The Bible gives many examples of signs that should warn us of the coming end of the age.  Six such signs are given by Jesus, two characteristics are given by Paul, and eleven other occurrences are given by the prophets to occur prior to or soon after the end of the age.  While we are also told we will not know the time of the End, God obviously wanted us to know when that time was getting closer.  As the Christian church is increasingly drawn into the interfaith movement, and as more and more churches go into isolation, preparing to sleep through the growing attacks on their faith, perhaps God knew it would take a few signs to wake us up and remind us that we have work to do.  

Unfortunately, many Christians take the verses that tell us we won't know the time of His coming to mean they should ignore any and all scripture that might warn us of this time of tribulation.  Others have fallen into the trap of fearing being labeled a "conspiracy theorist" should they display an interest in the Biblical prophecies about our future on Earth.  My philosophy is simple.  God included it in the Bible and, since God is all knowing, we should trust that it is something we should know and study along with the rest of His Word.  

It is increasingly obvious that the time of our Lord's coming is drawing near.  Prophecy is being fulfilled daily, and at a faster pace than ever before.  Whether you believe in a pre-tribulation rapture, or believe Christians will be witness to the full tribulation, wrath, and final judgments, matters not.  The beginning of birth pains and the signs of the times should have the same effect on all of us.  It should motivate us to save as many souls as we can in the time that we have left.  The Great Commission tells us to be disciples to all nations, bringing the message of salvation through Christ to all people.   If the Church is raptured before the tribulation, it is important that we leave behind an explanation for the trials and judgments those left behind will face.  How else will they recognize the deception of the anti-Christ and seek instead the truth of the Bible?  If we are to endure the tribulation along side them, we will need to be prepared to not only share the message of salvation, but share with them the reasons for God's judgment and hold it up as further proof of their need to be saved.  

Below is a study of the prophetic signs God gave us as a warning of the approaching end of the age.  Many of them are being fulfilled now and many will be fulfilled in the near future.  I would encourage you to study prophecy, know what is coming and be prepared to share it with others.




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SIX SIGNS GIVEN BY JESUS TO INDICATE HIS COMING AND THE END OF THE AGE


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In Matthew24:3 Jesus was asked, "Tell us, when will these things be, and what will be the sign of your coming, and of the end of the age?"  Jesus told his apostles to look for  the following signs prior to his second coming and the end of the age.



1.  FALSE PROPHETS AND CHRISTS

Matthew 24:5 "For many will come in my name, saying, I am Christ, and will mislead many."

Matthew 24:11 "And many false prophets will arise, and will mislead many."


In the last several years many have claimed to be the Messiah.  Jim Jones and David Koresh are examples of these false christs as well as countless others who are not as newsworthy.  These false prophets are a prelude to the ultimate false christ, the antichrist.  Many New Age groups, some even NGO's working for the United Nations, are anxiously awaiting the antichrist, preparing the way for his acceptance as the head of the hierarchy of gods and the one who will usher in world peace.

2.  WARS

Matthew 24:6 "And you will be hearing of wars and rumors of wars; see that you are not frightened, for those things must take place, but that is not yet the end."



Rumors of wars in all areas of the world now occur frequently thanks to instant media coverage and the availability of a multitude of 24-hour news sources.



Matthew 24:7 "For nation will rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom, and in various places there will be famines and earthquakes."



More people have been killed in warfare in this century than at any other time in history.  As the death toll rises in the Middle East, more and more countries work feverishly to develop devastating weapons of mass destruction.  Add to that the expanding threat of terrorism and unpredictable dictators such as Saddam Hussein, and the potential for the outbreak of war exists in nations, kingdoms and places across the globe.

3.  FAMINES

Matthew 24:7 "For nation will rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom, and in various places there will be famines and earthquakes."



As white, Christian farmers are driven out of Zimbabwe in increasing numbers, and foreigners move in to replace life-sustaining crops with poppies that now supply 25% of the worlds drugs, famine spreads across the African continent.  The undernourished are not limited to Africa, however.  A large portion of the worlds 5 billion people suffers from a shortage of food.

4.  EARTHQUAKES

Matthew 24:7 "For nation will rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom, and in various places there will be famines and earthquakes."



