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Posted: 9/20/2005 7:31:32 PM EDT
I posted this in the HK Forum as well but thought I'd post it here as well.


What can you tell me about a company called Special Weapons, LLC? I know a guy who has a
HK Clone of a MP5 but it is in .45 Auto. It was made by Special Weapons, LLC in Arizona. I believe the Model number is SW45FS. It has a 16" barrel but looks like a SBR because it has a fake suppresor permanently attached.

Anything you can tell me about this is appreciated! Is it reliable? Is it of good quality? What is the value? ETC.....

Thanks!!!!!
Link Posted: 9/20/2005 7:32:09 PM EDT
Scoop it up quick!

Link Posted: 9/20/2005 7:33:28 PM EDT
Oh Lord.
Link Posted: 9/20/2005 7:34:00 PM EDT
INCOMING
Link Posted: 9/20/2005 7:34:03 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Target2:
I posted this in the HK Forum as well but thought I'd post it here as well.


What can you tell me about a company called Special Weapons, LLC? I know a guy who has a
HK Clone of a MP5 but it is in .45 Auto. It was made by Special Weapons, LLC in Arizona. I believe the Model number is SW45FS. It has a 16" barrel but looks like a SBR because it has a fake suppresor permanently attached.

Anything you can tell me about this is appreciated! Is it reliable? Is it of good quality? What is the value? ETC.....

Thanks!!!!!





I'm sure someone will opine
Link Posted: 9/20/2005 7:35:01 PM EDT
Special Weapons for Special People.

Link Posted: 9/20/2005 7:35:03 PM EDT
get to cover, the shit is inbound!
Link Posted: 9/20/2005 7:35:48 PM EDT
TOAD
Link Posted: 9/20/2005 7:35:48 PM EDT
No
Link Posted: 9/20/2005 7:37:32 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 9/20/2005 7:39:13 PM EDT by mjrowley]

Originally Posted By Lumpy196:
No




ETA: I wonder if TOAD has a Troll account on here?
Link Posted: 9/20/2005 7:37:35 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 9/20/2005 7:38:37 PM EDT by Janus]
IBSA
(SteyrAug)
Link Posted: 9/20/2005 7:38:52 PM EDT
sPesHuL weApOnS.................the toad lives !!
Link Posted: 9/20/2005 7:39:54 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 9/20/2005 7:43:22 PM EDT by Target2]
Kind of what I figured! Any idea what the value is? He was going to take it to the local funshop sometime in the next few weeks for them to sell for him. What amount should he be happy with to walk away from it with?

I want to tell him resonable to try to get for it but I have no clue what it is worth.
Link Posted: 9/20/2005 7:40:15 PM EDT
Link Posted: 9/20/2005 7:40:54 PM EDT
Link Posted: 9/20/2005 7:40:58 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Target2:
Kind of what I figured! Any idea what the value is? He was going to take it to the local funshop sometime in the next few weeks for them to sell for him. What amount should he be happy to walk away from it with?



Ill give him $50.00.
Link Posted: 9/20/2005 7:42:05 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Target2:
Kind of what I figured! Any idea what the value is? He was going to take it to the local funshop sometime in the next few weeks for them to sell for him. What amount should he be happy to walk away from it with?



Ill give ya $3.50 for it sight un seen! And ill even pay for shipping...
Link Posted: 9/20/2005 7:45:40 PM EDT
Honestly, What is a fair price for it?
Link Posted: 9/20/2005 7:47:16 PM EDT
Link Posted: 9/20/2005 7:48:17 PM EDT
Link Posted: 9/20/2005 7:49:00 PM EDT
Here we go...
Link Posted: 9/20/2005 7:52:11 PM EDT
OK, I am aware that it is not a valuable gun. What should I tell him that he should be able to get for it? I dont want to tell him to sell it for a price that is too low nor do I what to tell him to ask for a price that is to high making it just set in the used gun rack at the funshop for months. Whats a fair price?
Link Posted: 9/20/2005 7:57:00 PM EDT
$100.00 And I wouldn't buy it for that much.
Link Posted: 9/20/2005 7:59:28 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Target2:
Honestly, What is a fair price for it?



Does it even work?

Short story...

I saw his ad in Shotgun News. I live in Mesa, so I called to see if I could stop by and see one. He said "NO!" So I asked, "You mean I just order one blindly with out even seeing one?", "Yep" he said.

I have no Idea how much they are worth.
Link Posted: 9/20/2005 8:00:57 PM EDT
Thanks Stove-Pipe!!

I know nothing about its value so I figured it was best to check here to get some idea as to what to tell the guy what he could sell it for.
Link Posted: 9/20/2005 8:02:15 PM EDT
mjrowley


How much are they going for NIB ????
Link Posted: 9/20/2005 8:02:34 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 9/20/2005 8:14:52 PM EDT by mjrowley]
What if we all chipped in like 10 - 20 bucks to see it destroyed, sans the receiver?

Maybe put it on a train track?

