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Posted: 11/19/2012 3:30:46 PM EST
[Last Edit: 11/19/2012 3:34:48 PM EST by TylerF]












http://photos.mlive.com/4474/gallery/police_standoff_in_muskegon_ends_peacefully/index.html

http://www.mlive.com/news/muskegon/index.ssf/2012/11/muskegon_standoff_suspect_lodg.html#incart_river_default
^^^Video^^^At bottom of page.
MUSKEGON, MI – A 39-year-old Muskegon man has been lodged in the Muskegon County Jail on two felonies in connection with an early-morning standoff on Monday.
Authorities have declined to release the man’s name until he is officially charged. As of late Monday afternoon, a warrant hadn’t yet been signed.


Link Posted: 11/19/2012 3:35:04 PM EST
Im just wondering why police need suppressors on their rifles? And why they always have to try and look like a military unit.
Link Posted: 11/19/2012 3:37:32 PM EST
[Last Edit: 11/19/2012 4:04:28 PM EST by SiVisPacem]
Originally Posted By engineer1371:
Im just wondering why police need suppressors on their rifles? And why they always have to try and look like a military unit.


That's like asking why machinery operators need to wear ear muffs when operating machinery. They're being exposed to loud noises during the course of their work and they'd like to protect their hearing, so that they can enjoy a reasonable quality of life.

As to the military unit comment, the military chooses uniforms and equipment because it is supposed to be durable and works when engaged in confrontations against armed opponents. That kind of sounds like the job description of a SWAT team, doesn't it?
Link Posted: 11/19/2012 3:37:57 PM EST
Originally Posted By engineer1371:
Im just wondering why police need suppressors on their rifles? And why they always have to try and look like a military unit.


The suppressors I understand in a LE setting.
What I DONT get is the guy with the cammo painted face, and the guy with his headgear gillied out

Link Posted: 11/19/2012 3:38:51 PM EST
I would love to see the markings on the side of that black vehicle. Are those local police? Smells like DHS. A frickin ghillie suit? are you kidding me.
Link Posted: 11/19/2012 3:39:24 PM EST
Originally Posted By engineer1371:
Im just wondering why police need suppressors on their rifles? And why they always have to try and look like a military unit.


Yeah, it's much cheaper to pay for their care once they have permanent hearing damage.

Link Posted: 11/19/2012 3:39:32 PM EST
Originally Posted By raresheg:
I would love to see the markings on the side of that black vehicle. Are those local police? Smells like DHS. A frickin ghillie suit? are you kidding me.

State police.
Link Posted: 11/19/2012 3:39:51 PM EST
Originally Posted By echo6:
Originally Posted By engineer1371:
Im just wondering why police need suppressors on their rifles? And why they always have to try and look like a military unit.


The suppressors I understand in a LE setting.
What I DONT get is the guy with the cammo painted face, and the guy with his headgear gillied out


May be snipers.
Link Posted: 11/19/2012 3:40:24 PM EST
the militarization of the police. And is that motherfucker wearing a ghillie suit? Jumping jesus christ that's dumb.
Link Posted: 11/19/2012 3:40:58 PM EST
Vehicle ID?
Link Posted: 11/19/2012 3:41:17 PM EST

Originally Posted By echo6:
Originally Posted By engineer1371:
Im just wondering why police need suppressors on their rifles? And why they always have to try and look like a military unit.


The suppressors I understand in a LE setting.
What I DONT get is the guy with the cammo painted face, and the guy with his headgear gillied out



Police Swat teams have Snipers.. and paramedics on the team.
Link Posted: 11/19/2012 3:41:17 PM EST
Originally Posted By echo6:
Originally Posted By engineer1371:
Im just wondering why police need suppressors on their rifles? And why they always have to try and look like a military unit.


The suppressors I understand in a LE setting.
What I DONT get is the guy with the cammo painted face, and the guy with his headgear gillied out



designated marksman?
Link Posted: 11/19/2012 3:41:27 PM EST
Originally Posted By engineer1371:
Im just wondering why police need suppressors on their rifles? And why they always have to try and look like a military unit.


Everyone needs suppressors on their rifles. You should be asking why they don't come standard on every deer rifle.
Link Posted: 11/19/2012 3:41:36 PM EST
Originally Posted By echo6:
Originally Posted By engineer1371:
Im just wondering why police need suppressors on their rifles? And why they always have to try and look like a military unit.


