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9/22/2017 12:11:25 AM
Posted: 8/5/2005 10:34:45 PM EDT


customwire.ap.org/dynamic/stories/N/NCAA_INDIAN_NICKNAMES?SITE=FLTAM&SECTION=SPORTS&TEMPLATE=DEFAULT&CTIME=2005-08-05-11-53-47

Florida State to Challenge Ban on Mascots

By MICHAEL MAROT
AP Sports Writer




INDIANAPOLIS (AP) -- Fed up with what it considers "hostile" and "abusive" American Indian nicknames, the NCAA announced Friday it would shut those words and images out of postseason tournaments, a move that left some school officials angry and threatening legal action.

Starting in February, any school with a nickname or logo considered racially or ethnically "hostile" or "abusive" by the NCAA would be prohibited from using them in postseason events. Mascots will not be allowed to perform at tournament games, and band members and cheerleaders will also be barred from using American Indians on their uniforms beginning in 2008.

Major college football teams are not subject to the ban because there is no official NCAA tournament.

Affected schools were quick to complain, and Florida State - home of the Seminoles - threatened legal action.

"That the NCAA would now label our close bond with the Seminole people as culturally 'hostile and abusive' is both outrageous and insulting," Florida State president T.K. Wetherell said in a statement.

"I intend to pursue all legal avenues to ensure that this unacceptable decision is overturned, and that this university will forever be associated with the 'unconquered' spirit of the Seminole Tribe of Florida," he added.

The committee also recommended that schools follow the examples of Wisconsin and Iowa by refusing to schedule contests against schools that use American Indian nicknames.

While NCAA officials admit they still can't force schools to change nicknames or logos, they are making a statement they believe is long overdue. Eighteen mascots, including Florida State's Seminole and Illinois' Illini, were on the list of offenders.

Those schools will not be permitted to host future NCAA tournament games, and if events have already been awarded to those sites, the school must cover any logos or nicknames that appear.

"Certainly some things remain to be answered from today, and one of those things is the definition of what is 'hostile or abusive,'" said Tom Hardy, a spokesman at Illinois.

The NCAA did not give a clear answer on that.

President Myles Brand noted that some schools using the Warrior nickname will not face sanctions because they do not use Indian symbols. One school, North Carolina-Pembroke - which uses the nickname Braves - will also be exempted because Brand said the school has historically had a high percentage of students, more than 20 percent, who are American Indians.

"We believe hostile or abusive nicknames are troubling to us and it can't continue," committee chairman Walter Harrison said. "We're trying to send a message, very strongly, saying that these mascots are not appropriate for NCAA championships."

The decision, however, quickly evoked passions and complaints from both sides.

At Florida State, Wetherell said the NCAA was trying to embarrass the school for using its nickname, even though the Seminole Tribe of Florida has given the university permission to continue using it.

"Other Seminole tribes are not supportive," said Charlotte Westerhaus, the NCAA vice president for diversity and inclusion.

Supporters also were unhappy.

Vernon Bellecourt, president of the National Coalition on Racism in Sports and Media and a member of the Anishinabe-Ojibwe Nation in Minnesota, approved of the ban but had hoped the NCAA would take even stronger action.

"We're not so happy about the fact that they didn't make the decision to ban the use of Indian team names and mascots," he said.

Harrison, president at the University of Hartford, said the executive committee does not have the authority to do that, and schools can still appeal their inclusion on the list.

Brand and Harrison said they hoped school officials would pursue policy changes through the NCAA first, before going to court.

"I suspect that some of those would like to having a ruling on that," Brand said. "But unless there is a change before Feb. 1, they will have to abide by it."

Two years ago, the NCAA recommended schools determine for themselves whether Indian depictions were offensive.

Among the schools to change nicknames in recent years were St. John's (from Redmen to Red Storm) and Marquette (from Warriors to Golden Eagles).

But that hasn't changed opinions on either side.

"They're not willing to give up this money," Bellecourt said, referring to merchandising revenue. "We would hope that it (the decision) was the handwriting on the wall that would urge them to drop these team names and mascots."

