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Posted: 8/29/2004 2:13:52 AM EST
I was snooping around the Washington CeaseFire web site (know thy enemy ) and came across a link to a LETTER written by Seattle Police Chief Gil Kerlikowske regarding the AWB expiration.

Now, I have seen some of the infamous letters and quotes on our site (bullet hose, more thrust per squeeze, AR-15 machine gun, assault rifles falling from the sky, streets filled with blood, etc..etc...) - but this one strikes me even more bizarre in a way (if you can possibly imagine that)

Seattles CHIEF OF POLICE has provided us these fine quotes to add to our inventory:

"Starting Sept. 14, our law-enforcement officers and the general public will face a more dangerous environment in our communities."

"The ban was passed for very practical reasons. Prior to 1994, criminals were armed with enough firepower to outgun the police, making them nearly impossible to subdue, and allowing them to wreak terrible havoc in public places. The ban kept military-style assault weapons out of the hands of criminals."

"If this ban is allowed to expire, our nation's law-enforcement leaders will be faced with the reality of having front-line officers out-gunned by every street gang, drug trafficker, and common criminal with access to the neighborhood sporting-goods store."

"The reality is, when the family firearm becomes an AK-47 or Tec-9 assault pistol, they also become the easy weapon of choice for would-be school shooters and other violent teens. How many more lives will the gun lobby put at risk to sell more assault weapons?"

"As law-enforcement professionals, we must demand that our lawmakers help by keeping in place proven legislation that reduces crime and keeps our communities safe from violence."


Can you believe this guy?

I have A LOT of respect for Police Officers...but I think this guy might need more than a few sick days.

Did he sit on his Tazer?

How can he possibly make these kind of irresponsible statements?

Is he Diane Fienswines (I have no idea how to spell it, and she is not even worth a search for correct spelling) cousin or something?

Do most Police Officers (low ranking and high) have simular opinions? I am guessing that they do not (at least the ones who are members of AR15.com )

Just thought I would share

Link Posted: 8/29/2004 2:21:20 AM EST
This type of BS is all too common among Police Chiefs... remember, they're more politician than cop.
Link Posted: 8/29/2004 2:21:55 AM EST
His main concern on semi-auto rifles seems to be about all these "would-be school shooters and teens" that can't own firearms legally reguardless...

What a jackass!

His knowledge on the subject gives the impression that he spends his days at luncheons with the PTA and the like....or he's simply an outright lier?
Link Posted: 8/29/2004 2:24:38 AM EST
The man's an asshat.
Link Posted: 8/29/2004 2:28:13 AM EST
He obviously has higher aspirations. Too bad we can't say the same for his I.Q.
Link Posted: 8/29/2004 2:57:27 AM EST
This idiot is obviously sucking Fienswines strap-on....
Link Posted: 8/29/2004 3:19:30 AM EST
Link Posted: 8/29/2004 3:22:02 AM EST
You obviosly mis quoted this guys. After all, according to the LEO on this board ALL cops support the 2nd ammendment.


SGatr15
Link Posted: 8/29/2004 4:03:47 AM EST

After all, according to the LEO on this board ALL cops support the 2nd ammendment.

I just turned 76, and I have never met a pro-gun cop. Ever. Not even close. You have to wonder if the guys that post here that claim to be cops aren't some 13 year-old playing around, because what they say doesn't match-up with what you always hear cops say in public (like the guy above) or what I've heard in person.z
Link Posted: 8/29/2004 4:13:39 AM EST
Link Posted: 8/29/2004 4:14:26 AM EST
And now for some "facts" of our own.

1: More AW's were used in shootings AFTER the '94 AWB then before, so just how did this ban stop crime?

2: The North Hollywood shoot out(where cops were "out gunned") took place AFTER the ban so how did this ban "even up" the odds for cops?

3: Even before the ban, less then 1% of guns used in crime were long guns, so how is the ban sunsetting going to make the streets less safe?

4: Even with the ban sunsetting the Brady Law is still in place so kids that are underage or have a criminal record will still be denied buying a firearm from the local "sporting goods" store, won't they?

5: It's not the type of gun, it's the person so let's stop demonizing an object and start locking up criminals, that will truly make the streets safer.
Link Posted: 8/29/2004 4:17:49 AM EST
Link Posted: 8/29/2004 4:19:44 AM EST
This is the typical, vehement, anti-gun attitude of the police. Nothing new here.
Link Posted: 8/29/2004 4:20:33 AM EST
How are criminals not going to be able to get firearms with an assault weapon ban?

If they arent using "assault" rifles, they are using handguns and non assault weapon type rifles.

What is an assault weapon anyways... A accessorized rifle. I would rather have a rifle that I can put a flashlight and bayonet on etc. to protect my home then a regular rifle or handgun. They both equally kill.

I would just have a better chance of living with my assault weapon.

Bunch of flower sniffing police officers. There are dozens of crimes every day in almost every neighborhood, town in the United States. If it was all flowers and roses and guns didnt exist then I can see passing laws to infringe on our constitutional rights to bear them.