The suppressors I understand in a LE setting.
What I DONT get is the guy with the cammo painted face, and the guy with his headgear gillied out



Cause he looks badass ! LL
Link Posted: 11/19/2012 3:41:50 PM EST
Originally Posted By maggiethecat:
the militarization of the police. And is that motherfucker wearing a ghillie suit? Jumping jesus christ that's dumb.

A lot of arfcommers are bigger gear queers than anyone in those pictures and have a lot less necessity to be so.
Link Posted: 11/19/2012 3:42:01 PM EST
hey you never know when its go time- might as well bust out the G-Suit when you can, it multicam could be out of style by the next time we can employ it.
Link Posted: 11/19/2012 3:42:02 PM EST
Originally Posted By maggiethecat:
the militarization of the police. And is that motherfucker wearing a ghillie suit? Jumping jesus christ that's dumb.


How do you know whether or not it was appropriate for that situation?
Link Posted: 11/19/2012 3:42:23 PM EST
Those guys need to lay off the COD and my tax dollars
Link Posted: 11/19/2012 3:42:31 PM EST
Originally Posted By engineer1371:
Im just wondering why police need suppressors on their rifles? And why they always have to try and look like a military unit.


Because shooting short barrelled rifles indoors in a confined space without earpro while trying to listen to a radio for vitally important information that may save their lives or someone else's is dangerous. The suppressor reduces the noise factor somewhat, and more importantly indoors, reduces the flash so that vision inside a dark structure isnt hindered.

Clearing a house isnt as easy as it looks on tv or in the movies.
Alot of times it means operating the weapon in odd ways which puts your face closer to the noisy end of the gun.
Link Posted: 11/19/2012 3:43:35 PM EST
Militarization of the police is a bad idea......
Link Posted: 11/19/2012 3:43:51 PM EST
Originally Posted By FreePort:
Those guys need to lay off the COD and my tax dollars


So dont call them...save their budget by not using their resources.

Link Posted: 11/19/2012 3:43:52 PM EST
Originally Posted By maggiethecat:
the militarization of the police. And is that motherfucker wearing a ghillie suit? Jumping jesus christ that's dumb.


As was said above, he's likely a sniper. If you were the cops, wouldn't you want your sniper hidden from sight, as best as possible, lest the bad guy see him and move to a position out of the sniper's line of fire. By camouflaging himself, the sniper gives himself the advantage of not betraying the position of his hide site to the bad guy. In the military, we call that a combat multiplier.
Link Posted: 11/19/2012 3:44:06 PM EST

Originally Posted By TGMoore:
Vehicle ID?

http://www.army-guide.com/eng/product2667.html
Link Posted: 11/19/2012 3:44:25 PM EST
Originally Posted By echo6:
Originally Posted By engineer1371:
Im just wondering why police need suppressors on their rifles? And why they always have to try and look like a military unit.


The suppressors I understand in a LE setting.
What I DONT get is the guy with the cammo painted face, and the guy with his headgear gillied out



This.

Suppressors should be optional on all guns. Nothing wrong with them. Go to some places in the world and its considered simple common courtesy.

But the outfits on these guys.... Jesus H. Christ on a rocket powered pogo stick...

Link Posted: 11/19/2012 3:45:14 PM EST

Originally Posted By raresheg:
I would love to see the markings on the side of that black vehicle. Are those local police? Smells like DHS. A frickin ghillie suit? are you kidding me.



Michigan State Police Emergency Support Team.
Link Posted: 11/19/2012 3:45:23 PM EST
Originally Posted By B62stew:
Militarization of the police is a bad idea......

No more than the militarization of the civilian populace.
Link Posted: 11/19/2012 3:45:36 PM EST
Originally Posted By Chesh97:

Originally Posted By echo6:
Originally Posted By engineer1371:
Im just wondering why police need suppressors on their rifles? And why they always have to try and look like a military unit.


The suppressors I understand in a LE setting.
What I DONT get is the guy with the cammo painted face, and the guy with his headgear gillied out



Police Swat teams have Snipers.. and paramedics on the team.


Yep. I understand he is a DM or a "sniper", but in a Urban or even semi rural setting, the cammo is more for cool points than for practicality.

That "sniper" is not doing a stalk across enemy held ground to get within range of his tgt.

I guess he could hide in the shrubbery out front of Dunkin' 75 m from the objective

Link Posted: 11/19/2012 3:45:58 PM EST
Originally Posted By raresheg:
I would love to see the markings on the side of that black vehicle. Are those local police? Smells like DHS. A frickin ghillie suit? are you kidding me.


