Most influential Gun Guru?

[ARCHIVED THREAD] - Most influential Gun Guru?

uncleSAM Joined Jan 2001 Posts EE Offline TX, USA	Posted: 4/29/2001 2:04:33 PM EDT Who is (in your opinion) the most influential gun guru? I think maybe Jeff Copper, although I don't agree with everything he says. Let me know how you feel.

Paul Member Joined Nov 2000 Posts EE Offline CA, USA	Posted: 4/29/2001 2:06:57 PM EDT Rambo! [:D]
	Celebrating the Second Amendment One Fine Firearm at a Time

LARRYG Member Joined Feb 2001 Posts EE Offline GA, USA	Posted: 4/29/2001 2:12:51 PM EDT Rambo???? The guy who played the character is just another draft dodging coward, like Klinton.
	If it's a Colt, it's a copy of an original ArmaLite. I am not LARRYG36. Racing is life. Anything that happens before or after is just waiting. If your AR10 is marked Geneseo, IL, it's still an AR10 no matter what some people say.

ar15operator

Joined Feb 2001
Posts
EE Offline

FL, USA

Posted: 4/29/2001 3:27:58 PM EDT

Of the people you would know of Jeff Cooper, The most infuential in my career is Jeff Hall. He waxed a badguy out of a Jet Ranger (with an M-16)that was crabbing towards a badguys hide after the badguy shot and killed his partner sitting next to him. He is a warrior and has the ability to pass on lessons learned. BTW he teaches at Frontsight and Gunsite now that he is retired. Hunter out...

Troy Member Joined Nov 2000 Posts EE Offline CA, USA	Posted: 4/29/2001 3:28:32 PM EDT I don't know this Mr. Copper, but Jeff Cooper would be my pick, though I too disagree with a few of his ideas. Still, he laid some very important foundation that's been built upon by others. -Troy
	Ammo FAQ: www.ammo-oracle.com (Old) Mag FAQ: magfaq.tripod.com Barrel? Go CHROME or go home.

Paul Member Joined Nov 2000 Posts EE Offline CA, USA	Posted: 4/29/2001 3:32:11 PM EDT Not that "RAMBO" - rambo from the email list.
	Celebrating the Second Amendment One Fine Firearm at a Time

oldeschool Joined Nov 2000 Posts EE Offline NJ, USA	Posted: 4/29/2001 3:36:01 PM EDT Yeah, I'd have to go with Jeff Cooper, with Elmer Keith a close second, at least in the handgun department. Ed McGivern seems to have fallen out of favor with the decline of the revolver and rise of the polymer, laser sighted, tac lighted 9's and .40's, but that old guy could shoot better and faster than almost anyone I can think of!

sharkbait Joined Mar 2001 Posts EE Offline CO, USA	Posted: 4/29/2001 3:46:44 PM EDT maybe not a gun GURU but I would have to say BOSTON T.PARTY ( Boston,s Gun BIBIE )or JOHN ROSS

M4 Member Joined Nov 2000 Posts EE Offline FL, USA	Posted: 4/29/2001 4:07:28 PM EDT Duncan Long He has a bunch of great books on all sorts of firearms. Including a few really good AR15/M16 books.
	كافر AMERICAN INFIDEL كافر

TheSniper Joined Mar 2001 Posts EE Offline IN, USA	Posted: 4/29/2001 4:12:34 PM EDT My vote goes to - Col. Jeff Cooper USMCRet [+]:D] [sniper] The Sniper

Troy Member Joined Nov 2000 Posts EE Offline CA, USA	Posted: 4/29/2001 4:43:53 PM EDT McGivern was a great shooter, and Keith was a great experimenter, but neither were the teacher that Cooper was and is. That's the difference. -Troy
	Ammo FAQ: www.ammo-oracle.com (Old) Mag FAQ: magfaq.tripod.com Barrel? Go CHROME or go home.

03shooter Joined Apr 2001 Posts EE Offline OK, USA	Posted: 4/29/2001 4:44:25 PM EDT Jeff Cooper, Elmer Keith, Skeeter Skelton, Jim Carmichal, take your pick.

Striker Member Joined Nov 2000 Posts EE Offline CAN	Posted: 4/29/2001 5:06:09 PM EDT If your talking actuall urban "combat" experience the Jim Cirillo (sp?) of the NYPD "stake out squad" would qualify as an expert. I can't remember the exact number of gun fights he won. Another "guru" IMHO is Bill Jordan if your talking Old School. His articles about working Border Patrol are classic.
	Originally Posted By Jim-Scoutten: There's no way to clean up GD. Posted By Bed_Head: And yes, all women know the power of the boobies.... and the pie too.

Imbroglio Joined Jan 2001 Posts EE Offline USA	Posted: 4/29/2001 6:01:22 PM EDT gunkid

ShamusMcOI Member Joined Apr 2001 Posts EE Offline MO, USA	Posted: 4/29/2001 6:13:30 PM EDT My dad, no doubt about it. He's the one who got me interested, relayed to me the importance of the second amendment, and most importantly, how to handle firearms in a safe manner. No other big names have had nearly as much influence on me when it comes to guns as him.
	Does Somebody Need A Hug?

