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Posted: 9/7/2004 5:01:38 PM EST
froggyruminations.blogspot.com/2004/09/beslan-usa.html

An interesting discussion of tactics that could be used in the event of
a Beslan-style attack in the US.
Link Posted: 9/7/2004 5:10:39 PM EST
That is what scares me. The author of that article says that our police forces need to become more military minded to deal with these attacks, which is for the most part true. But when our police become like the military thats just one step closer to a dictatorship.
Link Posted: 9/7/2004 5:24:16 PM EST
[Last Edit: 9/7/2004 5:24:47 PM EST by Airwolf]
Another problem is that our mindset is used to dealing with people that think and operate somewhat like a "normal" person. That is there is a basic survival instinct in play and they (usually) have some doable demand (money, release people held in jail, transportation out of the area, etc...).

These terrorists don't HAVE any demands that can be met, don't care about surviving the op and most of all don't have any motivation to keep ANY of the hostages alive.

I can't think of any situation involving Islamofacists that can have anything like a good outcome. The tangos are going to end up dead (either by their own hand or the operators) and they will take as many of the hostages as they can along with them.

As long as people have have sheep-like "comply and someone in Authority will protect me" programming and our laws keep law-abiding citizens from carrying some SERIOUS hardware we will be targets of a Russian school like op. It will NOT have a happy ending.
Link Posted: 9/7/2004 5:25:48 PM EST
Yes. It's a difficult problem. I don't want police SWAT teams to act like SEALS when they're taking down someone for failure to appear warrants. But getting Delta Force to the site of a Beslan would take too long.
Link Posted: 9/7/2004 5:29:21 PM EST
Link Posted: 9/7/2004 5:31:05 PM EST

Originally Posted By Lightning_P38:
When this happens here, no amount of reperation or training is ging to make a difference, Once the evil has taken over the school, it is all over, the only real effective strategy would be something that would stop the attack in its early stages, before the evil bastards ae in control of the situation. Once they have taken control it is all over, and a single survivor will be as close to a victory as you can expect.



Don`t worry, my school has a zero tolerance policy!
Link Posted: 9/7/2004 5:35:48 PM EST
Tell the world that if the terrorists dont free the children, we will destoy Mecca. Wipe it from the face of the earth, never to return.
Link Posted: 9/7/2004 5:38:42 PM EST
I have a simple solution to this problem,ARM THE TEACHERS. Israel did this and they have never had a school shooting.
Link Posted: 9/7/2004 5:40:45 PM EST

Originally Posted By WI_Rifleman:
I have a simple solution to this problem,ARM THE TEACHERS. Israel did this and they have never had a school shooting.



The reason they became armed was school shootings.
Link Posted: 9/7/2004 5:42:34 PM EST
You can use whatever tactics you want, nevermind the casualties. Once they get control of the school they are all dead anyway. Try to minimize the death of innocents but...

Say for instance they have 400 children in various rooms with 40 shitbags around, and at one point you see 35 shitbags in a room with 50 kids then you destroy that room and all occupants. Then you take out the 5 remaining shitbags whatever it takes.
There is no other way. Once it all starts you MUST consider all the hostages dead already. Any survivors are a bonus.
Link Posted: 9/7/2004 5:42:59 PM EST

Originally Posted By Lightning_P38:
When this happens here, no amount of reperation or training is ging to make a difference, Once the evil has taken over the school, it is all over, the only real effective strategy would be something that would stop the attack in its early stages, before the evil bastards ae in control of the situation. Once they have taken control it is all over, and a single survivor will be as close to a victory as you can expect.



BINGO

The situation in Russia was decided 15 minutes after the terrorist got in to the school. No matter how the Russians responded the outcome was likely to have been the same.

The same thing could happen here… no matter who you throw in SWAT Teams, FBI Hostage Rescue, Delta Force, ect. it will not change the outcome. The ONLY chance to mitigate a disastrous outcome from this type attack is to train and arm teachers in sufficient numbers to stop the terrorist as they come into the school.
Link Posted: 9/7/2004 5:43:57 PM EST

Originally Posted By WI_Rifleman:
I have a simple solution to this problem,ARM THE TEACHERS. Israel did this and they have never had a school shooting.



While I agree with the thought you do realize that teachers tend to be the most liberal, sheep-like, gooberment will protect us, why does anyone need an icky gun it will just end up hurting someone types.