State Police. The entry shield says it all.

The ghillie suit is for the sniper and it is quite common, I bet he was set up across the street next to a hedgerow or other greenery. The SO I used to work with had all of their snipers equipped as such, once on scene they could remove it from their being if their position did not require it.

I like to see LEO's still resemble what they are even when all decked out in tacti-coolio gear. There is no reason these guys cant wear a straight colors and show some sort of identification in their uniform. They are not military, they should not look like they are military. I understand the hemmits, suppressors, and even the ghillie suits for the marksmen, but looking like Delta Force on the go is a bit much, imo.
Link Posted: 11/19/2012 3:46:04 PM EST
Originally Posted By TylerF:

Originally Posted By raresheg:
I would love to see the markings on the side of that black vehicle. Are those local police? Smells like DHS. A frickin ghillie suit? are you kidding me.

http://blog.mlive.com/chronicle/news_impact/2009/04/large_MSP4.jpg

Michigan State Police Emergency Support Team.


PEST control?

Link Posted: 11/19/2012 3:47:30 PM EST
Looking at the terrain, I don't think cammo is bad. Why not use
surpressors? I think it's a good idea.

Jesus....What do people want them to wear? Bus driver hats
and ties? I don't see any issue with light armored vehicles either.
For the application, I don't think it's overkill at all.

Link Posted: 11/19/2012 3:47:35 PM EST
Originally Posted By SiVisPacem:
Originally Posted By engineer1371:
Im just wondering why police need suppressors on their rifles? And why they always have to try and look like a military unit.


That's like asking why machinery operators need to wear ear muffs when operating machinery. They're being exposed to loud noises during the course of their work and they'd like to protect their hearing, so that they can enjoy a reasonable quality of life.

As to the military unit comment, the military chooses uniforms and equipment because it is supposed to be durable and works when engaged in confrontations against armed opponents. That kind of sounds like the job description of a SWAT team, doesn't it? They probably went with MultiCam before it was adopted by the Army for OEF, as that was fairly recent. So, an argument could be made that the Army is trying to look like the Michigan State Police.


Link Posted: 11/19/2012 3:47:56 PM EST
So the camo guys show up in squad cars and a big black tank.......
Link Posted: 11/19/2012 3:48:12 PM EST
Originally Posted By maggiethecat:


the militarization of the police. And is that motherfucker wearing a ghillie suit? Jumping jesus christ that's dumb.






perhaps it was cold.

Link Posted: 11/19/2012 3:49:18 PM EST

Originally Posted By scootr29:
So the camo guys show up in squad cars and a big black tank.......

The Black and Whites are Muskegon PD, not the State Police.
Link Posted: 11/19/2012 3:49:44 PM EST
[Last Edit: 11/19/2012 3:52:34 PM EST by SiVisPacem]
Originally Posted By echo6:
Originally Posted By engineer1371:
Im just wondering why police need suppressors on their rifles? And why they always have to try and look like a military unit.


The suppressors I understand in a LE setting.
What I DONT get is the guy with the cammo painted face, and the guy with his headgear gillied out



The guy with the camo face appears to be wearing a camouflaged face veil or balaclava, not face paint. Judging by the fact that the other guys are wearing balaclavas, I'm going to assume doing so is a team SOP. that makes since, as it serves several purposes. One, it protects the identity of the cop, in case he's working an undercover assignment, but pulls double duty on the SWAT team. Secondly, they tend to protect the cop's face from debris or burns from things like flashbangs or rounds hitting walls which cause splinters to fly. And, third, it gets freaking cold in Michigan this time of year.
Link Posted: 11/19/2012 3:50:23 PM EST
They couldn't commit to being in the military so they like to pretend.
Link Posted: 11/19/2012 3:51:07 PM EST
They want to look bad lollolol
Link Posted: 11/19/2012 3:51:42 PM EST
Originally Posted By effinNewGuy:
They couldn't commit to being in the military so they like to pretend.


Yeah, they really should only be carrying 686's and mag-lites.

Link Posted: 11/19/2012 3:52:08 PM EST
Let's face it, most people think tactical gear is cool, and cops aren't immune from thinking the same thing.

Link Posted: 11/19/2012 3:52:26 PM EST
[Last Edit: 11/19/2012 3:54:50 PM EST by Qweevox]

Originally Posted By Shenanigunz:
Originally Posted By maggiethecat:
the militarization of the police. And is that motherfucker wearing a ghillie suit? Jumping jesus christ that's dumb.

