Warning

 

Close

Confirm Action

Are you sure you wish to do this?

Confirm Cancel
Member Login
Site Notices
1/25/2018 7:38:29 AM
Arrow Left Previous Page
Page / 2
Posted: 7/21/2002 5:10:10 PM EST
Link Posted: 7/21/2002 5:28:28 PM EST
C first then A if chase continued. Or get to a safe place like PD HQ.
Link Posted: 7/21/2002 5:29:49 PM EST
[Last Edit: 7/21/2002 5:32:56 PM EST by Dave_A]
Well, I had a similar incident, involving 2 high-school aged white males in a riced up ('fart-can' 4" muffler, 'fake racecar' stickers, bolt-on wing, etc) compact car who were trying to get me to street race them (I used to (prior to Friday, when some idiot in a Camry rear-ended me while I was stopped in traffic) have a '91 305 Firebird). But that's (a) illegal (and easy to get you a ticket where I was), and (b) very dangerous on a busy street. So instead, they hung around in the adjacent lane, swerving back and forth, matching my speed, and looking for an oppertunity to cut me off. I get to the point where (a) I'm almost home, and (b) I'm first in line at a light (they were back a car or so), so I take off in a left turn. I'm parked at another light a block down the road, and all the sudden, I hear 'What the F*ck you think you're doin', the 2 punks start to open my doors, and one starts to stick his head in the passenger side. Fortunately for me (And, if I had waited a few seconds it would have been 'unfortunately for him') I was first in line at this light too. What did I do? Hit the gas, and if his head had been in the door, he would have gotten a nice concussion (Firebird steel doorjamb meets airhead, what wins?)... Don't know what I'd have done if I'd had my .45 at hand, but WI law requires guns to be 'encased and unloaded' while in cars, so it was in a gun box in the trunk, I had a 'means of escape', and CCW is not yet legal in WI. Chances are I could have just picked it up, pointed it at the roof of my car, and they would have said 'Oh sh*t, he's got a GUN!' (these wern't gangsta types, just suburban HS punks), but I don't know about the legality of that either (think it's illegal here)... Also, robably could have gotten their tag number and reported them to the Glendale PD for attempted carjacking (Hey, I don't know why he tried to get inside...), but...
Link Posted: 7/21/2002 5:36:03 PM EST
I wouldn't have "brake checked" him to start with. If you're gonna be running around with a loaded weapon, you probably should not be antagonizing people. Then again, if you're going unarmed, you probably shouldn't be antagonizing people. The main thing is, if you're going to CCW, you have the obligation to comport yourself in a manner that is not agressive and confrontational. That way you don't have to worry about shooting someone because you have enticed them into kicking your ass. [;)]
Link Posted: 7/21/2002 5:41:14 PM EST
Link Posted: 7/21/2002 5:43:58 PM EST
Dark Helmet, I have done what you did in the past. I have a bad temper. I am always prepared to fight and have been since I was small. This is a bad way to live, but nothing seems to help, soooo...in the future, if you are going to be stupid, you better be tough. And don't run to the cops,sheesh, what a nancy suggestion. I know, it is only for CYA in our litigious times, but still.
Originally Posted By Dave_A: Well, I had a similar incident, involving 2 high-school aged white males in a riced up ('fart-can' 4" muffler, 'fake racecar' stickers, bolt-on wing, etc) compact car who were trying to get me to street race them (I used to (prior to Friday, when some idiot in a Camry rear-ended me while I was stopped in traffic) have a '91 305 Firebird). But that's (a) illegal (and easy to get you a ticket where I was), and (b) very dangerous on a busy street. So instead, they hung around in the adjacent lane, swerving back and forth, matching my speed, and looking for an oppertunity to cut me off. I get to the point where (a) I'm almost home, and (b) I'm first in line at a light (they were back a car or so), so I take off in a left turn. I'm parked at another light a block down the road, and all the sudden, I hear 'What the F*ck you think you're doin', the 2 punks start to open my doors, and one starts to stick his head in the passenger side. Fortunately for me (And, if I had waited a few seconds it would have been 'unfortunately for him') I was first in line at this light too. What did I do? Hit the gas, and if his head had been in the door, he would have gotten a nice concussion (Firebird steel doorjamb meets airhead, what wins?)... Don't know what I'd have done if I'd had my .45 at hand, but WI law requires guns to be 'encased and unloaded' while in cars, so it was in a gun box in the trunk, I had a 'means of escape', and CCW is not yet legal in WI. Chances are I could have just picked it up, pointed it at the roof of my car, and they would have said 'Oh sh*t, he's got a GUN!' (these wern't gangsta types, just suburban HS punks), but I don't know about the legality of that either (think it's illegal here)... Also, robably could have gotten their tag number and reported them to the Glendale PD for attempted carjacking (Hey, I don't know why he tried to get inside...), but...
View Quote
I am from Louisiana where we don't have carjackings. We have a shoot the carjacker law. How come this crap never happens to me? I feel very put upon that I am denied the sacrament of holy combat on a daily basis. Do you think the judge will accept that I prefer to live by and be judged under chivalric code?
