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11/22/2017 10:05:29 PM
Posted: 9/7/2004 4:01:53 PM EST
[Last Edit: 9/7/2004 4:09:05 PM EST by mjohn3006]
I live in a rather large apartment complex, a "Luxury Apartment" complex full of people with good jobs and are not really too short on money, you should see some of the cars in the parking lot, and I just got a wireless router so my roommates can share the cable connection. People keep getting on, and I keep kicking them off. Its kinda fun, but I just made it so no one except my roomates can get on. Amazing how many people tried to freeload my connection.

Seems pretty stupid to me, I can find a ton of unique information about their computer, and I even have logs turnd on, so I know every website they visit. All their connection are belong to me.

dumb asses.

ETA YES I made it so the only MAC address acepted is my roomates
Link Posted: 9/7/2004 4:05:32 PM EST
Why don't you lock it down. If they do some dumb shit via your connection, it's your door that get's knocked on. I cantenna and rarely use MY own ISP. But I don't do crap to get the wireless owner in any real trouble. If the people using your wireless have a single iota of common sense they can easily mask their info from you.
Link Posted: 9/7/2004 4:06:58 PM EST
[Last Edit: 9/7/2004 4:07:30 PM EST by fight4yourrights]
YOUR fault. (doesn't make it right though)


Lock it down.


Best way - only authorize your and your roomate's MAC addresses
Link Posted: 9/7/2004 4:07:05 PM EST
assuming the packets on a wireless lan are sent the same way as a standard cat5 ethernet lan get a packet sniffer and capture their passwords for sites like hotmail
Link Posted: 9/7/2004 4:07:40 PM EST

Originally Posted By ar50troll:
Why don't you lock it down. If they do some dumb shit via your connection, it's your door that get's knocked on. I cantenna and rarely use MY own ISP. But I don't do crap to get the wireless owner in any real trouble. If the people using your wireless have a single iota of common sense they can easily mask their info from you.



I did. I said that. I made it so the only MAC address acepted is my roomates.
Link Posted: 9/7/2004 4:07:57 PM EST
Link Posted: 9/7/2004 4:08:09 PM EST
You need to set up a secure connection. If you can see thiers, they can see yours.
Hard wire to your wireless moem and set a pass code.
Link Posted: 9/7/2004 4:08:14 PM EST

Originally Posted By sharky30:

assuming the packets on a wireless lan are sent the same way as a standard cat5 ethernet lan get a packet sniffer and capture their passwords for sites like hotmail




MAC address filter, much harder for a someone to spoof
Link Posted: 9/7/2004 4:08:44 PM EST

Originally Posted By mjohn3006:

Originally Posted By ar50troll:
Why don't you lock it down. If they do some dumb shit via your connection, it's your door that get's knocked on. I cantenna and rarely use MY own ISP. But I don't do crap to get the wireless owner in any real trouble. If the people using your wireless have a single iota of common sense they can easily mask their info from you.



I did. I said that. I made it so the only MAC address acepted is my roomates.



Not enough, MAC addresees can easily be spoofed.
Link Posted: 9/7/2004 4:09:11 PM EST

Originally Posted By Stove_Pipe:

Originally Posted By mjohn3006:

Originally Posted By ar50troll:
Why don't you lock it down. If they do some dumb shit via your connection, it's your door that get's knocked on. I cantenna and rarely use MY own ISP. But I don't do crap to get the wireless owner in any real trouble. If the people using your wireless have a single iota of common sense they can easily mask their info from you.



I did. I said that. I made it so the only MAC address acepted is my roomates.



Not enough, MAC addresees can easily be spoofed.



Yup.
Link Posted: 9/7/2004 4:09:14 PM EST
most of the time people dont realize they are on another network.

They set up their own wireless lan without encryption and just have the card/pc use any available ap.

I did it at home once when I forgot to return my wireless settings to my home profile. I logged onto the neighbors router and found it wierd that my password for the router was the default setting. oops not my router.
Link Posted: 9/7/2004 4:09:49 PM EST
ARFCOM Member Foxxz is coming over Friday. He is going to help me set up encription.
Link Posted: 9/7/2004 4:09:56 PM EST

Originally Posted By mjohn3006:
I live in a rather large apartment complex, a "Luxury Apartment" complex full of people with good jobs and are not really too short on money, you should see some of the cars in the parking lot, and I just got a wireless router so my roommates can share the cable connection. People keep getting on, and I keep kicking them off. Its kinda fun, but I just made it so no one except my roomates can get on. Amazing how many people tried to freeload my connection.

