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Posted: 10/6/2004 1:32:25 PM EST
[Last Edit: 10/6/2004 1:32:25 PM EST by Hawkeye]


The Gun Debate on October 12th hock.gif

The Great Gun Debate will be a TV debut for the Library of King's College London. Both Rebecca Peters from the IANSA and Wayne LaPierre from the NRA will speak on the topic of Gun Control. This will be a first in history where strong advocates from both sides come together and speak before a live audience. On Pay per view, Check your local listings.

Yep, it's the NRA versus the UN on global gun control. The topic appears to be focused around the proposed United Nations treaty banning civilian possession of small arms. There's a vote on the topic as well.

Rebecca Peters almost single-handedly brought gun confiscation to Australia and to England, and is now the most feared gun-banner in the world. With more than 500 gun control organizations under her command worldwide, and with the unlimited financial backing of billionaire George Soros, she`s determined to make gun confiscation a reality here in the United States— through a U.N.-backed treaty that would be binding on every American citizen.
You and every American gun owner need to watch this debate—and see first-hand this enormous and very real threat to our Second Amendment rights.

Rebecca Peters: Chief Executive of IANSA (the International Action Network of Small Arms), In 1996 Rebecca was awarded the Australian Human Rights Medal for her work in promoting gun control in Australia... IANSA is the global network of civil society organizations working to stop proliferation and misuse of small arms and light weapons. IANSA brings world attention on the humantarian impact of these weapons and brings the voices and activities of non-government organizations and concerned individuals across the world. Founded in 1998 it now has more than 500 participant groups in nearly one hundred countries. Rebecca Peters works hand-in-hand with the United Nations to ban small arms around the globe. According to the NRA, "Peters engineered the 1996 campaign that banned, confiscated and destroyed 640,000 rifles and shotguns owned by law-abiding Australians.

Wayne LaPierre: Chief Executive of the National Rifle Association of America. The Association of its 4 million members, are staunch defenders of the Second Amendment rights and is a major player in the politcal arena and stands firm in its resolve to protect the right to keep and bear arms. The NRA was founded in 1871.

Wayne LaPierre has been with the NRA since 1978 and became its CEO in 1986 and is now its leading spokesperson on all NRA legislative activities at entry level of government.
Wayne serves on the board of the American Association of Political Consultants. He holds a Master's degree in American Government and Politics and a Bachelor's degree in Education and Political Science.


Jumpman
Link Posted: 10/5/2004 2:25:55 PM EST

Originally Posted By NAV:

The Gun Debate on October 12th



Rebecca Peters: Chief Executive of IANSA (the International Action Network of Small Arms), In 1996 Rebecca was awarded the Australian Human Rights Medal for her work in promoting gun control in Australia...




Shouldn't that say...

Rebecca Peters: Chief Executive of IANSA (the International Action Network of Small Arms), In 1996 Rebecca was awarded the Australian Human Rights Medal for her work in promoting an increased violent crime rate in Australia...

Link Posted: 10/5/2004 2:35:37 PM EST
Rebecca Peters, will run into her fate quickly,she barking up the wrong tree, this time.

Beside that, who in the fuck does the UN think it is? Bunch of fucking morons.


TG
Link Posted: 10/5/2004 2:41:49 PM EST
Beside that, who in the fuck does the UN think it is? Bunch of fucking morons

I totally agree, just think of the possibilities though if John Kerry were to get into office. I would certainly hope that with a Republican controlled Congress that they would never let it fly but you never know and with the way the Supreme Court has been ruling lately I wouldnt count on them to call it unconstitutional either...
Link Posted: 10/5/2004 3:03:31 PM EST
not gonna happen, no way, no how.......The UN is a totally useless entity & they can go fuck themselves with a Pineapple...
Link Posted: 10/5/2004 3:12:05 PM EST
fuck the un. fuck them up their stupid asses.

rebecca peterpuffer can lick my nuts
Link Posted: 10/5/2004 2:17:40 PM EST
I hope she's attacked on the way to the debate by someone with an "assault" spoon or some other small arm like a big utility ball. Drill the point that "the user" is the issue into her thick liberal skull.