Then ship out a DVD of the destruction? I just got in 100 blank DVDs.
Link Posted: 9/20/2005 8:03:37 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 9/20/2005 8:08:43 PM EDT by mjrowley]

Originally Posted By Target2:
mjrowley


How much are they going for NIB ????



all of these are 9mm. i dont see any .45's yet.

$1,499.00

$1,199.00

$1,299.00
Link Posted: 9/20/2005 8:03:39 PM EDT
For $100 I might try one.

Not for $101
Link Posted: 9/20/2005 8:06:36 PM EDT
mjrowley


Your kidding? $1200 NIB, I'm going to have to call to see what this guy originally paid for it and where he got it? I'll be right back with an update in a few minutes.

And you guys are being serious, its only worth a $100.00 ?

Link Posted: 9/20/2005 8:06:36 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 9/20/2005 8:08:09 PM EDT by 2nd_Amendment]
my kids can make better welds than that



have you seen one up close??

they look like someone used TOO MUCH glue on them and didn't bother to wipe off the excess

that, or someone spooged on all the joints just before it got painted.

As a matter of fact, they are SO GOOD, they are now called 'Bobcat Arms' or some crap like that.

If Anus Computers made firearms, they would be called 'Special Weapons'.
Link Posted: 9/20/2005 8:10:36 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Target2:
mjrowley


Your kidding? $1200 NIB, I'm going to have to call to see what this guy originally paid for it and where he got it? I'll be right back with an update in a few minutes.

And you guys are being serious, its only worth a $100.00 ?




A fool and his money are soon parted.........

Yeah, they cost X, and they REALLY are only worth Y

where X = $1200
and Y = $100

(and I think he was being nice about the $100, you would have to give me the US Grant along with the gun just to take it off your hands).
Link Posted: 9/20/2005 8:12:51 PM EDT
Maybe A Company for Those
with Learning Disabilities?

Link Posted: 9/20/2005 8:14:17 PM EDT
How much would just the receiver worth?
Link Posted: 9/20/2005 8:17:18 PM EDT
The value of the weapon is inversely proportional to the buyer's knowledge of the maker's reputation.

Your friend will surely be able to find a buyer who will pay more than $100.

But not around here.
Link Posted: 9/20/2005 8:17:26 PM EDT

Originally Posted By mjrowley:
How much would just the receiver worth?



More than the weapon AFTER TOAD and the crew 'assemble' it.
Link Posted: 9/20/2005 8:19:31 PM EDT
WOW, I just called the guy and he stated he bought the SW45FS about two years ago, new. He stated he has put no more that 100 rounds through it and if functioned fine. I told him I wanted to see it first before he takes it to the funshop to be sold.

I've never seen a Special Weapons, LLC firearm before and you guys here have peaked my interest.

He asked me what I thought he could sell it for but I have not given him a ballpark price yet. I told him I wanted to look at it first.

He never did answer me about what he paid when he got it.

If he paid a lot I hate to tell him to only expect a $100
Link Posted: 9/20/2005 8:20:15 PM EDT
I had the SW45FS for several years. I had to sell it due to losing my job and not finding another for several years. I paid something like $1200 for mine. I took a big loss when I sold it.

The FS models are an 8" barrel for a fake "can" pinned on. You can register it as an SBR, pop the can off and it will have a 3 lug barrel.

The .45 was nice for me because it took modded Grease Gun mags. Mine worked well and had the plastic SEF grip assy on it. It shot well, I had a few jams, not as many as you hear about. I reloaded and had tons of .45 anyway.

Some work well, others may not. Todd is an ass, but I don't deal with him, so I don't care. ORF has yet to come up with a pistol caliber HK style rifle, so I won't hold my breath.

I also had a pinned tele HK stock on mine. I still have the tele stock. They are worth some cash. Last time I checked they were like $200+.
Link Posted: 9/20/2005 8:21:02 PM EDT
For the last 5 years, from what I've gathered on this site and a few others is RUN AWAY! Avoid spezshul wepuns like the plague.
Link Posted: 9/20/2005 8:26:18 PM EDT
Would it be out of line if I told the guy to tell the gunshop he would like to walk away from it with $400 in his pocket ?
Link Posted: 9/20/2005 8:27:24 PM EDT


Link Posted: 9/20/2005 8:31:51 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Target2:
Would it be out of line if I told the guy to tell the gunshop he would like to walk away from it with $400 in his pocket ?



You're too fixated on coming up with a number. It ain't gonna happen here. Does the dealer in question know Special Weapons' reputation? That's the real question.
Link Posted: 9/20/2005 8:35:48 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 9/20/2005 8:39:18 PM EDT by www-glock19-com]
everyone here is treating it like some sort of inside joke which it kinda is
readers digest version of special weapons
Todd the guy that runs it is ass and will not stand behind anything and if something is wrong it is your fault
He trolled gun boards for years with various alias defending his sub standard product
mainly claiming you do not really own one and you are jealous because you cannot afford his $1k gun
the guns are rough looking POS and you have about a 20% chance of getting one that works
If you brought one into my shop I would probably offer about $300
Link Posted: 9/20/2005 8:36:53 PM EDT
I had never heard of Special Weapons before tonight. I am just going to tell the guy to take it to the gunshop where they sell used firearms and tell him to let them pick a price and value for it. I'm just going to warn him not to expect much out of it at all and more than likely it will be significantly lower that whatever he paid.