ShamusMcOI Member Joined Apr 2001 Posts EE Offline MO, USA	Posted: 4/29/2001 6:15:20 PM EDT My dad, no doubt about it. He's the one who got me interested, relayed to me the importance of the second amendment, and most importantly, how to handle firearms in a safe manner. No other big names have had nearly as much influence on me when it comes to guns as him.
	Does Somebody Need A Hug?

uncleSAM Joined Jan 2001 Posts EE Offline TX, USA	Posted: 4/29/2001 6:21:44 PM EDT I just noticed I misspelled Cooper on my first post, sorry. I see no takers for Massad Ayoob.

BlackandGreen Joined Feb 2001 Posts EE Offline NY, USA	Posted: 4/29/2001 6:22:42 PM EDT John M Browning.........John C Garand...................[shotgun]

Juggernaut Joined Feb 2001 Posts EE Offline TN, USA	Posted: 4/29/2001 6:26:32 PM EDT Originally Posted By M4: Duncan Long He has a bunch of great books on all sorts of firearms. Including a few really good AR15/M16 books. View Quote Duncan LONG? You gotta be kidding me! [url]http://www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?id=6667[/url]

Juggernaut Joined Feb 2001 Posts EE Offline TN, USA	Posted: 4/29/2001 6:29:05 PM EDT BTW, my answer has to the Colonel. Cooper is very opinionated, and I don't always agree with him, but his New Pistolcraft alone was a boon. He is wrong about the "poodleshooter", though.

jomeokee Joined Mar 2001 Posts EE Offline NC, USA	Posted: 4/29/2001 6:40:49 PM EDT Trick shot artist Bob Munden who is featured regularly on American Shooter, really funny and a pretty good shot!!

CIB Joined Jan 2001 Posts EE Offline AR, USA	Posted: 4/29/2001 6:57:34 PM EDT I'm with B&G, John Browning.

BlackandGreen Joined Feb 2001 Posts EE Offline NY, USA	Posted: 4/29/2001 7:05:14 PM EDT Originally Posted By no ma''am: I just noticed I misspelled Cooper on my first post, sorry. I see no takers for Massad Ayoob. View Quote No offense to massad, but there are people on this board who could keep up with him i believe.....anyone heard of a guy named bill jordan?.........[pistol]

SS109 Member Joined Feb 2001 Posts EE Offline CO, USA	Posted: 4/29/2001 7:11:08 PM EDT I like Cooper because he pisses me off. I still would rather take my M1A Scout on a scouting mission than his overpriced plastic POS. (He is probably right, because he has much more experience than me.) I also like Ayoob, he seems to be very analytical and use real life scenarios to teach.
	When They Knock Down Your Front Door, How You Going To Come? With Your Hands On Your Head Or On The Trigger Of Your Gun? Bassist Paul Simonon-The Clash

oldeschool Joined Nov 2000 Posts EE Offline NJ, USA	Posted: 4/29/2001 7:17:51 PM EDT Another "guru" IMHO is Bill Jordan if your talking Old School. His articles about working Border Patrol are classic. View Quote Damn, Striker, you're right (slap to forehead!) Must be Alzheimers setting in early. [;)] Bill Jordan was/is "dabomb" (yeah, I know that's outta date too, but WTF)....Man knew his shit.

WILSON

Member

Joined Nov 2000
Posts
EE Offline

IN, USA

Posted: 4/29/2001 8:05:21 PM EDT

black&green:John M Browning.........John C Garand...................[shotgun]

View Quote

Good point. Ditto on Elmer Keith, & Skeeter Skelton. If it has to be someone that's still alive - Gaston Glock. If "influential" means a world class shooter - Jerry Miculek, & Bob Munden - both are light-years ahead of most (with a lot more weapons than American Shooter will ever show). To me influential people usually means really decent people, Miculek, and Munden both ARE! I've met Col. Cooper twice now (even bought him lunch when he [u]WAS[/u] TR). He IS the top 1911 (user, thinker/philosopher & real world tactics) expert in the world, & has been since 1957! I know he's a great teacher too - he really does deserve credit for what he's done - nobody can ever take that away from him. But the guy is a rigid minded "My way is the ONLY way!" bitter asshole who thinks pistol design ended in 1911, & automatically thinks anyone who disagrees is an idiot. Of course he [u]is[/u] right about [b]most[/b] of his opinions. What in the hell does that have to do with his accomplishments? - actually nothing, but his hardened, unchangeable, sclerotic attitude just makes him a little less "influential" (to me). $0,000, 000.02

Perfection! Wait ... what? Wadaya mean "generation 1,.. 2,.. 3,.. and 4"?