The number and intensity of earthquakes this century is at a level higher than any other time in history.  A staggering number of seismic events occur around the world daily.  The earthquake seismic monitor IRIS shows all major earthquakes for the last year.  Indicated by yellow and red circles, the seismic events of the last 15 days provides strong evidence of the fulfillment of Matthew 24:7 in our day.  By contrast, in the years from 1890 to 1900 there was only one major earthquake in the world.

5.  TRIBULATIONS

Matthew 24:8-9 "But all these things are merely the beginning of birth pangs.  Then they will deliver you to tribulation, and will kill you, and you will be hated by all nations on account of my name."



Christians are under attack throughout the world today.  In the United States Christians still enjoy freedom to worship God without suffering much more than ridicule, hatred, or discrimination at work and school.  However in many other countries such as China, Sudan, Africa, Saudi Arabia, Korea, Russia, and many Muslim nations, Christian suffer much greater persecution and often times death for their faith.  During the tribulation this suffering will be worldwide and will continue even to the point of martyrdom.  These first 5 signs will increase in intensity and severity as the tribulation approaches, much like the birth pangs or contractions of a pregnant woman worsen as the delivery time approaches.

6.  THE GOSPEL WILL BE PREACHED THROUGHOUT THE WORLD

Matthew 24:14 "And this gospel of the kingdom shall be preached in the whole world for a witness to all the nations, and then the end shall come."



This prophecy has already been fulfilled through television, radio, missionaries, the translation of the Bible into many languages, and the internet.  People all over the world now hear the message of Christ from missionaries who have the means to travel the globe, and via technology that allows us to communicate with people on the other side of the world right from our own homes, churches and offices.




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TWO CHARACTERISTICS OF THE END OF THE AGE FROM THE APOSTLE PAUL


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1.  GODLESSNESS IN THE LAST DAYS

II Timothy 3:1-5,7 "But realize this, that in the last days difficult times will come.  For men will be lovers of self, lovers of money, boastful, arrogant, disobedient to their parents, ungrateful, unholy, unloving, unforgiving, malicious gossips, without self-control, brutal, haters of good, treacherous, reckless, conceited, lovers of pleasure rather than lovers of god; holding to a form of godliness, although they have denied its power; always learning and never able to come to the knowledge of the truth."



For anyone who has watched television, read a newspaper, lost a retirement to corporate greed and corruption, or just walked outside their front door, it is obvious this prophecy has been fulfilled by our generation.  Our leaders are often corrupt; our cities are filled with crime, brutality, and neon signs proclaiming our sinful, godless nature.  The New Age Movement brings in increasing numbers of mystics who claim to be the enlightened ones.  They are some of the most educated and influential people in our societies, and yet the most lacking in real truth.

2.  APOSTASY (FALLING AWAY FROM THE FAITH)

I Timothy 4:1-3 "But the spirit explicitly says that in later times some will fall away from the faith, paying attention to deceitful spirits and doctrines of demons.  By means of the hypocrisy of liars seared in their own conscience as with a branding iron, men who forbid marriage and advocate abstaining from foods which God has created to be gratefully shared in by those who believe and know the truth."



Churches today are becoming more and more ecumenical, embracing the New Age interfaith agenda, and denying Christ as the only way to salvation.  Giving in to the politically correct media and a corrupt society, they have embrace homosexuality as an acceptable alternate lifestyle and preach tolerance and compromise in place of God's truth for the salvation of the world.  The environmentalist movement within the New Age movement lures them into a worship of mother earth, belief in past lives, reincarnation, and Karma while demonizing all those who would eat the meat God gave us as nourishment for our bodies.  


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ELEVEN FULFILLMENTS OF BIBLE PROPHECY REQUIRED FOR THE END OF THE AGE


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1.  EXISTENCE OF A 200,000,000 MAN ARMY IN THE EAST

Revelation 9:16 "And the number of the armies of the horsemen was two hundred million; I heard the number of them."



An army of that size had never existed until China's army reached that number in the 1960's.

2.  REDEVELOPMENT OF THE ROMAN EMPIRE (EUROPEAN COMMUNITY)

Daniel 2:32-33 "The head of the statue was made of fine gold, its breast and its arms of silver, its belly and its thighs of bronze, its legs of iron, its feet partly of iron and partly of clay."



