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1/16/2020 9:48:49 PM
Posted: 1/20/2015 2:36:49 PM EST
So after spending the latter half of 2014 looking for work, 2015 has started off with some great luck and I have 2 companies that want to hire me.

I am a mechanical engineer by the way.

Company 1 made me a solid offer this morning, about 5k more than my previous job. I'd be working on radio frequency systems which I find interesting, company size about 800. I have until Thursday to accept their offer.

Company 2 can't make me an offer until I meet with their owner who's traveling for business this week, but I've been told by the head of engineering that he's never not hired anyone that made it this far in the interview process. I'd be working on medical devices, company size about 200, they're exploding in growth right now, company's owner has a singular no non-sense vision for the company which I really like after working for a large company that started going Office Space near the end. Pay would be at least equal to Company 1, though probably 2-3k more.

I really like aspects of both companies, I feel like if I could get into Company 2 at this time I would be working some long hours but be in a great position in the company, but I'd have to reject company 1's offer without having a solid offer from Company 2 yet.

Decisions, decisions....

Link Posted: 1/20/2015 2:39:21 PM EST
tell company #1 that you need a week.

Link Posted: 1/20/2015 2:39:54 PM EST
Bird in the hand. You can always accept the offer from the first company, then if the second offer is all you've ever dreamed of, call the first back and let them know you changed your mind. This happens more often than you might think.
Link Posted: 1/20/2015 2:41:21 PM EST
long term prosperity is what you seek not short term gain....think long term and which of the opportunities better fills that need
Link Posted: 1/20/2015 2:42:54 PM EST
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Originally Posted By Whizzinator:
tell company #1 that you need a week.

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And tell Company #2 your situation. But that you're very interested.
Link Posted: 1/20/2015 2:44:14 PM EST
Originally Posted By Thatdude333:
So after spending the latter half of 2014 looking for work, 2015 has started off with some great luck and I have 2 companies that want to hire me.

I am a mechanical engineer by the way.

Company 1 made me a solid offer this morning, about 5k more than my previous job. I'd be working on radio frequency systems which I find interesting, company size about 800. I have until Thursday to accept their offer.

Company 2 can't make me an offer until I meet with their owner who's traveling for business this week, but I've been told by the head of engineering that he's never not hired anyone that made it this far in the interview process. I'd be working on medical devices, company size about 200, they're exploding in growth right now, company's owner has a singular no non-sense vision for the company which I really like after working for a large company that started going Office Space near the end. Pay would be at least equal to Company 1, though probably 2-3k more.


I really like aspects of both companies, I feel like if I could get into Company 2 at this time I would be working some long hours but be in a great position in the company, but I'd have to reject company 1's offer without having a solid offer from Company 2 yet.


Decisions, decisions....



View Quote


have you asked company 1 if they can give you until you can meet with company 2 to weigh all options before deciding?

i'd hate to tell #1 no just to get turned down by #2. bird in the hand and all.
Link Posted: 1/20/2015 2:48:14 PM EST
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Originally Posted By Dash_ISpy:

And tell Company #2 your situation. But that you're very interested.
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Originally Posted By Dash_ISpy:
Originally Posted By Whizzinator:
tell company #1 that you need a week.


And tell Company #2 your situation. But that you're very interested.

With company #2 I'm working through a recruiter, who I immediately called once I got off the phone with company #1. He said he'd see if there was anything he could do to get company #2 to move forward faster or give me a concrete offer.
Link Posted: 1/20/2015 2:50:09 PM EST
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Originally Posted By Strizzo:


have you asked company 1 if they can give you until you can meet with company 2 to weigh all options before deciding?

i'd hate to tell #1 no just to get turned down by #2. bird in the hand and all.
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Originally Posted By Strizzo:
Originally Posted By Thatdude333:
So after spending the latter half of 2014 looking for work, 2015 has started off with some great luck and I have 2 companies that want to hire me.

I am a mechanical engineer by the way.

