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9/22/2017 12:11:25 AM
Posted: 3/6/2002 6:16:02 AM EDT
Link Posted: 3/6/2002 6:18:34 AM EDT
Was the Alamo that Texas thing? [}:D]
Link Posted: 3/6/2002 6:20:40 AM EDT
Sanat Anna marched into San Antonio and raised the red flag of no quarter. He won the battle, but he eventually lost the war. Perhaps that's how it will be in regards to all this stupid legislation?
Link Posted: 3/6/2002 6:23:50 AM EDT
Originally Posted By Minman72: Was the Alamo that Texas thing? [}:D]
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I bet you won't come down here and say that....[BD]
Link Posted: 3/6/2002 6:45:28 AM EDT
Link Posted: 3/6/2002 7:02:47 AM EDT
Raised the flag of 'no quarter' and ordered the buglers to sound [i][b]'Degeullo'[/b][/i]! Hear this my Texans! and hear the last music that filled the patriots' ears on that fateful and glorious morning.... [url]http://www.texancultures.utsa.edu/alamo/deguello.ram[/url] DEGÜELLO. The degüello, music played by the Mexican army bands on the morning of March 6, 1836, was the signal for Antonio López de Santa Anna's attack on the Alamo. The word [i][b]degüello[/b][/i] signifies the act of beheading or throat-cutting and in Spanish history became associated with the battle music, which, in different versions, meant complete destruction of the enemy without mercy. And finally, here is the letter to the world from Col. Wm. Barrett Travis, that stirred our hearts so... [b]Commandancy of the Alamo Bexar, Fby. 24th, 1836 To the People of Texas & all Americans in the world Fellow Citizens & Compatriots I am besieged by a thousand or more of the Mexicans under Santa Anna. I have sustained a continual bombardment & cannonade for 24 hours & havenot lost a man. The enemy has demanded a surrender at discretion, otherwise the garrison are to be put to the sword if the fort is taken. I have answered the demand with a cannon shot, and our flag still waves proudly from the walls. [i]I shall never surrender nor retreat[/i]. Then, I call on you in the name of Liberty, of patriotism, & of everything dear to the American character, to come to our aid with all dispatch. The enemy is receiving reinforcements daily & will no doubt increase to three or four thousand in four or five days. If this call is neglected, I am determined to sustain myself as long as possible & die like a soldier who never forgets what is due to his own honor & that of his country. Victory or Death William Barret Travis Lt. Col. Comdt. P. S. [i]The Lord is on our side[/i]. When the enemy appeared in sight we had not three bushels of corn. We have since found in deserted houses 80 or 90 bushels & got into the walls 20 or 30 head of Beeves. Travis[/b] And folks have to ask what makes us so proud of being Texans! Eric The([b]13DaysToGlory![/b])Hun[>]:)]
Link Posted: 3/6/2002 7:03:02 AM EDT
Thebeekeeper1, great post, thank's. Don't let the comment's of some armchair commando's spoil it. 186 men deserve more respect. Hey, btw Davy Crockitt and I were born on the same date 08/17. That and a dollar will get you a cup of coffee in some places. Still hyped about the BRC, see you then.
