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Link Posted: 12/2/2013 5:40:08 PM EDT
Note how everyone now insists that the car was travelling along the road at 45, the same as when it hit the tree. Think maybe the gigantic brakes on the flyweight car slowed it down a little first?

People driving minivans probably go thru there at 60.

Just because you like this actor (all the sudden), you don't have to completely abandon all grip on reality.






Link Posted: 12/2/2013 5:46:18 PM EDT
Carbon shatters when stressed the wrong way as it was designed.

At 45mph it is likely the quick onset of fire that killed them and not the actual crash. Those cars passenger compartments are very strong crash cages.

That model of porsche is basically a race car with head lamps. A few people own them locally in Stock form and I have heard them described as "terrifying, scary and too much for any normal person". And those are factory cars. This car was modified so it could be a matter of a simple driving error or a malfunction to the car in ssome way.

In any case 45mph is not crazy speeds and 2 people with families died in what I am betting was a fiery, horrible death. It's not funny and if you think it is well think about yourself burning to death and people making fun of you for no good reason.


Assholes
Link Posted: 12/2/2013 5:49:54 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By TxRabbitBane:



45? Cops interviewed on TV a couple hours ago were estimating 90ish...
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Originally Posted By TxRabbitBane:
Originally Posted By Dan_Gray:
Originally Posted By 4thbreak:
I just saw on TMZ that they were doing 45mph, the tree was actually doing 65mph, so a total impact mph of +/- 110mph. Nearby surveillance photos show them street racing the tree before ultimately peaking out at 45mph(rev limiter) and losing the race. According to TMZ, a CGT is designed to break away in high impact crashes(30+mph) and launch random parts 50+ feet away, so the story makes sense.


The combined impact speed is a myth.



45? Cops interviewed on TV a couple hours ago were estimating 90ish...


Yea I just cant see a pro race car driver losing this car at 45mph, just no way. If they did they would have just hit the curb and lost maybe a rim or two.
Link Posted: 12/2/2013 5:55:49 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By sloppyjoe:
Carbon shatters when stressed the wrong way as it was designed.

At 45mph it is likely the quick onset of fire that killed them and not the actual crash. Those cars passenger compartments are very strong crash cages.

That model of porsche is basically a race car with head lamps. A few people own them locally in Stock form and I have heard them described as "terrifying, scary and too much for any normal person". And those are factory cars. This car was modified so it could be a matter of a simple driving error or a malfunction to the car in ssome way.

In any case 45mph is not crazy speeds and 2 people with families died in what I am betting was a fiery, horrible death. It's not funny and if you think it is well think about yourself burning to death and people making fun of you for no good reason.


Assholes
View Quote



what the jumping fuck are you talking about?

This thread is truly one of the weirdest things I ever saw on arf

Link Posted: 12/2/2013 6:01:06 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By TxRabbitBane:



45? Cops interviewed on TV a couple hours ago were estimating 90ish...
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Originally Posted By TxRabbitBane:
Originally Posted By Dan_Gray:
Originally Posted By 4thbreak:
I just saw on TMZ that they were doing 45mph, the tree was actually doing 65mph, so a total impact mph of +/- 110mph. Nearby surveillance photos show them street racing the tree before ultimately peaking out at 45mph(rev limiter) and losing the race. According to TMZ, a CGT is designed to break away in high impact crashes(30+mph) and launch random parts 50+ feet away, so the story makes sense.






The combined impact speed is a myth.



45? Cops interviewed on TV a couple hours ago were estimating 90ish...


A lot of rear engined super cars are designed to separate at the firewall in a moderate impact. This lambo is estimated to have been going 50 ish MPH.































So FWIW, It doesn't necessarily mean they were hauling ass.
Link Posted: 12/2/2013 6:05:51 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By Goodn:


A lot of rear engined super cars are designed to separate at the firewall in a moderate impact. This lambo is estimated to have been going 50 ish MPH.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u4RY3UwudlM




Exactly this.

I am around supercars all summer. In a crash the passenger structure is built to be a cage and the rear engine/driveline to separate away from the main structure.

In this case I am betting it was the fire that killed them. Not the crash as it was not crazy high speed.



























So FWIW, It doesn't necessarily mean they were hauling ass.
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Originally Posted By Goodn:
Originally Posted By TxRabbitBane:
Originally Posted By Dan_Gray:
Originally Posted By 4thbreak:
I just saw on TMZ that they were doing 45mph, the tree was actually doing 65mph, so a total impact mph of +/- 110mph. Nearby surveillance photos show them street racing the tree before ultimately peaking out at 45mph(rev limiter) and losing the race. According to TMZ, a CGT is designed to break away in high impact crashes(30+mph) and launch random parts 50+ feet away, so the story makes sense.






The combined impact speed is a myth.



45? Cops interviewed on TV a couple hours ago were estimating 90ish...


A lot of rear engined super cars are designed to separate at the firewall in a moderate impact. This lambo is estimated to have been going 50 ish MPH.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u4RY3UwudlM




Exactly this.

I am around supercars all summer. In a crash the passenger structure is built to be a cage and the rear engine/driveline to separate away from the main structure.

In this case I am betting it was the fire that killed them. Not the crash as it was not crazy high speed.



