Id rather see laws that make it more safe for gun owners and children in the household. And definatly background checks for everyone who ever buys a gun (gun shows).

Our politicians are idiots. They cant even think deductively and look at things from any kind of different kind of point of view. And they are traitors to our constitution. There are tons of logical ways to make gun ownership more of a responsibility. (required training yearly, registration of concealed weapons, child safety laws, no tolerance for felons or mentally disabled people being able to buy firearms etc.). I think if we do those things we will be alot better off then pissing us off who know better.

Link Posted: 8/29/2004 4:25:59 AM EST

Originally Posted By AZMAN-1:
This idiot is obviously sucking Fienswines strap-on....




I'm pretty sure it's real.
Link Posted: 8/29/2004 4:42:58 AM EST

Originally Posted By Blackgun_Fun:
I was snooping around the Washington CeaseFire web site (know thy enemy ) and came across a link to a LETTER written by Seattle Police Chief Gil Kerlikowske regarding the AWB expiration.




just proves that a liar can become a chief of police (every one of his statements can be factually refuted)

(didn't he get a no-confidence vote from his own force?)
Link Posted: 8/29/2004 5:01:27 AM EST
The sad part about it is that so many of the "sheeple" believe people like this! The only thing we may see flooding the streets with the AWB expiration is flash suppressors and bayonet lugs. I can't remember the last time one of those little pieces of hardware caused any crime!

The antis in the PRK are calling for this renewal also, even though it has no effect one way or the other there, as they have their own much more restrictive law. They are pointing to the recent shooting of a SF police officer with an SKS as a reason. HELLO.... but that shooting happened 4 years into the PRK's total ban on everything! So what good is the ban?

As far as the police being outgunned, just watch the news and you will see how anybody perceived as a threat is immediately surrounded by 'armed to the teeth' SWAT teams and two dozen police cars. Now who is outgunned?
Link Posted: 8/29/2004 5:19:07 AM EST
I think we can safely translate the term "outgunned" as "can't shoot for shit". A man with a single shot rifle that can hit what he aims at that comes up against a thug with an AK that can't hit shit "Outguns" the thug everytime. All the police need to do is learn how to shoot and use what they've got in a more effective manner and they'll not have to worry about being "outgunned". Wasn't it Jeff Cooper that said "Only hits count."
Link Posted: 8/29/2004 5:34:25 AM EST

Originally Posted By TNFrank:
And now for some "facts" of our own.

1: More AW's were used in shootings AFTER the '94 AWB then before, so just how did this ban stop crime?

2: The North Hollywood shoot out(where cops were "out gunned") took place AFTER the ban so how did this ban "even up" the odds for cops?

3: Even before the ban, less then 1% of guns used in crime were long guns, so how is the ban sunsetting going to make the streets less safe?

4: Even with the ban sunsetting the Brady Law is still in place so kids that are underage or have a criminal record will still be denied buying a firearm from the local "sporting goods" store, won't they?

5: It's not the type of gun, it's the person so let's stop demonizing an object and start locking up criminals, that will truly make the streets safer.



Kudos!! Very well said.............
Link Posted: 8/29/2004 7:05:47 AM EST

Originally Posted By kindstranger:

Originally Posted By AZMAN-1:
This idiot is obviously sucking Fienswines strap-on....




I'm pretty sure it's real.




.....

Link Posted: 8/29/2004 7:11:15 AM EST

Originally Posted By Merrell:

just proves that a liar can become a chief of police (every one of his statements can be factually refuted)

(didn't he get a no-confidence vote from his own force?)



Yes...I believe he DID get a vote of no-confidence early on, but I will double check. I am not in Seattle, about 2 hours away - so I rarely concern myself with their "news"
Link Posted: 8/29/2004 7:45:08 AM EST

Originally Posted By zoom:

After all, according to the LEO on this board ALL cops support the 2nd ammendment.

I just turned 76, and I have never met a pro-gun cop. Ever. Not even close. You have to wonder if the guys that post here that claim to be cops aren't some 13 year-old playing around, because what they say doesn't match-up with what you always hear cops say in public (like the guy above) or what I've heard in person.z



Wow...Im only 34, and I know a whole shitload of them...in fact, I deal with cops on a daily basis when I am at work (firefighter), and I have never met a local cop who was anti gun.
I see all of the cops I run into on the street, at every gun show...and I shoot with several of them.

The local Sherrif is class III friendly, and is an avid gun collector.

Now, Im sure there are some officers on the three local LEO agencies that I have not met...who are anti gun...but it is definitely not a blatant majority.
Link Posted: 8/29/2004 8:20:17 AM EST
FWIW, Kerlikowski received a unanimous vote of no-confidence from his subordinates following his demonstrated lack of leadership & poor handling of the NAFTA protest riots in Seattle a few years back. Of course, Mayor McCheese - a.k.a. Greg Nickels - stood by his man, which only supported the contention of some that the good chief is blowin' the mayor & not Ms. Sweinswein (good guess, though). His ranting 'cop killer bullets'-style rant only shows what he thinks of the 'common' citizen - how untrustworthy & seething w/ inner rage they are - as opposed to stable, capable morons like himself. But, it only gets better. For you see, the sheeple in Seattle are all too willing to belive this liberal dribble, much as they always have in the past.