Link Posted: 7/21/2002 5:45:21 PM EST
Link Posted: 7/21/2002 5:46:27 PM EST
Helmut, you had me until you gave the guy the brake job. You escalated the situation, which could have resulted in injury to yourself, the driver of the Yukon, or someone not involved in your little game(like the Cadillac in the next lane when the Yukon swerves to avoid hitting you). You could have just continued on your way, and the guy would have probably done the same; after all, up until that point it was just a misunderstanding. By the way, what his vehicle looked like, or for that matter, his age or the color of his skin have nothing to do with it, and are a very lame attempt to justify your actions. Grow up.
Link Posted: 7/21/2002 5:47:57 PM EST
[Last Edit: 7/21/2002 5:48:38 PM EST by Zak]
Road Rage begins here: He of course tried to merge right into the side of me forcing me to slow and allow him to get in front of me where he comes to a stop. Here is where I'm thinking "Sh!t... I just started this and if I escalate it any further I'm on shaky ground if I end up shooting this guy."
View Quote
You are incorrect, sir. Roadrage begins HERE:
I did the un-courteous thing.... I brake checked him and let the tires lock. He nearly hits me but avoids (I was in my shitty Honda Accord '87)
View Quote
Yeah, the guy was on your bumper, but YOU are the one who escalated--YOU are the source of the danger. Having had someone do this to me in the past (NJ Turnpike, rush hour, the guy apparently didn't like the fact that I kept being in the correct lane to avoid all the traffic, and kept getting ahead of him. At the GSP exit, he decided to "brake check" me) it's one of my pet peeves. You seem a nice enough guy, but: If you engage in this sort of behavior on a daily basis, do us all a favor and stay off the road. You've got available public transportation, I suggest you use it.
Link Posted: 7/21/2002 5:50:49 PM EST
I guess i've always thought (*this isn't a flame, and it prolly belongs in another thread*) that a CCW should turn you into Casper Milquetoast... it should make one even less likely to piss people off but, then, how should i know, as i don't have one yet...
Link Posted: 7/21/2002 6:25:15 PM EST
You know, it's good I don't have a CCW. After almost 40 years of fast driving, I have only had ONE ticket (radar). Why? Because I concentrate on what I am doing; what is around me; and, because of some considerable experience that allows me to guess what is likely to happen in front of me in the next few seconds. This is NOT casual driving, it is very tiring and takes a drain on you. And I bitterly resent assholes who do not seriously take the responsibility of travelling at 120ft/sec with 3500lbs of momentum and drive like assholes. Nowadays, I fiind driving, esp. freeway driving, to be VERY dangerous. Dark Helmet, I know your frustration and, as I said, it's good I do not even own a firearm!
Link Posted: 7/21/2002 6:32:22 PM EST
Yes I know how you feel as I carry A mod 29 44 usually with 44 specials in it. This makes me feel more at ease only in the advent that someone were walking down the lanes of vehicles at a stop shooting people indescrimantly. Never would I drive letting my gun handle the wheel,or my attitude towards other drivers. I know I'm not the best driver in the world, but sometimes I wonder! So we learn from what happens to us,maybe next time you will react differently. Good luck Bob [8D]
Link Posted: 7/21/2002 6:48:10 PM EST
As soon as I saw the brake check reference I was gonna' start yellin' at ya', but it appears that you've already been told, so I won't repeat it. If the Yukon driver had been altered, reaction times affected, you might have been killed. Not worth the risk.
Link Posted: 7/21/2002 6:55:06 PM EST
WWYD? (What Would Yoda Do?) Seriously, a fight avoided is a fight won. While you may be carrying legally, you really oughta think like you are carrying [i]illegally[/i]. CCW is for defensive, not offensive purposes. It is that final ace in the hole to be used as a last resort, in defense of life or limb. Brandishing a weapon prior to that point simply escalates things. What would you have done if you had clocked his door, got in a "tactical" position, and the guy had pulled a gun on [i]you[/i]?