You also have a large number of WOMEN teaching (esp the lower grades - the ones most likely to be targets) and those attitudes are even MORE prevelant among women.

While I applaud (and support) the idea, having it happen ranks right up there with Dracula wearing silver and eating garlic.
Link Posted: 9/7/2004 5:46:29 PM EST

Originally Posted By Airwolf:

Originally Posted By WI_Rifleman:
I have a simple solution to this problem,ARM THE TEACHERS. Israel did this and they have never had a school shooting.



While I agree with the thought you do realize that teachers tend to be the most liberal, sheep-like, gooberment will protect us, why does anyone need an icky gun it will just end up hurting someone types.

You also have a large number of WOMEN teaching (esp the lower grades - the ones most likely to be targets) and those attitudes are even MORE prevelant among women.

While I applaud (and support) the idea, having it happen ranks right up there with Dracula wearing silver and eating garlic.



Then we will have to live through this scenario before they change their minds. Sad.
Link Posted: 9/7/2004 5:47:02 PM EST
It is pretty much that once the terrorist enter the school in force, all the kids are dead. The assault and clearing force are going in to kill the terrorists, any kids that happen to come out alive is just a bonus.

Link Posted: 9/7/2004 5:47:57 PM EST

Originally Posted By captainpooby:

Originally Posted By Airwolf:

Originally Posted By WI_Rifleman:
I have a simple solution to this problem,ARM THE TEACHERS. Israel did this and they have never had a school shooting.



While I agree with the thought you do realize that teachers tend to be the most liberal, sheep-like, gooberment will protect us, why does anyone need an icky gun it will just end up hurting someone types.

You also have a large number of WOMEN teaching (esp the lower grades - the ones most likely to be targets) and those attitudes are even MORE prevelant among women.

While I applaud (and support) the idea, having it happen ranks right up there with Dracula wearing silver and eating garlic.



Then we will have to live through this scenario before they change their minds. Sad.



Don`t worry they won`t (change their minds).
Link Posted: 9/7/2004 5:49:42 PM EST

Originally Posted By captainpooby:

Originally Posted By Airwolf:

Originally Posted By WI_Rifleman:
I have a simple solution to this problem,ARM THE TEACHERS. Israel did this and they have never had a school shooting.



While I agree with the thought you do realize that teachers tend to be the most liberal, sheep-like, gooberment will protect us, why does anyone need an icky gun it will just end up hurting someone types.

You also have a large number of WOMEN teaching (esp the lower grades - the ones most likely to be targets) and those attitudes are even MORE prevelant among women.

While I applaud (and support) the idea, having it happen ranks right up there with Dracula wearing silver and eating garlic.



Then we will have to live through this scenario before they change their minds. Sad.



Once there is one major incident like this in the US, I guarantee this issue will surface and will be debated in a public forum.
Link Posted: 9/7/2004 5:52:55 PM EST
Link Posted: 9/7/2004 5:53:06 PM EST

Originally Posted By STLRN:
It is pretty much that once the terrorist enter the school in force, all the kids are dead. The assault and clearing force are going in to kill the terrorists, any kids that happen to come out alive is just a bonus.




That's exactly how I feel. Then the blame gets shifted onto the government, instead of the animals that committed the atrocity. Sound familiar?
Link Posted: 9/7/2004 5:58:51 PM EST
Link Posted: 9/7/2004 6:16:03 PM EST

Originally Posted By Balzac72:

Originally Posted By STLRN:
It is pretty much that once the terrorist enter the school in force, all the kids are dead. The assault and clearing force are going in to kill the terrorists, any kids that happen to come out alive is just a bonus.




That's exactly how I feel. Then the blame gets shifted onto the government, instead of the animals that committed the atrocity. Sound familiar?



+1. I'm amazed that anybody got out of the Russian school alive. 9/11 was a wake-up call for most people; they realized that .gov can't always protect you. It made lots of them mad, and there was a huge effort to lay the blame somewhere (cough Bush cough). If they find somebody to blame, then the problem is solved in their minds.
Link Posted: 9/8/2004 7:47:47 AM EST
All I know is that if (GOD forbid) this happens here (with my kids in the school) my AICS 2.0 will have a few notches in the stock before I’m through.
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