In other actions, the executive committee approved:

-Imposing stronger penalties for schools that fall well below the NCAA's new academic scoring system. Harrison said teams would receive a warning letter the first year; restrictions on scholarships, recruiting and playing time the second year; and a postseason ban the third year. If a school fails to meet the standard four consecutive years, all teams at that school would be ineligible for postseason play.

-Rewarding schools that perform consistently well in the classroom with public recognition and additional money. Schools that make significant improvements may also be singled out for recognition.

-Not penalizing schools for athletes who leave when circumstances are deemed beyond the control of the athlete or school. Included among the measure would be the dropping of programs or majors, or the death of a family member. Departures because of coaching changes would not be included. Schools could also salvage one point in the new academic measurement if underclassmen are academically eligible when they are drafted and would receive a bonus point if an underclassmen returned to complete his or her degree.

-A two-year contract extension for Brand. His deal was to run through Dec. 31, 2007 and now includes an indefinite two-year rollover.

-Recommended schools re-examine their policies regarding alcohol sales and advertising.
Link Posted: 8/5/2005 10:49:09 PM EDT
WTF??? is the world coming to.

Link Posted: 8/5/2005 10:59:51 PM EDT
PC will be the downfall of this country. Idiots!
Link Posted: 8/5/2005 11:03:53 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/5/2005 11:04:16 PM EDT by The_Macallan]


I was SOOO hoping to see this on a baseball field one day:




Ah well.
Link Posted: 8/6/2005 5:09:19 AM EDT
There is nothing that is going to stop these fucking socialists except a good ass kicking and boy do they have one coming.
Link Posted: 8/6/2005 6:09:29 AM EDT
I want to see how the universities are going to handle this...

Imagine the Fighting Illini...or the Seminoles?!

The 'Noles are a virtual lock for a post-season bowl appearance. Occasionally, they even make it to the big show...and their baseball team is very good too and is often in the CWS. So...NOW what???
Link Posted: 8/6/2005 6:22:31 AM EDT

Originally Posted By The_Macallan:

I was SOOO hoping to see this on a baseball field one day:

zoom.cafepress.com/0/932070_zoom.jpg


Ah well.



Well its already been on a basketball court.

Im happy with the ruling. Too bad it didnt go farther.

Whats funny is the Seminole tribes permission to use Native Iconography. Last time I saw a FSU Mascot he was dressed as more like a Lakota than a Seminole.
Link Posted: 8/6/2005 6:24:57 AM EDT
Maybe all the major schools should just pull out of the NCAA and form their own association, and then we would see how they like not having all that revenue come in
Link Posted: 8/6/2005 6:27:11 AM EDT
They even banned the name "warriors", IIRC.
Link Posted: 8/6/2005 6:38:42 AM EDT

Originally Posted By cyclone:
Maybe all the major schools should just pull out of the NCAA and form their own association, and then we would see how they like not having all that revenue come in



I like this idea.

but what prevents schools from telling these people to piss off?

can a judge order a school to chnage its name?
Link Posted: 8/6/2005 6:39:06 AM EDT
The NCAA may be on borrowed time anyway. Their lawsuit with the NIT isn't going too well & they have had problems for years with the "have" schools (big sport schools) & the "have nots" (mid-majors). They even limited the size of a school's press guide for football, for christ's sakes! How meddling can they get?

Eventually, the big boys will break away, form their own allience for sports & have a Div-I foot playoff for boocoo $$$$.
Link Posted: 8/6/2005 6:41:44 AM EDT

Originally Posted By cyclone:
Maybe all the major schools should just pull out of the NCAA and form their own association, and then we would see how they like not having all that revenue come in



That might work, IF you could get enough support. I would imagine that would be a *very* tell sell to the liberal student body in all of those schools, though...I'm sure student support for changing the name is high among the lefties.
Link Posted: 8/6/2005 6:48:59 AM EDT
This is something that has been broiling for years now...the liberal pc idiots have finally taken over the NCAA hiearchy. This sucks. Like Coach Bowden said last spring. How are they going to stop all the paraphanlia that has been used for years? This would cost the university millions of dollars to take every symbol, every sign and depiction of the Seminoles from the campus. Stupid, stupid, stupid. Of course these liberal schitt heads don't care about cost.