Link Posted: 3/6/2002 7:07:24 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 3/6/2002 7:20:50 AM EDT by texastactical]
Link Posted: 3/6/2002 7:07:39 AM EDT
BeauxBeaux, being from Tennsessee, you are already an Honorary Texan, dear Son of Crockett! A whole lot of those men at the Alamo were from Tennessee, as you well know! My great, great grandfather Hun came to Texas from Tennessee in 1846, just in time for the Mexican War! So that's 'T' for Texas, and 'T' for Tennessee! Eric The(It'sAnOldSong)Hun[>]:)]
Link Posted: 3/6/2002 7:10:21 AM EDT
Link Posted: 3/6/2002 7:15:30 AM EDT
And Louisianans shouldn't feel left out either! One of my favorite stories is of Jim Bowie's mother, who was living in what was shortly to become Shreveport on the banks of the Red River. As a rider with the news of her son's death at the Alamo rode up, he found her sitting in her rocking chair on the front porch of her cabin. When told the sad news, the elderly woman continued smoking her corncob pipe, and then, suddenly leaning forward and pointing the stem of her pipe at the rider, said: [b]'I'll wager they found no bullet holes in my boy's back!'[/b] And then continued on rocking, puffing her pipe. Nope, they don't make many mothers like that anymore. And there certainly weren't any bullet holes in Col. Bowie's back! Eric The(Louisiana,Too!)Hun[>]:)]
Link Posted: 3/6/2002 7:48:29 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 3/6/2002 7:49:02 AM EDT by RNYC]
Here is a list of the defenders of the Alamo: [url]http://www.thealamo.org/defenders.html[/url]
Link Posted: 3/6/2002 7:48:43 AM EDT
Originally Posted By Ponyboy:
Originally Posted By Minman72: Was the Alamo that Texas thing? [}:D]
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I bet you won't come down here and say that....[BD]
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Amen Brother
Link Posted: 3/6/2002 7:54:14 AM EDT
Originally Posted By The_Beer_Slayer: i was really disappointed with my visit to the alamo. Here i was expecting an old church out on a desert plain. The damn thing is in the middle of downtown. Right across the street from all the freak show museums. The basement tour was rather cool though [:D] mike
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Basement....ok pee wee...quit watching so much TV.
Link Posted: 3/6/2002 8:01:09 AM EDT
Great post beekeeper! God Bless Texas and the heroes of the Alamo. BTW, Col. Travis was 26 years old (can we all say Leadership).
Link Posted: 3/6/2002 8:02:06 AM EDT
The rest of the missions are quite interesting also. Out of all of them, it seems as if the Alamo was ironically the most successful. San Antonio grew and developed beyond what the Franciscans had ever dreamed. My wife is back in San Antonio this week. She says that it's C-O-L-D.
Link Posted: 3/6/2002 8:05:47 AM EDT
Here, here to Texans and the ALamo. This was one of the events that gave America a rock solid foundation. But I disagree with the sentiments of the writer with regard to "this pragmatic generation of spoiled Americans." I can give you several hundred VERY unpragmatic firefighters and policemen. Actually, no I can't. They are all dead. Running into a burning building when everyone else was running out. I can give you at least a dozen VER unpragmatic Armed Forces soldiers and sailors. Uhhh, no i can't. They died in a hick country called Afgghanistan, dying for a nation that largely forgets them, in a nation that largely dislikes them. I dare say I could rally 186 Americans to stand and die for HOME TERRITORY here in the continental US, just as Travis and his boys nobly did in Texas. Nobility has ALWAYS been in the minority. And it SELDOM gets media attention these days. Which is NOT to say that I don't fear where the liberal bedwetter eduKKKators and chicken feces like Tom Daschle are taking this country. But as of today, I feel confident I could find NUMEROUS unpragmatic, unselfish Americans (maybe even some Canadians [}:D] OK, yes DEFINITELY some Canadians ) to do the same. We Americans shine BEST when PUSHED.
Link Posted: 3/6/2002 8:13:09 AM EDT
Originally Posted By garandman: I dare say I could rally 186 Americans to stand and die for HOME TERRITORY here in the continental US, just as Travis and his boys nobly did in Texas.
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I am a native Texan. My family settled Central Texas in 1822. You, sir, are no William B. Travis.
Link Posted: 3/6/2002 8:15:15 AM EDT
[beer]
Link Posted: 3/6/2002 8:15:55 AM EDT
God Bless Texas! Remember The Alamo! Remember 09.11.01! Thanks beekeeper1, great post. [img]www.pinette.net/chris/flags/texas/tx-gonz.gif[/img] [img]www.pinette.net/chris/flags/texas/us-tx.gif[/img]
Link Posted: 3/6/2002 8:18:53 AM EDT
You know, I was born and raised in TX, and I will retire and die there! When I try to explain my pride in my home state out here in CA, I get the strangest responses. Most folks from most other states just don't have any pride in thier heritage or their history. It's really sad. I also try to inform folks about the war for Texan Independence(most think its just a John Wayne movie), and tell about the brave souls who perished in that mission in San Antonio, and the lives lost a Goliad, and how the Battle of San Jacinto was one of the most lop-sided and decisive victories in the history of warfare, and how Santa Anna turned out to be a coward who tried to run and hide behind his conscripted troops when it all fell apart for him. He had no pride, and he had no honor in the end. Folks just don't understand how I get so worked up about it, and that tells me they are not the type of folks I would want watching my back. I am proud to be a Texan, and will always be proud of it no matter where I am in the world! Ya'll have a nice day, and REMEMBER THE ALAMO!!