Link Posted: 7/21/2002 7:07:43 PM EST
[Last Edit: 7/21/2002 7:12:06 PM EST by uglygun]
I would have likely snapped because of something that nearly happened to me a few years ago. I'm on the Ca. 99 freeway driving north to Fresno, the road is a two lane road for a LONG ways where traffic generally can drive at a 70mph clip the majority of the way. Left lane is used by general traffic while the right lane is used by truckers. As the "flock"(don't know what else to call it, 3-4 cars with me in the back were traveling at about the same speed for miles) of cars I'm in comes up apon a couple of trucks in the right lane we're all just passing as usual. Just as I'm starting to pass the first of the semis in the right lane I notice a car coming up from behind me in the right lane, FLYING! I instantly recognized what this joker was going to do, he was gonna try to make the pass on the right and cut me off. I should have hit the brakes and let the asshole cut in front of me but it was a situation where it was just easier to apply a bit of gas and not leave him the room to do it.(situation was such that I had maybe 1-2 car lengths of room between me and the truck as I was passing with this guy about a dozen car lengths back behind me, he still wouldn't have made it even if I didn't apply the gas. Was also a matter of principles, the person should have gotten behind me and waited his turn in line rather than go right for cutting me off.) Son of a bitch cuts in behind me since he has to hit the brakes but what he does next is completely frighting. After I get past the truck which took all of 10 seconds to do, the guy pulls over into the right lane to pass me again. Only this time when he gets along side of me he's obviously totally enraged, the guy starts to swerve over on me in the middle of the lane at 60-65mph and was definitely dangerous to the extreme. But get this, I looked over at the guy while he was doing this and what do I see? I see his wife in the passenger seat sitting there crying at the top of her lungs and I see a goddamned child seat in the back of the car with a toddler in it, what a family man. After the guy nearly runs me off the road by jerking his car over into my lane he gets infront of me and starts slamming on the brakes trying to make me rear end him. To a point, I wish it were possible to just wipe that human sack of shit right off the face of the earth. But it sure as hell scares the crap out of me thinking about how everything degraded so rapidly all because this guy was dead set on cutting me off. It never came to a stop at the side of the road but I'm not sure exactly where it would have gone if it had. The actions of that asshole were enough that if I was forced to the side of the road(by wreck possibly) that I would have been ready to defend my life because I defintely felt my life was threatened while in the car, I wouldn't have expected it to be in any less danger if I had to get out of my car and face the guy. I'm typically a pretty courteous driver but there are a few things that drive me insane and they usually all revolve around rules of the road and people who will break them putting your safety at risk. These people have made it so that no matter what you do in some situations it will only fuel them into a rage. Now days I take roadrage pretty darned seriously because of those events, if it can be avoided then great but the potential for it to be life threatening isn't far from my mind.
Link Posted: 7/21/2002 7:23:06 PM EST
When driving, I try to avoid any confrontation. Everybody is in a hurry, so I will drive fast enough to keep from blocking them, but slow enough to avoid LEO. Around here the speed limit is the minimum suggested speed. We had a case of woman on woman road-rage about 2 years ago. A woman(manual laborer) in an old gray station wagon kept cutting off a woman(well to do) in an SUV. They got to an exit ramp and the woman in the station wagon went out of her way to cut-off the other one. The woman in the station-wagon then went back to the SUV and got shot. The woman in the SUV got life in prison.
Link Posted: 7/21/2002 7:29:00 PM EST
I was once in a very similar situation here in FL. on 275 in St.Petersburg. Moderately heavy traffic on a Tuesday night heading out of downtown St.Pete. I'm in the middle of three lanes doing about 80 with traffic in both lanes to the left and right moving slower. I check the rearview and notice a car weaving aggressively in and out of traffic several cars behind me. Before i know it, he's on my bumper (I can't even see his headlights anymore). I speed up slightly (I was already doing 80) but with traffic it took about 1 mile before he could pass me. The whole time he is right *on* my ass. The main difference is that I didn't 'brake check' him or do anything else to provoke him but apparently it wasn't fast enough. He pulls up beside me in the middle lane on my passenger side as I move to the left lane (rt lane was still clogged with traffic) and I find a late 80's Accord with one 20-30's Hispanic male gesturing and yelling wildly at me. I calmly stare over at him and give him the finger and continue on. He gasses it and pulls ahead of me about one car length and hits his brakes (I guess he wasn't in such a hurry after all, huh?). Ok, now things are getting interesting. I slow down slightly and he slows down beside me and starts hanging out the window yelling and pointing at me to pull over. I slowly mouth the words 'f...u...c...k...u.' and keep going. He then pulls half a car length ahead of me and starts merging into my (left lane) which forces me to move to the inside breakdown lane to keep from colliding. All the while we're slowing down and are now going about 25 mph in the interior breakdown lane of the interstate. When I try to get back into traffic he blocks me and it's pretty apparent that things are about to get really ugly. I had my .32 tomcat in the glovebox and took it out and placed it my seat between my legs. Then I jotted down his tag number on a scrap of paper as we're rolling to a stop halfway in the left lane and breakdown lane. At this point I was pretty sure my life was in danger if we stopped cars. The really weird part is that I had been working out at the gym that night and playing raquetball and I was *extremely* hungry. All I was thinking about as this was occuring is how long it was going to be before I could eat something if I ended up having to shoot this guy. There would be several hours of dealing with the cops, probably getting arrested, telling my story, posting bail, etc. I was just pissed off that this idiot had escalated it to this point over something *so insignificant* as traffic. How stupid is that? So I'm getting mentally and physically prepared to have to deal with this jackass (damn I was hungry too!) and we're now going about 2 mph halfway in the fast lane. Then to my total surprise he gasses it and takes off down the interstate, and I never saw him again. I stopped at the next exit and called FHP to report him, then I got a BK cheeseburger. If that jackass only knew how close he came to making me shoot him. Plus it would've totally screwed up my evening. Don't drive like an asshole. It's just not worth it. If you're armed, you need to be *more* responsible than the idiots around you. Be the bigger man about it and let it go. Nobody whose opinion is worth anything will think any less of you for doing so.
Link Posted: 7/21/2002 7:38:27 PM EST
Link Posted: 7/21/2002 7:40:27 PM EST
Originally Posted By Observer: Be the bigger man about it and let it go. Nobody whose opinion is worth anything will think any less of you for doing so.
