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9/22/2017 12:11:25 AM
Posted: 8/11/2005 8:15:46 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/11/2005 8:16:52 PM EDT by Fast_Jimmy]
The range I use is great. Unlimited access for 50 dollars a year plus one time membership, very reasonable rules, they even allow you to set your own targets up as long as you make sure the shots will hit the backstop.

Problem is, for some reason, some shooters seem bent on tearing it apart. There is 3/8" angle Iron covering the posts at 50 and 100 yds, and 1/4" steel cross brackets that seat the 2X4's at 2 levels running across. I counted 65 high power impacts in one piece of iron, and people also seem to like to shoot the cross brackets, making it impossible to fully seat the 2X4's when they're replaced. I once talked to the main guy who repairs them every year, and he said he wouldn't mind if people wanted to shoot iron, but they should just bring their own. How much more reasonable can a range be?

What kind of shooter buys a nice rifle, exercises their rights as a citizen taking up this great hobby and tradition, and then goes out and destroys something other shooters work hard building to make their shooting more fun and productive?

What thought process is working when a guy is blasting away at something that not only is posted and against the rules, but jeopardizes his own access to a beautiful 200 yard facility that isn't terribly crowded, and has a great covered bench area?

I just don't understand. It's hard to imagine.
Link Posted: 8/11/2005 8:17:37 PM EDT
thats sucks. Luckily at the range I'm a member of we've put a stop to that kind of behavior by mounting cameras......(that don't really work). The assclowns no longer shoot the shit out of the permanent structures.
Link Posted: 8/11/2005 8:19:02 PM EDT
That's a damn good idea. I'll talk to the guy who does the repairs. He's pretty cool, and takes a lot of pride in the range.
Link Posted: 8/11/2005 8:21:22 PM EDT
Link Posted: 8/11/2005 8:50:55 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Fast_Jimmy:
Problem is, for some reason, some shooters seem bent on tearing it apart.

I just don't understand. It's hard to imagine.



Sadly it is not just some shooters but most. Their behavior reflect badly on the few that actually behave responsibly.

It's like all the campers who litter as aposed to the campers who don't and make a valiant attempt to clean up after them.

It's called responsibility or in other words persoanal accountability. When I was growing up the rule of the day was pack out everything you pack in.

Over the years this sound philosophy has turned out to be lacking and when I, like many others go out shooting I/we regularly pack out signifigantly more than what I/we packed in but my/our efforts often go un-noticed due to the overwhelming number of asshats who just don't give a shit one way or the other.

They drag computers, washing machines, lawnmowers and in some instances even cars out to public and even private shooting areas, shoot them up and leave. They don't pick up their casings, targets or even their empty ammo boxes.

Paul for example. For every Paul there seems to be 100 assholes. Unfortunately Paul and responsible shooters can't keep up with the assholes so the public image of the responsible gun owner is lost. We all end up looking like irresponsible asshats who don't care.
Link Posted: 8/11/2005 10:30:45 PM EDT
We have the same problem at our range. People want to shoot up the target carriers, so now, the carriers are not provided; you bring your own. Even then, people will leave teh place looking like a dump. Fortunately, with the infrastructure of our club, when we find these ignorant bastards in action, we can bring them before the board of directors. Given the rash of destructive shooters, the board would have no issues kicking them out of the club.
Link Posted: 8/11/2005 11:43:40 PM EDT
Our club built steel target holders and left them out for range users to make it easier for users. within a month all of them were completely destroyed. You could see were people shot the stand leg itself a good 2 feet below the target area. Of course this only happens when no one is around. No matter where you go there is an a-hole waiting to ruin it.
Link Posted: 8/12/2005 12:19:27 AM EDT
everytime the H-crew meets for a shoot at impact, someone peppers the poppers with 5.56
Link Posted: 8/12/2005 12:28:40 AM EDT
Certainly not standing up for range vandals, but is it possible that the range gets used a lot and people with iron sights hit the metal by accident. Maybe even a scoped rifle if it is off or the shooter is a poor shot. It could be on accident.
Link Posted: 8/12/2005 12:51:20 AM EDT

Originally Posted By VTwin60:
thats sucks. Luckily at the range I'm a member of we've put a stop to that kind of behavior by mounting cameras......(that don't really work). The assclowns no longer shoot the shit out of the permanent structures.



