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Posted: 10/4/2005 8:32:28 AM EDT

I'm on Chicago SWAT and we're in the middle of some changes. Uniform style/color is a big sticking point. We curse the current all black tactical as it cooks us in the sun. Also our all black outfits actually stand out as we move under our street lights and against the background of our concrete jungle. Some of us have a few OD green add-ons and the blend is nice. We may get OD Green flight suits.
Can anyone out there in the forum direct me to an article or study that shows OD Green as the better color/pattern to use. Thank You.

Posted: 10/4/2005 8:42:46 AM EDT

[#1]

Well, black is a bad camo, period. Even at night. Olive drab at least blends in somewhat instead of look at me, look at me. Then again, you are in a city, where camo is a (mostly) moot point, its just about looking as intimidating as humanly possible, where someone sees you and thinks, "Oh hell no, he's gonna fuck me up, Ill just sit here and play good suspect and comply."

Again, its which thing your brass care about: Ability to camo, or ability to aid intimidation which allows a better chance of de-escalating a situation more effectively.

Posted: 10/4/2005 8:44:18 AM EDT

[#2]

You might check with Indianapolis SWAT. They use olive drab clothing during deployments.

Posted: 10/4/2005 8:47:51 AM EDT

[#3]

I would think grey bdu-s would be better than OD green in an urban area. I seem to remember references in this book about avoiding black uniforms: www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/1581600267/qid=1128444431/sr=8-3/ref=pd_bbs_3/102-8716473-9708918?v=glance&s=books&n=507846

Mainly I'm curious to see what others come up with here

Posted: 10/4/2005 8:49:41 AM EDT

[#4]

I don't understand why SWAT/cops wear black. At least a tan color would be nice. I know you all have got to be hot as hell with the black, body armor, and all the crap you gotta wear. I think they should issue you the new digital light colored city camo.

Posted: 10/4/2005 8:49:48 AM EDT

[#5]

tag

Posted: 10/4/2005 8:55:03 AM EDT

[#6]

Blue tiger stripes. If it's good enough for the Air Force....

ETA: Hi

Posted: 10/4/2005 8:55:35 AM EDT

[#7]

take a look at Major John Plaster’s "UltimateSniper".
they have a section on camo that might help.

Posted: 10/4/2005 9:01:00 AM EDT

[#8]

Quoted:
take a look at Major John Plaster’s "UltimateSniper".
they have a section on camo that might help.

Yeah, despite Maj Plaster's asshattedness, that book does have a decent, if not old, assesment of some common camo patterns. He supports the use of OD as a general purpose color. If I remember correctly, gray is too bright at night under NVGs. Nomex flight suits serve a purpose, but they are hot in the summer, and are no fun if you have to go greenside for very long.

Posted: 10/4/2005 9:12:00 AM EDT

[#9]

Gentlemen, Thank you all for the quick commments.
Looking forward to many more.

To Train or not to Train..... TRAIN

Posted: 10/4/2005 9:16:44 AM EDT

[#10]

Are you with Chicago PD or Cook County Sherrif's Police?

Posted: 10/4/2005 9:18:50 AM EDT

[#11]

whats wrong with a nice plad?

Posted: 10/4/2005 9:24:37 AM EDT

[#12]

Quoted:
Are you with Chicago PD or Cook County Sherrif's Police?

I'm with Chicago

Posted: 10/4/2005 9:26:48 AM EDT

[#13]

Quoted:
Quoted:
Are you with Chicago PD or Cook County Sherrif's Police?

I'm with Chicago

Oh cool. What's the name of you guys' tactical team again? If I remember right, it's kind of unique.

Posted: 10/4/2005 9:29:48 AM EDT

[#14]

It was HBT (Hostage, Barricade, Terrorist) but was changed this past summer to standardize...

Posted: 10/4/2005 9:32:57 AM EDT

[#15]

Quoted:
It was HBT (Hostage, Barricade, Terrorist) but was changed this past summer to standardize...

That's right. I remember it was somehthing odd like that.

Posted: 10/4/2005 9:37:41 AM EDT

[#16]

When we'd attend a conference or training guys would ask, whats HBT , and we'd reply we'll it's like SWAT. To which they said "Why not call it that then ?!"

Finaly some of the brass had enough and grabbed the reins ! Ya-Know

Posted: 10/4/2005 9:38:51 AM EDT

[#17]

Quoted:
It was HBT (Hostage, Barricade, Terrorist) but was changed this past summer to standardize...

Standardize?

That's another odd name for a swat team.

Posted: 10/4/2005 9:42:26 AM EDT

[#18]

Be the envy of every conference-->

www.actiongear.com/cgi-bin/tame.exe/agcatalog/level4s.tam?xax=21458&M5COPY%2Ectx=28392&M5%2Ectx=3666&M2%5FDESC%2Ectx=Adventure%20Ready%99%20%2D%20BDU%204%20Pocket%20Coats%20%26%202%20Pocket%20Shirts&level3%2Ectx=results%2Etam&query%2Ectx=tacpat&backto=

Posted: 10/4/2005 9:43:17 AM EDT

[#19]

I sent you an IM, sigbangin.

Posted: 10/4/2005 9:45:55 AM EDT

[#20]

May I suggest:

Posted: 10/4/2005 9:46:21 AM EDT

[#21]

Welcome to the site (from a downstater).

