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9/22/2017 12:11:25 AM
Posted: 1/9/2006 4:50:41 PM EDT
So I'm at the range with my new FAL and I'm adjusting my gas port and sighting in.
With the bi-pod extended, I zero for windage and elevation. Boom, just like that I'm hitting the X perfectly.
So I try shooting without the bi-pod to fire the rifle freestanding and the hits are off to the left and high.
Hmmm, I say.
An "experienced" shooter tells me that the point of impact was changed because the bi-pod puts pressure on the barrell.

Does this seem correct or bullshit? Seems OK. Kinda makes sense.
I went back to the bi-pod and hit perfect again.

Weird or true. What sayest thou?
Link Posted: 1/9/2006 4:54:15 PM EDT
What range?
Link Posted: 1/9/2006 4:55:10 PM EDT
True, does that with a bayonet also.
Link Posted: 1/9/2006 4:55:49 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/9/2006 4:57:21 PM EDT by mayday]

Originally Posted By ArtyZ:
So I'm at the range with my new FAL and I'm adjusting my gas port and sighting in.
With the bi-pod extended, I zero for windage and elevation. Boom, just like that I'm hitting the X perfectly.
So I try shooting without the bi-pod to fire the rifle freestanding and the hits are off to the left and high.
Hmmm, I say.
An "experienced" shooter tells me that the point of impact was changed because the bi-pod puts pressure on the barrell.

Does this seem correct or bullshit? Seems OK. Kinda makes sense.
I went back to the bi-pod and hit perfect again.

Weird or true. What sayest thou?



Absolutely true.

For decades I've shot rifles and I'll even go as far to tell you that even the use of a sling as an aid will substantially change the point of impact. I've really seen this with AR15's that are not H-bars. You can really see the difference @ 250-400 yards. Thats why when shooting AR15's @ 400-500 yards I prefer to put the sandbags as far BACk as possible. Sometimes if I'll rest the rifle right past the mag-well.

Precision shooting is all about consistency; therefore ANY force applied or removed to the barrel will likely cause a change in performance.
Link Posted: 1/9/2006 4:59:02 PM EDT
Have you ever seen a BAR? They put the bipod way out near the muzzle to purposely increase dispersion.
Anything you touch the barrel with will affect it's POI. That's why AR Service Rifles have a float tube that you attach the sling to. Otherwise, you can pull the POI completely off the target at 300 yards just with sling tension.

Link Posted: 1/9/2006 4:59:49 PM EDT
Link Posted: 1/9/2006 5:25:27 PM EDT
Yes, that's why none of my FALs have bipod's. That and FALs are already heavy enough by themselve's.
Link Posted: 1/9/2006 5:27:58 PM EDT
Link Posted: 1/9/2006 6:01:54 PM EDT
You'll need a free float handguard if you do not want point of aim to change.
Link Posted: 1/9/2006 6:02:43 PM EDT
I have an M-44 that will shoot differently with the bayonet extended. Makes sense to me about the bipod.
If you sight in with it, use it all the time, and still the POI will change.
Link Posted: 1/9/2006 6:03:40 PM EDT
Indeed, but I like bipods on my G1 and STG. I know my POI with mine.
Link Posted: 1/9/2006 6:07:43 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Sodie:
You'll need a free float handguard if you do not want point of aim to change.



My understanding is that to truly free-float a FAL is not so simple. Maybe someone like Derek can chime in and elaborate or correct me.
Link Posted: 1/9/2006 6:08:58 PM EDT
Can muzzle brakes also change POI? For example the AK slant cut brake.
Link Posted: 1/9/2006 6:11:47 PM EDT

Originally Posted By CZ75_9MM:
Can muzzle brakes also change POI? For example the AK slant cut brake.



Yes
Link Posted: 1/9/2006 6:17:09 PM EDT
If you wanna see something really cool, Lay a wet rag on your barrel and fire 4 shots in about 1.5 minutes.
Link Posted: 1/9/2006 6:59:18 PM EDT

Originally Posted By SS109:
I have an M-44 that will shoot differently with the bayonet extended.



All post WWI Mosin Nagant rifles (save sniper variations) are sighted with bayonets attached or unfolded. In WWII, no scabbards were even issued. An M44 can have a shift of about 1 foot at 100 meters between bayonet open and folded.
Link Posted: 1/9/2006 7:09:32 PM EDT
thats why my Bushmaster varminter has the bi-pod on the handguard and all sniper rifles have the bi-pod ( if they use one ) on the stock. Yes,it's true that pressure on the barrel will change POA.
Link Posted: 1/9/2006 8:30:21 PM EDT
They are actually pretty easy to put on, they just clamp onto the thickest part of the barrel and the front is held on with tensioning bolts.




DSA Free Float tubes

Entreprise

Link Posted: 1/9/2006 8:34:21 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Sodie:
they just clamp onto the thickest part of the barrel



and therefore not a true free-float, correct?

p.s.

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