So FWIW, It doesn't necessarily mean they were hauling ass.

Link Posted: 12/2/2013 6:06:08 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By cyborg543:
Note how everyone now insists that the car was travelling along the road at 45, the same as when it hit the tree. Think maybe the gigantic brakes on the flyweight car slowed it down a little first?
People driving minivans probably go thru there at 60.
Just because you like this actor (all the sudden), you don't have to completely abandon all grip on reality.
View Quote

I've been in a car traveling sideways at speed. The brakes weren't doing me much good, YMMV.
Link Posted: 12/2/2013 6:08:50 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By dtux:

I've been in a car traveling sideways at speed. The brakes weren't doing me much good, YMMV.
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Originally Posted By dtux:
Originally Posted By cyborg543:
Note how everyone now insists that the car was travelling along the road at 45, the same as when it hit the tree. Think maybe the gigantic brakes on the flyweight car slowed it down a little first?
People driving minivans probably go thru there at 60.
Just because you like this actor (all the sudden), you don't have to completely abandon all grip on reality.

I've been in a car traveling sideways at speed. The brakes weren't doing me much good, YMMV.



Yup.

Could have been a brake failure for all we know. Or a suspension failure. Either would render a car difficult to control.
Link Posted: 12/2/2013 6:10:50 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/2/2013 6:11:02 PM EDT by realwar]
A little off topic but.


2014 Porsche 918 Spyder - Jay Leno's Garage




http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qlBUB9RqY_I
Link Posted: 12/2/2013 6:10:53 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By sloppyjoe:



Yup.

Could have been a brake failure for all we know. Or a suspension failure. Either would render a car difficult to control.
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Originally Posted By sloppyjoe:
Originally Posted By dtux:
Originally Posted By cyborg543:
Note how everyone now insists that the car was travelling along the road at 45, the same as when it hit the tree. Think maybe the gigantic brakes on the flyweight car slowed it down a little first?
People driving minivans probably go thru there at 60.
Just because you like this actor (all the sudden), you don't have to completely abandon all grip on reality.

I've been in a car traveling sideways at speed. The brakes weren't doing me much good, YMMV.



Yup.

Could have been a brake failure for all we know. Or a suspension failure. Either would render a car difficult to control.

Witness reports discussed a few pages back that it was leaking fluids. All the info combined paints a realistic picture.
Link Posted: 12/2/2013 6:18:41 PM EDT
Link Posted: 12/2/2013 6:19:45 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By Dan_Gray:

Witness reports discussed a few pages back that it was leaking fluids. All the info combined paints a realistic picture.
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It for sure left fluids all over the place after it hit. Granted I've never had a Carrera GT but most Porches have the fluids in the rear. The front is a trunk of sorts.
Link Posted: 12/2/2013 6:20:36 PM EDT
Link Posted: 12/2/2013 6:22:29 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By RarestRX:

I still think it has to be faster than 45.

Carbon fiber monocoques are supposed to be super strong.

Getting sheered in half, rupturing the tank?

I'm dubious.
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Rigid isn't the same as strong.
Link Posted: 12/2/2013 6:26:44 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By JAMES77257:


Rigid isn't the same as strong.
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Originally Posted By JAMES77257:
Originally Posted By RarestRX:

I still think it has to be faster than 45.

Carbon fiber monocoques are supposed to be super strong.

Getting sheered in half, rupturing the tank?

I'm dubious.


Rigid isn't the same as strong.

It can actually work to hurt strength.
Link Posted: 12/2/2013 6:27:03 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By JAMES77257:


Rigid isn't the same as strong.
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Originally Posted By JAMES77257:
Originally Posted By RarestRX:

I still think it has to be faster than 45.

Carbon fiber monocoques are supposed to be super strong.

Getting sheered in half, rupturing the tank?

I'm dubious.


Rigid isn't the same as strong.


I don't know man, CF is supposed to be pretty strong as well.

From the pics of that Aventador, the Carrera GT wasn't a clean planned separation, it looks like the car was sheered right at the seat backs/firewall.

If the tank got ruptured and instantly lit up, there was some serious energetics happening.

All speculation, of course, but I have faith in the Porsche engineers.

That car was going fast when it hit.
Link Posted: 12/2/2013 6:29:11 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By AKengineer:
It for sure left fluids all over the place after it hit. Granted I've never had a Carrera GT but most Porches have the fluids in the rear. The front is a trunk of sorts.
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Originally Posted By AKengineer:
Originally Posted By Dan_Gray:

Witness reports discussed a few pages back that it was leaking fluids. All the info combined paints a realistic picture.
It for sure left fluids all over the place after it hit. Granted I've never had a Carrera GT but most Porches have the fluids in the rear. The front is a trunk of sorts.

I've been on the scene of a few accidents through the years. It's probably almost 1000. It could be more, some days I'm at 3 or more. Some days none, I guess it evens out. Either way, I like to think I know a little something about them. Just a little, MAYBE even a little more than a layman. Just maybe.

The difference between leaking before and after from a moving car is blatant.
Link Posted: 12/2/2013 6:32:02 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By Dan_Gray:

It can actually work to hurt strength.
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Originally Posted By Dan_Gray:
Originally Posted By JAMES77257:
Originally Posted By RarestRX:

I still think it has to be faster than 45.