A lot of arfcommers are bigger gear queers than anyone in those pictures and have a lot less necessity to be so.

I agree. Cut the guys a break, This is probably a once in a "blue moon" opportunity. They seldom get to wear all their cool army gear in an actual "situation". They rolled out their armored vehicle, and I bet if they had a drone available, it was flying. They probably donned everything they had for this. It's the same reason airsoft guys dress up...because they can.
Link Posted: 11/19/2012 3:52:49 PM EST
Originally Posted By effinNewGuy:
They couldn't commit to being in the military so they like to pretend.

A lot of SWAT guys are prior service.
Link Posted: 11/19/2012 3:53:16 PM EST

Originally Posted By effinNewGuy:
They couldn't commit to being in the military so they like to pretend.

ASSuming they aren't veterans?
Link Posted: 11/19/2012 3:53:41 PM EST
Originally Posted By engineer1371:
Im just wondering why police need suppressors on their rifles? And why they always have to try and look like a military unit.


Better accuracy
Link Posted: 11/19/2012 3:54:01 PM EST
Originally Posted By trwoprod:
Originally Posted By engineer1371:
Im just wondering why police need suppressors on their rifles? And why they always have to try and look like a military unit.


Everyone needs suppressors on their rifles. You should be asking why they don't come standard on every deer rifle.


Exactly this. The ringing in a frequent shooter's ears is his constant reminder that his government cares more about placating morons than about the actual safety or health of it's citizens.
Link Posted: 11/19/2012 3:54:58 PM EST
Originally Posted By Qweevox:

Originally Posted By Shenanigunz:
Originally Posted By maggiethecat:
the militarization of the police. And is that motherfucker wearing a ghillie suit? Jumping jesus christ that's dumb.

A lot of arfcommers are bigger gear queers than anyone in those pictures and have a lot less necessity to be so.

I agree. Cut the guys a break, This is probably a once in a "blue moon" opportunity. They seldom get to wear all their cool army gear in an actual "situation". They rolled out their armored vehicle, and I bet if they had drone available, it was flying. They probably donned everything they had for this. It's the same reason airsoft guys dress up...because they can.


Or, they don the gear on the ride to the scene, preparing for any possibility, to include having to go straight into a fight as soon as they roll up on the scene, as opposed to waiting until they get on scene to decide what individual pieces of gear they need for this particular nut job. You know, the whole "better to have it and not need it, than need it and not have it" theory.
Link Posted: 11/19/2012 3:55:08 PM EST
Holy crap! I guess I should be asking what they were up against. It ain't called militiagan for nuttin.....
Link Posted: 11/19/2012 3:55:21 PM EST
Originally Posted By TDCJBoss:
Looking at the terrain, I don't think cammo is bad. Why not use
surpressors? I think it's a good idea.

Jesus....What do people want them to wear? Bus driver hats
and ties? I don't see any issue with light armored vehicles either.
For the application, I don't think it's overkill at all.



I gotta agree. I dont see a problem with anything they got.
Link Posted: 11/19/2012 3:58:04 PM EST
Originally Posted By Shenanigunz:
Originally Posted By effinNewGuy:
They couldn't commit to being in the military so they like to pretend.

A lot of SWAT guys are prior service.


Abe Lincoln eh? Now that's funny, spit water out my nose....

Link Posted: 11/19/2012 3:58:46 PM EST
Originally Posted By Swoosh101:
Originally Posted By echo6:
Originally Posted By engineer1371:
Im just wondering why police need suppressors on their rifles? And why they always have to try and look like a military unit.


The suppressors I understand in a LE setting.
What I DONT get is the guy with the cammo painted face, and the guy with his headgear gillied out



designated marksman?


My guess as well. Probably a Marksman/Observer working the perimeter.
Link Posted: 11/19/2012 3:58:56 PM EST
Originally Posted By reelserious:
Originally Posted By maggiethecat:


the militarization of the police. And is that motherfucker wearing a ghillie suit? Jumping jesus christ that's dumb.






perhaps it was cold.



Or perhaps they need to able observe the suspect from the bushes (ie not hard cover) without being seen nor shot.

Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile
Link Posted: 11/19/2012 3:59:05 PM EST
I'll tell you what I see that I do agree with. I agree with the crotch armor. If I was a member of the state police SWAT team, one thing I wouldn't want would be to get shot in the dick. I for one am glad to see crotch armor in use.
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