Link Posted: 3/6/2002 8:28:02 AM EDT
Originally Posted By Bud:
Originally Posted By garandman: I dare say I could rally 186 Americans to stand and die for HOME TERRITORY here in the continental US, just as Travis and his boys nobly did in Texas.
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I am a native Texan. My family settled Central Texas in 1822. You, sir, are no William B. Travis.
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Why the personal insult, "bud?" You have NO IDEA OF either my personal charachter or charisma. I may be the next George Washingotn for all you know. Does your family settling in texas almost 200 years ago make YOU closer to being noble as Col. Travis than I am?? Puhleeease. But this AIN'T ABOUT and is NOT a commentary about either me or Col. Travis. Its about the charachter of brave Americans, like the NYPD, or our boys in Afghanistan, or the Mog, or the 59,000 names on the black wall. Do you think they died FOR Col. Travis?? No, they died for a fledgling nation that needed them, Col. Travis leading them. And i say Americans STILL GO IT. Not all, but MANY MANY. Regardless of whether or not you think I'm the next Col. Travis, bud. [rolleyes]
Link Posted: 3/6/2002 9:04:12 AM EDT
Originally Posted By jadams951:
Originally Posted By Ponyboy:
Originally Posted By Minman72: Was the Alamo that Texas thing? [}:D]
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I bet you won't come down here and say that....[BD]
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Amen Brother
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Actually, being a self respecting Yank, I'd happily come to Texas again and say the same thing AGAIN. I mean really, the only thing that happened last time was that I had to buy each man at the bar a pink drink. [;D] Oh yeah, don't take this as a flame, I love Texans, I think everyone should own one. [:P]
Link Posted: 3/6/2002 9:05:13 AM EDT
The two times in my life where I felt most humbled and somber were when I visited the Alamo, and Dachau, where millions of Jews were put to death. Growing up in Texas, the Alamo has meant not being afraid to give all for your freedoms and liberties. For me, the men at the Alamo will always be heroes to me.
Link Posted: 3/6/2002 11:24:47 AM EDT
Originally Posted By Minman72: Was the Alamo that Texas thing? [}:D]
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Yup and still is!
Link Posted: 3/6/2002 1:05:14 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 3/6/2002 1:07:09 PM EDT by Ranman223]
I have alot of respect for those that died at the Alamo , doing what they thought was right . Here in Northern IN it looks like we have been invaded from Mexico all over again . Wasn't John Wayne at the Alamo too ?
Link Posted: 3/6/2002 1:12:03 PM EDT
Link Posted: 3/6/2002 1:14:25 PM EDT
Originally Posted By deadeye47:
Originally Posted By Minman72: Was the Alamo that Texas thing? [}:D]
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Yup and still is!
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You mean that the Alamo battle is ONGOING? Jeez, I wish I didn't study European History in college! (Wink wink to all you inflamed Texans)
Link Posted: 3/6/2002 1:40:16 PM EDT
A humble and hearty THANKS to you [b]beekeeper1[/b] and to you [b]garandman[/b] for being ever vigil in reminding us what being an "American" means. In our present paper-thin culture of unseriousness, we need constant reminders of what it took to make us and keep us a free people. Too often we hear calls upon us to "sacrifice" for our community (usually from liberal social engineers). I hardly think any liberals today would view what happened at the Alamo as a noble sacrifice as much as simply an act of machismo warfare. Pity. I've never been to the Alamo, but I have been to Lexington and Arlington. More sacred ground on earth I'd be hard pressed to find. I only hope we can help our children shrug off the dumbed-down, PC propaganda/indoctrination they get in schools, movies, music and TV and ensure that they learn the principles those men were fighting for and that they always "Remember The Alamo".