View Quote
In total agreement with you, it's still frightening because some of them are so dead set on backing you into a wall with the only way out being directly through them. Responsibility can be a real bitch.
Link Posted: 7/21/2002 7:45:08 PM EST
Link Posted: 7/21/2002 7:50:36 PM EST
Link Posted: 7/21/2002 8:11:02 PM EST
Way back in the 70's in NJ, I had a clown in a cadillac cruising along at 25 on a one lane congested road. As soon as I had the chance (clear road ahead) I passed him. Being a kid with a rather loud and DAMN quick (70 Cyclone GT, 429 CJ, Top loader 4 speed, 410 detroit locker, quater @ 108 in 11.03 seconds)car he gets pissed and decides I was rude to pass him. We get to the part of the road that goes to 4 lanes and he comes up to pass me (I'm back at the limit now) as he gets next to me he gives me the bird (this is an OLD man!!!) and starts to slide over at me to push me off the side of the road. I drop to 3rd lock the back tires and let him fly by. He slows down... I fly past him again. He catches up and now i'm pissed/worried, what kind of nut case is he? SO as he comes up along side me again I reach for my trusty dry chemical extinguisher (between the seats in a bracket) and as he gets along side I point it out the window and blast him. End of chase, he stops to clear winshield, I drive merrily on.
Link Posted: 7/21/2002 8:11:18 PM EST
Originally Posted By DarkHelmet: I exit and turn left then make a hard right. There is a large Cadillac in the right lane near me. I take the hard right pretty fast and so I am ahead. I see a "Gangstafied" Yukon (Tinted, 20" chrome wheels... late 20's black male driver) take the corner fast behind me also. Being the courteous driver that I am I anticipate his desire to pass me so I begin to move right. Being the impatient driver that he was he tried to cut right and pass me but now I'm already in front of him in the right lane. He gets pissed and rather than move back left and just pass he decides to get right on my tail. Just as he moves back left (and still very close to me) I did the un-courteous thing.... I brake checked him and let the tires lock. He nearly hits me but avoids (I was in my shitty Honda Accord '87) So what would you have done? A) When he came to a stop, pull up right next to him so close that he can't open his drivers door and proceed to exit into a tactical position.... B) Start dialing the cops on the cell phone knowing that when they come that you'll have to explain how you contributed to the start of the confrontation... C) Do what I did... Evade and escape hoping he'll decide to take off the other direction.... D) Other? Keeping in mind... I have my concealed permit, and was carrying a Glock 30 .45ACP and he had a considerably larger vehicle that he was wielding like a weapon before, during, and after the confrontation.
View Quote
Darkhelmet. I was driving around the Eastside(Bellevue-Woodinville) in my SUV this Saturday while carrying 1300 lbs of gravel in the back. The scales at the rockery put my Pathfinder at something like 5800 lbs. If a honda accord brake checked in front of me, he would have almost 3 tons of Nissan metal and rock in the back seat. "Brake checks" are suicidal. Message for everyone, don't overestimate the ability of the vehicle behind you to stop or even slow. The margin for error is in the direction that he can't stop as fast as you or he thinks. If he hits you, you might be able to claim he was too close, though your skid marks may raise some questions, but appearing to be "in the right" doesn't matter if you are DEAD. Knowing how I-5 is, and the traffic on it, through downtown Seattle and farther south, I can understand how your situation occured. Regarding your options. C then B if necessary, and keep moving, don't stop, and don't get out of the car. Oh yeah, I was keeping my distance from traffic, and giving my self lots of room to slow down with the extra weight.
Link Posted: 7/21/2002 8:27:25 PM EST
Road rage begins here: "I did the un-courteous thing.... I brake checked him and let the tires lock. He nearly hits me but avoids..." Yes, you were the @$$hole in this situation. I sentence you to watch the National Transportation Highway Safety Administration Defensive Driving Course, narrated by Hugh Downs, 20 times. Next time you do a stupid, like changing lanes in front of someone... yes, he was impatient and tried to whip around you... as he passes, wave real friendly and smile sheepishly, as if you did the stupid thing, and say to him, "I'm sorry." Trying to prove your manhood while driving down the highway at 70 mph is dangerous to all around you. Drive defensively. Yes, even if you have red and blue lights on your car, drive defensively. Nobody gets a trophy for getting to the next red light first. Oh, I have 25 years safe driving with my company, and have had one ticket in the last 20 years... expired inspection sticker... which I understand in Kalifornia the cops can beat on you with impunity now... but anyway... Drive safely and courteously.
Link Posted: 7/21/2002 8:35:14 PM EST
Instead of speeding off, you should have apologized and taken your beating like a man. I was once run off the road by a dangerous speeding lane switcher. He saw me and intentionally cut me off. I put this type of behavior up there with attempted murder. Turn in your keys and never get behind the wheel again!