Company 1 made me a solid offer this morning, about 5k more than my previous job. I'd be working on radio frequency systems which I find interesting, company size about 800. I have until Thursday to accept their offer.

Company 2 can't make me an offer until I meet with their owner who's traveling for business this week, but I've been told by the head of engineering that he's never not hired anyone that made it this far in the interview process. I'd be working on medical devices, company size about 200, they're exploding in growth right now, company's owner has a singular no non-sense vision for the company which I really like after working for a large company that started going Office Space near the end. Pay would be at least equal to Company 1, though probably 2-3k more.


I really like aspects of both companies, I feel like if I could get into Company 2 at this time I would be working some long hours but be in a great position in the company, but I'd have to reject company 1's offer without having a solid offer from Company 2 yet.


Decisions, decisions....





have you asked company 1 if they can give you until you can meet with company 2 to weigh all options before deciding?

i'd hate to tell #1 no just to get turned down by #2. bird in the hand and all.

I have not, just got the offer this morning and didn't know at the time if I should mention it or not, I'm sure I can talk to them tomorrow and see.
Link Posted: 1/20/2015 2:52:18 PM EST
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Originally Posted By Dash_ISpy:

And tell Company #2 your situation. But that you're very interested.
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Originally Posted By Dash_ISpy:
Originally Posted By Whizzinator:
tell company #1 that you need a week.


And tell Company #2 your situation. But that you're very interested.

Link Posted: 1/20/2015 2:52:27 PM EST
Any company that gives the "can't hire you until you meet with the owner who's travelling" speech throws up giant red flags in my experience. Unless of course your position would have you as a direct report to the owner.
Link Posted: 1/20/2015 2:53:08 PM EST
I would go with #1. Or stall with #1 and wait. As far as #2, if the offer isn't on paper, it ain't worth shit IMO.
Link Posted: 1/20/2015 2:54:09 PM EST
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Originally Posted By AlabamaFan64:
Bird in the hand. You can always accept the offer from the first company, then if the second offer is all you've ever dreamed of, call the first back and let them know you changed your mind. This happens more often than you might think.
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Probably the best route to take, though I would feel like an ass telling them I accept while knowing that there's a good chance of me bailing.
Link Posted: 1/20/2015 2:57:03 PM EST
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Originally Posted By csrevenant:
I would go with #1. Or stall with #1 and wait. As far as #2, if the offer isn't on paper, it ain't worth shit IMO.
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Yep. Take the first.
Link Posted: 1/20/2015 2:57:08 PM EST
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Originally Posted By Thatdude333:

Probably the best route to take, though I would feel like an ass telling them I accept while knowing that there's a good chance of me bailing.
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Originally Posted By Thatdude333:
Originally Posted By AlabamaFan64:
Bird in the hand. You can always accept the offer from the first company, then if the second offer is all you've ever dreamed of, call the first back and let them know you changed your mind. This happens more often than you might think.

Probably the best route to take, though I would feel like an ass telling them I accept while knowing that there's a good chance of me bailing.

I know. I would feel bad doing that as well, but from what I've seen over the years, it's normally the best option.
Link Posted: 1/20/2015 2:57:58 PM EST
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Originally Posted By AeroEngineer:
Any company that gives the "can't hire you until you meet with the owner who's travelling" speech throws up giant red flags in my experience. Unless of course your position would have you as a direct report to the owner.
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It's an interesting company, very driven, the owner wants to meet everyone, no matter the position, before hiring. Was told that's just how he rolls. Also told he's very generous to his employees because he expects a lot from them.
Link Posted: 1/20/2015 2:58:52 PM EST
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Originally Posted By csrevenant:
I would go with #1. Or stall with #1 and wait. As far as #2, if the offer isn't on paper, it ain't worth shit IMO.
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This. Also, after a reread, what kind of company has an engineering manager who lacks hiring authority? I'd cut bait on #2. Sounds like a company with a micro-managing owner who can't delegate. This way of doing things probably worked fine as the owner was building up his business, but at a point you have to delegate some authority otherwise you paralyze the whole company. Sorry, I've seen these situations where nothing of any importance could happen without the owner's direct approval, and at a point this way of doing things breaks down when there are so many decisions needing to be made that one person can't cover them all timely.
Link Posted: 1/20/2015 3:00:38 PM EST
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Originally Posted By Thatdude333:
It's an interesting company, very driven, the owner wants to meet everyone, no matter the position, before hiring. Was told that's just how he rolls.
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Knew of a guy like that. Said he could see peoples souls, and interviewed every potential full time employee. Turns out, he just wanted to hire the ladies with big boobies, and ditch the uggo's.
Link Posted: 1/20/2015 3:01:07 PM EST
Counter-offer company #1, this may kick the can until after the weekend.

