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1/25/2018 7:38:29 AM
Posted: 8/26/2001 6:04:58 PM EST
I was at the Indy 1500 gun show this weekend and saw a new M1A (the black "plastic" one, not the wood one). It was love at first sight. But I have some questions... The one I saw had a funky scope mount attached to the side with a single screw. It wobbled badly. The guy said that the newer mounts have two screws, but there is only one screw hole. Where does the other screw screw into? Is it solid? (I'm used to the rock solid rail on the AR15 of course). I forget the exact price, but I think it was around $1100. Am I better off with another weapon in 308? Is there an "obviously" better choice compared to the M1A, like the AR10, the CETME, etc? Are these things close in accuracy to a bolt action? How bad is the recoil? Is it easy to place follow up shots? Should I consider the Scout (which I also saw at the show) since it has the builtin rail? The rail was pretty far forward though.
Link Posted: 8/26/2001 6:12:22 PM EST
Link Posted: 8/26/2001 6:20:36 PM EST
[Last Edit: 8/26/2001 6:21:28 PM EST by The_Beer_Slayer]
Link Posted: 8/26/2001 7:00:16 PM EST
I've had one for years and it may be the best shooting gun I have. I've put thousands of rounds of all types of ammo and never had a single jam or misfire and everyone who has shot it has raved about how well it shoots. I have heard rumors about the quality of the newer SA M1A's going down hill but cannot confirm this. It is heavy but balanced well. Handle one and decide yourself. Mike, you are treading on thin ice!!!
Link Posted: 8/26/2001 7:18:11 PM EST
Link Posted: 8/26/2001 7:22:35 PM EST
Originally Posted By The_Beer_Slayer: I couldn't hit shit with it. mike
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Another plus of the M1A...can actually be used as a club without damaging the gun if you are not that good a shot with it!
Link Posted: 8/26/2001 7:30:42 PM EST
I`m thinking about the M1a and/or Garand. Must be all the WWII shows on the history channel.[:)] As for a choice between a Cetme or a M1a,definitely buy American.IMHO. Compared to the AR-10, it`s a toss up. More like which one you want to get first?
Link Posted: 8/26/2001 7:32:22 PM EST
Peter I just got me a new M1A. Springfield armory has a special on right now if you buy an M1A you get a Springfield 6x40 rangefinding scope and the third generation scope mount for 99.99. If you buy it through the Davidsons web locator you will also get a coupon worth 50.00 in Springfield bucks. Springfield also has the loaded package that is a national match barrel, sight and trigger group included and a coupon for some Springfield goodies at a greatly reduced price. Check out all the details at the Springfield armory web site. I love shooting my AR-15 and shoot it about twice as much but the M1a is great. And if you are looking at shooting at long distances the M1A is the tool for the job. The navy seals agree. If you need some ammo check out AIM. The South African .308 ammo is good ammo at a reasonable price. A good place to get magazines is Cole dist..
Link Posted: 8/26/2001 7:32:59 PM EST
They are very nice guns, well-balanced and ergonomic, with the best iron sights of any battle rifle. But they just weren't for me. Had one and wound up selling it. Too complicated to disassemble, didn't like the lack of a slide release catch and didn't like the Garand-like safety. Personally I think for the money you are better off buying a FAL variant. Mags are much cheaper too.
Link Posted: 8/26/2001 7:37:37 PM EST
I traded my Bushy on an M1A exactly like the one you describe. Get it! The scope mount that was on the one you handled may have been a B-square, or some other equally worthless POS. The Springfield mount is good and solid, as is the ARMS #18, but the #18 gives no lee-way as to ring placement. Recoil isn't all that bad, even with a steel buttplate, and I'm a skinny guy with little built-in padding. Accuracy? With iron sights, it's possible to hit a 2-liter coke bottle at 300yds. I don't like the scout rifle just because the forward mount screams "sales Gimmick" (at least to me it does), and what good is a LER scope on a rifle which is at it's best at long range, anyway? Go with bone-stock, and tweak it as you go.
