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10/20/2017 1:01:18 AM
9/22/2017 12:11:25 AM
Posted: 10/4/2005 8:32:28 AM EDT
I'm on Chicago SWAT and we're in the middle of some changes. Uniform style/color is a big sticking point. We curse the current all black tactical as it cooks us in the sun. Also our all black outfits actually stand out as we move under our street lights and against the background of our concrete jungle. Some of us have a few OD green add-ons and the blend is nice. We may get OD Green flight suits.
Can anyone out there in the forum direct me to an article or study that shows OD Green as the better color/pattern to use. Thank You.
Link Posted: 10/4/2005 8:42:46 AM EDT
Well, black is a bad camo, period. Even at night. Olive drab at least blends in somewhat instead of look at me, look at me. Then again, you are in a city, where camo is a (mostly) moot point, its just about looking as intimidating as humanly possible, where someone sees you and thinks, "Oh hell no, he's gonna fuck me up, Ill just sit here and play good suspect and comply."

Again, its which thing your brass care about: Ability to camo, or ability to aid intimidation which allows a better chance of de-escalating a situation more effectively.
Link Posted: 10/4/2005 8:44:18 AM EDT
You might check with Indianapolis SWAT. They use olive drab clothing during deployments.
Link Posted: 10/4/2005 8:47:51 AM EDT
Link Posted: 10/4/2005 8:49:41 AM EDT
I don't understand why SWAT/cops wear black. At least a tan color would be nice. I know you all have got to be hot as hell with the black, body armor, and all the crap you gotta wear. I think they should issue you the new digital light colored city camo.
Link Posted: 10/4/2005 8:49:48 AM EDT
tag
Link Posted: 10/4/2005 8:55:03 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 10/4/2005 8:55:44 AM EDT by SmilingBandit]
Blue tiger stripes. If it's good enough for the Air Force....

ETA: Hi
Link Posted: 10/4/2005 8:55:35 AM EDT
take a look at Major John Plaster’s "UltimateSniper".
they have a section on camo that might help.
Link Posted: 10/4/2005 9:01:00 AM EDT

Originally Posted By hk940:
take a look at Major John Plaster’s "UltimateSniper".
they have a section on camo that might help.



Yeah, despite Maj Plaster's asshattedness, that book does have a decent, if not old, assesment of some common camo patterns. He supports the use of OD as a general purpose color. If I remember correctly, gray is too bright at night under NVGs. Nomex flight suits serve a purpose, but they are hot in the summer, and are no fun if you have to go greenside for very long.
Link Posted: 10/4/2005 9:12:00 AM EDT
Gentlemen, Thank you all for the quick commments.
Looking forward to many more.


To Train or not to Train..... TRAIN
Link Posted: 10/4/2005 9:16:44 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 10/4/2005 9:17:13 AM EDT by Mr-H]
Are you with Chicago PD or Cook County Sherrif's Police?
Link Posted: 10/4/2005 9:18:50 AM EDT
whats wrong with a nice plad?
Link Posted: 10/4/2005 9:24:37 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Mr-H:
Are you with Chicago PD or Cook County Sherrif's Police?



I'm with Chicago
Link Posted: 10/4/2005 9:26:48 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 10/4/2005 9:27:28 AM EDT by Mr-H]

Originally Posted By sigbangin:

Originally Posted By Mr-H:
Are you with Chicago PD or Cook County Sherrif's Police?



I'm with Chicago



Oh cool. What's the name of you guys' tactical team again? If I remember right, it's kind of unique.
Link Posted: 10/4/2005 9:29:48 AM EDT
It was HBT (Hostage, Barricade, Terrorist) but was changed this past summer to standardize...
Link Posted: 10/4/2005 9:32:57 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 10/4/2005 9:33:11 AM EDT by Mr-H]

Originally Posted By sigbangin:
It was HBT (Hostage, Barricade, Terrorist) but was changed this past summer to standardize...


That's right. I remember it was somehthing odd like that.

Link Posted: 10/4/2005 9:37:41 AM EDT
When we'd attend a conference or training guys would ask, whats HBT , and we'd reply we'll it's like SWAT. To which they said "Why not call it that then ?!"

Finaly some of the brass had enough and grabbed the reins ! Ya-Know
Link Posted: 10/4/2005 9:38:51 AM EDT

Originally Posted By sigbangin:
It was HBT (Hostage, Barricade, Terrorist) but was changed this past summer to standardize...



Standardize?