BTW - I don't think a tongue in cheek spoon assault or dodge ball wacking seriously qualify as advocating violence here, so it should not be a violation of the CoC.
Link Posted: 10/5/2004 3:29:24 PM EST
The chick needs to have an encounter with a raged lunatic who is absolutely deterimined to gouge her eyes out with a knife and do other unkind things to her before finally killing her.


In her last moments of her life while she's wondering where the police are to protect her she'll probably be wishing he had something to properly defend herself with.


We should send her a bunch of feel good improvised Hallmark cards with the message "Hey bitch, hope you get cancer and die!"
Link Posted: 10/5/2004 3:41:44 PM EST
No doubt the UN will pass a resolution/treaty that will ban guns, and all nations will be expected to ratify it. The leftie nations will do so quickly, and will keep producing AK's and other weapons through the back door and sell them to terrorists and criminal types (UN Oil for Food Program), and the violent crime wave will increase here and world wide. Leftie's (read: communists and/or the Democratic Party) will cry for more gun control since the US is the center for all evils in the world and has caused the increase in violence because the US has that peskey 2nd Amendment to their Constitution. As the political tides shift, the sheepole in the US will become a majority and elect a Kerry/Edwards/Kennedy/Feinstein/Schumer type president. That president will force the treaty ratification through the Senate. Then, the 2nd Amendment will be voided, and that, my friends, is the day that I start turning over my stuff to the government, ammo first, one bullet at a time.

You must understand that the goal of a majority of the countries in the world, especially France, Germany, and China, is ending the reign of the US as the sole super power, and making us "equal" to them, so that no one has the power to determine their own destiny unless they pass the "Global Test". And you had also better remember that this will only be accomplished with the help and support of a majority of the people in the US. They cannot defeat us from the outside, only on the inside, and you better bet they know it. The enemy is among us.

Seen the polls lately? Close election? What are you going to do?
Link Posted: 10/5/2004 4:23:42 PM EST
DougW has it right. The Constitution needs to be defended against all enemies, foriegn and DOMESTIC. The day to start sending lead will be here the day troops with blue helmets land on our soil to get your guns.

Oh, "Its for the children"
Link Posted: 10/5/2004 4:28:47 PM EST
If, Kerry makes it into office, you can bet the SHTF will really happen.

Kerry a globist,he'll sell us out in a heart beat, not just gun owners,but the American way of life as we know it.


He'll promise America anything to get into office, than he'll do worsed than Clinton & Gore.

TG
Link Posted: 10/5/2004 4:35:03 PM EST
Make no mistake about it folks, this UN treaty is coming.. The question is, Will the sitting President ratify it? This is not up to congress, it is up to the pres.. If he/she does ratify the treaty, ALL of your guns will become, instantlly ILLEGAL, subject to turn in/confiscation..

Blue helmets make good targets!!!
Link Posted: 10/5/2004 4:38:00 PM EST
i dont see how a UN treaty is at all binding on us. I for one do not recoginize the UN as a legitimate authority in the US. A bunch of euro-socialist pussies and third world trash.
Link Posted: 10/5/2004 4:38:06 PM EST
As law-abiding citizens are disarmed, criminals become more daring and violence goes up in society. Fear factor kicks in, citizens wants stronger protection from the government.

The social elites elected in our government takes action. More civil rights are taken away for the "good" of the society. Police force are turned into para-military forces for better logistic support and heavier hardware. Soon armor personal carriers zooms throught the suburbs as patrol vehicles. Special police task force will be setup to "secretly" monitor and arrest State deemed criminals.

Few self interested men finds oppertunity and grab power. Passing laws to give themselves more control over the society. Soon civil disobedient protest starts, then civil unrest. State deems the protesters as "terroist" and arrest them as enemy combatant and be held in commuicata.

Slowly only the social elites decides what's good for the common man... And a class based citizenship is developed.