Link Posted: 3/6/2002 2:22:09 PM EDT
Originally Posted By The_Beer_Slayer: i was really disappointed with my visit to the alamo. Here i was expecting an old church out on a desert plain. The damn thing is in the middle of downtown. Right across the street from all the freak show museums. The basement tour was rather cool though [:D] mike
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you should of gone to the other missions in San Antonio - they are alot different and very, very cool
Link Posted: 3/6/2002 3:09:00 PM EDT
There's an apartment building near my house that's styled to look like the Alamo. I drove by it yesterday. It's tented for termites. Thanks for the history lesson, thebeekeeper1!
Link Posted: 3/6/2002 4:29:30 PM EDT
I'm about to go help my daughter put the finishing touches on her model of the Alamo right now. Tomorrow is open house at her school and their project was for each to build a model of it. Thanks to the internet I think we ( I mean she) did a pretty good job. With a science fair last week and the model this week I feel like I just might pass the fourth grade again.[:)] DEGÜELLO= a good ZZ Top album
Link Posted: 3/6/2002 4:56:46 PM EDT
I read some "revisionist" history a few months ago. It said that the research from Mexican Army survivors indicated the following: 1. The defenders stayed because they always felt they were going to be rescued by others. 2. A day or so before the end approximately 75 additional men arrived making the total number of defenders 250. 3. Several eyewitness claim that about 30 men or more surrendered including Davey. They asked for mercy but were taken out and shot. Does anyone know if the stories have any truth to them? And please, don't jump on me for being anti Texan or anything. I'm just asking the question.
Link Posted: 3/6/2002 7:21:42 PM EDT
Originally Posted By DonR: The two times in my life where I felt most humbled and somber were when I visited the Alamo, and Dachau, where millions of Jews were put to death.
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Uhhhhh, 'scuse me? MILLIONS of Jews died at Dachau? What funny paper did you get that stat from? If you're gonna tell fairy tales, tell the OFFICIAL versions only please....... Next thing you know, you'll be dabbing tears over the "gas chambers" at Dachau. Since the German government, along with the rest of the world freely admits no Jews were EVER gassed on German soil, I'd LOVE to know where these "millions" from Dachau went. I'm sure it's just a mistake on your part, but if you need me to clear up your mixing of fact from fantasy, let me know. I'll be glad to provide you with the relevant data. Also, if we're gonna wax poetic about the Alamo, let us NEVER forget the ONE man who went over the wall after Travis drew his fabled line in the sand. According to Mrs. Dickenson, one of the only known survivors of the fray, that man was none other than Moses Rose. He obviously fled the scene looking for easier targets....like Palestinian children no doubt.
Link Posted: 3/6/2002 7:39:36 PM EDT
Uh, [b]jesred[/b], [b]DonR[/b] is one of the most beloved guys on this site, so please watch what you're doing when you mention his good name on this Board! If DonR says he did something, or saw something, I guaran-damn-tee that it was done or seen by him. And all the official German pronouncements in the world will not make me think otherwise. I'm certain that DonR was referring to the fact that Dachau was one of many such camps that were operated during one of the most recent 'dark ages' in Europe (1933-1945AD), that produced the deaths of at least 6 million Jews and others. Such a thought would humble me, especially so since I am principally of German descent. I'm just sorry of how far the Germans descended...into that black pit. Eric The(ButJesusStillSaves)Hun[>]:)]
Link Posted: 3/6/2002 7:52:33 PM EDT
Link Posted: 3/6/2002 7:53:07 PM EDT
"Beloved" or not...he shouldn't play so fast and loose with the "facts". His "somber" experience over the "millions" killed at Dachau must be akin to my "somber" experience over the "millions" killed at the Alamo. Facts is facts, and I'd consider it no shame to be caught defending truth while pointing out distortions. The FACT is the millions did NOT die at Dachau. PERIOD! In fact, as the camps revise their numbers there seem to be awkward inconsistancies in merging the myth with science. I meant no flame to Don......but did feel a need to point out the HUGE and easily provable myth he was propagating. Camps have official death tolls you know. If he was at Dachau, he should have read the sign. As far as your "German" side goes....why mention it? You've made it quite clear what/who it is you REALLY worship. BTW....you NEVER did get back to me and explain just exactly how it was that God became Jewish......Did you get the name of the Rabbi that converted the Godhead? If God IS Jewish, does he pray to himself? I'm lost here Eric....care to help a wayward soul? :)
Link Posted: 3/6/2002 7:55:30 PM EDT
Jesred, FYI, I missed the funny papers. All I could come up with was my mother's family, who just happen to be German. I guess I'll have to break the news to them that they're all wrong, even though they actually lived through it. Would it be alright if I referred them to you so that they might learn what really happened?? I'm sure they'd love to know the real truth.