I would just shoot the cameras.
Link Posted: 8/12/2005 5:01:00 PM EDT

Originally Posted By sum-rifle:
Certainly not standing up for range vandals, but is it possible that the range gets used a lot and people with iron sights hit the metal by accident. Maybe even a scoped rifle if it is off or the shooter is a poor shot. It could be on accident.



I'm sure that's some of it, but the 2X4's running across mean that, with a centered target, you'd have to miss by 4 or 5 feet. I guess with more rapid fire, it's possible.

Link Posted: 8/12/2005 5:14:58 PM EDT


I've done it accidently.

but damn sure never on purpose
Link Posted: 8/12/2005 6:22:49 PM EDT
I thought that only happened at out range!! I use to think it was the low life that was doing it, but we caught one guy that had a nice car, and nice rifle shooting our bench stools!!. We made him pay for them.

People seem to want to destroy what is not theirs, even though they get to use it. Our range is open to the pubilc with no watchman, so anything goes when they are by themself. It is a constant policing detail to keep down the trash, computers and crap. I suspect these are the same people that have a hard time staying in their lane when driving.

Another club I belong to has a locked gate, and cost $125 a year dues, but it is the same porblem slob shooters. I try to consol myself that these dudes are expending their ammo at our range and not on the highway signs for others to see.

My heaven help us all.



Link Posted: 8/12/2005 7:11:15 PM EDT
Throught the years I've belonged to 1/2 dozen different clubs. they all have this problem. A lot of it is from unprepared shooters who tack their targets to the structure instead of a cardboard backer. I've seen this a lot. I've also seen (the aftermath) nonmembers show up and shoot up the telephone poles that hold a suspension wire up for our targets. And the other 95% is the a hole who wants to destroy something to see what his gun will do. I say charge the bastards criminally! That probably wouldn't hold up in court because they'd say it was an accident and they're on the range to learn,.,,,, yeah right,
o well
Link Posted: 8/12/2005 8:08:42 PM EDT
My range used to allow members to bring their own targets.

They stopped that three years ago when someone was caught bringing a v8 block to the range as a target.

Now they shoot the shit out of the target stands.

It's gotten to the point where I built my own with a set of wheels so I can move it.

Last month when I was packing up to leave some jerk came over to where I had my stand and grabbed it.

I asked WTF did he think he was doing, he told me that he was going to use "this stand" since it was the only one not shot up.

I told him there was a reason for that, I had built it for me.

It took me telling him three times to look at the other target stands to see how many others there were like mine, and then I had to show him the marks I had made when I cut the lumber.


Link Posted: 8/12/2005 8:10:14 PM EDT
We would inspect the range after they got out. Any intentional hits were charged.
Link Posted: 8/12/2005 8:11:34 PM EDT
I'm not supposed to shoot the target stand?
Link Posted: 8/12/2005 8:14:12 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Paul:
I shoot on public land and end up having to clean up junk every time I go there - televisons, microwaves, beer bottles ...




I'm the same; it's sad to say but every time I go to a public range I become convinced that we are only a few decades from loosing our rights cause shooters are SO INCONSIDERATE and SLOVENLY.

GAS OVENS for hell's sake. Tv's, Fridges crap like that. It pisses me off to no end. If I had land I would NOT let shooters on it and it's hard to expect others to cause most just ruin it.



I have started hooking my little army trailer on behind the jeep and when I go I try to put as much crap into it as possible when I leave. I barely make a dent.
Link Posted: 8/12/2005 8:16:35 PM EDT
At the informal range I shoot at in Mammoth it's littered with glass, plastic and other crap. Last time it had an over-stuffed chair and a snow-mobile. I went up the hill a few hundred yards to the alternate range and it was clean and empty of shooters.
Link Posted: 8/12/2005 8:18:23 PM EDT
I am glad I belong to clubs with very strict membership requirements. The shit they make you go through (being sponsored by another member, approved by the BOD, have to go to orientation, and work 8 hours fixing shit up, etc) has kept such damage so low that I have never seen it.

Link Posted: 8/13/2005 3:21:11 PM EDT

Originally Posted By SWO_daddy:
I am glad I belong to clubs with very strict membership requirements. The shit they make you go through (being sponsored by another member, approved by the BOD, have to go to orientation, and work 8 hours fixing shit up, etc) has kept such damage so low that I have never seen it.