You know, our forefathers with their Bill of Rights are a LOT smarter than we thought......
Link Posted: 10/5/2004 6:08:33 PM EST

Originally Posted By JeffersonDarcy:
i dont see how a UN treaty is at all binding on us. I for one do not recoginize the UN as a legitimate authority in the US. A bunch of euro-socialist pussies and third world trash.



Look how close Klinton came to signing the Kioto Treaty, which would have set us back economically decades (one of the two things he did that I agree with). I agree that the UN is the problem, but a shift in power in Washington, and an Executive order for the "good of society" would serve to end the most sacred of the Amendments. The next one to fall would be the 10th, then the 5th, and finally the 1st, in that order.

Look how the Supreme Court ruled on Campaign Finance Reform? That is a blantant violation of the 1st Amendment. Where is the out cry?

I too will never recognise the UN as having authority over the US, let alone the Great State of Texas. There was a fight by a few determined men here in this state not too many years ago for Freedom. It ended in Victory. Will history repeat itself?
Link Posted: 10/5/2004 6:37:42 PM EST
Yea and when that policy conflicts with the constitutional rights of a sovereign nation all I can say is that with my aimpoint I should have no trouble sighting in my carbine on blue helmeted soldiers....please the day this country lets foreign soldiers try and take our arms it will be anarchy here.as far as soros his billions wont protect him if hes at the head of the line of a proposed UN confiscation..thats why we cant let Kerry win to use his "world test" for foreign policy and his support of the world international court that could jepordize our men and women abroad.
Link Posted: 10/5/2004 6:49:22 PM EST
So...I guess we are all meeting in Texas then huh...?? I wont be protesting with the 1st amendment..Ill use the 2nd.....whos house are we meeting at.?? ;)
Link Posted: 10/5/2004 6:56:32 PM EST
[Last Edit: 10/5/2004 7:01:38 PM EST by Corporal_Chaos]

Originally Posted By DougW:

You must understand that the goal of a majority of the countries in the world, especially France, Germany, and China, is ending the reign of the US as the sole super power, and making us "equal" to them, so that no one has the power to determine their own destiny unless they pass the "Global Test".



Bullshit. They don't want equal anything. They want to outright replace us as the dominant world power. They may work together to undermine our efforts, but that's only because "the enemy of my enemy is my friend." There is not a single one of the mentioned countries that would like anything more than to rule the world. France used to have it, Germany tried twice, and China gets closer and closer to that objective every day.


It's issues like this that reaffirm my belief that U.S. needs to pull out of the U.N. and kick them out of New York.
Link Posted: 10/5/2004 7:01:31 PM EST

Originally Posted By Corporal_Chaos:

Originally Posted By DougW:

You must understand that the goal of a majority of the countries in the world, especially France, Germany, and China, is ending the reign of the US as the sole super power, and making us "equal" to them, so that no one has the power to determine their own destiny unless they pass the "Global Test".



Bullshit. They don't want equal anything. They want to outright replace us as the dominant world power.


It's issues like this that reaffirm my belief that U.S. needs to pull out of the U.N. and kick them out of New York.



replace all the other country's flags with American flags and state flags, destroy that stupid revolver in a knot statue, and arrest the diplomats for unpaid parking tickets
Link Posted: 10/5/2004 7:15:04 PM EST
Don't you think a more worthy and useful goal would be to ban terrorists or other hostile groups from having guns first? I mean, it's not even fair to ban people from having guns while there are still bad guys around. There is no question that she is not at all interested in security, but in power.
Link Posted: 10/5/2004 7:27:00 PM EST
She needs to be brutally skull fucked.
Link Posted: 10/5/2004 8:10:28 PM EST
That's exactly what they want, a bunch of crazy, profane, and uninvolved gun owners who are all talk and no action. We must all make sure we are members of NRA and involved in our local, state, and federal politics. We hate it, but they make the rules, and we need to make sure that the rules protect freedom, not agendas. As for the treaty becoming law, the US is a member of the UN, and if our sitting president ratifies the treaty, by virtue of our membership in the UN, we are bound by that treaty. I personally think it would be unconstitutional for international law to supersede our rights, but who would I be to argue with a bunch of armed government agents trying to take my guns, and ruin my security clearance, affecting my job, family, etc.!!! As for aiming a blue-helmeted soldiers, just remember that someone like John Kerry WILL, ABSOLUTELY WILL, turn over control of our military to the UN, so you'll be aiming at the guys on this board who serve our nation now, but will serve a global government if the treaty is ratified. Don't just be mad, act, sign up, write congress, write your newspaper, be an ambassador for gun owners. Mind your manners, be the better person, keep your composure, and educate all those you encounter. Show them that we are not a bunch of gun nuts, that we are intelligent, motivated, free, Americans who care about of our lives and our freedom. Check it out.www.nra.org
Link Posted: 10/5/2004 9:14:35 PM EST
Just reading this causes me to feel suffocated.