Daniel 2:40-43 "Then there will be a fourth kingdom as strong as iron; inasmuch as iron crushes and shatters all things, so like iron that breaks in pieces, it will crush and break all these in pieces.  And in that you saw the feet and toes, partly of potter's clay and partly of iron, it will be a divided kingdom; but it will have the toughness of iron, and partly of pottery, so some of the kingdom will be strong and part of it will be brittle.  And in that you saw the iron mixed with clay, they will combine with one another in the seed of men; but they will not adhere to one another, even as iron does not combine with pottery."



The fourth kingdom of iron is the Roman empire according to Daniel's interpretation of King Nebuchadnezzar's dream.  The two legs are the division of the Roman empire into an eastern portion called the Byzantine empire which ended in the 1400's and a western portion based in Rome which ended in the 400's.  The nations of Europe since the Roman empire dissolved have never adhered or formed one empire but continue as separate nations, however, the European Union now has 15 Member States and is preparing for the accession of 13 eastern and southern European countries.

3.  RETURN OF THE ONE PURE LANGUAGE, HEBREW, TO ISRAEL

Zephaniah 3:9 "For then I will return to the people a pure language, that they may all call upon the name of the Lord, to serve him with one consent."



Prior to the restoration of Israel in 1948, Hebrew was a dead language.  Now Hebrew is spoken throughout Israel.

4.  REBUILDING OF THE TEMPLE, RESTORATION OF TEMPLE WORSHIP AND ANIMAL SACRIFICES IN JERUSALEM

For several end time prophecies to be fulfilled, the temple will have to be rebuilt.



Revelation 11:2 "Leave out the court which is outside the temple and do not measure it, for it has been given to the nations; and they will tread under foot the oly city for forty-two months."



Daniel 9:27 "And he will make a firm covenant with the many for one week, but in the middle of the week he will put a stop to sacrifice and grain offering; and on the wing of abominations will come one who makes desolation, even until a complete destruction, one that is decreed, is poured out on the one who makes desolate."



Daniel 9:26 "Then after the sixty-two weeks the Messiah will be cut off and have nothing, and the people of the prince who is to come will destroy the city and the sanctuary."



Some archeologists believe that the temple mount is actually 340 feet south of the Dome of the Rock site, putting the Dome of the Rock within the Court of the Gentiles.  This may be the court outside the temple that is left out.



There are many groups already working on preparations for the new temple.  The blueprints are already done, the temple garments have been made, and there have already been attempts to lay the cornerstone of the temple.  The only thing standing in the way of the construction of the new temple is Islam's third holiest site, the Dome of the Rock and government support for such an undertaking.  Some possible scenarios for the rebuilding of the temple are as follows:



1.  The persuasion and performing of miracles by the Antichrist and False Prophet convinces the Islamic world to approve the rebuilding.



2.  The United Nations will negotiate the rebuilding of the temple following a war with the armies from the North (Russia and Islamic forces).  This assumes that the war with the armies from the North is not the battle of Armageddon as some feel and that this attack occurs before the rapture or tribulation period begins.  The supernatural destruction of the Russian army and Islamic forces will cause an outpouring of Christian worship and zeal amongst the Jewish people who will reconstruct the temple.



3.  It is determined that the site of the first two temples is actually south of the Dome of the Rock, and the court of the gentiles (Dome of the Rock) will be left out of the 3rd temple.



A group in Israel called the Temple Mount Faithful have obtained most of the clothing, instruments and other equipment required for temple worship and are actively preparing for the laying of the third temple's cornerstone.

5.  APPEARANCE OF THE RED HEIFER AFTER 2000 YEARS

Numbers 19:2-7 "This is the statute of the law which the Lord has commanded, saying, "Speak to the sons of Israel that they bring you an unblemished red heifer in which is no defect and on which a yoke has never been placed.  "You shall give it to Eleazar the priest, and it shall be brought outside the camp and be slaughtered in his presence.  Next Eleazar the priest shall take some of its blood with his finger and sprinkle some of its blood toward the front of the tent of meeting seven times.  "Then the heifer shall be burned in his sight; its hide and its flesh and its blood, with its refuse, shall be burned.  "The priest shall then wash his clothes and bathe his body in water, and afterward come into the camp, but the priest shall be unclean until evening."



A red heifer will be required to be used in the process of purification described in the book of Numbers.  In May 1997 the first Red Heifer was born in 2000 years.  Another red Heifer was born in Israel in March of 2002.