Link Posted: 7/21/2002 8:40:46 PM EST
Originally Posted By Lord_Grey_Boots:
Originally Posted By DarkHelmet: I exit and turn left then make a hard right. There is a large Cadillac in the right lane near me. I take the hard right pretty fast and so I am ahead. I see a "Gangstafied" Yukon (Tinted, 20" chrome wheels... late 20's black male driver) take the corner fast behind me also. Being the courteous driver that I am I anticipate his desire to pass me so I begin to move right. Being the impatient driver that he was he tried to cut right and pass me but now I'm already in front of him in the right lane. He gets pissed and rather than move back left and just pass he decides to get right on my tail. Just as he moves back left (and still very close to me) I did the un-courteous thing.... I brake checked him and let the tires lock. He nearly hits me but avoids (I was in my shitty Honda Accord '87) So what would you have done? A) When he came to a stop, pull up right next to him so close that he can't open his drivers door and proceed to exit into a tactical position.... B) Start dialing the cops on the cell phone knowing that when they come that you'll have to explain how you contributed to the start of the confrontation... C) Do what I did... Evade and escape hoping he'll decide to take off the other direction.... D) Other? Keeping in mind... I have my concealed permit, and was carrying a Glock 30 .45ACP and he had a considerably larger vehicle that he was wielding like a weapon before, during, and after the confrontation.
View Quote
Darkhelmet. I was driving around the Eastside(Bellevue-Woodinville) in my SUV this Saturday while carrying 1300 lbs of gravel in the back. The scales at the rockery put my Pathfinder at something like 5800 lbs. If a honda accord brake checked in front of me, he would have almost 3 tons of Nissan metal and rock in the back seat. "Brake checks" are suicidal. Message for everyone, don't overestimate the ability of the vehicle behind you to stop or even slow. The margin for error is in the direction that he can't stop as fast as you or he thinks. If he hits you, you might be able to claim he was too close, though your skid marks may raise some questions, but appearing to be "in the right" doesn't matter if you are DEAD. Knowing how I-5 is, and the traffic on it, through downtown Seattle and farther south, I can understand how your situation occured. Regarding your options. C then B if necessary, and keep moving, don't stop, and don't get out of the car. Oh yeah, I was keeping my distance from traffic, and giving my self lots of room to slow down with the extra weight.
View Quote
1300lbs. of gravel in a Nissan? Can you say "overloaded?" Carefull with that Grey Boots, overloaded is very bad--slooow stoppy, hard on chassis.
Link Posted: 7/21/2002 8:53:40 PM EST
[Last Edit: 7/21/2002 8:54:51 PM EST by Sam_Rothstein]
Originally Posted By DarkHelmet:
Originally Posted By Rabbit9: By the way, what his vehicle looked like, or for that matter, his age or the color of his skin have nothing to do with it, and are a very lame attempt to justify your actions. Grow up.
View Quote
Just a description for Pete's sake! Don't turn it into a racial issue now. No different than me describing my POS '87 Honda Accord. It had nothing to do with justifying my already self-admitted unjustified actions. Grow up.
View Quote
B.S., YOU turned it into a racial issue when you said what race the other driver was.
Link Posted: 7/21/2002 8:57:12 PM EST
[Last Edit: 7/21/2002 9:09:15 PM EST by SIX]
[b]DIM LID[/b] If I had the power, I'd yard that card outta your grip soooooooooo fast....... Think about it.
Link Posted: 7/21/2002 9:02:17 PM EST
Originally Posted By Sam_Rothstein:
Originally Posted By DarkHelmet:
Originally Posted By Rabbit9: By the way, what his vehicle looked like, or for that matter, his age or the color of his skin have nothing to do with it, and are a very lame attempt to justify your actions. Grow up.
View Quote
Just a description for Pete's sake! Don't turn it into a racial issue now. No different than me describing my POS '87 Honda Accord. It had nothing to do with justifying my already self-admitted unjustified actions. Grow up.
View Quote
B.S., YOU turned it into a racial issue when you said what race the other driver was.
View Quote
Damn Sam, at precisely what point does it go over the line from painting a picture to being a racial issue? Please, let us all in on your arbitrary standards so as not to offend thine sensibilities, oh great one. LOL!
Link Posted: 7/21/2002 9:15:15 PM EST
I haven't owned anything with four wheels in about 15 years, I'm a "pure biker". I can't play any games. Somebody plays games with me, such as getting pissed over lane splitting (legal in Calif), my standard answer is just leave. And if they try and follow, good luck, unless they can fit through a 2.5ft gap like I can. And before you talk down at lane splitting: first, it's safer because if I try and "act like a car", some moron behind me will fixate on the LARGE vehicle ahead of him during hard braking, and squish me like a bug. In heavy traffic, the way I can tell I'm driving safely is when I'm bouncing off the botz dots :). Second, if you see it as "unfair" as a co-worker did years ago, I'll make y'all the same deal I did him: if you're willing to rip out your stereo, pull your windshield glass, fill your trunk and back seats with styrofoam so you've got my cargo and passenger capacity, I'll promise not to lane split. That way we'll be "fair". If not, understand that you made your choices and I made mine, we each got different things out of the deal so don't begrudge me what I got - speed and thinness :).
