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1/22/2020 12:12:56 PM
Posted: 11/22/2012 10:29:09 AM EST
[Last Edit: 11/22/2012 10:42:03 AM EST by madmann135]
I have few forums I regularly visit and this one seems to have the most legal proficient individuals so I want your opinion.

A relative of mine was recently charged with a drug related crime and in my opinion the charges are unjust.

The story goes the individual was speeding and was pulled over. When he was pulled over the officer noticed a smell of cannabis and he was brought in. Later the individual (a college student) was coaxed into giving a urine drug test, there was no lawyer present and there were no traces of cannabis in the car.
My understanding is that a urine test can detect traces of the drug for up to 3 days.

In court the judge threw the book at him with a $700 equipment fee, $500 fine and 24 months probation.
From what I herd the people before him who were caught growing or transporting the stuff received 2 months probation and fines under $500 fees.

I am here asking is there anything that can be done.
Well this is my first unofficial opinion.

UPDATE: I contacted the individual and the individual said it was a DUI
Link Posted: 11/22/2012 10:30:44 AM EST
Originally Posted By madmann135:
I have few forums I regularly visit and this one seems to have the most legal proficient individuals so I want your opinion.

A relative of mine was recently charged with a drug related crime and in my opinion the charges are unjust.

The story goes the individual was speeding and was pulled over. When he was pulled over the officer noticed a smell of cannabis and he was brought in. Later the individual (a college student) was coaxed into giving a urine drug test, there was no lawyer present and there were no traces of cannabis in the car.
My understanding is that a urine test can detect traces of the drug for up to 3 days.

In court the judge threw the book at him with a $700 equipment fee, $500 fine and 24 months probation.
From what I herd the people before him who were caught growing or transporting the stuff received 2 months probation and fines under $500 fees.

I am here asking is there anything that can be done.
Well this is my first unofficial opinion.


What was the charge? DUI?
Link Posted: 11/22/2012 10:32:39 AM EST
You should've remained silent and requested an attorney as soon as they got your ass to the jail. Not sure what you can do now....
Link Posted: 11/22/2012 10:33:03 AM EST
What was the actual charge(s)?
Link Posted: 11/22/2012 10:35:15 AM EST
Originally Posted By 1SubSailor:
You should've remained silent and requested an attorney as soon as they got your ass to the jail. Not sure what you can do now....


This.

Tell your "friend/family member/whatever" to get a lawyer next time.
Link Posted: 11/22/2012 10:35:38 AM EST
As time goes by, I think there will be higher and higher fines due to the cities and counties needing more revenue. This will include less actual jail/prison time as that cost money.
Link Posted: 11/22/2012 10:40:55 AM EST
I just came in contact with the individual and the individual said it was a DUI.
Link Posted: 11/22/2012 10:44:16 AM EST
[Last Edit: 11/22/2012 10:46:56 AM EST by AR15fan]
Originally Posted By madmann135:
I just came in contact with the individual and the individual said it was a DUI.


$1,200.00 in fines and 24-months probation doesnt sound unreasonable for driving under the influence. Higher than my state but not what i would consider cruel or unusual.

He plead guilty?

DUI's can be fought. Challange the RS for the stop. If you lose that one challange the PC for the arrest. If you lose that one go to trial and take your chances with the jury. you've only got to convince one person on the jury you were not under the influence.
Link Posted: 11/22/2012 10:45:52 AM EST
Originally Posted By madmann135:
I just came in contact with the individual and the individual said it was a DUI.


Then he got off dirt cheap. Here in Arkansas, (my area anyways) it costs you out the yazoo, plus you are required to have a lawyer, the work only drivers license thing, and insurance goes up. About the same thing as being drunk.
Link Posted: 11/22/2012 10:58:55 AM EST
[Last Edit: 11/22/2012 11:05:33 AM EST by oscardeuce]
I have told too many families a loved one was killed by a impaired/speeding driver to have much sympathy.
Link Posted: 11/22/2012 11:45:09 AM EST
Sounds like he plead out and got off relatively light. Appealing after a plea deal is not an easy route to take as you generally had to admit to the court that you know exactly what the meaning of the deal is. I would guess that he stuck where he is.
Link Posted: 11/22/2012 11:50:21 AM EST

Originally Posted By madmann135:
I have few forums I regularly visit and this one seems to have the most legal proficient individuals so I want your opinion.