Link Posted: 3/6/2002 7:58:06 PM EDT
Link Posted: 3/6/2002 8:03:05 PM EDT
Post from jesred -
BTW....you NEVER did get back to me and explain just exactly how it was that God became Jewish......Did you get the name of the Rabbi that converted the Godhead? If God IS Jewish, does he pray to himself?
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No, I suppose I never did answer your question, now that you mention it. What you have failed to discern is this difference: God is a Jewish God, not a God who happens to be a Jew! I'll explain further, below.
I'm lost here Eric....care to help a wayward soul? :)
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Well, at the risk of casting pearls, etc., let me ask you this question, first, and it will help me to explain my answer to you a whole lot better! Is God a Christian? If he is, how and when did He become Christian? Did He confess His sins? Did He repent? Did He get baptized? Did He do any of the things which we know Christians do to become Christian? Let me know when you answers my question, and I will be as pleased as punch to answer yours! Eric The(BelievingAllThings)Hun[>]:)]
Link Posted: 3/6/2002 8:09:08 PM EDT
Sorry Beekeeper....I'm new. Here's a cut'npaste taken from http://www.scrapbookpages.com/DachauScrapbook/DachauFAQ While not from the official Dachau website...the numbers are close enough that it doesn't matter. 30k is not millions...or do I have to explain that? BTW, Don....nothing against your German kin, but MY German kin wouldn't allow me to sit by while whoppers fly by uncontested. <<>> How many Jews were murdered at Dachau? The precise number of Jewish deaths at Dachau is unknown. According to the Nazi camp records, there were a total of 31,951 recorded deaths from all causes at Dachau, which included people of all religions and ethnic groups. Dachau was primarily a camp for political prisoners, common criminals and religious dissidents. The majority of the prisoners who died in the camp were Catholic. It was the policy of the Nazis to send the Jews first to ghettos and then to extermination camps in Poland, not to concentration camps in Germany. When the death camps in Poland were closed between June 1944 and January 1945, the surviving Jews were transferred to camps in Austria, Czechoslovakia, and Germany, including some who were brought to Dachau and then sent to the sub-camps of the main Dachau camp. In the final days of the war, Jewish prisoners in the sub camps were brought to the Dachau main camp, along with Jewish prisoners evacuated from Buchenwald. There were 2,539 Jews at Dachau when it was liberated. How many Jews were murdered in the gas chamber at Dachau? According to a book published by the US Seventh Army immediately after the war ("Dachau Liberated, The Official Report by The U.S. Seventh Army), there were a total of 29,138 Jews brought to Dachau from other camps between June 20, 1944 and November 23, 1944. This report says the Jews were brought to Dachau to be executed and that they were gassed in the gas chamber disguised as a shower room and also in the four smaller gas chambers. According Dachau Museum Director Barbara Distel, the gas chamber at Dachau, which was disguised as a shower room, was never used for any purpose. The Dachau Memorial Site also says that the four smaller gas chambers were disinfection chambers used to kill lice in the camp clothing. Was Dachau a death camp? Although people died in the Dachau camp, including some Jews, Holocaust historians do not refer to Dachau as a death camp because Jews were not sent there for the express purpose of being murdered. The six Nazi death camps where Jews were gassed were Chelmno, Majdanek, Sobibor, Treblinka, Belzec, and Auschwitz-Birkenau, all of which were in Poland.