Carbon fiber monocoques are supposed to be super strong.

Getting sheered in half, rupturing the tank?

I'm dubious.


Rigid isn't the same as strong.

It can actually work to hurt strength.


Yep. Steel with the highest tensile strength is also some of the most brittle.
Link Posted: 12/2/2013 6:34:18 PM EDT
I'm amazed at the destruction, death and damage if that car impacted at 45mph.
Link Posted: 12/2/2013 6:37:46 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By RarestRX:


I don't know man, CF is supposed to be pretty strong as well.

From the pics of that Aventador, the Carrera GT wasn't a clean planned separation, it looks like the car was sheered right at the seat backs/firewall.

If the tank got ruptured and instantly lit up, there was some serious energetics happening.

All speculation, of course, but I have faith in the Porsche engineers.

That car was going fast when it hit.
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Originally Posted By RarestRX:
Originally Posted By JAMES77257:
Originally Posted By RarestRX:

I still think it has to be faster than 45.

Carbon fiber monocoques are supposed to be super strong.

Getting sheered in half, rupturing the tank?

I'm dubious.


Rigid isn't the same as strong.


I don't know man, CF is supposed to be pretty strong as well.

From the pics of that Aventador, the Carrera GT wasn't a clean planned separation, it looks like the car was sheered right at the seat backs/firewall.

If the tank got ruptured and instantly lit up, there was some serious energetics happening.

All speculation, of course, but I have faith in the Porsche engineers.

That car was going fast when it hit.



CF is super strong, but when stressed in a way that it was not designed it will shatter like glass.

Take a formula 1 car for instance. Their body, suspension, wings etc are all CF. And take super extreme loads, but when they are hit lightly under stress in a wrong way the cars appear to explode. Wings, suspension, bodywork all goes flying.
Link Posted: 12/2/2013 6:38:37 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By TheGunCollector:
I'm amazed at the destruction, death and damage if that car impacted at 45mph.
View Quote

It's more than what I'd expect to see, BUT, in the aforementioned wrecks I've worked, I have to say that I have seen a LOT of odd shit. From trucks that were driven up to the wrecker in which both occupants died, to mini SUVs crushed so bad that no one checked for living occupants and the person inside had a few scratches and nothing else. I watched a guy die after a ten mph impact, and I've seen damn near ok after 85mph ejections. You really just never know. I'm not saying that the car was doing 45, I'm just saying that my experienced gut says it's possible.
Link Posted: 12/2/2013 6:39:22 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By sloppyjoe:



CF is super strong, but when stressed in a way that it was not designed it will shatter like glass.

Take a formula 1 car for instance. Their body, suspension, wings etc are all CF. And take super extreme loads, but when they are hit lightly under stress in a wrong way the cars appear to explode. Wings, suspension, bodywork all goes flying.
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Originally Posted By sloppyjoe:
Originally Posted By RarestRX:
Originally Posted By JAMES77257:
Originally Posted By RarestRX:

I still think it has to be faster than 45.

Carbon fiber monocoques are supposed to be super strong.

Getting sheered in half, rupturing the tank?

I'm dubious.


Rigid isn't the same as strong.


I don't know man, CF is supposed to be pretty strong as well.

From the pics of that Aventador, the Carrera GT wasn't a clean planned separation, it looks like the car was sheered right at the seat backs/firewall.

If the tank got ruptured and instantly lit up, there was some serious energetics happening.

All speculation, of course, but I have faith in the Porsche engineers.

That car was going fast when it hit.



CF is super strong, but when stressed in a way that it was not designed it will shatter like glass.

Take a formula 1 car for instance. Their body, suspension, wings etc are all CF. And take super extreme loads, but when they are hit lightly under stress in a wrong way the cars appear to explode. Wings, suspension, bodywork all goes flying.



Like I said, rigid does not equal strong.
Link Posted: 12/2/2013 6:39:29 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/2/2013 6:41:27 PM EDT by RarestRX]
Here's a pic off of Wrecked Exotics:




This happened after a light rain, this guy turned left on the road going at least 90mph and just lost it, the car spun out, (rear end) took out about 35 feet of a cinder block wall, then spun & hit the wall again with the front end, one of the wheels flew across the street into a neighborhood, the guy came out with one little scratch
View Quote


No separation.



Crashed into a retaining wall at California Speedway on June 2nd. Car was travelling approximately 150 mph when it lost control. Sadly, 2 people were killed, the passenger being Corey Rudl, one of the best internet marketers in the world. The driver was also well known and liked among Porsche enthusiasts. Both will be missed.
View Quote


No separation, even at a buck fifty.

I'm thinking the concrete pole hit right over Paul's right shoulder and just sheered/ripped the car in two.

I don't think it would do that at 45mph.

Buuuut, I could be totally full of shit and wrong, so take it with a big grain of salt.


Link Posted: 12/2/2013 6:44:19 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/2/2013 6:57:49 PM EDT by cyborg543]
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Originally Posted By Aimless:
So they were putting along at the speed limit when the race car spontaneously combusted and fell apart?
View Quote



Well, the basic underlying theme of this thread is that those two guys were not doing anything wrong at all.

Not speeding even the teeny tiniest little bit.