What will we be called now? The Florida State college of people? Stupid, stupid, stupid.

Well, good luck NCAA...we got a hell of alot of lawyers that are alumni and can't wait to do the pro bono work for the cause. Let the games begin, we got alot of people that will back the university on this. How in the hell can one woman from the NCAA make this policy and think it won't affect the university?
Link Posted: 8/6/2005 6:57:37 AM EDT



-A two-year contract extension for Brand. His deal was to run through Dec. 31, 2007 and now includes an indefinite two-year rollover.



Of course...
Link Posted: 8/6/2005 6:59:34 AM EDT
This is the person responsible for this action.

Politically correct idiot

Miss Westerhaus



yep...could have guessed it too.
Link Posted: 8/6/2005 7:02:35 AM EDT

Originally Posted By cyclone:
Maybe all the major schools should just pull out of the NCAA and form their own association, and then we would see how they like not having all that revenue come in



+1

HH
Link Posted: 8/6/2005 7:11:21 AM EDT

Originally Posted By HoustonHusker:

Originally Posted By cyclone:
Maybe all the major schools should just pull out of the NCAA and form their own association, and then we would see how they like not having all that revenue come in



+1

HH



That would take a major coup...I like it, but if the larger universities ever had any say in what the new alliance did it would corrupt the whole process in a matter of months. The NCAA is shooting itself in the foot here.
Link Posted: 8/6/2005 7:22:03 AM EDT
Link Posted: 8/6/2005 11:06:20 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Airwolf: Affected schools were quick to complain, and Florida State - home of the Seminoles - threatened legal action.

"That the NCAA would now label our close bond with the Seminole people as culturally 'hostile and abusive' is both outrageous and insulting," Florida State president T.K. Wetherell said in a statement.

"I intend to pursue all legal avenues to ensure that this unacceptable decision is overturned, and that this university will forever be associated with the 'unconquered' spirit of the Seminole Tribe of Florida," he added.

Way to go 'Noles! Don't bow down to "Da Man".
Link Posted: 8/6/2005 11:24:16 PM EDT
I guess my favorite team, the "Slappahoes" are verboten?
Link Posted: 8/6/2005 11:45:33 PM EDT
I always wanted ALL the teams named with racial slurs.

11PM Sportsecap would sound like a night at the race riots.


Wops slap Hebes 10-8,

Chinks lose to Spooks 3-7

Polacks clobber Harps 11-7.

and so on.

That way EVERYONE could be equally offended.
Link Posted: 8/7/2005 12:51:44 PM EDT
panzies
Link Posted: 8/7/2005 12:56:14 PM EDT
Isn't it too agressive to call the team in possession of the ball "on the offensive"? Then there's all the hitting and running into each other. Let's do away with it all and just sit down for a cup of tea and play with Barbies.
Link Posted: 8/7/2005 12:58:37 PM EDT
POA - The Pussification of America continues.
Link Posted: 8/7/2005 1:03:04 PM EDT
If an "Offensive" team should make it to post season play they should temporarily rename their team the "PC Executive Idiots" and carry on.
Link Posted: 8/7/2005 1:05:18 PM EDT
The solution would be the schools withdraw from the NCAA, and go to another league.
Link Posted: 8/7/2005 6:02:15 PM EDT

Originally Posted By warlord:
The solution would be the schools withdraw from the NCAA, and go to another league.





It will happen not too far in the future, IMO.

Link Posted: 8/8/2005 7:01:50 AM EDT
Illinios,Iowa,N Dakota,S Dakota,Utah,Texas. all indian names doe this mean Texas Tech, UT ,And Texas A&M have to change their name to compete?

Wait maybe if we added "resort and casino" to the end,let's see Florida State University Resort and Casino. That's better.
Link Posted: 8/8/2005 7:13:25 AM EDT
Someone is sitting around with too much time on their hands.

We've had the same BS here in Calif., Jackie Goldberg in the Calif. St. Assembly(she's a lesbian) and former teacher and LAUSD(L.A. Unified School Dist.) board member routinely introduces bills to do away with Indian-type names in the local high schools nicknames. She's been voted down many times because of the immenses costs associated with scheme.
Link Posted: 8/8/2005 7:24:50 AM EDT

Charlotte Westerhaus, the NCAA vice president for diversity and inclusion.