Link Posted: 7/21/2002 9:20:37 PM EST
Originally Posted By AR-10: I wouldn't have "brake checked" him to start with. If you're gonna be running around with a loaded weapon, you probably should not be antagonizing people. Then again, if you're going unarmed, you probably shouldn't be antagonizing people. The main thing is, if you're going to CCW, you have the obligation to comport yourself in a manner that is not agressive and confrontational. That way you don't have to worry about shooting someone because you have enticed them into kicking your ass.
View Quote
Perfectly said, sir!!!
Link Posted: 7/21/2002 9:25:35 PM EST
Damn Sam, at precisely what point does it go over the line from painting a picture to being a racial issue? Please, let us all in on your arbitrary standards so as not to offend thine sensibilities, oh great one. LOL!
View Quote
My sensibilities were in no way offended. My point was why would it matter what race the guy was? And if it did matter enough to mention, then race was part of the issue. Hense it was a racial issue. And if someone has race issues I could give a shit, but dont play it off like you dont. Maybe if he wasnt a black "gangstafied" car driver Dark Helmet wouldnt have scurried off so quicklly. Was that why he mentioned it?
Link Posted: 7/21/2002 9:32:50 PM EST
P.S. I know someone who was rear-ended, got sued for 'stopping too quickly' (non-road rage situation, this wasn't a 'brake check'), and lost - despite the fact that WI traffic law says you're at fault (for tailgating) if you RE someone. Be very careful with your brakes... And this whole car-thread makes me wish the guy who hit me on Friday had swerved... Instead, I'm out a great car (although his was in worse shape, my 'bird actually started up and drove 6ft afterwards (still runs)), and here I wait, wondering if his insurance will rip me off or not...
Link Posted: 7/21/2002 9:43:39 PM EST
[Last Edit: 7/21/2002 9:45:21 PM EST by Adam_White]
Originally Posted By Sam_Rothstein: My sensibilities were in no way offended. My point was why would it matter what race the guy was? And if it did matter enough to mention, then race was part of the issue. Hense it was a racial issue. And if someone has race issues I could give a shit, but dont play it off like you dont. Maybe if he wasnt a black "gangstafied" car driver Dark Helmet wouldnt have scurried off so quicklly. Was that why he mentioned it?
View Quote
No, I don't think so. I think he mentioned it because he was describing the situation in detail. Only a liberal or someone with a guily "race consciousness" would omit such a blatantly obvious descriptive factor. Unfortunately, the PC police have made the world paranoid. Things have become so PC it seems people will mention everything BUT race. I deal with it at least once a week. We get a lot of new people here. Conversation usually goes like this, A: "You know Jones - new guy, a little over 6 ft, receeding hair line, always wears those funny green shoes - hangs out with Smith a lot?" B: "White guy" A: "Yeah, white guy" B: "Yeah, I think I met him last Tuesday" Strangely, black guys will always mention if the person they are describing is black (actually it's usually "dark-skinned or "light-skinned"), white guys will always mention if the person they are describing is white. For some reason, when the "opposite" race is involved, people seem to put on this subconscious color-blind front. I think it's ridiculous. Adam
Link Posted: 7/21/2002 9:48:39 PM EST
[Last Edit: 7/21/2002 9:51:14 PM EST by magnum_99]
Originally Posted By Sam_Rothstein:
Damn Sam, at precisely what point does it go over the line from painting a picture to being a racial issue? Please, let us all in on your arbitrary standards so as not to offend thine sensibilities, oh great one. LOL!
View Quote
My sensibilities were in no way offended. My point was why would it matter what race the guy was? And if it did matter enough to mention, then race was part of the issue. Hense it was a racial issue. And if someone has race issues I could give a shit, but don't play it off like you don't. Maybe if he wasnt a black "gangstafied" car driver Dark Helmet wouldnt have scurried off so quicklly. Was that why he mentioned it?
View Quote
"If it mattered enough to mention...it was a race issue...." Why is it that ANY time race is mentioned, it is a race issue? What if DH had said it was a white guy in a Subaru? Is it a race issue then? Or is it only a race issue when it's a black guy? Are we not allowed to mention race at all without it being a "racially motivated incident?" Sounds like that's where you're headed. I'm really not trying to provoke you, but we all need to get over this stuff. If I get into an altercation (whatever it is) with someone, then, in telling its story, to put meat on the skeleton, I need to give the audience an idea of the scene. I would tell you what, where, how, when, and who, all with adequate descriptions, so you could get the flavor of the encounter. I think DH was doing just that. We've all seen "Gangstafied" cars around. The "gangsta" terminology, look, and attitude is a product of black pop culture itself; it is pervasive (even among suburban white kids) and apparent to all who experience it. Why should not DH mention his impression of the SUV so we can get an idea of the tactical situation he was dealing with? (and yes, I'd be more concerned about the "gangstafied" suv in a tactical scenario than the white guy in the Subaru--I'm a realist, and the condonation and perceived willingness of "gangstas" to use non-necessary violence is a real concern). I'm not defending DH's actions, but the rather harmless description served a legit purpose in this forum. Edit: spelling
Link Posted: 7/21/2002 9:50:48 PM EST
Originally Posted By Sam_Rothstein:
Damn Sam, at precisely what point does it go over the line from painting a picture to being a racial issue? Please, let us all in on your arbitrary standards so as not to offend thine sensibilities, oh great one. LOL!