Sure you and I would be driving our commuter cars thru there at 60, but the two dead guys absolutely positively did not.


Probably the garbage man drives his truck thru there at 60.

Sure, it's no big deal at all. People drive faster than the limit all the time. There are plenty of roads that are posted 45 and people drive 60 on them.

But those two race drivers suddenly turned into complete nerds and let that awesome car burble along at 45. Because they have to be completely innocent.

Link Posted: 12/2/2013 6:44:21 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By RarestRX:
Here's a pic off of Wrecked Exotics:

http://www.wreckedexotics.com/carreragt/carreragt_20060402_002.jpg



No separation.

http://www.wreckedexotics.com/carreragt/carreragt_20050602_004.jpg



No separation, even at a buck fifty.

I'm thinking the concrete pole hit right over Paul's right shoulder and just sheered/ripped the car in two.

I don't think it would do that at 45mph.

Buuuut, I could be totally full of shit and wrong, so take it with a big grain of salt.


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Originally Posted By RarestRX:
Here's a pic off of Wrecked Exotics:

http://www.wreckedexotics.com/carreragt/carreragt_20060402_002.jpg


This happened after a light rain, this guy turned left on the road going at least 90mph and just lost it, the car spun out, (rear end) took out about 35 feet of a cinder block wall, then spun & hit the wall again with the front end, one of the wheels flew across the street into a neighborhood, the guy came out with one little scratch


No separation.

http://www.wreckedexotics.com/carreragt/carreragt_20050602_004.jpg

Crashed into a retaining wall at California Speedway on June 2nd. Car was travelling approximately 150 mph when it lost control. Sadly, 2 people were killed, the passenger being Corey Rudl, one of the best internet marketers in the world. The driver was also well known and liked among Porsche enthusiasts. Both will be missed.


No separation, even at a buck fifty.

I'm thinking the concrete pole hit right over Paul's right shoulder and just sheered/ripped the car in two.

I don't think it would do that at 45mph.

Buuuut, I could be totally full of shit and wrong, so take it with a big grain of salt.





I'm going with you not being full of shit
Link Posted: 12/2/2013 6:45:24 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By realwar:


Yea I just cant see a pro race car driver losing this car at 45mph, just no way. If they did they would have just hit the curb and lost maybe a rim or two.
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Originally Posted By realwar:
Originally Posted By TxRabbitBane:
Originally Posted By Dan_Gray:
Originally Posted By 4thbreak:
I just saw on TMZ that they were doing 45mph, the tree was actually doing 65mph, so a total impact mph of +/- 110mph. Nearby surveillance photos show them street racing the tree before ultimately peaking out at 45mph(rev limiter) and losing the race. According to TMZ, a CGT is designed to break away in high impact crashes(30+mph) and launch random parts 50+ feet away, so the story makes sense.






The combined impact speed is a myth.



45? Cops interviewed on TV a couple hours ago were estimating 90ish...


Yea I just cant see a pro race car driver losing this car at 45mph, just no way. If they did they would have just hit the curb and lost maybe a rim or two.


Best post so far.
Link Posted: 12/2/2013 6:49:52 PM EDT
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By cyborg543:



Well, the basic underlying theme of this thread is that those were not doing anything wrong at all.

Not speeding even the teeny tiniest little bit.

Sure you and I would be driving our commuter cars thru there at 60, but the two dead guys absolutely positive did not.


Probably the garbage man drives his truck thru there at 60.

Sure, it's no big deal at all. People drive faster than the limit all the time. There are plenty of roads that are posted 45 and people drive 60 on them.

But those two race drivers suddenly turned into complete nerds and let that awesome car burble along at 45. Because they have to be completely innocent.

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Originally Posted By cyborg543:
Originally Posted By Aimless:
So they were putting along at the speed limit when the race car spontaneously combusted and fell apart?



Well, the basic underlying theme of this thread is that those were not doing anything wrong at all.

Not speeding even the teeny tiniest little bit.

Sure you and I would be driving our commuter cars thru there at 60, but the two dead guys absolutely positive did not.


Probably the garbage man drives his truck thru there at 60.

Sure, it's no big deal at all. People drive faster than the limit all the time. There are plenty of roads that are posted 45 and people drive 60 on them.

But those two race drivers suddenly turned into complete nerds and let that awesome car burble along at 45. Because they have to be completely innocent.



Who said they weren't doing anything wrong? Have you never done anything stupid? Only people I know that hasn't done something that could have killed them are fucking pussies.

I've done hundreds of things that should have killed be. The difference between me, and them is that it wasn't my time to die.

Link Posted: 12/2/2013 6:50:52 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By sloppyjoe:



I'm going with you not being full of shit
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Originally Posted By sloppyjoe:
Originally Posted By RarestRX:
Here's a pic off of Wrecked Exotics:

http://www.wreckedexotics.com/carreragt/carreragt_20060402_002.jpg


This happened after a light rain, this guy turned left on the road going at least 90mph and just lost it, the car spun out, (rear end) took out about 35 feet of a cinder block wall, then spun & hit the wall again with the front end, one of the wheels flew across the street into a neighborhood, the guy came out with one little scratch


No separation.

http://www.wreckedexotics.com/carreragt/carreragt_20050602_004.jpg

Crashed into a retaining wall at California Speedway on June 2nd. Car was travelling approximately 150 mph when it lost control. Sadly, 2 people were killed, the passenger being Corey Rudl, one of the best internet marketers in the world. The driver was also well known and liked among Porsche enthusiasts. Both will be missed.