Such a job exists? The world is truly INSANE!
Link Posted: 8/8/2005 7:26:11 AM EDT
I am totally surprised at this. I guess since no one has pushed the issue, someone had to.

Fighting Irish
FS Seminoles


Lots of folks might get pissed.
Link Posted: 8/8/2005 7:28:25 AM EDT

Originally Posted By piccolo:
I always wanted ALL the teams named with racial slurs.

11PM Sportsecap would sound like a night at the race riots.

Wops slap Hebes 10-8,

Chinks lose to Spooks 3-7

Polacks clobber Harps 11-7.

and so on.


That way EVERYONE could be equally offended.


Link Posted: 8/8/2005 7:43:36 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Wobblin-Goblin:

Originally Posted By piccolo:
I always wanted ALL the teams named with racial slurs.

11PM Sportsecap would sound like a night at the race riots.

Wops slap Hebes 10-8,

Chinks lose to Spooks 3-7

Polacks clobber Harps 11-7.

and so on.


That way EVERYONE could be equally offended.





I have to agree. that is pretty damn funny!
Link Posted: 8/8/2005 7:44:46 AM EDT
Seminole Nation will not go without a fight, With the Seminole Tribe firmly backing the University, it's going to be WAR!!!!!!!

FSU.com

Florida State University responds to NCAA decision banning use of Native American symbols

FSU President T.K. Wetherell has issued the following statement in response to action August 5 by the National Collegiate Athletic Association banning the use of American Indian mascots during NCAA championship games. In taking the action, the NCAA deemed FSU's use of the Seminole name and symbols as "hostile or abusive," despite the recent formal endorsement by the Seminole Tribe of Florida for their use.

* * * STATEMENT FROM FSU PRESIDENT T.K. WETHERELL * * *

Florida State University is stunned at the complete lack of appreciation for cultural diversity shown by the National Collegiate Athletic Association's executive committee, which announced today a policy banning schools using Native American names and symbols from hosting NCAA championship events. That the NCAA would now label our close bond with the Seminole Tribe of Florida as culturally "hostile and abusive" is both outrageous and insulting.

On June 17, the Tribal Council of the Seminole Tribe of Florida spoke unequivocally of its support for Florida State University in its use of the Seminole name and related symbols. Accordingly, I intend to pursue all legal avenues to ensure that this unacceptable decision is overturned, and that this university will forever be associated with the "unconquered" spirit of the Seminole Tribe of Florida.

National surveys have shown in recent years that an overwhelming majority of Native Americans are not offended by the use of Native American names and symbols. In making its decision, the executive committee has been swayed by a strident minority of activists who claim to speak for all Native Americans. It is unconscionable that the Seminole Tribe of Florida has been ignored.

The rules as we understand them would have us cover the Seminole name and symbol as if we were embarrassed, and any committee that would think that is a proper and respectful treatment of Native Americans should be ashamed.

MAX B. OSCEOLA, JR., SEMINOLE TRIBE OF FLORIDA COUNCIL REPRESENTATIVE, GREETS FSU PRESIDENT T.K. WETHERELL PRIOR TO THE TRIBE'S RECENT FORMAL ENDORSEMENT OF FSU'S USE OF SEMINOLE NAME AND SYMBOLS.


UNCONQUERED
Link Posted: 8/8/2005 8:27:56 AM EDT
Can someone say BACKLASH?
Link Posted: 8/8/2005 8:34:46 AM EDT
Woo woo woo woo woo woo woo.
Link Posted: 8/13/2005 10:29:09 PM EDT
No way in hell FSU will change their name, the Seminole tribe endorses it, another example of college liberals running away with politicalcorrectness. The games won't be the same without this:

FSU War Chant
Link Posted: 8/13/2005 10:48:27 PM EDT

Originally Posted By LANCEMAN:
No way in hell FSU will change their name, the Seminole tribe endorses it, another example of college liberals running away with politicalcorrectness. The games won't be the same without this:

FSU War Chant



Is there any way to combat the idiocy displayed, largely, by that one dumb-ass PC dim-wit woman on the NCAA board who pushed this through?
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