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Posted: 1/18/2012 8:43:50 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/18/2012 9:36:14 AM EDT by NagOrzo15-1]
Dear gun manufacturers, aftermarket designers, and garage gunsmiths.

You fucking fucks. You schweaty taint licking dipshits. You fucking ingrates.

The primary and over-riding PURPOSE of a reconfigurable "non-fixed" stock is to provide the user with an option to stow or carry the weapon in a substantially smaller form factor. Its not to fine tune length of pull, which can be handled through other arrangements. A gun that can be stowed in less space, or which can be utilized from the hip, or swung back and forth from weak to strong side while still pointing at the target "sans" stock adds flexibility and options to the operator.

Are we clear?

ARE WE FUCKING CLEAR?

Now, the CAR/M4 style of telescoping stock was necessitated by DESIGN considerations unique to the Stoner family rifles. Specifically, when the weapon is fired, the bolt and carrier –– being the full length of the receiver –– has to recoil into the buffer tube, which protrudes past the rear of the receiver. The only way to accommodate that and SOMEWHAT have the option of making the firearm more compact is to use a telescoping stock that is incorporates the buffer tube. A consequence is that the stock cannot collapse shorter than the length of the buffer tube.

THIS SHIT IS NOT NECESSARY ON OTHER WEAPONS AND USING THE CAR/M4 STYLE TELESCOPING STOCK ON THESE GUNS IS LIKE PUTTING BICYCLE PEDALS ON A FORMULA ONE RACER.

These photos show how an AK pattern rifle without a full length stock should be configured:




Do you SEE that?

Do you see what a compact, versatile, and easily stow-able weapon those stocks allow on that platform?????


Now look at this sloppy puddle of mechanized abortion:



That's in its MOST compact configuration. Look at that fucking train wreck!!!

And remember, an AK pattern rifle has a bolt carrier that lives entirely in its receiver. It does not recoil back into that tube. There's no fucking need for that tube. That thing is a fucking waste. You're paying $100 for a stock that provides virtually ZERO benefit over a fixed wooden stock, and it looks like the god damned gun got raped by a meth-addicted Tapco salesman.

Lets move on.

This gorgeous piece of hardware is a Winchester 1300 defender. With a proper fucking non-fixed stock:


Here's another:


See that? For home defense, etc., and navigating urban environs, that thing is usable and compact. It gives some ACTUAL TANGIBLE benefit compared to the fixed stock. Do you SEE that? Can you fucking GET it?

Now, we have another idiotic aberrant abomination:


Are you fucking kidding me?

Lets continue:

For the A-Team crowd, here's a properly set up Ruger Mini 14. Not my bag of tea, but nice and functional.


And here..... is a monkey fucking a football:



The H&K MP5 is a legendary design. It can be set up with a true telescoping stock designed for the weapon itself. What a thing of beauty, form, function and integrity.


Now shield your eyes and behold the awful existence of this fucking horror show:

(I take solace at the fact this one appears to be an airsoft gun, but the one I saw at the range about a month ago was the real deal. With an m4 stock... and judging from this, it looks like he paid like $200 for it LINK)

As anyone with their .38 and .22 on this board would know, the Ruger 10/22 is one of the most beloved plinkers in the shooting sports. Its had great options for fixed and non-fixed stocks available for years. My favorite is this one.


But folks are are raping this venerable old shooting iron in the ear too:


Why!????? WHY!!!!!

Do you guys know what this sort of rampant buggery leads to? Do you have any fucking idea of the raw stupidity it can unleash?

Well, it leads to shit like this:


Oh, fucking NO!

What's next, a fucking UZI with an M4 style stock?

Maye they can put one out for the Remington 700 class of rifles.

Or the M14, or the M1 Carbine or the M1 Garand... hey, why not fuck these things up too?

Hey, I know... lets fucking put one on an Enfield.
(Whoops... too late: http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/2008/02/01/enfield-with-ar-stock-and-pistol-grip/)

Maybe we can release a line of high end over under sporting clay shotguns with the M4 stock option.

Where does it end?

I submit to you that this shit has got to stop.

Its the height of ignorant fuckery by folks who do not understand their weapons. Its akin to those fucking idiots who9 put wing style spoilers on a Ford Pinto and then call it high speed low drag.

So please. Fucking stop it already.
Link Posted: 1/18/2012 8:46:07 AM EDT
It's a good design, so naturally people will use it on other guns.