Company #2 has some red-flasgs; huge growth in medical field & the hiring manager cannot make a decision on their own w/o approval from one of the owner's.

The biggest red-flag in that is the huge growth. You're not going to be clued in regarding finance activities but I've seen a lot of small biotech firms grow and then get swallowed up by bigger fish. Even the ones who were hopelessly insolvent and leveraged up to their necks.

Without knowing a little more about the history of the company, who their clients are, etc...it's tough to say. If they get bought out, it's not the end of the world and a newer corp. culture may even be a good thing when it replaces "old boys" who own the joint. You're not going to get paid more nor will you get promoted. That stuff will be handled by those who already earned their stripes for the larger company.


Just thought I'd throw out a different dynamic that hasn't been mentioned yet.
Link Posted: 1/20/2015 3:03:53 PM EST
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Originally Posted By Thatdude333:

Probably the best route to take, though I would feel like an ass telling them I accept while knowing that there's a good chance of me bailing.
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Originally Posted By Thatdude333:
Originally Posted By AlabamaFan64:
Bird in the hand. You can always accept the offer from the first company, then if the second offer is all you've ever dreamed of, call the first back and let them know you changed your mind. This happens more often than you might think.

Probably the best route to take, though I would feel like an ass telling them I accept while knowing that there's a good chance of me bailing.


This is an option. Be warned it will probably burn some bridges with #1 if you do this. Not saying that makes it a no go, just something to think about. I wouldn't feel bad in a personal sense (how many stories of long serving employees being laid off do you hear?), but there can be a professional cost.
Link Posted: 1/20/2015 3:03:58 PM EST
With all this Obamacare bullshit still getting figured out (and getting worse), I would be hesitant to go into the medical equipment field right now....
Link Posted: 1/20/2015 3:04:12 PM EST
Try and stall the first offer a little longer. If they can not give you another couple of days it maybe a sign of how they run things in general. If they push back hard accept the offer and see what happens with company #2. If #2 makes an offer I wouldn't feel bad about walking away from the first offer since they tried to play hardball.
Link Posted: 1/20/2015 3:06:19 PM EST
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Originally Posted By Thatdude333:

Probably the best route to take, though I would feel like an ass telling them I accept while knowing that there's a good chance of me bailing.
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Originally Posted By Thatdude333:
Originally Posted By AlabamaFan64:
Bird in the hand. You can always accept the offer from the first company, then if the second offer is all you've ever dreamed of, call the first back and let them know you changed your mind. This happens more often than you might think.

Probably the best route to take, though I would feel like an ass telling them I accept while knowing that there's a good chance of me bailing.
They would not care about you if the roles were reversed.
Link Posted: 1/20/2015 3:06:31 PM EST
Originally Posted By Thatdude333:
So after spending the latter half of 2014 looking for work, 2015 has started off with some great luck and I have 2 companies that want to hire me.

I am a mechanical engineer by the way.

Company 1 made me a solid offer this morning, about 5k more than my previous job. I'd be working on radio frequency systems which I find interesting, company size about 800. I have until Thursday to accept their offer.