Link Posted: 8/26/2001 9:06:07 PM EST
[Last Edit: 8/27/2001 6:07:36 PM EST by ACK]
Sir, the new Springfield scope mount, the Smith, Brookfield and ARMS use two screws for attachment. One bolt attaches to the side of the receiver. The loading clip is replaced from the receiver by an adapter plate. It is to this plate that the second screw mounts. In addition there is a set screw that reduces any "cantilever" motion on the mount. Do not even think of B-Square. Except for the Springfield the mentioned mounts are made of steel. Steel is the best option. I have a walnut-stainless steel loaded model. I replaced the walnut stock (too pretty for playing) with a GI fiberglass stock. With the proper ammunition, conditions (weather and shooter) it will do 1 to 1.5 groups. Once it heats up the group will open up a tad. AR10 is probably more accurate but probably less reliable (not GI proof) and expensive magazines (M1A are around $35, not cheap). The CETME/HK91 is a heavy beast with horrible trigger pull, stamped receiver and mediocre sights (compared to the M1A). Parts, unless part of a kit are hard to come by. A German HK91 has great accuracy potential but a terrible trigger pull. FAL would be a good choice. Parts are available. cast or forged receiver, magazines <$10 excellent ergonomics (breaks down similar to an AR15)ok sights. Accuracy is less than an M1A but for half the cost can't complain. The black plastic stock from Springfield (I was informed) is nothing more than a painted GI stock that chips easily. A few years ago I spent two weeks visiting my inlaws (FL). Once we got home I went out and bought the rifle. "I served my time, paid my dues" not a comment from my wife. Regards ACK
Link Posted: 8/26/2001 9:33:24 PM EST
ACK, you're right about the M1As' synthetic stock. All it is, is a used (obviously) GI fiberglass stock that has been painted with that "crinkle" finish paint. I redid mine with Brown camo paint, and it looks nice, although a little on the dark side. I'm waiting for my 6x40mm scope and the mount to arrive, but I may get an ARMS #18 later on. Springfield seems to be a little slow shipping any orders involving their scope promotion; I may end up calling them to light a fire under 'em.
Link Posted: 8/27/2001 6:17:36 PM EST
Mr. MelonPopper: In my M1A I initially installed a Simmons AETEC. Didn't last very long, once it returned from the factory it was installed on a .22 Current scope is a TASCO SUPER SNIPER (dumb name) the scope is pretty rugged. I read a review wher some individuals have installed it (and survived) in a Barrett .50 It is a 10x42 with rear parallax adjustment (side adjust are a tad fragile) and a mil-dot reticle. I can play "tactical shooter" (just kidding) The 42mm objective allows me to mount the scope low in the receiver but a stock riser would be even nicer. My scope mount is from Entreprise. Weights a ton but it is solid. Regards ACK By the way what kind of paint did you use in your stock? How do you keep it from getting damaged by cleaning fluids?
Link Posted: 8/27/2001 6:41:15 PM EST
Pete- Depends on what you want to use it for.. Keep it light if you're actually going to carry it.. I've see a few "Walter Mitty" M1A's that probably outweighed a 1918 BAR, with all the junk attached to em..If you don't need to carry it, I know where there is one that looks like someone wanted a SAW instead of a M1A.. Seriously though, they're a decent rifle.. And it's a matter of what You want .. Have fun. Meplat.
Link Posted: 8/27/2001 7:13:27 PM EST
ACK, I used Rustoleum camo spray paint on the stock (it held up well on my Blazer & Jeep), which I got at Home Depot. I really couldn't say about how resistant it is to anything but Hoppes, which doesn't seem to affect it much at all. I may go ahead and get the Enterprise mount, as I've bought fromthem before, and I know thier stuff is good. Thanks, I hadn't even thought of them.
Link Posted: 8/27/2001 7:25:20 PM EST
Melon popper you are right about SA being slow in delivering the scopes. SA advised me today that they are out of the 6X40 but will have them back in stock in a couple of weeks. If enough of us give them #$%^ they may upgrade us to a better scope. Ya right.
Link Posted: 8/27/2001 7:38:53 PM EST
Thanks for the heads up! I think I'll call those schmucks tomorrow and tell them to ship me the mount, anyway. Why'd those sh*theads want my phone number if they aren't going to use it to notify me of this kind of thing? Oh, I can hardly wait for them to answer the phone.......if they balk at shipping the mount, I'll just ask 'em to send me back my money order. With any luck, it's already been deposited.
Link Posted: 8/28/2001 11:11:45 AM EST
I had a few M1As. Now I have one just because. They were replaced with ARs from Armalite and FALs from DSA. The M14 is perhaps the best looking rifle of all time, in my opinion, though.
Link Posted: 8/28/2001 2:08:44 PM EST
[b]Don't buy an M1A M14 unless your are nostalgic![/b] Actually, I had an M1A, with a Kreiger 1-10, custom built-up by Clint Fowler in Virginia. It was a nice rifle - for awhile. In the book, "The Competitive AR15", author Glen Zediker called it best when he said the the M14 accuracy was "here today, somewhere else tomorrow." :) Unfortunately the M14 does not stay tuned w/o the services of a gunsmith. The reason the USMC pioneered the double-lugged receiver was to improve stability, and make the bedding last longer. Even so, the M14's need rebedding every so often, and the gas system is finicky. When my accuracy began wandering with my M14, I came to the conclusion that I either needed to send it *back out for rebeding and retuning* or [i]step up to a gas gun recoil system that required less tuning, and stayed put.[/i] Thus my move to the AR10. Whether I stay with the AR10 or go with an H&K, the one thing I would never do is go back to a weapon that uses a gas piston and operating rod!