Why you mad OP?
Link Posted: 1/18/2012 8:46:09 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/18/2012 8:46:55 AM EDT by Furyataurus]
OP is
Link Posted: 1/18/2012 8:46:23 AM EDT
Have you ever used these guns with M4-type stocks, or is this just a fashion thread?
Link Posted: 1/18/2012 8:47:35 AM EDT
6/10


Too wordy, even if it is spot on.
Link Posted: 1/18/2012 8:48:14 AM EDT
OP is a genius, man among men, and a winner at life.

He just may be The most interesting man in the world.

Link Posted: 1/18/2012 8:48:40 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/18/2012 8:49:20 AM EDT by dubBinSEA]
excellent rant ...

pictures.....

use of descriptive language.....

A-Team reference.....

I agree...


10/10
Link Posted: 1/18/2012 8:48:54 AM EDT
Run out of Meds OP?
Link Posted: 1/18/2012 8:48:56 AM EDT
Sir, that was a well thought out and argued point. I for one, agree with you, and wish the madness would stop.
Link Posted: 1/18/2012 8:49:11 AM EDT
Originally Posted By david_g17:
Have you ever used these guns with M4-type stocks, or is this just a fashion thread?


Of course I've tested them.

Half my buddies have buggered their AKs with these abortions. When you weld your cheek, you get a good view of the back of the receiver. They're fucking awful. And again, they defeat the basic purpose of a non-fixed stock.

Link Posted: 1/18/2012 8:49:14 AM EDT
Frankenchester
Link Posted: 1/18/2012 8:49:22 AM EDT
Originally Posted By NagOrzo15-1:
Dear gun manufacturers, aftermarket designers, and garage gunsmiths.

You fucking fucks. You schweaty taint licking dipshits. You fucking ingrates.

The primary and over-riding PURPOSE of a reconfigurable "non-fixed" stock is to provide the user with an option to stow or carry the weapon in a substantially smaller form factor. Its not to fine tune length of pull, which can be handled through other arrangements. A gun that can be stowed in less space, or which can be utilized from the hip, or swung back and forth from weak to strong side while still pointing at the target "sans" stock adds flexibility and options to the operator.

Are we clear?

ARE WE FUCKING CLEAR?




Uh dude, the M4 style collapsing stock doesn't really give you a much smaller form factor for storage or carry. Folding stocks do though. Maybe you're confused.

The M4 style is designed to adjust the stock to make the shooter more comfortable and accurate, as well as give it a slightly smaller form factor.

Link Posted: 1/18/2012 8:49:38 AM EDT
I agree with OP.

M4 style stock fit a need unique to the M4. Putting it on other shit is just marketing for the masses.

Which is fine, I suppose.
Link Posted: 1/18/2012 8:49:40 AM EDT
Aside from anything else, I must thank you for what will be my new signature line when describing problems at work. "And here... is a monkey fucking a football." That was just awesome.
Link Posted: 1/18/2012 8:50:58 AM EDT
When I move to a free state I'm going to put a m4 stock on a glock just to spite you op
Link Posted: 1/18/2012 8:53:13 AM EDT
Originally Posted By NagOrzo15-1:
Originally Posted By david_g17:
Have you ever used these guns with M4-type stocks, or is this just a fashion thread?


Of course I've tested them.

Half my buddies have buggered their AKs with these abortions. When you weld your cheek, you get a good view of the back of the receiver. They're fucking awful. And again, they defeat the basic purpose of a non-fixed stock.



Well there's your problem. Half your buddies have AKs.

Plus, your rant sucks and receives no points thanks to you using a shitty cell phone to........Take fucking pictures. Why don't you just put the m4 stock on your phone while your at it and stop bitching about things that are being used for things they shouldn't be.
Link Posted: 1/18/2012 8:53:16 AM EDT
Originally Posted By Swoosh101:
When I move to a free state I'm going to put a m4 stock on a glock just to spite you op


I'm sure someone has already put out a platform for that.

Link Posted: 1/18/2012 8:53:37 AM EDT
Link Posted: 1/18/2012 8:53:40 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/18/2012 8:55:21 AM EDT by Swatter911]

Link Posted: 1/18/2012 8:53:53 AM EDT
Originally Posted By dubBinSEA:
excellent rant ...

pictures.....

use of descriptive language.....

A-Team reference.....

I agree...