Company 2 can't make me an offer until I meet with their owner who's traveling for business this week, but I've been told by the head of engineering that he's never not hired anyone that made it this far in the interview process. I'd be working on medical devices, company size about 200, they're exploding in growth right now, company's owner has a singular no non-sense vision for the company which I really like after working for a large company that started going Office Space near the end. Pay would be at least equal to Company 1, though probably 2-3k more.


I really like aspects of both companies, I feel like if I could get into Company 2 at this time I would be working some long hours but be in a great position in the company, but I'd have to reject company 1's offer without having a solid offer from Company 2 yet.


Decisions, decisions....



View Quote


Also - consider what your time is worth to you. If you are going to be working an extra 15-20 hours a week for the second company, that hardly justifies the $2-3k bump in pay you're talking about.

Other things to consider...

1) The commute
2) Benefits packages - specifically retirement matching and health insurance.
3) Vacation/ sick time and how its use is treated in the company (do people frown on others who actually use leave)
Link Posted: 1/20/2015 3:08:29 PM EST
bird in the hand. there are opportunity costs to everything.
Link Posted: 1/20/2015 3:11:49 PM EST
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Originally Posted By AeroEngineer:
Any company that gives the "can't hire you until you meet with the owner who's travelling" speech throws up giant red flags in my experience. Unless of course your position would have you as a direct report to the owner.
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why?


i would appreciate that to be honest.
Link Posted: 1/20/2015 3:19:09 PM EST
Link Posted: 1/20/2015 3:20:13 PM EST
It sounds like you like both offers, so either would probably be ok. Here are things I would look at if it were me. Are you married? Do you have kids? How is the commute to either job? If you have family concerns I would look at the first job more seriously. It seems like a more stable job and allows for more home time. If job two is significantly further than job one that $2-3K/year will be eaten up with transportation costs. Which job has better benefits/vacation?

The way it sounds, job one is a more stable job, but job two could have a higher growth potential. Without family concerns I might look at job two more seriously (depending on if I got a good feeling that they wouldn't go under as a newer company). If I'm looking at family time I might consider job one more because it could be more stable and sounds like it involves less time away from home.
Link Posted: 1/20/2015 3:27:17 PM EST
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Originally Posted By bngracing:
Counter-offer company #1, this may kick the can until after the weekend.

Company #2 has some red-flasgs; huge growth in medical field & the hiring manager cannot make a decision on their own w/o approval from one of the owner's.

The biggest red-flag in that is the huge growth. You're not going to be clued in regarding finance activities but I've seen a lot of small biotech firms grow and then get swallowed up by bigger fish. Even the ones who were hopelessly insolvent and leveraged up to their necks.

Without knowing a little more about the history of the company, who their clients are, etc...it's tough to say. If they get bought out, it's not the end of the world and a newer corp. culture may even be a good thing when it replaces "old boys" who own the joint. You're not going to get paid more nor will you get promoted. That stuff will be handled by those who already earned their stripes for the larger company.


Just thought I'd throw out a different dynamic that hasn't been mentioned yet.
View Quote


Thanks, that definitely helps me see things from another viewpoint. The last place I worked was somewhat similar, a smaller-medium sized company that got bought out by a big company and culture went downhill.

I will say company #2's product line is all stuff that the owner (a doctor) came up with and patented, was told he'd got a bunch more stuff on the back burners, and his number 1 concern is getting these products out and on surgery tables to save lives.
Link Posted: 1/20/2015 3:32:27 PM EST
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Originally Posted By rbread:
It sounds like you like both offers, so either would probably be ok. Here are things I would look at if it were me. Are you married? Do you have kids? How is the commute to either job? If you have family concerns I would look at the first job more seriously. It seems like a more stable job and allows for more home time. If job two is significantly further than job one that $2-3K/year will be eaten up with transportation costs. Which job has better benefits/vacation?

The way it sounds, job one is a more stable job, but job two could have a higher growth potential. Without family concerns I might look at job two more seriously (depending on if I got a good feeling that they wouldn't go under as a newer company). If I'm looking at family time I might consider job one more because it could be more stable and sounds like it involves less time away from home.
View Quote

Not married, not planning on having kids (already got snipped) and either job will require me to move, and are about the same distance from where the GF lives, who I'll travel to and see on weekends.