6.  INCREASE IN KNOWLEDGE AND TRAVEL

Daniel 12:4 "But as for you, Daniel, conceal these words and seal up the book until the end of time; many will go back and forth, and knowledge will increase."



Billy Graham was quoted as saying, "ninety percent of all the engineers and scientists who have ever lived are alive today."  Air travel, space travel, DNA research and human cloning are all examples of the rapid increase in knowledge in our generation.  

7.  RETURN OF THE ETHIOPIAN JEWS TO ISRAEL

Zephaniah 3:10-11 "From beyond the rivers of Ethiopia My worshipers, My dispersed ones, will bring My offerings.  In that day you will feel no shame because of all your deeds by which you have rebelled against Me; For then I will remove from your midst your proud, exulting ones, and you will never again be haughty on My holy mountain."



In 1984, Operation Moses saw the airlift of 15,000 Jews who had already fled to refugee camps in Sudan to escape starvation.  In 1991, Operation Solomon flew 20,000 Jews to Israel from Ethiopia itself.  A further airlift began in June of 1999, aimed at transporting the last 3,000 members of the Quara Jewish community from northeastern Ethiopia to Israel.

8.  THE RISE OF RUSSIA

Ezekiel 38:2,4,8 "Son of man, set your face toward Gog of the land of Magog, the prince of Rosh, Meshech and Tubal, and prophesy against him.  I will turn you about and put hooks into your jaws, and I will bring you out, and all your army, horses and horsemen, all of them splendidly attired, a great company with buckler and shield, all of them wielding swords.  After many days you will be summoned; in the latter years you will come into the land that is restored from the sword, whose inhabitants have been gathered from many nations to the mountains of Israel which had been a continual waste; but its people were brought out from the nations, and they are living securely, all of them."



In order for some end time events to occur Russia will have to be a strong nation with a strong military.  

9.  RETURN OF RUSSIAN JEWS TO ISRAEL

Jeremiah 23:7-8 "Therefore behold, the days are coming declares the Lord, when they will no longer say, as the Lord lives, who brought up the sons of Israel from the land of Egypt, but as the Lord lives, who brought up and led back the descendants of the household of Israel from the north land and from all the countries where I have driven them.  Then they will live on their own soil."



In the 1970's and 1980's there was a mass exodus of Russian Jews out of Communist Russia.  In 1999 the Associated Press reported a dramatic increase in the number of Jewish immigrants from Russia, bringing the largest number of Russian Jews to Israel since the early 1990's.  

10.  TECHNOLOGY FOR THE MARK OF THE BEAST

Revelation 13:16-17 "And he causes all, the small and the great, and the rich and the poor, and the free men and the slaves to be given a mark on their right hand or on their forehead, and he provides that no one will be able to buy or to sell, except the one who has the mark, either the name of the beast or the number of his name."



On May 10, three members of a family in Florida became the first people to receive the biochip implant.  Each device, made of silicon and called a VeriChip, is a small radio transmitter about the size of a piece of rice that is injected under a person's skin. It transmits a unique personal ID number whenever it is within a few feet of a special receiver unit. VeriChip's maker describes it as "a miniaturized, implantable, radio frequency identification device (RFID) that can be used in a variety of security, emergency and healthcare applications."



Is the biochip the mark of the beast to be used by the antichrist?  We can't really know.  What is significant is that people are being softened to the idea of a mark or an implant as a means of maintaining security, providing medical information, and regulating a more interdependent world.  As attitudes change, fears subside, and people are convinced of the need for such a mark, the true mark of the beast will be easily introduced to the world by the antichrist.

11.  PLANS FOR THE ONE WORLD GOVERNMENT

The United Nations, World Trade Organization, International Criminal Court, UN peacekeeping/police force, numerous UN NGO's, and other agencies are preliminary steps to the formation of a one world government.  We now have the communications technology, transportation, and the pro-globalization media necessary to usher in the one world government headed by the antichrist.  The increasing terrorist threat and the middle east conflict will only speed up the formation of this governing body as fear and promises of better security make more people willing to give up their national sovereignty for global governance.