View Quote
My sensibilities were in no way offended. My point was why would it matter what race the guy was? And if it did matter enough to mention, then race was part of the issue. Hense it was a racial issue. And if someone has race issues I could give a shit, but dont play it off like you dont. Maybe if he wasnt a black "gangstafied" car driver Dark Helmet wouldnt have scurried off so quicklly. Was that why he mentioned it?
View Quote
Twice in one week....... As the official Black Leader on arfcom, as one of the [i]very few[/i] who has major issues on how race baiting is handled on this board, as one who knows personally and shoots with DH... I personally in no way think it was a race issue, I am [u]certain[/u] it was a descriptor. If you look thru the race threads on this board you can [b]easily[/b] see who is a race baiter, who is sym[b]pathetic[/b] and who is not. DH IS one of the good guys, I guess you will just have to trust me on this one....
Link Posted: 7/21/2002 9:52:21 PM EST
[Last Edit: 7/21/2002 9:55:48 PM EST by magnum_99]
Right on CavVet. Oh, and lest anyone thing I only meant to include blacks in the "gansta" class, I (if you read closely) included whites into the class as well. ANYONE can take on the "gangsta" characteristics (now, whether they are a "thug" is another story). Aren't words fun?
Link Posted: 7/21/2002 10:17:26 PM EST
[Last Edit: 7/21/2002 10:19:39 PM EST by USNJoe]
Dude, come try drive on and off Whidbey any given day of the week and twice on the weekends and you will be thanking the gods of traffic for Seattle freeways. I will always pass when it is legal, and if I can't hold my position then I'll gladly give it up to someone else. If someone flashes their lights in my mirror I'll get out of their way, if they want to tailgate me I'll move over and let them by. I carry to protect myself and I avoid any situation where I may have to defend myself over a lane on a road. If I were in a POS Honda and I had a big ole SUV playing Redneck Racing in the freeway with my I would have just given up my position. About the only time I won't yeild is if they don't use their turn signal. If you don't signal I don't know what you are doing. According to the local WSP (we had a safety brief by them at work last week) if you call and report the plate number, make, color, driver and anything else they will call the registered owner of the vehicle to let them know that they were doing something "wrong". Of course you could always turn them in for littering or using the HOV lanes too.
Link Posted: 7/21/2002 11:11:06 PM EST
Link Posted: 7/21/2002 11:15:35 PM EST
E. Wouldn't have been such a smart ass. Ok, maybe I would have.
Link Posted: 7/22/2002 12:57:24 AM EST
Darkhelmet: What did you delete?
Link Posted: 7/22/2002 2:29:40 AM EST
Originally Posted By Sam_Rothstein: B.S., YOU turned it into a racial issue when you said what race the other driver was.
View Quote
Actually, he never said what race the guy was, only what color the guy is. I personally know a few Indians (from india) that are darker than most of the African Americans I know, so black isn't really and identifier on race. Or did you simply make the assumption of race based upon the "ganstafied" description of the vehicle? Now who's making it a racial issue? I don't think you'll last too long here Sammy....
Link Posted: 7/22/2002 2:56:45 AM EST
Strange weekend. I flew to Seattle to purchase a Yukon. It was a great deal to buy except for one thing... It was "Gangstafied." When I picked it up I fell out of the vehicle into a huge pile of 'dark' mud. I was totally covered and I had nothing to wipe myself off with. Oh well... Well, I didn't care. So, during the test drive, and on an offramp, the throttle stuck for a second. I tried to swerve but the guy in front of my original lane swerved into the lane I was going for. I touch the brakes and slow down. Whoo, close. I'm not sure about the throttle so I don't want anyone in front of me so I'm attempting to go into the other lane and the guy in front slams on his brakes!!! WTF. He finally peels out and takes off down another road. Btw, it was a Honda accord. 87 if I remember correctly. [:P] heh
Link Posted: 7/22/2002 3:08:05 AM EST
Originally Posted By DarkHelmet: So what would you have done?
View Quote
Not brake checked him, which started this whole incident. This guy was obviously pissed and could have been armed. You're lucky he wasn't. Why people take unnecessary risks with their lives is beyond me, but it goes back to what I learned as a kid in Karate and in may self defense classes/books later. "The best fight is the one you avoid." Remember the Alamo, and God Bless Texas...
Link Posted: 7/22/2002 4:57:02 AM EST
Originally Posted By DarkHelmet:
Originally Posted By Rabbit9: By the way, what his vehicle looked like, or for that matter, his age or the color of his skin have nothing to do with it, and are a very lame attempt to justify your actions. Grow up.
View Quote
Just a description for Pete's sake! Don't turn it into a racial issue now. No different than me describing my POS '87 Honda Accord. It had nothing to do with justifying my already self-admitted unjustified actions. Grow up.
