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Posted: 12/27/2003 10:19:58 PM EDT
Ok - so I'm drooling over these FN shotguns CMMG has for sale www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=7&f=93&t=165214

This thing holds 7+1 regular 12 gauge shells, or 12+1 mini slugs.  I've never heard of mini slugs (I'm mainly a handgun guy. Go Sig!!)  Since I'm not all that dumb, I assume these are just half length 12 gauge shells, but what's the main purpose of them, and where can I buy some?

Are they meant for home/apt use to prevent overpenetration?  Or is it just to knock the bad guy over, instead of sending him flying 15 feet through a window like in the movies?
Link Posted: 12/27/2003 10:31:42 PM EDT
Here ya go:

[url]http://www.the-armory.com/shopsite_sc/store/html/aguila.html[/url]
Link Posted: 12/27/2003 10:56:38 PM EDT
Great!  Thanks for the link.  This is exactly was I was looking for.

Link Posted: 12/28/2003 12:04:44 AM EDT
Here's another link

[url]http://64.177.53.248/ubb/Forum78/HTML/000587.html[/url]

Just about anything DocGKR says is close to gold.
Link Posted: 12/28/2003 12:50:57 AM EDT
Warning:

If using a semi-automatic or pump action shotgun with an "elevator" (most have them), there may be a small problem with some models.  For example, the MOssberg 500 shell elevator doesn't feed them very reliably (unless you pump the gun VERY fast).  In order to solve this problem it's easy to modify or extend the elevator to allow more reliable feeding.  Though there is still a chance that the shells may 'tumble' in the receiver before being chambered, thus remains a slight chance of misfeeding.

These shells are VERY fun to shoot, they're generally cheap, and have a generally light load as well. I like them (even in my mossberg 500).  My shotgun also holds the 12+1 minislugs.  Sure are fun little slugs, just don't depend upon them in a life-threatening situation.
Link Posted: 12/28/2003 2:46:22 AM EDT
I have used Aguila 12 gauge minislugs out of my Mossberg 500 with no problems.

If they were cheaper than the 2&3/4 slugs I can get from Wally World or Ace or the gunshows I would use them.

They are good if you are letting a non-shooter try a 12 gauge for the first time. Better than giving them a 3 inch bear slug, LOL.
Link Posted: 12/28/2003 8:08:46 AM EDT
Originally Posted By iNuhBaDNayburhood:
These shells are VERY fun to shoot, they're generally cheap, and have a generally light load as well. I like them (even in my mossberg 500).  My shotgun also holds the 12+1 minislugs.  Sure are fun little slugs, just don't depend upon them in a life-threatening situation.
View Quote


After some searching, I found this:
[url]http://www.findarticles.com/cf_dls/m0BQY/12_45/57006138/p1/article.jhtml[/url]

The specifications for the new Minishells are indeed Lilliputian. The 12 gauge slug weighs a mere 386 grs. (normally 1 oz. Or 437 grs.) and has a muzzle velocity of 1,265 fps. The buck-shot load carries only six pellets (normally 16) #1 Buck at 1,100 fps. The regular shotshell carries 5/8 oz. of #7 -- more or less a .410 or 28 gauge shot charge.
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A slug weighing 386 grains at 1265 fps is still 170% more lead flying downrange than my .45 230gr loads, and at faster speeds, so I'm wondering why some are saying they are weak.  Granted, they don't have the thump of a full 12 guage round, but it's like having 13 REALLY REALLY big .45 rounds at your disposal.

I'd trust my Sig P220 with only 7 rounds, so this seems like a pretty good thing to me.  Anything I'm missing here?
Link Posted: 12/28/2003 8:13:13 AM EDT
For the most part, they don't feed reliably enough to be considered for ANY kind of defensive ammo, IMO...


  - georgestrings
Link Posted: 12/28/2003 12:38:47 PM EDT
Aguila was supposed to be marketing a shotgun made specifically for their mini-shells.

Has anyone seen or heard anything more about this?
Link Posted: 12/28/2003 2:55:47 PM EDT
They feed well in my Ithaca 37. I have not shot any of the shot shells but the slugs work great. I dint know about knockdown power but I have been able to hit steel plates with them at 100 yards.

Seems like if they were 100% in a gun they would be a good home defense option.
Link Posted: 12/28/2003 3:11:28 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Gopher:
They feed well in my Ithaca 37. I have not shot any of the shot shells but the slugs work great. I dint know about knockdown power but I have been able to hit steel plates with them at 100 yards.