12.  INSTANT COMMUNICATION AROUND THE WORLD

Revelation 11:3, 7-10 "And I will grant authority to my two witnesses, and they will prophecy for twelve hundred and sixty days, clothed in sackcloth.  When they have finished their testimony, the beast that comes up out of the abyss will make war with them, and overcome them and kill them.  And their dead bodies will lie in the street of the great city which mystically is called Sodom and Egypt, where also their Lord was crucified.  Those from the peoples and tribes and tongues and nations will look at their dead bodies for three and a half days, and will not permit their dead bodies to be laid in a tomb.  And those who dwell on the earth will rejoice over them and celebrate; and they will send gifts to one another, because these two prophets tormented those who dwell on the earth."



Television and the 24-hour news networks make it possible for people around the world to see the dead prophets and rejoice at their deaths.



Luke 21:28 "But when these things begin to take place, straighten up and lift up your heads, because your redemption is drawing near."



Luke 21:32 "Truly I say to you, this generation will not pass away until all things take place."

Guess no one else is ready for the end yet

I am not focused on the end times, I am trying to stay focused on Jesus.

Timely post...some friends and I were talking about this over coffee tonight.

Look at the Middle East today..the fulfillment of prophecy is all there.

Quoted: Timely post...some friends and I were talking about this over coffee tonight. Look at the Middle East today..the fulfillment of prophecy is all there.

Heck it's been that way over there for a thousand years .............

Quoted: Quoted: Timely post...some friends and I were talking about this over coffee tonight. Look at the Middle East today..the fulfillment of prophecy is all there. Heck it's been that way over there for a thousand years .............

True dat, and sometimes I'm skeptical, but each passing day gets us closer to the end, whenever that is.

Quoted: 1.  FALSE PROPHETS AND CHRISTS

In theory, couldn't the Catholics have thrown this brick at the Protestants?  Who does that luther guy think he is anyway...?

2.  WARS

Got rose colored glasses?  The world is more at peace now than it has ever been.  Funny how many who believe that the late 1800s was nearly a utopia totally ignore the wholesale slaughter of Indians by ..........US!

3.  FAMINES

Again, same as it ever was...

4.  EARTHQUAKES

5.  TRIBULATIONS

Please don't put a mission in the Suburbs of Mecca and expect kind treatment.  Our political, economic, and behavioral systems don't extend beyond our borders...

6.  THE GOSPEL WILL BE PREACHED THROUGHOUT THE WORLD

 I didn't think televangelists counted...

Quoted: Timely post...some friends and I were talking about this over coffee tonight. Look at the Middle East today..the fulfillment of prophecy is all there.

I recall going through this phase.  This is an age old problem with prophecies.  Most of them are so vague you can attache enough of them to any current events.  Kinda like astrology and horoscopes.

In a related story, it was just recently discovered that there is a rather large planet in our solar system that we were not previously aware of.  It's called Sedna and is about the same size as Pluto.  It orbits our Sun at a distance of roughly 3.6 Billion (with a B) miles.

The only reason I mention it is that it kinda throws a wrench in the works for Astrologist.  All this time they've been explaining thing in terms of Mars is in alignment with Jupiter or the Moon is aligned with Venus but they never made any predictions based on how Sedna was aligned with Saturn.

Besides, who wears sackcloth anymore.

IBTL and I'm waiting to be raptured!

You missed one of the most important signs as for timing. That is the reformation of isreal in Ezekiel.  It says that the end times will come before all of the generation present at the time of the reformation of isreal will pass.

Good web sites. fulfilledprophecy.com/

                              www.hallindseyoracle.com



sysop you should really read, I used to think the same thing. Most of the prophecy is very detailed.
  I didnt used to be Christian and prophecy really brought me to my faith.

Quoted: IBTL and I'm waiting to be raptured!

You know if there were a tinfoil hat icon I think it would have been more appropriate.

I'm ready.  The sooner the better.  

I'm tired...

Quoted: I'm ready.  The sooner the better.   I'm tired...

Awww, now that's no way to be.  Chin up Buckaroo.........

When your chewing on lifes gristle
don't grumble, give a whistle
and this things turn out for the best and........