Benefits / vacation time are about equal, and I'm Mr. high deductible never goes to the doctor anyways.
Link Posted: 1/20/2015 3:36:38 PM EST
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Originally Posted By rod727:
long term prosperity is what you seek not short term gain....think long term and which of the opportunities better fills that need
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This. Also, is medical a good thing or a bad thing with the ZeroCare shit rolling out? I really am not sure, I'd be asking myself that. Glad you have options OP. Good luck
Link Posted: 1/20/2015 3:39:50 PM EST
I think #1. #2 sounds a little hinkey.
Link Posted: 1/20/2015 3:42:00 PM EST
Your answers can be found here.
Link Posted: 1/20/2015 3:49:15 PM EST
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Originally Posted By AeroEngineer:
Any company that gives the "can't hire you until you meet with the owner who's travelling" speech throws up giant red flags in my experience. Unless of course your position would have you as a direct report to the owner.
View Quote


This unless it's a direct report or very small (eg. <25 people) company.
Link Posted: 1/20/2015 3:49:45 PM EST
A guy at my company just did this dance and lost both opportunities - essentially trying to squeeze the most juice out of the orange.

If the time is right to move on a take a job elsewhere and you get an offer you like, don't be the fool who loses everything over deciding which grass is greener.
Link Posted: 1/20/2015 3:50:12 PM EST
You'd be borderline crazy to not accept offer one. Wait as long as you can and accept it. If by some chance company 2 gives you the solid offer you want, take it. You don't owe company one anything
Link Posted: 1/20/2015 3:54:34 PM EST
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Originally Posted By AeroEngineer:


This. Also, after a reread, what kind of company has an engineering manager who lacks hiring authority? I'd cut bait on #2. Sounds like a company with a micro-managing owner who can't delegate. This way of doing things probably worked fine as the owner was building up his business, but at a point you have to delegate some authority otherwise you paralyze the whole company. Sorry, I've seen these situations where nothing of any importance could happen without the owner's direct approval, and at a point this way of doing things breaks down when there are so many decisions needing to be made that one person can't cover them all timely.
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Originally Posted By AeroEngineer:
Originally Posted By csrevenant:
I would go with #1. Or stall with #1 and wait. As far as #2, if the offer isn't on paper, it ain't worth shit IMO.


This. Also, after a reread, what kind of company has an engineering manager who lacks hiring authority? I'd cut bait on #2. Sounds like a company with a micro-managing owner who can't delegate. This way of doing things probably worked fine as the owner was building up his business, but at a point you have to delegate some authority otherwise you paralyze the whole company. Sorry, I've seen these situations where nothing of any importance could happen without the owner's direct approval, and at a point this way of doing things breaks down when there are so many decisions needing to be made that one person can't cover them all timely.



As much as I have idea what AE's avatar is, I have to agree that this is a real possibility. Also, the part above where you said he is an MD and and runs the place and they are his products sort of confirms it. This makes me think job 1 would be less drama. I have been in this position and Its hard to predict the future but these are clues.

I don't know the market where you are but you could ask for more money from job 1 as mentioned which may delay it. If you have a job now, you have nothing to lose and you may get more$$. Make the recruiter do it





Link Posted: 1/20/2015 4:00:00 PM EST
A hand in the bush.
Link Posted: 1/20/2015 4:01:52 PM EST
Link Posted: 1/20/2015 4:29:49 PM EST
Just on a hunch, does it seem like at company #2 everyone is afraid to take a shit without owner's approval? Feel out to see if he's a quirky, eccentric micromanager type who may have unrealistic expections. This can really stress you out as an engineer if said owner is non-technical and doesn't fully understand the nuances of designing, prototyping, testing, tooling, programming, and producing a product.

Personally (I'm an engineer as well), I would probably lean more toward company #1.
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