No separation, even at a buck fifty.

I'm thinking the concrete pole hit right over Paul's right shoulder and just sheered/ripped the car in two.

I don't think it would do that at 45mph.

Buuuut, I could be totally full of shit and wrong, so take it with a big grain of salt.





I'm going with you not being full of shit


I'm just speculating. Here's a couple other pics on Wrecked Exotics of a planned separation:







You can see the roof is still on and passenger compartment is still in one piece.

If you look at the Walker wreck pics, the roof is gone and the passenger cell is completely shattered.

I still think they were going pretty fast, which again, is an indictment against the driver, not the passenger.
Link Posted: 12/2/2013 6:56:40 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By JAMES77257:


Who said they weren't doing anything wrong? Have you never done anything stupid? Only people I know that hasn't done something that could have killed them are fucking pussies.

I've done hundreds of things that should have killed be. The difference between me, and them is that it wasn't my time to die.

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Originally Posted By JAMES77257:
Originally Posted By cyborg543:
Originally Posted By Aimless:
So they were putting along at the speed limit when the race car spontaneously combusted and fell apart?



Well, the basic underlying theme of this thread is that those were not doing anything wrong at all.

Not speeding even the teeny tiniest little bit.

Sure you and I would be driving our commuter cars thru there at 60, but the two dead guys absolutely positive did not.


Probably the garbage man drives his truck thru there at 60.

Sure, it's no big deal at all. People drive faster than the limit all the time. There are plenty of roads that are posted 45 and people drive 60 on them.

But those two race drivers suddenly turned into complete nerds and let that awesome car burble along at 45. Because they have to be completely innocent.



Who said they weren't doing anything wrong? Have you never done anything stupid? Only people I know that hasn't done something that could have killed them are fucking pussies.

I've done hundreds of things that should have killed be. The difference between me, and them is that it wasn't my time to die.




Yup. I've rode and owned 200+hp bikes and raced amateur 1000cc super bikes. Crashed at 100+ mph and been side swiped by a car and slammed into a wall at 60.

I was able to sleep in my own bed each night. I've don't lots of really really dangerous and dumb stuff. Some my fault and some not. But I was just lucky. These guys,whatever caused the accident, were not lucky that day.
Link Posted: 12/2/2013 6:57:16 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By Dan_Gray:

It's more than what I'd expect to see, BUT, in the aforementioned wrecks I've worked, I have to say that I have seen a LOT of odd shit. From trucks that were driven up to the wrecker in which both occupants died, to mini SUVs crushed so bad that no one checked for living occupants and the person inside had a few scratches and nothing else. I watched a guy die after a ten mph impact, and I've seen damn near ok after 85mph ejections. You really just never know. I'm not saying that the car was doing 45, I'm just saying that my experienced gut says it's possible.
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Originally Posted By Dan_Gray:
Originally Posted By TheGunCollector:
I'm amazed at the destruction, death and damage if that car impacted at 45mph.

It's more than what I'd expect to see, BUT, in the aforementioned wrecks I've worked, I have to say that I have seen a LOT of odd shit. From trucks that were driven up to the wrecker in which both occupants died, to mini SUVs crushed so bad that no one checked for living occupants and the person inside had a few scratches and nothing else. I watched a guy die after a ten mph impact, and I've seen damn near ok after 85mph ejections. You really just never know. I'm not saying that the car was doing 45, I'm just saying that my experienced gut says it's possible.



Sure, anything is possible.

But this thread is goofy, it has an agenda that supersedes fact and logic.

I'll bet that Porsche is going to weigh in on the physics of the suspiciously street legal 45 mph verdict on this incident.

Because if a 45 mph crash will absolutely grenade one of their cars, their sales will suffer.


Link Posted: 12/2/2013 6:57:58 PM EDT
WHO???
Link Posted: 12/2/2013 6:59:49 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/2/2013 7:01:42 PM EDT by sloppyjoe]
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Originally Posted By RarestRX:


I'm just speculating. Here's a couple other pics on Wrecked Exotics of a planned separation:

http://www.wreckedexotics.com/carreragt/carreragt_20050115_001.jpg

http://www.wreckedexotics.com/carreragt/carreragt_20050115_003.jpg

http://www.wreckedexotics.com/carreragt/carreragt_20050115_002.jpg

You can see the roof is still on and passenger compartment is still in one piece.

If you look at the Walker wreck pics, the roof is gone and the passenger cell is completely shattered.

I still think they were going pretty fast, which again, is an indictment against the driver, not the passenger.
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Originally Posted By RarestRX:
Originally Posted By sloppyjoe:
Originally Posted By RarestRX:
Here's a pic off of Wrecked Exotics:

http://www.wreckedexotics.com/carreragt/carreragt_20060402_002.jpg


This happened after a light rain, this guy turned left on the road going at least 90mph and just lost it, the car spun out, (rear end) took out about 35 feet of a cinder block wall, then spun & hit the wall again with the front end, one of the wheels flew across the street into a neighborhood, the guy came out with one little scratch


No separation.

http://www.wreckedexotics.com/carreragt/carreragt_20050602_004.jpg

Crashed into a retaining wall at California Speedway on June 2nd. Car was travelling approximately 150 mph when it lost control. Sadly, 2 people were killed, the passenger being Corey Rudl, one of the best internet marketers in the world. The driver was also well known and liked among Porsche enthusiasts. Both will be missed.