Seems pretty stupid to me, I can find a ton of unique information about their computer, and I even have logs turnd on, so I know every website they visit. All their connection are belong to me.

dumb asses.



Its funny. Im in the same situation as you. Only, I dont have an ISP. When I turn on my laptop, it usually finds a network to use. Since my building is not yet able to support cable broadband, I've been tempted to use what I can find. If not, than all I have is T-Mobile Hotspot at Starbucks/Borders...
Link Posted: 9/7/2004 4:10:24 PM EST

Originally Posted By sharky30:
assuming the packets on a wireless lan are sent the same way as a standard cat5 ethernet lan get a packet sniffer and capture their passwords for sites like hotmail



sniffing wep is a little more work, but can be done... or so I have been told
Link Posted: 9/7/2004 4:30:08 PM EST
WPA with MAC address filter.
XP SP2 has made secure wireless connection a breeze.

Someone with enough "want" will always be able to hack into your wireless network.
As long as there are enough unsecured wireless networks around I can't see someone hacking into a secure one.
Link Posted: 9/7/2004 4:32:59 PM EST
I had my house RF sheilded and wrapped in aluminum foil to prevent govt mind melding
Link Posted: 9/7/2004 4:33:10 PM EST
Do what I do, connect everything with CAT5/6 cable using a hardwired router.
Link Posted: 9/7/2004 4:33:50 PM EST
Change the default router password and the Router IP as well, and turn off SSID broadcast.
Link Posted: 9/7/2004 4:40:03 PM EST

Originally Posted By twonami:
I had my house RF sheilded and wrapped in aluminum foil to prevent govt mind melding


You did that too. Man that was spendy setting up my house as a giant Faraday Cage. But cell reception sure sucks.
Link Posted: 9/7/2004 4:40:51 PM EST

Originally Posted By Fat_McNasty:

Originally Posted By twonami:
I had my house RF sheilded and wrapped in aluminum foil to prevent govt mind melding


You did that too. Man that was spendy setting up my house as a giant Faraday Cage. But cell reception sure sucks.


not unless you have a cell repeater!!!
Link Posted: 9/7/2004 4:41:34 PM EST

Originally Posted By D-duck:
most of the time people dont realize they are on another network.

They set up their own wireless lan without encryption and just have the card/pc use any available ap.

I did it at home once when I forgot to return my wireless settings to my home profile. I logged onto the neighbors router and found it wierd that my password for the router was the default setting. oops not my router.



+1

Most people will have their card set to pick up a ip address via DHCP and won't have a clue that they are latching into someone elses network especially in a apartment area. Of course there will be some people with half a brain who will want to free load on your network.

I prefer CAT 5 cable, much easier to control access.
Link Posted: 9/7/2004 4:53:23 PM EST
Link Posted: 9/7/2004 5:09:53 PM EST

Originally Posted By mjohn3006:
All their connection are belong to me.



That sentence is much goodly.
Link Posted: 9/7/2004 5:17:08 PM EST
[Last Edit: 9/7/2004 5:20:01 PM EST by SO-COM]
Here is what I do to my wireless:
1) Enable MAC Filtering
2) 128Bit WEP (this can be broken, but it will stop most newbies and script kiddies)
3) Disable DHCP
4) Disable SSID Broadcast
5) Put the router on some weird ass static address range like 34.2.234.X and number the router something funky so figuring out the default gateway and dns server will be a little tough.
6) Change the WEP if you think someone is actually breaking it. Chances are, if they are breaking it, and getting access out, they know what the hell they are doing.
Link Posted: 9/7/2004 5:18:40 PM EST
You guys take this crap WAY too seriously.

I leave mine open just to see who gets on. Jeez, it aint that big a deal. My door knocked on? Whatever.... I think your tinfoil hat it a little too tight.

In any case - there is about as much BS on this thread as there is fact. You cant sniff hotmail passwords.... pretty much any password site is SSL.... and you gotta collect the packets, reconstruct, and then decrypt 128bit cyphers.... and thats a LOT more work for some stupid email account than hacking WEP.

There is no such thing as a secure network. It is by its very nature, insecure. Connectivity breed insecurity. There are only *more* secure networks, and *less* secure.

WEP, MAC filtering, static addressing, IP filtering, etc.... are all ways to make your home connection *more* secure. Even then, running IPSEC encryption over all wireless traffic is another goo way to secure it.... but jeez guys.... its a HOME network. Who cares. The odds of anyone smart enough to hack into your crap, within range of your signal, are low.