10/10


+1 for an overall score of 11/10
Link Posted: 1/18/2012 8:56:12 AM EDT
OP is correct.
Link Posted: 1/18/2012 8:56:19 AM EDT
Link Posted: 1/18/2012 8:56:22 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/18/2012 8:56:47 AM EDT by OKSoda]
BAWWWWWWWWWWWW

So should AR guys quit using muzzle brakes since you know the AK74 had one in use before on appeared on an AR15?

GET THAT AK SHIT OFF YOUR AR!!!
Link Posted: 1/18/2012 8:57:08 AM EDT
Originally Posted By dalesimpson:
Originally Posted By JINXR:
Originally Posted By NagOrzo15-1:
Dear gun manufacturers, aftermarket designers, and garage gunsmiths.

You fucking fucks. You schweaty taint licking dipshits. You fucking ingrates.

The primary and over-riding PURPOSE of a reconfigurable "non-fixed" stock is to provide the user with an option to stow or carry the weapon in a substantially smaller form factor. Its not to fine tune length of pull, which can be handled through other arrangements. A gun that can be stowed in less space, or which can be utilized from the hip, or swung back and forth from weak to strong side while still pointing at the target "sans" stock adds flexibility and options to the operator.

Are we clear?

ARE WE FUCKING CLEAR?




Uh dude, the M4 style collapsing stock doesn't really give you a much smaller form factor for storage or carry. Folding stocks do though. Maybe you're confused.

The M4 style is designed to adjust the stock to make the shooter more comfortable and accurate, as well as give it a slightly smaller form factor.



I was hoping some level-headed individual would make this point.


And if anyone argues my point, then I will post a picture of the 4 or 6 adjustable holes that are found in the stock.
Link Posted: 1/18/2012 8:57:59 AM EDT
At least that MP5K is an airsoft gun.
Link Posted: 1/18/2012 8:58:05 AM EDT
Well said, I agree.
Link Posted: 1/18/2012 8:58:52 AM EDT
Originally Posted By JINXR:


The M4 style is designed to adjust the stock to make the shooter more comfortable and accurate, as well as give it a slightly smaller form factor.



Ah, actually no.

The stock design was originated with the CAR-15 carbine with the specific intent of providing soldiers with a more compact rifle (the retracted stock and shorter barrel) so it could be more easily carried in helicopters, etc.

Its a consequence of the buffer tube that it can't be more compact, which is why one of the "selling" features of some of the piston driven AR15 derivatives is that you can use a true folding stock. Check out this lovely lady:





Link Posted: 1/18/2012 8:59:04 AM EDT

Originally Posted By NagOrzo15-1:
Its not to fine tune length of pull, which can be handled through other arrangements.

That's cute!

It must be why the other two people I regularly shoot with each have a different choice of LOP when they shoot my AR.
Link Posted: 1/18/2012 8:59:10 AM EDT
9/10

almost didn't read because of length. but was glad I did
Link Posted: 1/18/2012 8:59:30 AM EDT
OP has not seen what Mother Russia is attempting to sell lately.

He mad!


Link Posted: 1/18/2012 9:00:05 AM EDT
Originally Posted By JINXR:
It's a good design, so naturally people will use it on other guns.

Why you mad OP?


No it is not. It is a compromise required by the design of the AR15 platform.
Link Posted: 1/18/2012 9:00:21 AM EDT
Originally Posted By olekennyroy:
Originally Posted By dubBinSEA:
excellent rant ...

pictures.....

use of descriptive language.....

A-Team reference.....

I agree...


10/10


+1 for an overall score of 11/10


+1 for the "monkey fucking football" line.
Link Posted: 1/18/2012 9:00:44 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/18/2012 9:00:55 AM EDT by KalihiJack]
What a gamer changer
Link Posted: 1/18/2012 9:01:15 AM EDT

Originally Posted By NagOrzo15-1:
Originally Posted By JINXR:


The M4 style is designed to adjust the stock to make the shooter more comfortable and accurate, as well as give it a slightly smaller form factor.



Ah, actually no.

The stock design was originated with the CAR-15 carbine with the specific intent of providing soldiers with a more compact rifle (the retracted stock and shorter barrel) so it could be more easily carried in helicopters, etc.

Its a consequence of the buffer tube that it can't be more compact, which is why one of the "selling" features of some of the piston driven AR15 derivatives is that you can use a true folding stock. Check out this lovely lady:

http://s400.photobucket.com/albums/pp89/willhemh/PDW%20Review/IMG_1621.jpg




If it ONLY had an open and closed setting, I'd agree. In reality, it has 4-6 settings, so it's pretty easy to see that it's designed for adjusting LOP to each shooter.
Link Posted: 1/18/2012 9:01:28 AM EDT
If you don't like it..don't buy it.