No separation, even at a buck fifty.

I'm thinking the concrete pole hit right over Paul's right shoulder and just sheered/ripped the car in two.

I don't think it would do that at 45mph.

Buuuut, I could be totally full of shit and wrong, so take it with a big grain of salt.





I'm going with you not being full of shit


I'm just speculating. Here's a couple other pics on Wrecked Exotics of a planned separation:

http://www.wreckedexotics.com/carreragt/carreragt_20050115_001.jpg

http://www.wreckedexotics.com/carreragt/carreragt_20050115_003.jpg

http://www.wreckedexotics.com/carreragt/carreragt_20050115_002.jpg

You can see the roof is still on and passenger compartment is still in one piece.

If you look at the Walker wreck pics, the roof is gone and the passenger cell is completely shattered.

I still think they were going pretty fast, which again, is an indictment against the driver, not the passenger.



You are aware that car had a removable top?

If he top is off it can effect structural integrity somewhat. But also that car pictured was not on fire.

Fire will do a lot to make CF look like a melted mangled mess.
Link Posted: 12/2/2013 7:00:12 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By cyborg543:



Sure, anything is possible.

But this thread is goofy, it has an agenda that supersedes fact and logic.

I'll bet that Porsche is going to weigh in on the physics of the suspiciously street legal 45 mph verdict on this incident.

Because if a 45 mph crash will absolutely grenade one of their cars, their sales will suffer.


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Originally Posted By cyborg543:
Originally Posted By Dan_Gray:
Originally Posted By TheGunCollector:
I'm amazed at the destruction, death and damage if that car impacted at 45mph.

It's more than what I'd expect to see, BUT, in the aforementioned wrecks I've worked, I have to say that I have seen a LOT of odd shit. From trucks that were driven up to the wrecker in which both occupants died, to mini SUVs crushed so bad that no one checked for living occupants and the person inside had a few scratches and nothing else. I watched a guy die after a ten mph impact, and I've seen damn near ok after 85mph ejections. You really just never know. I'm not saying that the car was doing 45, I'm just saying that my experienced gut says it's possible.



Sure, anything is possible.

But this thread is goofy, it has an agenda that supersedes fact and logic.

I'll bet that Porsche is going to weigh in on the physics of the suspiciously street legal 45 mph verdict on this incident.

Because if a 45 mph crash will absolutely grenade one of their cars, their sales will suffer.



The only agenda anyone has here is to blame the passenger.
Link Posted: 12/2/2013 7:02:42 PM EDT
I know it's been said in one form or another, but just to recap after all the shenanigans... The Carrera GT is not your average supercar.

Walter Rohrl, a world rally champion who set the Pike's Peak record back when there was more gravel and an experienced Porsche test driver described it at "the first car in my life that I drive and I feel scared".

Jay Leno lost his ass in one. Jay Leno's Garage

Former Stig Ben Collins spent a morning practicing how to drive it on the Top Gear track He said it's "the first and only car to bite me three times in the same corner and make me feel like a novice. Spun out thrice at the Hammerhead as the V10 just exploded with power over the bumps - it was love at first sight. Once you survive the first lap and work it out.. just so much fun."

Link Posted: 12/2/2013 7:05:09 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By sloppyjoe:



Yup. I've rode and owned 200+hp bikes and raced amateur 1000cc super bikes. Crashed at 100+ mph and been side swiped by a car and slammed into a wall at 60.

I was able to sleep in my own bed each night. I've don't lots of really really dangerous and dumb stuff. Some my fault and some not. But I was just lucky. These guys,whatever caused the accident, were not lucky that day.
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Originally Posted By sloppyjoe:
Originally Posted By JAMES77257:
Originally Posted By cyborg543:
Originally Posted By Aimless:
So they were putting along at the speed limit when the race car spontaneously combusted and fell apart?



Well, the basic underlying theme of this thread is that those were not doing anything wrong at all.

Not speeding even the teeny tiniest little bit.

Sure you and I would be driving our commuter cars thru there at 60, but the two dead guys absolutely positive did not.


Probably the garbage man drives his truck thru there at 60.

Sure, it's no big deal at all. People drive faster than the limit all the time. There are plenty of roads that are posted 45 and people drive 60 on them.

But those two race drivers suddenly turned into complete nerds and let that awesome car burble along at 45. Because they have to be completely innocent.



Who said they weren't doing anything wrong? Have you never done anything stupid? Only people I know that hasn't done something that could have killed them are fucking pussies.

I've done hundreds of things that should have killed be. The difference between me, and them is that it wasn't my time to die.




Yup. I've rode and owned 200+hp bikes and raced amateur 1000cc super bikes. Crashed at 100+ mph and been side swiped by a car and slammed into a wall at 60.