A relative of mine was recently charged with a drug related crime and in my opinion the charges are unjust.

The story goes the individual was speeding and was pulled over. When he was pulled over the officer noticed a smell of cannabis and he was brought in. Later the individual (a college student) was coaxed into giving a urine drug test, there was no lawyer present and there were no traces of cannabis in the car.
My understanding is that a urine test can detect traces of the drug for up to 3 days.

In court the judge threw the book at him with a $700 equipment fee, $500 fine and 24 months probation.
From what I herd the people before him who were caught growing or transporting the stuff received 2 months probation and fines under $500 fees.

I am here asking is there anything that can be done.
Well this is my first unofficial opinion.

UPDATE: I contacted the individual and the individual said it was a DUI

So how do you know your relative was not DUI?

So the cop came to court, testified that the relative appeared to be impaired, and testified that he smelled cannibis. There was a positive drug test.
Was there any reason for the judge to believe your relative was not guilty?
Link Posted: 11/22/2012 12:05:56 PM EST
If your relative was under 4 nangrams BLOOD content, he can fight it. Urine analysis will just show a presence of the drug.

Might be able to fight it but as said above, If the relative agreed to plea bargain, it will make it harder to fight.
Link Posted: 11/22/2012 12:13:31 PM EST
[Last Edit: 11/22/2012 12:13:50 PM EST by pale_pony]
Originally Posted By Yesicarry:
If your relative was under 4 nangrams BLOOD content, he can fight it. Urine analysis will just show a presence of the drug.

Might be able to fight it but as said above, If the relative agreed to plea bargain, it will make it harder to fight.



Even if they never smoked pot, this is about the same content they would have by walking past someone smoking a joint at a Grateful Dead concert.

Link Posted: 11/22/2012 12:24:48 PM EST
There is no right to a lawyer in Pennsylvania until after the chemical test is taken if it is a DUI stop. Here is the warnings given before a blood, breath or urine test. Authorized by Section 1547 of Title 75.

1. Please be advised that you are under arrest for driving under the influence of alcohol or controlled substance in violation of Section 3802 of the
Vehicle Code.
2. I am requesting that you submit to a chemical test of ______________________ (blood, breath or urine. Officer chooses the chemical test).
3. It is my duty as a police officer to inform you that if you refuse to submit to the chemical test, your operating privilege will be suspended for
at least 12 months, and up to 18 months, if you have prior refusals or have been previously sentenced for driving under the influence. In
addition, if you refuse to submit to the chemical test, and you are convicted of or plead to violating Section 3802(a)(1) (relating to impaired
driving) of the Vehicle Code, because of your refusal, you will be subject to more severe penalties set forth in Section 3804(c) (relating to
penalties) of the Vehicle Code, the same as if you would be convicted of driving with the highest rate of alcohol, which include a
minimum of 72 consecutive hours in jail and a minimum fine of $1,000.00, up to a maximum of five years in jail and a maximum fine of
$10,000.
4. It is also my duty as a police officer to inform you that you have no right to speak with an attorney or anyone else before deciding whether to
submit to testing and any request to speak with an attorney or anyone else after being provided these warnings or remaining silent when asked
to submit to chemical testing will constitute a refusal, resulting in the suspension of your operating privilege and other enhanced criminal
sanctions if you are convicted of violating Section 3802(a) of the Vehicle Code.
Link Posted: 11/22/2012 1:19:17 PM EST
You have the right to legal representation basically any time you are contacted by the police, you need not be arrested to invoke this right (6th ammend backed by 1966 supreme court decision). Miranda applies as soon as your liberties are restricted, so if you aren't free to leave... You also have the right to keep your damned mouth shut when contacted by the police (5th ammend). You don't have to submit to shit in the field in most states, at worst its an additional fine, the only tests that count as refusal are official tests at the station, some checkpoints, and/or the hospital/clinic on certified equip by certified operators/adminstrators. If they deny you access to a lawyer get the recordings, they are almost always recording audio, if they're not that alone is suspicious most places, if they actually deny you requested rights (big diff from not informing), they've given you a huge leg up, don't agree to anything and get ahold of a lawyer.