I'd damn near bet dollars to donuts that the city will either push for a city ban (if possible), or outright lobby the state legislature to craft a statewide ban. Seattle elites are poison, pure & simple. Most of the rest of the state, particularly up in the north & east of the Cascades, are subject to the voting power of that city's population size. Much like Kalifornya in that respect. The burgeoning islands of needy, ever-believing sheeple overwhelm the opinions, lives, & tax dollars of the rest of the state residency.

But wait - there's more. For you see, in this coming election, we get to choose between Ron 'Tax-to-the-max' Sims & Kristine 'Let's sue the cigarette companies in the name of smoking victims & pocket the $$$ for us attorneys' Gregoire for state governor. We are soooo screwed.

I really hope there's a Libertarian candidate for governor this year.
Link Posted: 8/29/2004 9:02:28 AM EST
[Last Edit: 8/29/2004 9:04:26 AM EST by Blackgun_Fun]

Originally Posted By zoom:

After all, according to the LEO on this board ALL cops support the 2nd ammendment.

I just turned 76, and I have never met a pro-gun cop. Ever. Not even close. You have to wonder if the guys that post here that claim to be cops aren't some 13 year-old playing around, because what they say doesn't match-up with what you always hear cops say in public (like the guy above) or what I've heard in person.z



Happy B-day on #76 "Z"!!! I am sorry to hear that all of the LEO's you have known are anti-gun though. This would leave me with a negative impression of Police / 2nd Amendment Rights in general as well.

Fortunately for me my aquatenances have been exactly opposite of yours.

One of my best friends is a Sheriffs Deputy, and has just been promoted to Detective at his department. He believes deeply that guns in the hands of responsible civilians are a necessary and an essential deterrent to crime in the less populated areas he covers.

In many of his cases and interviews with criminals...they state that the reason they did not rob one home vs. another (in related break-in / home invasion style hold ups) was the simple fact that the home was well lit, and they knew the owner had firearms.

Just knowing for sure that the possible victim had firearms (small town) basically took their house off the list.
Link Posted: 8/29/2004 9:05:43 AM EST

Originally Posted By sgtar15:
You obviosly mis quoted this guys. After all, according to the LEO on this board ALL cops support the 2nd ammendment.


SGatr15


Not all of us do.


I hope it stays.....

Happy?
Link Posted: 8/29/2004 9:13:58 AM EST

Originally Posted By TNFrank:
And now for some "facts" of our own.

1: More AW's were used in shootings AFTER the '94 AWB then before, so just how did this ban stop crime?

2: The North Hollywood shoot out(where cops were "out gunned") took place AFTER the ban so how did this ban "even up" the odds for cops?

3: Even before the ban, less then 1% of guns used in crime were long guns, so how is the ban sunsetting going to make the streets less safe?

4: Even with the ban sunsetting the Brady Law is still in place so kids that are underage or have a criminal record will still be denied buying a firearm from the local "sporting goods" store, won't they?

5: It's not the type of gun, it's the person so let's stop demonizing an object and start locking up criminals, that will truly make the streets safer.



Dude, we already know all this shit!!! Now post how to get the cops to cut the crap!!!!!
Link Posted: 8/29/2004 10:13:23 AM EST
[Last Edit: 8/29/2004 10:13:55 AM EST by Phil_in_Seattle]

Originally Posted By Master_Blaster:

I'd damn near bet dollars to donuts that the city will either push for a city ban (if possible), or outright lobby the state legislature to craft a statewide ban.



The city ban can't happen.

RCW 9.41.290
State preemption.

The state of Washington hereby fully occupies and preempts the entire field of firearms regulation within the boundaries of the state, including the registration, licensing, possession, purchase, sale, acquisition, transfer, discharge, and transportation of firearms, or any other element relating to firearms or parts thereof, including ammunition and reloader components. Cities, towns, and counties or other municipalities may enact only those laws and ordinances relating to firearms that are specifically authorized by state law, as in RCW 9.41.300, and are consistent with this chapter. Such local ordinances shall have the same penalty as provided for by state law. Local laws and ordinances that are inconsistent with, more restrictive than, or exceed the requirements of state law shall not be enacted and are preempted and repealed, regardless of the nature of the code, charter, or home rule status of such city, town, county, or municipality.

We do have to watch out for a state ban and if it ever comes up we have to hope that the ghosts of I676 come back to life.

The final count on Initiative 676, the so-called "Handgun Safety Act" in Washington state, was:
FOR 496,633 29.4%
AGAINST 1,193,720 70.6%
The NO vote carried EVERY county in the state, even King County (56.7% NO)

Kerlikowske is the asshat who stood atop a Pioneer Square building watching over, and supervising the policing of the Fat Tuesday crowd in which over 70 people were injured and Kristopher Kime was killed.
seattlepi.nwsource.com/local/19855_chief23.shtml

See here for the other ongoing discussion of this crap
www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=8&f=15&t=183874
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