There...your butthurt problem has been solved
Link Posted: 1/18/2012 9:01:47 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/18/2012 9:02:42 AM EDT by JINXR]
Originally Posted By NagOrzo15-1:
Originally Posted By JINXR:


The M4 style is designed to adjust the stock to make the shooter more comfortable and accurate, as well as give it a slightly smaller form factor.



Ah, actually no.

The stock design was originated with the CAR-15 carbine with the specific intent of providing soldiers with a more compact rifle (the retracted stock and shorter barrel) so it could be more easily carried in helicopters, etc.

Its a consequence of the buffer tube that it can't be more compact, which is why one of the "selling" features of some of the piston driven AR15 derivatives is that you can use a true folding stock. Check out this lovely lady:

http://s400.photobucket.com/albums/pp89/willhemh/PDW%20Review/IMG_1621.jpg





Oh really? Why are there so many holes?

Link Posted: 1/18/2012 9:02:39 AM EDT
Good rant. Hate that stock being used on so many things that could otherwise be awesome. Instead they look like a sculpture made by monkeys out of their own shit.
Link Posted: 1/18/2012 9:03:29 AM EDT
Well done 9/10
Link Posted: 1/18/2012 9:04:30 AM EDT
Link Posted: 1/18/2012 9:04:52 AM EDT
Originally Posted By Banjaxed:
Originally Posted By JINXR:
It's a good design, so naturally people will use it on other guns.

Why you mad OP?


No it is not. It is a compromise required by the design of the AR15 platform.


First time I've ever heard somebody say that it's a compromise.

People don't keep using shit for decades if it's a compromise. Especially in the world we live in where everyone and their dog makes "game-changing" accessories for the AR platform.
Link Posted: 1/18/2012 9:05:55 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/18/2012 9:07:19 AM EDT by IHC53]
Lucas McCain is NOT amused! Get that crap off
my lever action!
Link Posted: 1/18/2012 9:06:22 AM EDT
FWIW the stock on this AK was made from a weight bench. Welded together, and welded to the receiver, but some AR people in the past threw a shit fit since it had a reddot, and western style furniture.



Link Posted: 1/18/2012 9:06:27 AM EDT
Originally Posted By NagOrzo15-1:
...

...


What in the name of Hindu fucking buttsex is that?
Link Posted: 1/18/2012 9:06:44 AM EDT
I like the rant and agree but what if they used Magpul Moe stocks instead? Would that fix the situation or make it worse?
Link Posted: 1/18/2012 9:06:46 AM EDT
Merrrrrrr
Link Posted: 1/18/2012 9:06:58 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/18/2012 9:07:24 AM EDT by dubBinSEA]
It's kinda like putting that collapsable stock on the back of my ballsack and hoping to get more pussy...


just cause theres a collapsable stock on it aint gonna make it any better....








soory ...i feel kind today
Link Posted: 1/18/2012 9:07:12 AM EDT
I'm asking because I honestly don't know: can the first AK pictured actually be held/fired in that configuration? It looks like the stock obstructs the grip and trigger.

I'm talking ergos here, not mechanics.
Link Posted: 1/18/2012 9:09:17 AM EDT
Originally Posted By NagOrzo15-1:
Originally Posted By JINXR:


The M4 style is designed to adjust the stock to make the shooter more comfortable and accurate, as well as give it a slightly smaller form factor.



Ah, actually no.

The stock design was originated with the CAR-15 carbine with the specific intent of providing soldiers with a more compact rifle (the retracted stock and shorter barrel) so it could be more easily carried in helicopters, etc.

Its a consequence of the buffer tube that it can't be more compact, which is why one of the "selling" features of some of the piston driven AR15 derivatives is that you can use a true folding stock. Check out this lovely lady:

http://s400.photobucket.com/albums/pp89/willhemh/PDW%20Review/IMG_1621.jpg





You talk about how awesome piston driven ar's are, and then post an airsoft gun with a cord hanging out. Fail.
Link Posted: 1/18/2012 9:09:25 AM EDT
And also you guys take for granted m4 stocks Wish I had even one rifle with one.
Link Posted: 1/18/2012 9:09:42 AM EDT

They are my guns and I will do what I want with them!
Link Posted: 1/18/2012 9:10:34 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/18/2012 9:11:08 AM EDT by 223Sauce]
HAI GUYZ WUT IS GOIN ON IN HUR'

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