That's a really light DUI sentence, the fact that it is a sentence as said indicates a plea, generally before the plea your attorney, sometimes the DA/ADA and the Judge/magistrate will spend a great deal of time telling you by agreeing you are acknowledging your guilt and forfitting any future appeal.


Link Posted: 11/22/2012 6:30:56 PM EST
He agreed to the tests and went to court with I'm assuming no lawyer and pleaded or lost. Nothing to be done now. Should of shut up refused all tests and only words should of been can I leave and I want a lawyer.
Link Posted: 11/22/2012 6:34:30 PM EST
Originally Posted By pa_ridgerunner:
There is no right to a lawyer in Pennsylvania until after the chemical test is taken if it is a DUI stop. Here is the warnings given before a blood, breath or urine test. Authorized by Section 1547 of Title 75.

1. Please be advised that you are under arrest for driving under the influence of alcohol or controlled substance in violation of Section 3802 of the
Vehicle Code.
2. I am requesting that you submit to a chemical test of ______________________ (blood, breath or urine. Officer chooses the chemical test).
3. It is my duty as a police officer to inform you that if you refuse to submit to the chemical test, your operating privilege will be suspended for
at least 12 months, and up to 18 months, if you have prior refusals or have been previously sentenced for driving under the influence. In
addition, if you refuse to submit to the chemical test, and you are convicted of or plead to violating Section 3802(a)(1) (relating to impaired
driving) of the Vehicle Code, because of your refusal, you will be subject to more severe penalties set forth in Section 3804(c) (relating to
penalties) of the Vehicle Code, the same as if you would be convicted of driving with the highest rate of alcohol, which include a
minimum of 72 consecutive hours in jail and a minimum fine of $1,000.00, up to a maximum of five years in jail and a maximum fine of
$10,000.
4. It is also my duty as a police officer to inform you that you have no right to speak with an attorney or anyone else before deciding whether to
submit to testing and any request to speak with an attorney or anyone else after being provided these warnings or remaining silent when asked
to submit to chemical testing will constitute a refusal, resulting in the suspension of your operating privilege and other enhanced criminal
sanctions if you are convicted of violating Section 3802(a) of the Vehicle Code.


interesting......
Link Posted: 11/22/2012 6:35:07 PM EST
Don't drink and drive, don't smoke pot and drive, don't text and drive, don't apply makeup and drive, don't adjust the stereo and drive, don't eat and drive...
Link Posted: 11/22/2012 6:39:30 PM EST
Originally Posted By Alpha82:
You have the right to legal representation basically any time you are contacted by the police, you need not be arrested to invoke this right (6th ammend backed by 1966 supreme court decision). Miranda applies as soon as your liberties are restricted, so if you aren't free to leave... You also have the right to keep your damned mouth shut when contacted by the police (5th ammend). You don't have to submit to shit in the field in most states, at worst its an additional fine, the only tests that count as refusal are official tests at the station, some checkpoints, and/or the hospital/clinic on certified equip by certified operators/adminstrators. If they deny you access to a lawyer get the recordings, they are almost always recording audio, if they're not that alone is suspicious most places, if they actually deny you requested rights (big diff from not informing), they've given you a huge leg up, don't agree to anything and get ahold of a lawyer.

That's a really light DUI sentence, the fact that it is a sentence as said indicates a plea, generally before the plea your attorney, sometimes the DA/ADA and the Judge/magistrate will spend a great deal of time telling you by agreeing you are acknowledging your guilt and forfitting any future appeal.







Custody + Interrogation = Miranda
Link Posted: 11/22/2012 6:54:58 PM EST
Originally Posted By Alpha82:
You have the right to legal representation basically any time you are contacted by the police, you need not be arrested to invoke this right (6th ammend backed by 1966 supreme court decision). Miranda applies as soon as your liberties are restricted, so if you aren't free to leave... You also have the right to keep your damned mouth shut when contacted by the police (5th ammend). You don't have to submit to shit in the field in most states, at worst its an additional fine, the only tests that count as refusal are official tests at the station, some checkpoints, and/or the hospital/clinic on certified equip by certified operators/adminstrators. If they deny you access to a lawyer get the recordings, they are almost always recording audio, if they're not that alone is suspicious most places, if they actually deny you requested rights (big diff from not informing), they've given you a huge leg up, don't agree to anything and get ahold of a lawyer.