The WORST thing about someone getting on your wireless connection, is simply using YOUR bandwidth when YOU want it. Gimme a break.
Link Posted: 9/7/2004 5:20:53 PM EST
[Last Edit: 9/7/2004 5:23:19 PM EST by dmaas]
I'm not a hippy but I do make the assumption that open networks are OK to share. It's just common courtesy. If you don't want people on your network, lock it down*.

Open wireless access points are the closest thing we have to "everywhere" internet access today. Yes there are various proprietary cell/packet services you can sign up for but they are still expensive and slow.

(*I forbid wireless ethernet in my company specifically to avoid these additional security problems)

Regarding MAC addresses, yes you can easily change yours, but the problem is finding out what to change it to :)
Link Posted: 9/7/2004 5:25:19 PM EST
[Last Edit: 9/7/2004 5:26:22 PM EST by ar50troll]

Originally Posted By FALARAK:
You guys take this crap WAY too seriously.

I leave mine open just to see who gets on. Jeez, it aint that big a deal. My door knocked on? Whatever.... I think your tinfoil hat it a little too tight.
In any case - there is about as much BS on this thread as there is fact. You cant sniff hotmail passwords.... pretty much any password site is SSL.... and you gotta collect the packets, reconstruct, and then decrypt 128bit cyphers.... and thats a LOT more work for some stupid email account than hacking WEP.

There is no such thing as a secure network. It is by its very nature, insecure. Connectivity breed insecurity. There are only *more* secure networks, and *less* secure.

WEP, MAC filtering, static addressing, IP filtering, etc.... are all ways to make your home connection *more* secure. Even then, running IPSEC encryption over all wireless traffic is another goo way to secure it.... but jeez guys.... its a HOME network. Who cares. The odds of anyone smart enough to hack into your crap, within range of your signal, are low.

The WORST thing about someone getting on your wireless connection, is simply using YOUR bandwidth when YOU want it. Gimme a break.



Nothing could be farther from the truth. I'm not going to get in a flame war explaining just what someone can do to get your door knocked on in,less than an hour. It can and does happen every single day. If you don't care, shit print this page for the day it happens to you.
There is a group of script kiddies that do this and watch from a block away as you get raided for fun. So don't tell me it ain't gonna happen.
Link Posted: 9/7/2004 5:37:37 PM EST

Originally Posted By FALARAK:
You guys take this crap WAY too seriously.

I leave mine open just to see who gets on. Jeez, it aint that big a deal. My door knocked on? Whatever.... I think your tinfoil hat it a little too tight.

In any case - there is about as much BS on this thread as there is fact. You cant sniff hotmail passwords.... pretty much any password site is SSL.... and you gotta collect the packets, reconstruct, and then decrypt 128bit cyphers.... and thats a LOT more work for some stupid email account than hacking WEP.

There is no such thing as a secure network. It is by its very nature, insecure. Connectivity breed insecurity. There are only *more* secure networks, and *less* secure.

WEP, MAC filtering, static addressing, IP filtering, etc.... are all ways to make your home connection *more* secure. Even then, running IPSEC encryption over all wireless traffic is another goo way to secure it.... but jeez guys.... its a HOME network. Who cares. The odds of anyone smart enough to hack into your crap, within range of your signal, are low.

The WORST thing about someone getting on your wireless connection, is simply using YOUR bandwidth when YOU want it. Gimme a break.



That is pretty much the way I look at it.

No use in making everyone pay for it if it doesn't bother my surfing!

BigDozer66
Link Posted: 9/7/2004 5:41:25 PM EST
Here's a good door knocker, suppose somebody sends eeeee-mails threaatening upper high muckymucks in a certain branch of the gummint? Or maybe simulates or really does plan some , shall we say very unsociable behaviour that might equate to a T******t Act. I bet you get visitors.

A friend of mine got a wireless set-up, and since he lives near what many might feel is a non-connected demographic. He found over fifty points he could enter in drtiving around his neighborhood, blew our minds. He definitely locked his down and makes sure any sensitive family data is put only on a disconnect unit and is sneaker-wared to one of the other units if he wants to internet it, and then sneaker awared off.
Link Posted: 9/7/2004 6:05:38 PM EST
[Last Edit: 9/7/2004 6:06:20 PM EST by dmaas]
On the other hand, having an open access point would be an excellent alibi if you were ever accused of online copyright infringement, etc. The prosecution can only trace back to your network, it's very unlikely they would be able to point at a specific person or computer on that network.
Link Posted: 9/7/2004 6:18:07 PM EST
I turned my SSID off, changed the channel and password, use WEP, and restrict to known MAC list. Anything less is asking for trouble.

Meanwhile, from the second floor of my house, I can connect to any of 4 Linksys Channel 6 Open routers if I would care to.