I still want to see it before he takes it to sell.
Link Posted: 9/20/2005 8:48:00 PM EDT


I bought an early stamped SW5 and later filed the Form IV for SBR. The gun has functioned flawlessly through 4000+ rounds. I also purchased their M3 conversion for the USC



At one time I purchased their G3 clone but returned it without firing it (can't remember why).

A buddy purchased the SP10 and had issues with the sights, we couldn't get enough elevation in the rear drum to bring the shots in at 7 yards, I'm not sure how he resolved it.

I have not personally had any bad dealings with them. I've heard horror stories but cannot validate them. I prefer to keep my business relationships as amicable as possible.

Bobcat Weapons bought parts/tools from SW and is making the MP5/HK94 clones. While I haven't seen one in person, I have read a couple of favorable reviews.
Link Posted: 9/20/2005 9:02:27 PM EDT

Originally Posted By JS1050:
www.jsholsters.com/photos/sw5/DSC02228.JPG

I bought an early stamped SW5 and later filed the Form IV for SBR. The gun has functioned flawlessly through 4000+ rounds. I also purchased their M3 conversion for the USC

jasons.net/projects/USC45/DSC01704.JPG

At one time I purchased their G3 clone but returned it without firing it (can't remember why).

A buddy purchased the SP10 and had issues with the sights, we couldn't get enough elevation in the rear drum to bring the shots in at 7 yards, I'm not sure how he resolved it.

I have not personally had any bad dealings with them. I've heard horror stories but cannot validate them. I prefer to keep my business relationships as amicable as possible.

Bobcat Weapons bought parts/tools from SW and is making the MP5/HK94 clones. While I haven't seen one in person, I have read a couple of favorable reviews.



BC is SW,he sold the parts to himself.
Link Posted: 9/21/2005 2:56:15 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 9/21/2005 2:56:44 AM EDT by FloridaConfederate]


I built one out of a SW receiver I got from FAC and a cut MP5SF post sample.

No issues here. Runs great.

Link Posted: 9/21/2005 6:41:15 AM EDT
You all don't know what you're talking about. All real operators know that Special Weapons are of the highest quality. Toad is going to send the Govenor and clique mob if you persist in slandering his products.
Link Posted: 9/21/2005 6:51:41 AM EDT

Originally Posted By GySgtD:
You all don't know what you're talking about. All real operators know that Special Weapons are of the highest quality. Toad is going to send the Govenor and clique mob if you persist in slandering his products.



Why you do the fraud?

SBG
Link Posted: 9/21/2005 7:02:35 AM EDT
Tell your buddy to ask $850 for it. There are a lot of folks out there who would consider it for that price.
Link Posted: 9/21/2005 7:27:02 AM EDT
Target,

I will assume you are legitimate.

I have never held, or intend to hold a SW firearm(let alone buy one).

I first heard of Special Weapons (and Todd 'Toad' Bailey) when he was beginning to advertise the firearms. These were the HK 94 replacements he first made.

He was taking pre-orders for $700 (if I recall properly). Retail was supposed to be $900 on the guns.

I actually held the order form in my hand and considered it--then bought an FNC instead (good move on my part).

However, out of curiousity, I followed the Special Weapons saga:

Multiple Delays in production--pissed off LOTS of people.

Todd threatens lawsuits against his critics.

When orders start shipping, and people ask when they will get theirs, he complains about them and refunds their money (without the benefit of notifying them first, or giving them the option to wait).

First guns get into peoples hands--turns out they SUCK bigtime. Poor welding, poor finish, poor reliability.

People start to publically criticize the guns.

Todd threatens lawsuits against his critics. (to save typing this again--I'll just put ***ditto***).

Todd claims there are no problems with his firearms.

***ditto***

Some people post pictures of the issues with the guns.

***ditto***

Lots of "Fluff" posts start to show up on gun boards 'This gun is better than my HK....Todd is a God...etc.' Strangely enough, these are people who have never posted on the gun boards before.

***ditto***

((((Timeline gets kind of murky here as I got tired of laughing about the saga, so I would only check occasionally)))))

Todd claims all his parts are better than Genuine HK.
Pakistani parts are demonstrated to be in his guns (HK contract parts from Pak.).
Todd is in negotiations to buy HK
Todd is now the supplier for many foreign militaries/police and many US agencies (per Special Weapons, however, no one seems to notice any of these firearms in circulation in official hands).
***ditto***
HK54.com is started. This is a Special Weapons fluff board--Todd is the moderator. Posts usually consist of "Your gun is better than HK", "Todd is God", "Special Weapons is going to make all the guns for the US Special Forces".
***ditto***

There is a picture floating around--Todd Bailey being served legal papers at the SHOT show by people he ripped off.

There are several faces to Special Weapons--there is a 'distributor' that is supposedly separate, but in the same building.

I'm sure some others can add MUCH more to the list.


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