Link Posted: 3/6/2002 8:10:06 PM EDT
Jesred, In your infinate wisdom, would you please tell my mother that those weren't really bombs she hid from as a child in Munich?? Would you please tell her that she shouldn't feel uneasy at the sound of a Fourth of July fireworks display?? I'm sure words from someone who's never been there would be a great comfort!
Link Posted: 3/6/2002 8:22:35 PM EDT
Don....bombs=millions dead at Dachau? Come on now.... this is some new form of logic you just invented, right? My grandma once had a gas oven blow up her house...that doesn't mean that millions of her kinfolk died in the explosion. I am not faulting you Don, merely your memory. Millions NEVER died at Dachau, and I find it a scurrilous slur to suggest otherwise. There's plenty of misery in the world without having to invent it wholecloth. Now....not to be contentious in any form, but can you please tell me what bombs dropping on Germany have to do with your recollections of millions dying at Dachau? I'm not asking you to say bad things didn't happen, I'd only ask that you guard the truth carefully when it is in your vicinity. You know...my Opa fought the Cossacks on the Russian front before winding up in a Tommy prison camp. Why....he was part of that German army that "confessed" to killing tens of thousands of Polish intelligentsia in the Kaityn massacre. A massacre that even the Russians today admit was 100% Russian in origin. Facts are too darned precious to be trampled on.
Link Posted: 3/6/2002 8:34:10 PM EDT
"Is God a Christian? If he is, how and when did He become Christian? Did He confess His sins? Did He repent? Did He get baptized? Did He do any of the things which we know Christians do to become Christian" No Eric, God is NOT a Christian. As I've pointed out many times before in expressing my disbelief that you would so easily worship all things Jewish. You are trying to obfuscate on this one, and I believe we both know this. You tried to impart to me that Christ was a Jew, as if this was one of the reasons for your blind worship of Jews as a race. I pointed out to you that Jesus is NOT worshipped because he was a Jew, anymore than he would be worshipped for being a hamster or Kentuckian. This has taken us to what might be called a circular argument. Jesus is worshipped as Gods earthly representative among us. Many "churchians" confuse this to mean that God was Jewish, hence we should all kiss as much Israeli ass as possible in an effort to show God how much we "love" him. You dodged the question the last few times I put it to you, and I can understand why. Still, I expected a better showing than that. We are NOT to worship man Eric, even those you feel are Angelic representations of God, the Jews. The worship of man, any man, is a SIN Eric. I'm just trying to keep you from leading folks down a well meaning, but totally false path. God is your saviour Eric, and he is NOT Jewish. He was here long before the tribe of Judah and will be here long after.
Link Posted: 3/6/2002 8:47:22 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Flash66: I read some "revisionist" history a few months ago. It said that the research from Mexican Army survivors indicated the following: 1. The defenders stayed because they always felt they were going to be rescued by others. 2. A day or so before the end approximately 75 additional men arrived making the total number of defenders 250. 3. Several eyewitness claim that about 30 men or more surrendered including Davey. They asked for mercy but were taken out and shot. Does anyone know if the stories have any truth to them? And please, don't jump on me for being anti Texan or anything. I'm just asking the question.
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I got some of the same schtick when I visited the Alamo. One of the resident "experts" went so far as to imply that the Texans should have just surrendered. The version I learned had the leaders of the Alamo executed by sword, cutting them limb from limb. Few were spared, including the slave who left and told the tale of what happened. "Remember the Alamo" refers not only to the brave stand Travis et al. took, but the way they were executed. Needless to say, the Texans were out for blood after the Alamo and Goliad. They got their payback at the battle of San Jacinto, when they defeated a numerically superior force with a terrain advantage. -Maddog50 "Payback's a MEDEVAC!"
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