I was able to sleep in my own bed each night. I've don't lots of really really dangerous and dumb stuff. Some my fault and some not. But I was just lucky. These guys,whatever caused the accident, were not lucky that day.




the stubborn belligerence of this thread is impenetrable

to the point of being really odd
Link Posted: 12/2/2013 7:07:09 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By Bassgasm:
I know it's been said in one form or another, but just to recap after all the shenanigans... The Carrera GT is not your average supercar.

Walter Rohrl, a world rally champion who set the Pike's Peak record back when there was more gravel and an experienced Porsche test driver described it at "the first car in my life that I drive and I feel scared".

Jay Leno lost his ass in one. Jay Leno's Garage

Former Stig Ben Collins spent a morning practicing how to drive it on the Top Gear track He said it's "the first and only car to bite me three times in the same corner and make me feel like a novice. Spun out thrice at the Hammerhead as the V10 just exploded with power over the bumps - it was love at first sight. Once you survive the first lap and work it out.. just so much fun."

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vE_WqdKbTvY&noredirect=1
View Quote




Exactly this


A local gent has one and I asked him about it. "terrifying" was his response. Not the typical car and easy to get your ass bit by it
Link Posted: 12/2/2013 7:07:49 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/2/2013 7:08:33 PM EDT by JAMES77257]
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Originally Posted By cyborg543:




the stubborn belligerence of this thread is impenetrable

to the point of being really odd
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Originally Posted By cyborg543:
Originally Posted By sloppyjoe:
Originally Posted By JAMES77257:
Originally Posted By cyborg543:
Originally Posted By Aimless:
So they were putting along at the speed limit when the race car spontaneously combusted and fell apart?



Well, the basic underlying theme of this thread is that those were not doing anything wrong at all.

Not speeding even the teeny tiniest little bit.

Sure you and I would be driving our commuter cars thru there at 60, but the two dead guys absolutely positive did not.


Probably the garbage man drives his truck thru there at 60.

Sure, it's no big deal at all. People drive faster than the limit all the time. There are plenty of roads that are posted 45 and people drive 60 on them.

But those two race drivers suddenly turned into complete nerds and let that awesome car burble along at 45. Because they have to be completely innocent.



Who said they weren't doing anything wrong? Have you never done anything stupid? Only people I know that hasn't done something that could have killed them are fucking pussies.

I've done hundreds of things that should have killed be. The difference between me, and them is that it wasn't my time to die.




Yup. I've rode and owned 200+hp bikes and raced amateur 1000cc super bikes. Crashed at 100+ mph and been side swiped by a car and slammed into a wall at 60.

I was able to sleep in my own bed each night. I've don't lots of really really dangerous and dumb stuff. Some my fault and some not. But I was just lucky. These guys,whatever caused the accident, were not lucky that day.




the stubborn belligerence of this thread is impenetrable

to the point of being really odd


Irony.
Link Posted: 12/2/2013 7:08:06 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By sloppyjoe:

You are aware that car had a removable top?

If he top is off it can effect structural integrity somewhat. But also that car pictured was not on fire.

Fire will do a lot to make CF look like a melted mangled mess.
View Quote


Yes, I am aware:





If you look at the pics of that black one, you can actually see the fuel tank.

The problem is that the rebar reinforced concrete pole hit right at the firewall, not far enough back to allow for a planned separation, and it ruptured the tank.

It's a fucked up situation to be sure.
Link Posted: 12/2/2013 7:09:54 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By JAMES77257:
Irony.
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Yep, he's fighting harder than anyone here. It's obviously an emotional thing for him at this point.
Link Posted: 12/2/2013 7:10:49 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By Dan_Gray:

I've been on the scene of a few accidents through the years. It's probably almost 1000. It could be more, some days I'm at 3 or more. Some days none, I guess it evens out. Either way, I like to think I know a little something about them. Just a little, MAYBE even a little more than a layman. Just maybe.

The difference between leaking before and after from a moving car is blatant.
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Originally Posted By Dan_Gray:
Originally Posted By AKengineer:
Originally Posted By Dan_Gray:

Witness reports discussed a few pages back that it was leaking fluids. All the info combined paints a realistic picture.
It for sure left fluids all over the place after it hit. Granted I've never had a Carrera GT but most Porches have the fluids in the rear. The front is a trunk of sorts.

I've been on the scene of a few accidents through the years. It's probably almost 1000. It could be more, some days I'm at 3 or more. Some days none, I guess it evens out. Either way, I like to think I know a little something about them. Just a little, MAYBE even a little more than a layman. Just maybe.

The difference between leaking before and after from a moving car is blatant.
Sure. I just don't see any way a Porsche could leak enough fluid to lose enough contact patch to lose control. In other words I'm not buying the leaky fluid theory one bit.
Link Posted: 12/2/2013 7:13:15 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By AKengineer:
Sure. I just don't see any way a Porsche could leak enough fluid to lose enough contact patch to lose control. In other words I'm not buying the leaky fluid theory one bit.
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Originally Posted By AKengineer:
Originally Posted By Dan_Gray:
Originally Posted By AKengineer:
Originally Posted By Dan_Gray:

Witness reports discussed a few pages back that it was leaking fluids. All the info combined paints a realistic picture.
It for sure left fluids all over the place after it hit. Granted I've never had a Carrera GT but most Porches have the fluids in the rear. The front is a trunk of sorts.