People are just too lazy to change default settings.
Link Posted: 9/7/2004 6:20:40 PM EST
Ok guys, It's simple. Lock the access point down, and encrypt if you don't want people on it. If you live in an apartment building there is the real possibility that people will wonder into an area where your wireless is stronger than theirs and Windows may just decide to use yours if the AP is wide open. You probably don't have a whole building full of hackers.

For instance with my wireless card installed I can sit in my friends apartment and I'll end up getting a connection from one of his neighbors. Windows does this automatically and my wireless card is built into the laptop. The only way to stop it is to disable the card or fiddle with the networks page to not connect to that network. I will not go make extra effort to change my PC to avoid someone elses wide open network.
Link Posted: 9/7/2004 6:25:13 PM EST

Originally Posted By Grunteled:
Ok guys, It's simple. Lock the access point down, and encrypt if you don't want people on it. If you live in an apartment building there is the real possibility that people will wonder into an area where your wireless is stronger than theirs and Windows may just decide to use yours if the AP is wide open. You probably don't have a whole building full of hackers.

For instance with my wireless card installed I can sit in my friends apartment and I'll end up getting a connection from one of his neighbors. Windows does this automatically and my wireless card is built into the laptop. The only way to stop it is to disable the card or fiddle with the networks page to not connect to that network. I will not go make extra effort to change my PC to avoid someone elses wide open network.



Exactly! There is one guy who put in an open AP real close to a neighbor who uses my internet access... and that royally screwed up my neighbor... because she would connect to me, then to this new AP, then to ME, etc...... I changed frequencies, everything.... to no avail. Its not just hackers... sometimes it just someone who comes how, uses their wireless equipped laptop, and it just happens to connect to you since you are open.

I would.
Link Posted: 9/7/2004 6:33:58 PM EST
Link Posted: 9/7/2004 7:14:36 PM EST

Originally Posted By mjohn3006:


ETA YES I made it so the only MAC address acepted is my roomates



How do you do that? I figured out WEP and turning SSID off.
Link Posted: 9/7/2004 7:42:45 PM EST

Originally Posted By FALARAK:
The WORST thing about someone getting on your wireless connection, is simply using YOUR bandwidth when YOU want it. Gimme a break.



Sharing is cool. Now if the kid next door would only chip in for my cable bill...
Link Posted: 9/7/2004 9:22:18 PM EST

Originally Posted By QuietShootr:

Originally Posted By mjohn3006:


ETA YES I made it so the only MAC address acepted is my roomates



How do you do that? I figured out WEP and turning SSID off.



You have to have a GOOD router. Those wally world specials probably wont do that. Linksys is coming a LONG way since Cisco bought them.
Link Posted: 9/7/2004 9:24:34 PM EST

Originally Posted By Paul:
his password on his AP was set to the default one, his SSID was turned on, and he wasnt' using WEP.



I LOVE changing other peoples passwords on their unprotected routers with default admin passwords..... right after I change all their settings.

I am just evil.
Link Posted: 9/8/2004 2:26:17 AM EST

Originally Posted By FALARAK:

Originally Posted By QuietShootr:

Originally Posted By mjohn3006:


ETA YES I made it so the only MAC address acepted is my roomates



How do you do that? I figured out WEP and turning SSID off.



You have to have a GOOD router. Those wally world specials probably wont do that. Linksys is coming a LONG way since Cisco bought them.



I got the NETGEAR router and it has tons of settings. Under Wireless setup is "Wireless Acess List" and there I tell it the MAC address to accept.
Link Posted: 9/8/2004 5:39:13 AM EST

Originally Posted By mjohn3006:

Originally Posted By FALARAK:

Originally Posted By QuietShootr:

Originally Posted By mjohn3006:


ETA YES I made it so the only MAC address acepted is my roomates



How do you do that? I figured out WEP and turning SSID off.



You have to have a GOOD router. Those wally world specials probably wont do that. Linksys is coming a LONG way since Cisco bought them.



I got the NETGEAR router and it has tons of settings. Under Wireless setup is "Wireless Acess List" and there I tell it the MAC address to accept.



I don't see that tab. I have "Starting MAC Filter enable/disable" then buttons for Active MAC filter and Edit MAC filter setting". Is that it?
Link Posted: 9/9/2004 2:32:58 PM EST
Step 1: Use seperate router and wireless gateway seperated by a switch.
Step 2: Configure switch to cascade all ports to your PC.
Step 3: Start Etherpeak session with appropriate POP3 filters.
Step 4: Read your neighbor's emails, and blackmail him about his affair with his secretary.




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