That's a really light DUI sentence, the fact that it is a sentence as said indicates a plea, generally before the plea your attorney, sometimes the DA/ADA and the Judge/magistrate will spend a great deal of time telling you by agreeing you are acknowledging your guilt and forfitting any future appeal.




That's a huge DUI sentence. DUI in almost every state (at least for the first three or four) are misdemeanors. Misdemeanors are punishable by up to one year in jail. In Florida, that means probation for a MM can only be up to 12 months.

This is the minimum (and most common) first DUI sentence in Florida (this includes MJ) assuming no accident with damage/injury:

Adjudication of Guilt
6 to 12 months of probation with early termination upon completion of the following conditions:
1. Level 1 DUI School
2. Victim Impact Panel
3. 50 hours of community service
4. 10 day vehicle immobilization (think vehicle impound, but the state merely takes your license plate for ten days)
5. 6 month DL suspension
6. Court Costs, Fines, and Fees (about $1500)

Unless Illinois has some special MJ rules for DUIs, 24 months of probation seems excessive.

As to the rest of what you the OP says, at least in Florida, I don't see anything wrong with the procedure. Sure he has a right to an attorney, but most people waive that right.
Link Posted: 11/22/2012 7:31:21 PM EST
Hippy Lettuce can stay in your system for up to 7 days (THC), currently Illinois does not differentiate this fact and any amount of THC in the system and the articulated report by the officer can and probably will lead you/him to a DUI charge. Just the way it bounces in Illinois. Now, you have to remember that in this great state there are actually two sides of a DUI charge, the criminal and the administrative. Assuming he was in Illinois for the arrest there are several options that he will be taken through:

-DUI charge and conviction, administrative hearing and loss of D/L
-DUI dismissal, administrative hearing and loss of D/L

There is a 99.99999999 percent chance he will lose his D/L for 6 months. If he would have failed to submit to a test the suspension is an insanely long time.

It is, to my knowledge, a very slim chance that he will not get his D/L suspended even if he gets off on the DUI charge. Illinois views that driving in this great state is a privilege and not a right. Therefore the two different courts that he will have to go to. It's going to be expensive, he can request and will probably receive a JDP (Judicial Driving Permit) that will only allow him to drive to and from court specified locations (school, doctors appointments, etc) if he is caught driving outside the courts parameters, automatic pull of the JDP and if I recall correctly his suspension is doubled to 1 year.

Now, a DUI is the easiest thing in the world to get out of due to the fact that even though all IL LEO's are certified in DUI administration/arrest the vast majority of them do not know how to do it correctly. Actually they do, but they tend to fuck it up. If you can find a lawyer that adheres to this though your GTG.

I'll find the statue for you and post a link later for your reading pleasure.
Link Posted: 11/22/2012 7:52:40 PM EST
Originally Posted By Yesicarry:
If your relative was under 4 nangrams BLOOD content, he can fight it. Urine analysis will just show a presence of the drug.

Might be able to fight it but as said above, If the relative agreed to plea bargain, it will make it harder to fight.


Not true. Depending on the urine test performed it will give the concentration as well.
Link Posted: 11/22/2012 7:54:17 PM EST
Originally Posted By Aiden:
Don't drink and drive, don't smoke pot and drive, don't text and drive, don't apply makeup and drive, don't adjust the stereo and drive, don't eat and drive...


Now just a minute. No need to besmirch the fine institution of scarfing a double meater with cheese from Whataburger and dipping fries while sipping on Coca Cola and jamming some sweet tunes in my moonroof coupe coming home at 2:00 a.m. after a loud night at the bar.
Link Posted: 11/22/2012 8:11:08 PM EST
There have been thousands upon thousands of people convicted of DUI of drugs using the testing procedures used in your relatives crime. One way to not get a DUI is to not drive impaired. Also don't do illegal drugs to start with and you don't have to worry about getting a drug related DUI. He got off light IMO
Link Posted: 11/22/2012 8:28:54 PM EST
As others have said, they should have respectfully declined to speak or submit to any tests.