That's another odd name for a swat team.
Link Posted: 10/4/2005 9:43:17 AM EDT
I sent you an IM, sigbangin.
Link Posted: 10/4/2005 9:45:55 AM EDT
May I suggest:



Link Posted: 10/4/2005 9:46:21 AM EDT
Link Posted: 10/4/2005 9:48:02 AM EDT

Originally Posted By JSteensen:
Well, black is a bad camo, period. Even at night. Olive drab at least blends in somewhat instead of look at me, look at me. Then again, you are in a city, where camo is a (mostly) moot point, its just about looking as intimidating as humanly possible, where someone sees you and thinks, "Oh hell no, he's gonna fuck me up, Ill just sit here and play good suspect and comply."

Again, its which thing your brass care about: Ability to camo, or ability to aid intimidation which allows a better chance of de-escalating a situation more effectively.



Right on, like these guys:



Link Posted: 10/4/2005 9:48:59 AM EDT
Link Posted: 10/4/2005 9:52:14 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 10/4/2005 9:58:34 AM EDT by Mr-H]

Originally Posted By Carabinero1979:

Originally Posted By JSteensen:
Well, black is a bad camo, period. Even at night. Olive drab at least blends in somewhat instead of look at me, look at me. Then again, you are in a city, where camo is a (mostly) moot point, its just about looking as intimidating as humanly possible, where someone sees you and thinks, "Oh hell no, he's gonna fuck me up, Ill just sit here and play good suspect and comply."

Again, its which thing your brass care about: Ability to camo, or ability to aid intimidation which allows a better chance of de-escalating a situation more effectively.



Right on, like these guys:

www.hkpro.com/image/actionsas1.jpg

www.hkpro.com/image/actionsassd.jpg



I think the SAS wear dark navy blue to their proms, but they're still scary as heck. Their gas masks don't make em look any friendlier either.

ETA: Check out that old SD in the bottom pic.
Link Posted: 10/4/2005 9:57:33 AM EDT
All this talk about clothing being the real intimidator cracks me up.

Link Posted: 10/4/2005 9:59:36 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Silesius:
All this talk about clothing being the real intimidator cracks me up.



Yeah, I think the automatic weapons might play a part, too.
Link Posted: 10/4/2005 10:07:49 AM EDT
Link Posted: 10/4/2005 11:04:28 AM EDT

Originally Posted By michaelj1978:
I don't understand why SWAT/cops wear black. At least a tan color would be nice. I know you all have got to be hot as hell with the black, body armor, and all the crap you gotta wear. I think they should issue you the new digital light colored city camo.



As one cop in town told me, cops used to like black BDUs because they didn't have to be pressed/ironed all the time, and stayed cleaner-looking longer. (Not necessarily cleaner...)

The local cops don't like them now, because even the statist libs around here complain that the black BDU-clad PD looks like a bunch of SS thugs.....
Link Posted: 10/4/2005 11:10:34 AM EDT
How about blaze orange like hunters wear....that way they won't get shot?
Link Posted: 10/4/2005 11:12:03 AM EDT

Originally Posted By macman37:
May I suggest:

www.2nilssons.com/Nilsson%20and%20Dawson%20Family/kln%20-%20baby,%20tutu.jpg

hr


There's a lot of Upper Managment that often squeeze into that !
Link Posted: 10/4/2005 11:30:03 AM EDT
Can't you just spray paint some graffitti on your clothes? Should blend right in.
Link Posted: 10/4/2005 12:03:40 PM EDT
OD makes for good night time camo. And it brings less attention in daytime. I have black AR-15's, and two in OD. I can promise you that the AR-15 profile, in black, is easily recognized for quite a distance. But the same AR-15 in OD leaves the viewer thinking, what was that?

In the dark, the eye loses color recognition first.

You do know that you can get BDU's in gray and in "urban camo"? Urban camo has a pattern like woodland, but in shades of gray. In fact, I have seen a darker version and a lighter version.
Link Posted: 10/4/2005 12:14:14 PM EDT
Personally, I think straight navy blue would suffice. In fact, that is the most common color used by SWAT/SRT/ESU units that I have seen.
Link Posted: 10/4/2005 1:12:38 PM EDT

Originally Posted By wessono:
How about blaze orange like hunters wear....that way they won't get shot?



Kinda fails the intimidation part. Scarying the everloving shit out of mr Perp as you come into to the room will make help make him a little more compliant, than, say, someone who looked like a hunter on crack,
Link Posted: 10/4/2005 1:21:19 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 10/4/2005 1:24:38 PM EDT by CitySlicker]

Originally Posted By Mr-H:

Originally Posted By sigbangin:
It was HBT (Hostage, Barricade, Terrorist) but was changed this past summer to standardize...


That's right. I remember it was somehthing odd like that.




I was thinking the exact same thing!

ETA: Have you thought about MultiCam? It's supposed to be comfortable as hell.

www.multicampattern.com/

www.cryeprecision.com/HTLM/products/index.htm
Link Posted: 10/4/2005 1:30:28 PM EDT



To better blend in with the urbanites.
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