Seems like if they were 100% in a gun they would be a good home defense option.
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I have an old chopped down Ithaca 37 Police with pistol grip designated as my Aquila mini-shell gun. [:D]
Link Posted: 12/28/2003 3:34:19 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/28/2003 3:35:35 PM EDT by ProfessorEvil]
Yeah, if you can do a quick mod on a mossberg they will feed just fine, but their accuracy isn't anything to write home about.  

Feeding problem pic:

[img]http://www.acmearms.com/images/minislugproblem.jpg[/img]

50yds accuracy (usually within about 6" of center using Wolf/Federal slugs)

[img]http://www.acmearms.com/images/oops.jpg[/img]
Link Posted: 12/28/2003 4:16:14 PM EDT
I ran 3 boxes through my stock M500 with no functional problems.
Link Posted: 12/28/2003 5:02:32 PM EDT
Notice that he is not talking about a mossberg but about the FN. The FN is built on a win 1300 action. It is EXTREMELY reliable in this action. Aguila even specifically states that the winchester is the ONLY normal shot gun they recomend them for use(they do have a special purpose shotgun of their own, but it wont shoot any other shells). The FN is OK because it is identical in it's operation to the winchester.

I have run these slugs through a Rem 870, Mossy M590A1, and Win 1300. The Remmy was the worst for feeding, the mossy would feed them really well if I worked the action at normal speeds but would jam literally every other round pumping fast. The win was 100%. I ran the slugs through it, and it shot about 10" lower than 3" mag slugs at 100 yds. I am looking at them for defensive purposes for my wife. She actually fired 6 of them in a row and didn't mind them too much. She won't fire normal slugs through a shotgun.

12 of the buckshot rounds at normal defensive ranges would be devistating. The energy is pretty good and recoil is dramatically minimized. Supposedly the powder is compressed to maintain more of the energy and keep them small. Definetly better than the 9mm she knows how to use now.
Link Posted: 12/28/2003 5:15:22 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Guncrazy223:
the mossy would feed them really well if I worked the action at normal speeds but would jam literally every other round pumping fast.
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Odd, since the only way I can get them to feed reliably is to pump at hyper speed on my mossy.
Link Posted: 12/28/2003 10:30:13 PM EDT
Originally Posted By ProfessorEvil:
Originally Posted By Guncrazy223:
the mossy would feed them really well if I worked the action at normal speeds but would jam literally every other round pumping fast.
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Odd, since the only way I can get them to feed reliably is to pump at hyper speed on my mossy.
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My mossberg also has the same problem you pictured above as well...  I need to extend the elevator sometime in the near future to increase reliability with these shorter aguila shells.  I'm going to wait until I buy a new elevator (to install if I screw up the one I'll be modifying) to do it though.

Also, like you, I have better reliability if I pump it at extremely fast rates.  If I slow down, gravity rotates the front of the slug shell down into that opening in the elevator as pictured.  They're still pretty fun, but my shotgun would need modification, and the ammo would need to get better reliability or consistancy in its loads.  Accuracy is nowhere near as good as Federal Tactical L.E. slugs, or other Federal slug loads.
Link Posted: 12/30/2003 3:28:19 PM EDT
I'm not sure but I think the 590 has a different elevator than the 500. This might be the diference. I ran 12 shells through the mossberg proabbaly 12 times and it was very predictable, fas meant jams, slow it never hickuped.
Link Posted: 12/30/2003 5:07:36 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/30/2003 5:20:08 PM EDT by Cape_hunter]
Originally Posted By clean_cut:
Originally Posted By Gopher:
They feed well in my Ithaca 37. I have not shot any of the shot shells but the slugs work great. I dint know about knockdown power but I have been able to hit steel plates with them at 100 yards.

Seems like if they were 100% in a gun they would be a good home defense option.
View Quote


I have an old chopped down Ithaca 37 Police with pistol grip designated as my Aquila mini-shell gun. [:D]
View Quote


I have and old 37, pistol pistol grip, that just loves those minis. I have put about 60 rounds thru it and not had a single ftf. I have also put 40 thru my police remi and it never once ftf.

I would really like to fire a handful thru a AOW pump or sxs, I think that would great fun!!!

Donith, I am not sure who makes it but I know the MAG7 is designed for hte mini shell only:
SOG has them.
[url]http://www.southernohiogun.com/products.html[/url]
CH

Link Posted: 12/30/2003 6:10:00 PM EDT
They don't work in my Benelli M3.  The magazine will try to release two rounds everytime.
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