God help us if it ever comes to that. I'm doing my duty. I registered to vote, I'm a member of WAC and intend to become a lifetime member of the NRA.

-Rob
Link Posted: 10/6/2004 12:23:00 AM EST
[Last Edit: 10/6/2004 12:23:20 AM EST by glockguy40]
No treaty from the UN is enforcible on the USA unless the US itself signs the treaty and ratifies it.

If we don't abide by the treaty, and the rest of the world does, so what. Their loss, not ours.

No one can force international treaties upon any country, they have to be signed by that nation and ratified by its parliament/congress before it enters into force.
Link Posted: 10/6/2004 12:40:08 AM EST
Correct me if I'm wrong........



but doesn't the SENATE ratify treaties? The Pres can sign 'em, but that signature don't mean shit unless the Senate agrees.



oh, and fuck the NRA. The only rights they care about is the Duck and Deer crowd's rights.
Link Posted: 10/6/2004 12:40:41 AM EST
Link Posted: 10/6/2004 4:31:09 AM EST
My point is that the "allies" don't want us to go away completely, they just want to control us and tap in to the huge economic machine that is the US economy. It is not "fair" that we are so prosperous.

If the UN can disarm the US, then there is nothing to stop any government from doing what is wants to do. We become subjects of the "crown" like the English. At that point, it's time to grab the ankles, cause it's coming.

I pray to God that I am wrong. I pray that George Bush will be re-elected. I pray for our troops, especially since my son and son-in-law are both serving in the US Army.

Link Posted: 10/6/2004 4:34:35 AM EST

Originally Posted By coltshorty14:
Make no mistake about it folks, this UN treaty is coming.. The question is, Will the sitting President ratify it? This is not up to congress, it is up to the pres.. If he/she does ratify the treaty, ALL of your guns will become, instantlly ILLEGAL, subject to turn in/confiscation..

Blue helmets make good targets!!!



actually, congress does have to ratify it.

TXL
Link Posted: 10/6/2004 5:24:32 AM EST
Sometimes I just wish they would ban all firearms and start the door to door sweeps so we could get this revolution started
Link Posted: 10/6/2004 6:08:36 AM EST
My question is to those who are currently active duty military or law enforcement. Are you willing to put on that blue helmet/beret? Think about it ...
Link Posted: 10/6/2004 6:28:04 AM EST
I don't believe that the US can agree to anything if it violates our constitution. I seem to recall it has happened before with the UN. But we're still in it aren't we now.
Link Posted: 10/6/2004 8:06:58 AM EST

Originally Posted By H-barCarbine:
I don't believe that the US can agree to anything if it violates our constitution. I seem to recall it has happened before with the UN. But we're still in it aren't we now.






Ever heard the term "GLOBAL TEST".. If this treaty is ratified, there will be no such thing as the Second Ammendment.. Period, end of disscussion, turn them in, or die...
Link Posted: 10/6/2004 8:11:47 AM EST
[Last Edit: 10/6/2004 8:20:27 AM EST by H-barCarbine]
Congress can't violate the Constitution is all I'm saying. That's why it's there, the law for Congress to follow. They aren't going to just cross out the 2nd amendment and say it dosen't exist. I'll never believe that it will happen.