That's how ours is set up, but with 100 hours over 3 years, and it still happens. And the way things are shot up, it's not accidental, or a nonzeroed weapon ( 4 feet off at 7 yards!?). THere's gonna come a day when I catch somebody, ooh boy oh boy. FWIW, we can shoot dryers, fridges, etc, but the "you brought it, you take it" rule applies. Unfortunately, the same people who whreck carriers are probably the ones leaving their junk behind.
Link Posted: 8/13/2005 3:40:21 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/13/2005 3:42:58 PM EDT by Galland]
The last range I paid to use, Ye Olde Gun Club, was sealed off from trespassers by a 10' high chain link fence. Every member received a key to the gate after he or she paid yearly dues. The padlock was changed once a year to prevent people with expired memberships from using the range. This system worked well. Every shooter I saw at Ye Olde Gun Club policed brass and swept his immediate area before leaving.

Unfortunately the range was too far away for a paying membership to be practical. The range owner didn't keep the place in very good shape either. Kneeling gave one the feeling of being in a rice paddy and going prone obscured the berms even more. It would've been a Grade-A pistol and rifle range if it was closer to home and kept neat.

And FYI to prospective range owners: Not everyone wants to sit at a bench all day and be a bench rest commando. Don't build your bench rests out of concrete or use heavy wooden picnic tables. Some of us want to go prone now and then. ;)

Galland
Link Posted: 8/13/2005 4:11:06 PM EDT

it's sad to say but every time I go to a public range I become convinced that we are only a few decades from loosing our rights cause shooters are SO INCONSIDERATE and SLOVENLY.


It makes you wonder what kind of people these are. I am working an internship for the forest service, and here in Washington you can shoot anywhere in the forest with basically only three rules: Know your backstop; don't shoot across a road; don't shoot at or across a body of water.
Almost without fail every time I come across a makeshift range the backstop is a huge valley. At one place there is a huge sand pit (with wrecked cars and appliances shot to shit), and we found tattered target stands whose only backstop was the trees lining the last 100 meters of the road to get there! It makes me sick.

Cheers
Link Posted: 8/13/2005 4:24:24 PM EDT
Link Posted: 8/13/2005 4:32:46 PM EDT
Damn, this stuff is depressing. I guess any sport that can be said to include, to some extent, nearly a third of the population, is bound to have people of questionable judgment when it comes to long term image of firearms owners.
I do recall a 100 yard range where I used to live that was pretty decent. They changed the keys yearly, and generally, I found the shooters there to be awesomely friendly and informative. I once had a guy leave and go home to get a 300 Weatherby so I could shoot it, since I hadn't before after a lengthy afternoon of firearms related jabbering. That's a brotherhood of sorts, to be sure. I generally think, whenever I see the NRA caps, there's someone I could likely trust in dire circumstances.
At this range, the target stands were relatively simple and cheap, heavy re-bar shaped and welded to take plywood/osb pieces, and they didn't do too badly. People almost never left junk around. It was, however, a great area of mixed farming and small towns, so that probably helped.
Link Posted: 8/13/2005 4:49:13 PM EDT
I belonged to a range once that inspected your lane when you left. Not clean(Brass swept, trash , ect), you cleaned it.
If you hit a target carrier and didnt tell then when it happened, so they could determine if it was an accident, you paid $15 dollars.

But that was at a public range with several employess keepping an eye on everyone.

Travis

P.S. Great place for pistol shooting, too.

"A Place to shoot" in Portland, OR.
Link Posted: 8/13/2005 5:00:23 PM EDT

I shoot at a public range located in a Wildlife Management Area . It's state funded so you know they
don't have a lot of money in the budget to keep it up . It really pisses me off to see the kind of damage people will do . The folding chairs have bullet holes in them . So much empty brass on the firing line that it's a hazard to walk , improper targets downrange ( cans , clay targets , etc ) , empty ammo boxes , etc . Jerks !
Link Posted: 8/13/2005 5:17:49 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/14/2005 6:20:18 AM EDT by RSF45]
I used to work at an indoor range.
One day this customer shoots the ceiling baffles with 3 consecutive shots.
The RO goes out, advises the customer to not shoot the baffles, be more careful, lower your target, etc.
Customer response:" I paid my money, I can shoot any damn thing I want!"
Needless to say she was shown the door..
Link Posted: 8/13/2005 6:03:56 PM EDT
I have started to get vocal at the public range towards folks who screw stuff up. So far, no one has responded in the negative.

If and when they do, I will show them my badge/ID and explain to them the meaning of Criminal Mischief .

I urge everyone to politely ask folks to stop this type of behaviour UNLESS the situation makes you feel that it is unsafe to do so.

Remember... PUBLIC RANGES ARE YOURS!!!
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