View Quote
Sorry, I didn't identify "GANGSTAFIED" as a general description, but the "(Tinted, 20" chrome wheels... late 20's black male driver)" should have clued me in. It appeared to me that you were looking for every reason to justify your childish behavior and this persons "profile" was just part of your case. I didn't mean to misinterpret your statements.
Link Posted: 7/22/2002 5:33:52 AM EST
A few years ago I was traveling west on I74 in central Illinois and pulled off at Morton to get gas. While out of the car a young woman and young man approach me. The man carried a large video camera. The woman identified herself as a reporter from a television station in Peoria and asked if she may interview me. I asked on what topic and she said, "How are you prepared to deal with 'road rage' over this July 4th holiday?" I leaned over and said, "To be honest, I am the kind of driver who causes 'road rage'." She backed away from me like I had leprosy or something and said she didn't need to do the interview!
Link Posted: 7/22/2002 6:03:35 AM EST
I found something better than break checking and safer as well. I invariably drive faster than the speed limit on nearly any road I'm on... not ridiculously fast, just faster than posted. Invariably, there will be some idiot tailgating me, insisting I get out of his way regardless of whether I'm in the right or left lane. If I'm in the left lane, and they gate me and then immediately drop back, I usually get out of their way and add them to my Big Revenge List (joking). Left lane is supposed to be for passing, so you shouldn't block traffic. If they insist on reading my bumper stickers by hand, here's what I do. I take my foot off the accellerator, and only resume to maintain a steady 5mph below the posted speed limit. No brakes, no insane changes in speed, just a gradual infuriating sluggishness. If they pull up and curse, I smile obliviously and wave briefly as though saying "hello". Drives them NUTS. I love it, and it's much safer than braking. The best part is they often don't realize what I'm doing, as it happens so slowly. All they know is their blood pressure goes up.
Link Posted: 7/22/2002 7:26:22 AM EST
here's my road rage story. i was driving (SUV passport) home by myself at about 1am on a divided (3 lanes on eaach side) main strip that goes through a couple of cities. tons of bars & nightclubs on this strip. in my rear veiw mirror i see some ass monkey weaving in and outta cars, driving (red sports car) quite fast. he blasts by me then cuts right in front of me and brakes. i slam on the brakes so i don't end up in their front seat right. they switch lanes and i rolled up next to the car and see a white version of snoop dog, & his gangsta wanna be side kick. i didn't say, do, or suggest anything to these dickheads. i just kind of looked at them. well, they didn't like that. so they abruptly switch lanes to get on my passenger side. they proceed to stare me down, then saying some colorful words. i ignored them and tried to get over as far as i could away from them. they manuver over to me again. this time they had fight in their eyes. you could just tell that they wanted to fight. i still sped up ahead of them. it didn't work they caught up to me and caught me at a red light. now that we were both next to eachother, & no where for me to go, they got all ansty like they were about to get out of their car. before they could, i decided i'd had enough of their shit. i tried avoiding them, something had to be done. so i reached down on my seat, grabbed my wallet and did some good 'ol fashion badge flashing. the shiny shield struck the fear of god into these assholes. i believe they turned a few shades of color in fact. they quickly decided they picked the wrong guy to mess with and proceeded to be perfect angles the of the ride home. for you fellow LEO's, i know it's very very frowned upon to "badge flash", and possibly grounds for temination. i didn't relish doing it. but i was left with little choice.
Link Posted: 7/22/2002 7:42:03 AM EST
Originally Posted By DarkHelmet: I did the un-courteous thing.... I brake checked him and let the tires lock. He nearly hits me but avoids (I was in my shitty Honda Accord '87)
View Quote
Don't ya just hate people who do that. Seems to me you provoked the incident......
Link Posted: 7/22/2002 7:47:43 AM EST
Twice in one week....... As the official Black Leader on arfcom, as one of the [i]very few[/i] who has major issues on how race baiting is handled on this board, as one who knows personally and shoots with DH... I personally in no way think it was a race issue, I am [u]certain[/u] it was a descriptor. If you look thru the race threads on this board you can [b]easily[/b] see who is a race baiter, who is sym[b]pathetic[/b] and who is not. DH IS one of the good guys, I guess you will just have to trust me on this one....
View Quote
It's been my unfortunate personal experience that when whites of any sort tailgate, they usually curse as they pass me, but rarely loiter around to harass; they are actually in a hurry. Nearly any tailgating vehicle with two or more black or hispanic men under the age of... oh I dunno, say 35, will almost always hang around to make lingering eye contact, yell things, and generally try to "front". About half the time, they indulge in roadgames. I wish I could say that the white kids do this too, but they don't. *shrug* Consequently, I watch my ass when dealing with them. I avoid trouble where possible, but it seems that some flavors of trouble are more aggressive than others. Does that make me prejudiced? Hell yes. I'm much more wary around black and hispanics within that age range than I am around other groups. Does that make me racist? No. I don't believe in an inherent, genetic superiority or inferiority of a racial group. Oh never mind, I forgot where I was going with this.
Link Posted: 7/25/2002 3:16:15 PM EST
[Last Edit: 7/25/2002 3:22:46 PM EST by DarkHelmet]
Arrow Left Previous Page
Page / 2
Top Top