I work at a probation department and our urine tests can detect THC from up to 30 days prior. I'd get my attorney to help me contact the urine test company and find out the specs on the test. Beyond that, your friend really shot themself in the foot by going along with everything the cop wanted without an attorney being present.
Link Posted: 11/22/2012 8:31:39 PM EST
Also, they may be able to take this route, depending on local laws: Urine tests only test past use of marijuana. No test can detect if an individual was "intoxicated" with THC, it can only detect use. In my state, there is no DUI for thc because there is no "legal level"....and there is no "legal level" because there is no way of testing the blood alcohol content of THC on the roadside.
Link Posted: 11/22/2012 9:47:15 PM EST
Originally Posted By Liberator11:
Also, they may be able to take this route, depending on local laws: Urine tests only test past use of marijuana. No test can detect if an individual was "intoxicated" with THC, it can only detect use. In my state, there is no DUI for thc because there is no "legal level"....and there is no "legal level" because there is no way of testing the blood alcohol content of THC on the roadside.


Dui means driving under influence. Now of its in your system then consider you under the influence. The officer gave him test options he chose to piss in the cup. It's same if he would of chose blood test. Also who said anything about road side. Cop just says I'm arresting you dui. Get to the jail or station then ask you to submjt to the test. Or in the case of cali they will take blood by force if you don't cooperate.
Link Posted: 11/22/2012 11:16:40 PM EST
Originally Posted By UrbancommandoX:
Originally Posted By Liberator11:
Also, they may be able to take this route, depending on local laws: Urine tests only test past use of marijuana. No test can detect if an individual was "intoxicated" with THC, it can only detect use. In my state, there is no DUI for thc because there is no "legal level"....and there is no "legal level" because there is no way of testing the blood alcohol content of THC on the roadside.


Dui means driving under influence. Now of its in your system then consider you under the influence. The officer gave him test options he chose to piss in the cup. It's same if he would of chose blood test. Also who said anything about road side. Cop just says I'm arresting you dui. Get to the jail or station then ask you to submjt to the test. Or in the case of cali they will take blood by force if you don't cooperate.


With a warrant, if necessary.

Link Posted: 11/22/2012 11:29:21 PM EST
Originally Posted By madmann135:

In court the judge threw the book at him with a $700 equipment fee, $500 fine and 24 months probation.
From what I herd the people before him who were caught growing or transporting the stuff received 2 months probation and fines under $500 fees.

I am here asking is there anything that can be done.


The way you describe things, he's already been convicted and sentenced. In which case, no, there isn't really much he can do at this point. If it was a trial, I suppose his lawyer could appeal the conviction (good luck with that). If he pled, it's a done deal.

Tell him to lay off the dope.
Link Posted: 11/22/2012 11:57:42 PM EST
Originally Posted By madmann135:

In court the judge threw the book at him with a $700 equipment fee, $500 fine and 24 months probation.
threw the book at him? That's about what a first time DUI runs here in OH.


From what I herd the people before him who were caught growing or transporting the stuff received 2 months probation and fines under $500 fees.
why is that so surprising? It's a different crime than the one your friend committed. You would agree that transporting illegal drugs is far less of a public safety concern than driving under the influence, right?



I am here asking is there anything that can be done.
Nope. He pled and was sentenced: it's done. He can appeal and try some post conviction attacks, his lawyer will like the pay, but it won't do dick.


Use it as a positive and build off of it in a good direction. That's all your buddy can really do.

Link Posted: 11/23/2012 12:06:28 AM EST
[Last Edit: 11/23/2012 12:06:55 AM EST by emopunker2004]
Tough shit. He'll get no sympathy from me

Too bad he didn't get sentenced to a year in jail.
Link Posted: 11/23/2012 1:08:36 AM EST
I love these threads.

"My friend"/"my girlfriend"/"my relative" threads. You know, it is someone else and not the poster, but he is concerned and empathetic, Sure!

Actually, some one sobered up and realized it was a dui with alcohol and thought that he was caught with marijuana. Wow, what a mistake!

Next time, take along a designated driver and make sure he/she/it is not driving your car.

The sadist thing of all is that you are now told that marijuana can be detected in your system, OP, for up to 30 days after consumption. So, use a designated driver next time.