Link Posted: 8/28/2001 2:37:13 PM EST
wobblin-Goblin are the DSA FAl as good as everyone says? Are they accurate,reliable and have low recoil compared to the M1a. I think a type one may be my next toy.
Link Posted: 8/28/2001 2:59:46 PM EST
I bought a standard M1A with the Walnut stock a few months ago and I really like it. I don't have it glass bedded or any of that crap. I only have the normal "standard" model. I've never cared about how tight of a group that I could shoot (as I consider such things to be useless IRL). I just like to shoot things and make the gun go bang. :) I ordered a bipod + the 6x40 scope. I have received all of them. They were a little slow sending me my Tanto knife, but I got it eventually. You can buy used GI synthetic stocks from Fred's for about 25 bucks apiece. I bought two (2) of them and they look pretty good. They aren't pretty but they will probably last forever. If I want the gun to look good, then I just switch back over to the wooden stock which looks fantastic (this takes about a minute tops). Its a nice set up. I plan to get an AR-10 next. I never wanted a FAL so I don't have one. The FAL is supposedly so much faster to take down than the M1A, but I can take the M1A apart in a matter of seconds so that big advantage of the FAL is just someobody who is reaching for straws IMHO. -SS
Link Posted: 8/28/2001 3:07:24 PM EST
Link Posted: 8/28/2001 3:36:35 PM EST
Originally Posted By crowboy: You are certainly entitled to your opinion ,But what you and Mr. Zediker don't seem to understand is that the M14 was not developed to shoot MOA, it was developed to kill people and that it does very well. Crowboy
View Quote
No argument here. However, can you name any U.S. [i]battle rifle[/i] ever "developed" to be an MOA gun? No! But Springfield Armory sells National Trash rifles and ppl buy them expecting performance. Performance that won't be there in a suprisingly short time. Whenever anyone gets excited about an M1A, they deserve to be told it's going to need tuning. Just like reminding a guy that that breaker-point, solid lifter big-block '70 Chevelle he's got his eye on is gonna need frequent tune-ups also!
Link Posted: 8/28/2001 4:52:33 PM EST
I think the M1A is a great gun, but I get better accuracy out of my .308 Enfield. It is not worth the price they are going for currently, IMHO.
Link Posted: 8/28/2001 5:09:30 PM EST
SouthernShark... since you can disassemble your M1A so darn fast, perhaps you can enlighten me on how the F*ck that damn operating rod is supposed to come off!!!!!!!! I'm so fed up, I think I'll shoot it off with my ar! And yes, I know "technically" how it is supposed to work, but it doesn't!
Link Posted: 8/28/2001 5:11:20 PM EST
I tried an L1A1, STG58C and an M1A side by side. I liked the L1A1, but the M1A was my favorite by far. Accurate as hell. I felt like the recoil of the M1A feels like more of a push compared to the FAL's sharper snap. Could be do to the muzzle brake on the FAls. I sold my STG58C and orderd an M1A. Get the fiberglass model. I ordered the blued/walnut Loaded model because I really like the look of a wood stock. Well, I went to the shop last week to take a look (MD=7day wait) and IMO the wood looks pretty bad on mine. I'm really bummed out too because I paid a lot more for the walnut stock. Later I saw Fred's advertisement in Shotgun news. I don't know what happened to the great looking stocks I'm used to seeing on just about every other Springfield M1A, but mine doesn't even come close. I'm going to order a couple from Fred's and see if I can't refinish/paint them. Save the $200 and get the Fiberglass model (I sure wish I had). Then go to Fred's [url]http://www.shotgunnews.com/members/fred/pages/Fredspagesindex.html[/url] and get whatever stock you like. I saw a couple M1A's, loaded with fiberglass and blued finish for $999 at the Harrisburg gun show. Made me want to cry. I laid down $1350 + tax, transfer and shipping for mine. As for the M1A loosing accuracy, sounds like a problem with the stock changing the POI due to climatic changes. The Fiberglass stock is supposed to be the way to go for accuracy. Luke
Link Posted: 8/28/2001 6:13:41 PM EST
Well, I called SA today, and they told me the scopes were in, and that mine (and hopefully Shooter505s' and everybody elses' who ordered one), should be shipped out this week. Personally, I mainly wanted the mount, with the scope to be used to offset some of the the cost of the 4.5-14x56mm scope (which I will hopefully locate at the gunshow the 15th). Scipio, just by looking at the thing, I've decided not to f*ck with the op-rod until I HAVE to! That damn handguard also seems to require 3 hands to reinstall after you get it off, too. Oh well....the price we pay.......
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