I've been on the scene of a few accidents through the years. It's probably almost 1000. It could be more, some days I'm at 3 or more. Some days none, I guess it evens out. Either way, I like to think I know a little something about them. Just a little, MAYBE even a little more than a layman. Just maybe.

The difference between leaking before and after from a moving car is blatant.
Sure. I just don't see any way a Porsche could leak enough fluid to lose enough contact patch to lose control. In other words I'm not buying the leaky fluid theory one bit.

You're assuming it had to mess with the traction. That's just simply not the case, nor did I imply it.
Link Posted: 12/2/2013 7:15:40 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By Dan_Gray:

Yep, he's fighting harder than anyone here. It's obviously an emotional thing for him at this point.
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Originally Posted By Dan_Gray:
Originally Posted By JAMES77257:
Irony.

Yep, he's fighting harder than anyone here. It's obviously an emotional thing for him at this point.





okey dokey


Link Posted: 12/2/2013 7:17:46 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By cyborg543:





okey dokey


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Originally Posted By cyborg543:
Originally Posted By Dan_Gray:
Originally Posted By JAMES77257:
Irony.

Yep, he's fighting harder than anyone here. It's obviously an emotional thing for him at this point.





okey dokey



Don't like the truth? You could leave the thread, but that would take away your opportunity to jump up and down like a drunk circus monkey screaming about how you don't like his movies or him and blame all the world's issues on him.
Link Posted: 12/2/2013 7:20:11 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/2/2013 7:32:58 PM EDT by CoreyR]
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Originally Posted By fiver:
This thread is the best thing on the entire fucking internet. I can't stop touching and playing with my blood engorged penis. God damn I love this shit.
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Why do people insist on shitting all over this thread, sure the guy might have been doing something stupid when he died but does that call for things like this? We all know you're not actually touching your flaccid dick and are just going for cool points, congratulations you've got them.
Link Posted: 12/2/2013 7:24:14 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By cyborg543:

the stubborn belligerence of this thread is impenetrable

to the point of being really odd
View Quote


There seems to be some sort of strange emotional investment on the part of some posters and that car was moving along well in excess of 45mph.
Link Posted: 12/2/2013 7:27:30 PM EDT
Welcome back fiver.
Link Posted: 12/2/2013 7:29:18 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By MikeS369:


There seems to be some sort of strange emotional investment on the part of some posters and that car was moving along well in excess of 45mph.
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Originally Posted By MikeS369:
Originally Posted By cyborg543:

the stubborn belligerence of this thread is impenetrable

to the point of being really odd


There seems to be some sort of strange emotional investment on the part of some posters and that car was moving along well in excess of 45mph.


I'm not emotionally invested, I just can't believe that hitting that pole and tree at 45 would explode the car like that.

*shrug*

Like I said, I could be wrong!
Link Posted: 12/2/2013 7:39:39 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By RarestRX:


Yes, I am aware:

http://www.eonline.com/eol_images/Entire_Site/2013111/rs_1024x759-131201101707-1024.Paul-Walker-Photograph-Carrera-GT-Death.jl.120113.jpg



If you look at the pics of that black one, you can actually see the fuel tank.

The problem is that the rebar reinforced concrete pole hit right at the firewall, not far enough back to allow for a planned separation, and it ruptured the tank.

It's a fucked up situation to be sure.
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Originally Posted By RarestRX:
Originally Posted By sloppyjoe:

You are aware that car had a removable top?

If he top is off it can effect structural integrity somewhat. But also that car pictured was not on fire.

Fire will do a lot to make CF look like a melted mangled mess.


Yes, I am aware:

http://www.eonline.com/eol_images/Entire_Site/2013111/rs_1024x759-131201101707-1024.Paul-Walker-Photograph-Carrera-GT-Death.jl.120113.jpg



If you look at the pics of that black one, you can actually see the fuel tank.

The problem is that the rebar reinforced concrete pole hit right at the firewall, not far enough back to allow for a planned separation, and it ruptured the tank.

It's a fucked up situation to be sure.


I think your correct. They hit a concrete pole with a composite car in just the right spot as to cause total carnage in the form of a burst fuel cell or any combinationof fluids catching fire. The passenger compartment probably looked much better before it burned away.
Link Posted: 12/2/2013 7:57:07 PM EDT
TMZ reports he was doing 45 in a 15 and you guys just accept that?

Bullshit. He hit a 45 mph sign while in the "15 mph zone".

No way that car was going 45. I'm still going with the 100+ mph the damage shows instead tmz's "inside information."
Link Posted: 12/2/2013 8:00:46 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By RarestRX:


I'm not emotionally invested, I just can't believe that hitting that pole and tree at 45 would explode the car like that.

*shrug*

Like I said, I could be wrong!
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Originally Posted By RarestRX:
Originally Posted By MikeS369:
Originally Posted By cyborg543:

the stubborn belligerence of this thread is impenetrable

to the point of being really odd


There seems to be some sort of strange emotional investment on the part of some posters and that car was moving along well in excess of 45mph.


I'm not emotionally invested, I just can't believe that hitting that pole and tree at 45 would explode the car like that.

*shrug*

Like I said, I could be wrong!


I wasn't talking about you. And like I said, that car was moving well over 45mph.
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