"You can have my gun, when you pry it from my cold dead fingers."
Link Posted: 10/6/2004 9:02:43 AM EST

Originally Posted By TealGunner:
That's exactly what they want, a bunch of crazy, profane, and uninvolved gun owners who are all talk and no action. We must all make sure we are members of NRA and involved in our local, state, and federal politics. We hate it, but they make the rules, and we need to make sure that the rules protect freedom, not agendas. As for the treaty becoming law, the US is a member of the UN, and if our sitting president ratifies the treaty, by virtue of our membership in the UN, we are bound by that treaty. I personally think it would be unconstitutional for international law to supersede our rights, but who would I be to argue with a bunch of armed government agents trying to take my guns, and ruin my security clearance, affecting my job, family, etc.!!! As for aiming a blue-helmeted soldiers, just remember that someone like John Kerry WILL, ABSOLUTELY WILL, turn over control of our military to the UN, so you'll be aiming at the guys on this board who serve our nation now, but will serve a global government if the treaty is ratified. Don't just be mad, act, sign up, write congress, write your newspaper, be an ambassador for gun owners. Mind your manners, be the better person, keep your composure, and educate all those you encounter. Show them that we are not a bunch of gun nuts, that we are intelligent, motivated, free, Americans who care about of our lives and our freedom. Check it out.www.nra.org

I just rejoined the NRA today after reading this post.Don't assume common sense and liberty will prevail.Urge your casual gun owner friends to join as well.
Link Posted: 10/6/2004 9:53:15 AM EST

Originally Posted By TealGunner:
As for aiming a blue-helmeted soldiers, just remember that someone like John Kerry WILL, ABSOLUTELY WILL, turn over control of our military to the UN, so you'll be aiming at the guys on this board who serve our nation now, but will serve a global government if the treaty is ratified.



I agree with you ideas and sentiment. Out of control, profane, red-neck stereotype behaviour is exactly what these people want from us. And I think that we should give them, instead, no less than our polished best.

However.

Should it come to targeting blue helmets, I don't care who they are. Anyone in our military, who took their oath to 'uphold and defend the Constitution' who takes orders from the UN to take away my guns, has instantly made himself a traitor to that oath, and to the spirit of the document that it represents. And I will not hesitate to treat that person as such. Even if it is someone from this board, from my church, from my neighborhood. It will hurt to do it. I don't want it to be that way. But I will smite my enemy if I am forced to. And if they come, they are my enemy. I can't afford to care who they are. They made their choice, at that point, and I have made mine. They're standing for their choice, and i'll stand for mine.

Molon Labe
Link Posted: 10/6/2004 10:33:58 AM EST

Originally Posted By mattimeo:

Originally Posted By TealGunner:
As for aiming a blue-helmeted soldiers, just remember that someone like John Kerry WILL, ABSOLUTELY WILL, turn over control of our military to the UN, so you'll be aiming at the guys on this board who serve our nation now, but will serve a global government if the treaty is ratified.



I agree with you ideas and sentiment. Out of control, profane, red-neck stereotype behaviour is exactly what these people want from us. And I think that we should give them, instead, no less than our polished best.

However.

Should it come to targeting blue helmets, I don't care who they are. Anyone in our military, who took their oath to 'uphold and defend the Constitution' who takes orders from the UN to take away my guns, has instantly made himself a traitor to that oath, and to the spirit of the document that it represents. And I will not hesitate to treat that person as such. Even if it is someone from this board, from my church, from my neighborhood. It will hurt to do it. I don't want it to be that way. But I will smite my enemy if I am forced to. And if they come, they are my enemy. I can't afford to care who they are. They made their choice, at that point, and I have made mine. They're standing for their choice, and i'll stand for mine.

Molon Labe




Thats very well put.