Oh, be sure to check out the Illinois Hometown Forum--up and to the right.

Posted: 10/4/2005 9:48:02 AM EDT

[#22]

Quoted:
Well, black is a bad camo, period. Even at night. Olive drab at least blends in somewhat instead of look at me, look at me. Then again, you are in a city, where camo is a (mostly) moot point, its just about looking as intimidating as humanly possible, where someone sees you and thinks, "Oh hell no, he's gonna fuck me up, Ill just sit here and play good suspect and comply."

Again, its which thing your brass care about: Ability to camo, or ability to aid intimidation which allows a better chance of de-escalating a situation more effectively.

Right on, like these guys:

Posted: 10/4/2005 9:48:59 AM EDT

[#23]

Quoted:
Be the envy of every conference--> www.actiongear.com/cgi-bin/tame.exe/agcatalog/level4s.tam?xax=21458&M5COPY%2Ectx=28392&M5%2Ectx=3666&M2%5FDESC%2Ectx=Adventure%20Ready%99%20%2D%20BDU%204%20Pocket%20Coats%20%26%202%20Pocket%20Shirts&level3%2Ectx=results%2Etam&query%2Ectx=tacpat&backto=

Man, that hat looks like something from "On Golden Pond".

Posted: 10/4/2005 9:52:14 AM EDT

[#24]

Quoted:
Quoted:
Well, black is a bad camo, period. Even at night. Olive drab at least blends in somewhat instead of look at me, look at me. Then again, you are in a city, where camo is a (mostly) moot point, its just about looking as intimidating as humanly possible, where someone sees you and thinks, "Oh hell no, he's gonna fuck me up, Ill just sit here and play good suspect and comply."

Again, its which thing your brass care about: Ability to camo, or ability to aid intimidation which allows a better chance of de-escalating a situation more effectively.

Right on, like these guys:

www.hkpro.com/image/actionsas1.jpg

www.hkpro.com/image/actionsassd.jpg

I think the SAS wear dark navy blue to their proms, but they're still scary as heck. Their gas masks don't make em look any friendlier either.

ETA: Check out that old SD in the bottom pic.

Posted: 10/4/2005 9:57:33 AM EDT

[#25]

All this talk about clothing being the real intimidator cracks me up.

Posted: 10/4/2005 9:59:36 AM EDT

[#26]

Quoted:
All this talk about clothing being the real intimidator cracks me up.

Yeah, I think the automatic weapons might play a part, too.

Posted: 10/4/2005 10:07:49 AM EDT

[#27]

Quoted:
Right on, like these guys:

www.hkpro.com/image/actionsassd.jpg

Not like those guys, "thems" are Martians

Posted: 10/4/2005 11:04:28 AM EDT

[#28]

Quoted:
I don't understand why SWAT/cops wear black. At least a tan color would be nice. I know you all have got to be hot as hell with the black, body armor, and all the crap you gotta wear. I think they should issue you the new digital light colored city camo.

As one cop in town told me, cops used to like black BDUs because they didn't have to be pressed/ironed all the time, and stayed cleaner-looking longer. (Not necessarily cleaner...

)

The local cops don't like them now, because even the statist libs around here complain that the black BDU-clad PD looks like a bunch of SS thugs.....

Posted: 10/4/2005 11:10:34 AM EDT

[#29]

How about blaze orange like hunters wear....that way they won't get shot?

Posted: 10/4/2005 11:12:03 AM EDT

[#30]

Quoted:
May I suggest:

www.2nilssons.com/Nilsson%20and%20Dawson%20Family/kln%20-%20baby,%20tutu.jpg

hr

There's a lot of Upper Managment that often squeeze into that !

Posted: 10/4/2005 11:30:03 AM EDT

[#31]

Can't you just spray paint some graffitti on your clothes? Should blend right in.

Posted: 10/4/2005 12:03:40 PM EDT

[#32]

OD makes for good night time camo. And it brings less attention in daytime. I have black AR-15's, and two in OD. I can promise you that the AR-15 profile, in black, is easily recognized for quite a distance. But the same AR-15 in OD leaves the viewer thinking, what was that?

In the dark, the eye loses color recognition first.

You do know that you can get BDU's in gray and in "urban camo"? Urban camo has a pattern like woodland, but in shades of gray. In fact, I have seen a darker version and a lighter version.

Posted: 10/4/2005 12:14:14 PM EDT

[#33]

Personally, I think straight navy blue would suffice. In fact, that is the most common color used by SWAT/SRT/ESU units that I have seen.

Posted: 10/4/2005 1:12:38 PM EDT

[#34]

Quoted:
How about blaze orange like hunters wear....that way they won't get shot?

Kinda fails the intimidation part. Scarying the everloving shit out of mr Perp as you come into to the room will make help make him a little more compliant, than, say, someone who looked like a hunter on crack,

Posted: 10/4/2005 1:21:19 PM EDT

[#35]

Quoted:
Quoted:
It was HBT (Hostage, Barricade, Terrorist) but was changed this past summer to standardize...

That's right. I remember it was somehthing odd like that.

I was thinking the exact same thing!

ETA: Have you thought about MultiCam? It's supposed to be comfortable as hell.

www.multicampattern.com/

www.cryeprecision.com/HTLM/products/index.htm

Posted: 10/4/2005 1:30:28 PM EDT

[#36]

To better blend in with the urbanites.

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