link Posted: 5/10/2002 1:47:37 PM EDT
Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech----Ok to continue...this says I have freedom of speech,yes? and that Government can't make laws against it yes? Now where does it say that every other Tom, dick and harry can make rules about what I say? And why would you describe this state of being as freedom of speech?
Link Posted: 5/10/2002 1:55:52 PM EDT
Really well written but--What applies to the gov't doesn't apply to me in my house? Oh really...the I have no expectations of life,or liberty, or the pursuit of happiness. Shall not be infringed---not by you or shrub or little green men...or am I confused and not reading these four words correctly? I don't see any allowance for you or anyone to change this...you can ask and I will leave....but it is not your right to break my rights. woohoo this has been fun...just trying to try to get someone else to see the other side......going to Philly now...
Link Posted: 5/10/2002 1:56:52 PM EDT
Link Posted: 5/10/2002 2:02:09 PM EDT
If they are going to get rid of the BOR, I wish they would just hurry up and do it already.
Link Posted: 5/10/2002 2:11:15 PM EDT
ooops raf won't let me go....I know raf...everyone thinks they can run my life...I am asking where did this notion come from? If I tell you 2+2=4---we can agree yes...? But the idea that freedom=everyone can tell you what to do doesn't figure........
Link Posted: 5/10/2002 2:11:46 PM EDT
Raf, maybe it would be constructive for us (members) to know what is offensive in your house. I was under the impression that this was in fact our house. So far, nothing here (in this thread) seems to be impinging on the rulings of your house, therefore, I hope you will "allow" this to run a reasonable course.
Link Posted: 5/10/2002 2:14:39 PM EDT
Originally Posted By hound: But the idea that freedom=everyone can tell you what to do doesn't figure........
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So when I'm at your house, you don't mind if steal cash out of your wallet, tear up your furniture, have sex with your wife, etc.? Freedom means I get to do whatever I want, right?
Link Posted: 5/10/2002 2:18:10 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 5/10/2002 2:20:32 PM EDT by raf]
Link Posted: 5/10/2002 2:19:23 PM EDT
Originally Posted By BostonTeaParty:
Originally Posted By hound: But the idea that freedom=everyone can tell you what to do doesn't figure........
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So when I'm at your house, you don't mind if steal cash out of your wallet, tear up your furniture, have sex with your wife, etc.? Freedom means I get to do whatever I want, right?
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I find stealing, destroying property, and rape (or adultry) a streach from speaking your mind.
Link Posted: 5/10/2002 2:25:29 PM EDT
My point was that it is obvious that freedom has limits. You bring the Bill of Rights into this when it obviously has no application. We as humans have rights. We can discuss that. But the Bill of Rights is irrelevant. It puts limitations on government. That is not the issue here, so why bring it into the discussion?
Link Posted: 5/10/2002 2:27:35 PM EDT
Link Posted: 5/10/2002 2:37:45 PM EDT
Originally Posted By BostonTeaParty: My point was that it is obvious that freedom has limits. You bring the Bill of Rights into this when it obviously has no application. We as humans have rights. We can discuss that. But the Bill of Rights is irrelevant. It puts limitations on government. That is not the issue here, so why bring it into the discussion?
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You're right teaparty, the bill of rights is nothing more than a statement of the rights of man, which transcends the constitution. We as a free people have these right as endowed to our species. I can in fact say what I wish, and take the consequence of rebutal. As Raf says the hand should stop at the nose, not necessarily before. Who makes the call on speech? Yes, fire in a safe building is a bad thing, but is bringing about discussion of some issues not allowed, while other offensive ones are, okay?
Link Posted: 5/10/2002 2:47:15 PM EDT
Link Posted: 5/10/2002 2:57:18 PM EDT
So how come I can't run naked into the house across the street with a gun and yell "screw you and prepare to eat lead ya lilly livered scoundrel!". It's a free country right? [:D] Hound, I believe all of your guaranteed rights end at that point where they step on my guaranteed rights.
Link Posted: 5/10/2002 6:18:49 PM EDT
Originally Posted By raf:
Originally Posted By ARgon:
Originally Posted By BostonTeaParty: My point was that it is obvious that freedom has limits. You bring the Bill of Rights into this when it obviously has no application. We as humans have rights. We can discuss that. But the Bill of Rights is irrelevant. It puts limitations on government. That is not the issue here, so why bring it into the discussion?
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You're right teaparty, the bill of rights is nothing more than a statement of the rights of man, which transcends the constitution. We as a free people have these right as endowed to our species. I can in fact say what I wish, and take the consequence of rebutal. As Raf says the hand should stop at the nose, not necessarily before. Who makes the call on speech? Yes, fire in a safe building is a bad thing, but is bringing about discussion of some issues not allowed, while other offensive ones are, okay?
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Well, at this site, GB and the Avilas are the ultimate authority on what issues and topics are permitted, and which are verboten. The Mods just attempt to enforce the rules as written. Remember, the rules are written down and pretty clear. Any Mod who started screwing people for no good reason wouldn't last long.
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Well put and well taken, raf. That is the best answer yet, and one I can accept, after all I paid up knowing those. So now let's let this topic die for once and all and get back to having fun!
Link Posted: 5/10/2002 6:25:24 PM EDT
Hell No!
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