I would hope that the LEO's and Military personell on this board read this and understand that the country needs to have people make the right decision as far as rights and freedoms are concerned, and not just follow orders 'cause the LT said to do so, or loose your job. Because once our guns are gone, there is nothing stopping the rest of our rights being taken away. Nothing will stop the .gov from censoring every radio and tv station in america. Id hate to see the day when the freedom of the press is gone, freedom of religion, freedom to serve or not serve in the military. Think about it long and hard, if and when "they" ask to go house to house.

Link Posted: 10/6/2004 11:28:14 AM EST
I think it's time for the UN to stick to feeding the hungry and clearing old minefields. A UN with out the USA could cause more problems for us in the future.
Link Posted: 10/6/2004 12:11:10 PM EST
The UN can have my guns, BULLETS first.
Link Posted: 10/6/2004 12:14:51 PM EST
My question is to those who are currently active duty military or law enforcement. Are you willing to put on that blue helmet/beret? Think about it ...
I personally could not and would not do it. The day that I am told to confiscate guns, is the day I quit my job and become a "criminal" myself. I think those that dont quit realize that by doing the confiscations are likely to be signing there own death warrant as well. I know quite a few LEO's who feel the same way I do and would rather quit.
Link Posted: 10/6/2004 12:42:09 PM EST

Originally Posted By Lawman734:
My question is to those who are currently active duty military or law enforcement. Are you willing to put on that blue helmet/beret? Think about it ...
I personally could not and would not do it. The day that I am told to confiscate guns, is the day I quit my job and become a "criminal" myself. I think those that dont quit realize that by doing the confiscations are likely to be signing there own death warrant as well. I know quite a few LEO's who feel the same way I do and would rather quit.



Well "if" I had been on the fence in regards to the question asked it was quickly settled after reading Molon Labe's post, lol. Last thing I need is to have my ass shot off by one of you when and if "collection" time comes around. I think it would be in my best interest to join the criminal element. I'm damn sure not parting with mine so why should you. Hopefully fellow mil., Leo's and myself will never be faced with such an order.
Link Posted: 10/6/2004 12:54:44 PM EST

Originally Posted By Tweak:
I think nchapa's response goes here.



Thanks tweak, it was late
Link Posted: 10/6/2004 1:02:50 PM EST
[Last Edit: 10/6/2004 1:10:07 PM EST by MrKasab]
I joined the NRA 3 days ago, fulfilling a promise to join after the AWB sunset. Yes it was late, but better than never. Also will join Gun Owners of America. The GOA makes it just too easy for me and you to get involved in fighting for our rights. It just seems like more often than not we fight just too hold on to our rights instead of fighting to grab back more of our rights.
Edit to add: its been 3 minutes and I am now a member of the GOA, $20 for a one year membership. If you wont even do that, at least sign up for their email alerts on upcoming political action on guns. Its just too easy.
Link Posted: 10/6/2004 1:15:36 PM EST

Originally Posted By JeffersonDarcy:
i dont see how a UN treaty is at all binding on us. I for one do not recoginize the UN as a legitimate authority in the US. A bunch of euro-socialist pussies and third world trash.



Exactly.
Fuck the UN and fuck Rebecca Peters. If the UN and Rebecca Peters want my rifles, they can walk up my fron yard and get them. If Kerry wins this election, this country is over, pure and simple.
Link Posted: 10/6/2004 10:11:53 PM EST
Link Posted: 10/6/2004 10:37:25 PM EST
I am LEO in FLorida. There is NO WAY IN HELL I am putting on a blue UN hat and taking guns from people. If it comes to that, I'll throw in my badge! I can not and will not support a UN resolution that hinders the rights of the Constitution of the United States. I took an oath to it and I will stand by it to the end. SCREW THE UN and their little dog Kerry too!
Link Posted: 10/6/2004 11:08:44 PM EST

Originally Posted By RABIDFOX50:
I am LEO in FLorida. There is NO WAY IN HELL I am putting on a blue UN hat and taking guns from people. If it comes to that, I'll throw in my badge! I can not and will not support a UN resolution that hinders the rights of the Constitution of the United States. I took an oath to it and I will stand by it to the end. SCREW THE UN and their little dog Kerry too!



Many thanks.
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