Grammar Nazi at your service, as well. The proper word is not "herd", it is "heard".
Link Posted: 11/23/2012 1:46:41 AM EST
i was almost killed by some DUI jackass.

he should do jail time and quit bitching and crying about his fines. MAN THE FUCK UP AND TAKE YOUR PUNISHMENT. then remember to NOT drive impaired.


..........sorry if i sound angry. i still have fucking nightmares of this shit.
Link Posted: 11/23/2012 2:12:45 AM EST
Sounds like your friend fucked himself.

Pot can stay in your system for 2 weeks or more.

He should have hired a lawyer and fought that shit.
Link Posted: 11/23/2012 2:14:52 AM EST
[Last Edit: 11/23/2012 2:25:31 AM EST by ECAS]
Originally Posted By cochran9304:
I love these threads.

"My friend"/"my girlfriend"/"my relative" threads. You know, it is someone else and not the poster, but he is concerned and empathetic, Sure!

Actually, some one sobered up and realized it was a dui with alcohol and thought that he was caught with marijuana. Wow, what a mistake!

Next time, take along a designated driver and make sure he/she/it is not driving your car.

The sadist thing of all is that you are now told that marijuana can be detected in your system, OP, for up to 30 days after consumption. So, use a designated driver next time.

Grammar Nazi at your service, as well. The proper word is not "herd", it is "heard".


A sadist is someone who obtains pleasure from inflicting pain on others. You might want to check your post for errors before pointing out the errors of others. That's not the only error in your post by the way. Just sayin...
Link Posted: 11/23/2012 4:14:59 AM EST
Can someone please explain to me why it is a 24 month probation for a misdemeanor?
Link Posted: 11/23/2012 4:19:21 AM EST
Originally Posted By ECAS:
Originally Posted By cochran9304:
I love these threads.

"My friend"/"my girlfriend"/"my relative" threads. You know, it is someone else and not the poster, but he is concerned and empathetic, Sure!

Actually, some one sobered up and realized it was a dui with alcohol and thought that he was caught with marijuana. Wow, what a mistake!

Next time, take along a designated driver and make sure he/she/it is not driving your car.

The sadist thing of all is that you are now told that marijuana can be detected in your system, OP, for up to 30 days after consumption. So, use a designated driver next time.

Grammar Nazi at your service, as well. The proper word is not "herd", it is "heard".


A sadist is someone who obtains pleasure from inflicting pain on others. You might want to check your post for errors before pointing out the errors of others. That's not the only error in your post by the way. Just sayin...


classic.....only here......
Link Posted: 11/23/2012 4:25:20 AM EST
Originally Posted By 103:
Can someone please explain to me why it is a 24 month probation for a misdemeanor?


Probation is a money maker.

You have to pay money to be on probation.


That's the only reason I can see.
Link Posted: 11/23/2012 4:49:53 AM EST
Originally Posted By Texas_Heat:
Originally Posted By 1SubSailor:
You should've remained silent and requested an attorney as soon as they got your ass to the jail. Not sure what you can do now....


This.

Tell your "friend/family member/whatever" to get a lawyer next time.


Yup. Always lawyer up and keep your mouth shut. Cooperating with the officer can also help. I was arrested one time years ago, not my proudest moment, but was a much needed reality check. Don't play stupid games, not worth it. Was the most embarrassing thing that's ever happened to me and cost me enough money to buy some badass shit.
Link Posted: 11/23/2012 4:55:51 AM EST
Originally Posted By 103:
Can someone please explain to me why it is a 24 month probation for a misdemeanor?


Why not?

I've seen 3 and 5 year probation terms for misdemeanors
Link Posted: 11/23/2012 4:59:22 AM EST
Originally Posted By AR15fan:
Originally Posted By 103:
Can someone please explain to me why it is a 24 month probation for a misdemeanor?


Why not?

I've seen 3 and 5 year probation terms for misdemeanors


I'm really only familiar with Florida law, and max probation for a first degree mm is one year. I find it very odd that probation can be longer than the max jail time.
Link Posted: 11/23/2012 5:16:44 AM EST
[Last Edit: 11/23/2012 5:17:46 AM EST by fishstix]
So did your "friend" admit to te court or you that he was guilty of drinkinga nd driving or getting high and driving?

If so, seems pretty cheap penalty for that level of stupidity
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