Always look on the bright side of life.
[whistling]
Always look on the light side of life.
[whistling]
If life seems jolly rotten,
There's something you've forgotten,
And that's to laugh and smile and dance and sing.
When you're feeling in the dumps,
Don't be silly chumps.
Just purse your lips and whistle. That's the thing.
And...
Always look on the bright side of life.
[whistling]
Always look on the right side of life,
[whistling]
For life is quite absurd
And death's the final word.
You must always face the curtain with a bow.
Forget about your sin.
Give the audience a grin.
Enjoy it. It's your last chance, anyhow.
So,...
Always look on the bright side of death,
[whistling]
Just before you draw your terminal breath.
[whistling]
Life's a piece of shit,
When you look at it.
Life's a laugh and death's a joke. It's true.
You'll see it's all a show.
Keep 'em laughing as you go.
Just remember that the last laugh is on you.
And...
Always look on the bright side of life.
[whistling]
Always look on the right side of life.
[whistling]
Always look on the bright side of life!
[whistling]
Always look on the bright side of life!
[whistling]
Always look on the bright side of life!
[whistling]
Always look on the bright side of life!
[whistling]
Always look on the bright side of life!
[whistling]
Always look on the bright side of life!
[whistling]
Always look on the bright side of life!
[whistling]
Always look on the bright side of life!
[whistling]
.......................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................

Quoted: Quoted: IBTL and I'm waiting to be raptured! You know if there were a tinfoil hat icon I think it would have been more appropriate.

Question sysop -

Why ARE you here?

If you're going to be raptured soon anyway, can I have your stuff?

you might believe that stuff, but I believe it's absurd to the point of hilarity.

People have been saying end times are near since, oh..... forever.

Quoted: you might believe that stuff, but I believe it's absurd to the point of hilarity. People have been saying end times are near since, oh..... forever.

I have no idea if they are near (which is a relative term anyway)

I merely agree with how the Bible says the end will come. The actual timing of the "rapture" (itself being a word nowhere found in Scripture) is the subject of much debate.

I'll let God take care of the "when."  I'm glad for the "how,"  and am responsible (in part) for the "who."

Looking at end prophesy to try to predict the second coming, etc is superstition:

(Mar 13:32)  But of that day and that hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels which are in heaven, neither the Son, but the Father. (Mar 13:33)  Take ye heed, watch and pray: for ye know not when the time is.

Jesus said these things so that we would know what they would be like, not when they would happen.  It's about Him, not when.

Y'know.. There is more than one way to interpret biblical prophesy. Hell, there's more than one way to interpret pretty much everything in the Bible. All you have to do is approach it from a different point of view. But there are so many people not just on this board, but in the world who simply refuse to do that.

HYDGIRL!!

I try to be ready whenever, rather than worried about when.

IBTR  (in before the Rapture)

II Peter 2:3-7

"Knowing this first, that there shall come in the last days scoffers, walking after their own lusts, and saying, "Where is the promise of his coming? for since the fathers fell asleep, all things continue as they were from the beginning of the creation." For this they are willingly ignorant of, that by the word of God the heavens were of old, and the earth standing out of the water and in the water: Whereby the world that then was, being overflowed with water, perished: But the heavens and the earth, which are now, by the same word are kept in store, reserved unto fire against the day of judgement and perdition of ungodly men."

Quoted: HYDGIRL!!

I do believe this world is winding down, however, I agree with a poster above who said rather then focus on the "End Times", I try to stay focused on Jesus and my daily walk.  Christians are told to prepare whether the end comes today or in 1,000 years.  That means getting and keeping our hearts and lives right with the Lord.  

I believe they are closer than some people may tend to believe. Yes there have been wars and rumors of wars since the world began. However it was not as wide spread as wwI and WWII. But I think the Jews returning to palestine is a significant sign. Also the push for one world things theses days. The technology that would allow an antichrist to be seen world wide is here. Even in remote places people can get stuff by computer. The 200,000 man army is very real now. I think more of it in the muslim holy war possibility than China. But at armageddon the U.S and other major players seem to be out of the mix. The war before Armageddon will be the bad one. The scripure uses terms relating to fire a lot. Nuclear? I don't know but it wont be fun.

The word of God will be preached to the world. It's been preached now more world wide than ever.
When you see the fig sprout leaves you know that Summer is nigh. I see sprouts.

I also think we should not be sign seekers but aware of the signs. Live a good christian (or what ever non religion religion you espouse) life.

Things could get real interesting the next 100yrs, maybe less. Less in my opinion.