DizzyRooster

Joined Jan 2001
Posts
EE Offline

GA, USA

Posted: 4/29/2001 9:21:26 PM EDT

in my opinion: Jeff Cooper Bill Ruger Clint Smith Gadston Glock Gabe Suarez and Jeff Gonzales (HALO group) Bill Laughridge Bill Wilson .....just to name a few. There are so many new young guys out there doing really impressive things with handguns, rifles, and handling technique. One very fine example of new rising talent can be seen at www.blackholeguns.com. These guys are machining some really beautiful guns in their shop.

Colt_M4_Carbine Joined Nov 2000 Posts EE Offline TX, USA	Posted: 4/29/2001 10:14:38 PM EDT I vote for Elmer... [img]http://www.looneycartoons.com/looneydonotleech/elmer/ElmerFudd005.jpg[/img]

thistle Joined Feb 2001 Posts EE Offline KY, USA	Posted: 4/29/2001 11:22:16 PM EDT LMAOROTL

WILSON Member Joined Nov 2000 Posts EE Offline IN, USA	Posted: 4/29/2001 11:46:14 PM EDT [center] [img]http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/4387/andypicts2/barn01.jpg[/img][/center]
	Perfection! Wait ... what? Wadaya mean "generation 1,.. 2,.. 3,.. and 4"?

OlDad Joined Mar 2001 Posts EE Offline IN, USA	Posted: 4/30/2001 5:31:36 PM EDT Elmer Keith, Skeeter Skelton, John Taffin, Bob Munden, Bill Jordan.

Finnbear Joined Mar 2001 Posts EE Offline OH, USA	Posted: 4/30/2001 8:46:48 PM EDT John M Browning gets my first vote. Elmer Keith, Bill Jordan, Jeff Cooper are way up on the list too. Finnbear out

ar15operator Joined Feb 2001 Posts EE Offline FL, USA	Posted: 4/30/2001 9:16:50 PM EDT Ayoob would be who I called (in a New York minute) to be on my defense team if I was involved in a shooting that landed me in court. I have sat beside him in many classes and as far as a gun guru (training type) I think I am a better instructor. Hunter out...

LAgunman2K Joined Mar 2001 Posts EE Offline CA, USA	Posted: 5/1/2001 12:21:30 AM EDT Mikhail Kalashnikov Jim Clark Sr Mr UZI

LawDawg Joined Feb 2001 Posts EE Offline USA	Posted: 5/1/2001 12:29:57 AM EDT Originally Posted By Striker: Another "guru" IMHO is Bill Jordan if your talking Old School. His articles about working Border Patrol are classic. View Quote Bill Jordan's patrol methods would get him severly flamed by the "patriots" on this board. In fact he devotes alot of print in one of his books to the "throw down" gun. So I'm surprised to see him mentioned.

GWIGG Joined Jan 2001 Posts EE Offline NC, USA	Posted: 5/1/2001 2:24:38 AM EDT Elmer Keith, Massad Ayoob.

rigger Joined Mar 2001 Posts EE Offline KS, USA	Posted: 5/1/2001 2:41:16 AM EDT In the recent period of modern arms development, it would be tough to beat Bill Ruger. One lemon to his credit, but I wish I had a few of them.

texastactical Member Joined Feb 2001 Posts EE Offline TX, USA	Posted: 5/1/2001 5:55:10 AM EDT RAY CHAPMAN!!!!! Ive known Ray for a few years now and have even shot with him. Its so cool to listen to him talk about the old days and Jeff Cooper. He has so many cool and funny stories. He is a very cool and gracious host. ONe helluva guy!! Michael "Iron Mike" Webb Texas Tactical http://sites.netscape.net/texastactical/homepage
	Michael "Iron Mike" Webb Texas Tactical WWW.TEXASTACTICAL.NET

Sigifrith Joined Feb 2001 Posts EE Offline IL, USA	Posted: 5/1/2001 6:34:53 AM EDT [Last Edit: 5/1/2001 6:37:34 AM EDT by Gwalchmai] FrankTheSpank

oldeschool

Joined Nov 2000
Posts
EE Offline

NJ, USA

Posted: 5/1/2001 7:28:59 PM EDT

Bill Jordan's patrol methods would get him severly flamed by the "patriots" on this board. In fact he devotes alot of print in one of his books to the "throw down" gun.

View Quote

Now, Bill Jordan was an Old Old School cop. "Don't leave home without your throwdown" Lawdawg!(to paraphrase some credit card commercial)....If those NYC cops that had popped Diullo or whatever his name was, had read Jordan's book, would have saved themselves a lot of problems and money on legal fees.

oldeschool Joined Nov 2000 Posts EE Offline NJ, USA	Posted: 5/1/2001 7:32:31 PM EDT Browning Garand Stoner Mauser Luger Ruger Great gun designers, engineers, machinists, but don't recall any books, articles they ever wrote about using the fruit of their genius...

[ARCHIVED THREAD] - Most influential Gun Guru?

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