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11/22/2017 10:05:29 PM
Posted: 8/21/2004 3:09:01 AM EST



Cops Disciplined for Tasering Grandmother




KANSAS CITY, Mo. - Police said Friday two officers have been disciplined and department policy changed following an investigation into the officers use of a taser when arresting a 66-year-old grandmother who honked her car horn at a police cruiser.



Louise Jones was arrested in June on charges of misuse of a car horn on a city street, resisting arrest and intentionally inflicting bodily harm on an officer. Her husband, Fred Jones, 74, was also arrested and charged with interfering with an arrest.


Police said Louise Jones tussled with officers when they tried to give her a ticket for honking the horn. One of the officers used the taser, which is capable of issuing a 50,000-volt shock, to stun her. The officers said Fred Jones then came downstairs and jumped on one of the officers' backs.


Louise Jones said she pulled away from the police when one of the officers grabbed her arm, and her husband said one of the officers had his knee on his wife's chest.


As a result of an internal investigation, the department has increased the threshold for when taser use is appropriate and now requires a field commander to look into each taser deployment. Police also have developed a task force made up of community members and department personnel to look into the department's current taser-use policies.


"This was an unfortunate incident that I believe could have been avoided if there would have been a less confrontational environment," said Chief Richard Easley in a statement. "Officers of this department, however, are held to a very high standard in their professional conduct, regardless of the conduct of other persons."


Police said the investigation was delayed because Louise Jones and other witnesses declined to be interviewed by investigators, though the department did review affidavits from Jones and the witnesses that were submitted by her attorney.


Police said the officers involved did cooperate in the investigation. The statement didn't indicate how the officers were disciplined.


Link Posted: 8/21/2004 3:13:42 AM EST
Your link doesn't work for me.
Link Posted: 8/21/2004 3:22:13 AM EST
I was in favor of the cops ramming the speeding car in GA that they had chased 76 miles at speeds of over 100 mph. I remained neutral on the Florida Hurricane victim taser case. But I have to say this one is hard to justify. I mean any cop who can't restrain a 66 year old woman probably doesn't need to be a cop to begin with. Good grief.

BTW, I listed my take on those other examples just to show that I'm neither a cop basher or a police apologist. I look at them all on a case by case basis and voice my opinion.
Link Posted: 8/21/2004 3:30:20 AM EST

Originally Posted By Charging_Handle:
I was in favor of the cops ramming the speeding car in GA that they had chased 76 miles at speeds of over 100 mph. I remained neutral on the Florida Hurricane victim taser case. But I have to say this one is hard to justify. I mean any cop who can't restrain a 66 year old woman probably doesn't need to be a cop to begin with. Good grief.

BTW, I listed my take on those other examples just to show that I'm neither a cop basher or a police apologist. I look at them all on a case by case basis and voice my opinion.




Agreed.

Agreed.
Link Posted: 8/21/2004 3:31:30 AM EST

Originally Posted By Wobblin-Goblin:
Your link doesn't work for me.



What link? Did I miss a link? Where's the link?
Link Posted: 8/21/2004 3:33:17 AM EST

Originally Posted By flashlegs:

Originally Posted By Wobblin-Goblin:
Your link doesn't work for me.


What link? Did I miss a link? Where's the link?


That's the point, bud.
Link Posted: 8/21/2004 3:36:05 AM EST

Originally Posted By Wobblin-Goblin:

Originally Posted By flashlegs:

Originally Posted By Wobblin-Goblin:
Your link doesn't work for me.


What link? Did I miss a link? Where's the link?


That's the point, bud.



Sorry, bud. Here you go, bud.

link for my bud

Can I call you bud?
Link Posted: 8/21/2004 3:37:33 AM EST

Originally Posted By Wobblin-Goblin:

Originally Posted By flashlegs:

Originally Posted By Wobblin-Goblin:
Your link doesn't work for me.


What link? Did I miss a link? Where's the link?


That's the point, bud.



This is kind of a dupe.

His post does report some follow up though.

The world is going nuts , a little more each day --- so few notice.
Link Posted: 8/21/2004 3:39:39 AM EST

Originally Posted By flashlegs:
Sorry, bud. Here you go, bud.

link for my bud

Can I call you bud?


Thanks, bud. Sure, bud. Anything you say, bud.

Link Posted: 8/21/2004 3:50:55 AM EST
If she would have submited to the officers none of this whould have happened. Who the fuck does she think she is, honking her horn at the police? She's lucky she only got tazered.
Link Posted: 8/21/2004 3:52:20 AM EST

Originally Posted By Max_Power:
If she would have submited to the officers none of this whould have happened. Who the fuck does she think she is, honking her horn at the police? She's lucky she only got tazered.


On yer knees boyah!
Link Posted: 8/21/2004 3:52:58 AM EST

Originally Posted By Max_Power:
If she would have submited to the officers none of this whould have happened. Who the fuck does she think she is, honking her horn at the police? She's lucky she only got tazered.







Resistance is futile --- submit.


She is of another time, another set of values, the new generation would not understand her.
Link Posted: 8/21/2004 3:55:16 AM EST
Link Posted: 8/21/2004 4:15:05 AM EST

Originally Posted By flashlegs:

Originally Posted By Charging_Handle:
I was in favor of the cops ramming the speeding car in GA that they had chased 76 miles at speeds of over 100 mph. I remained neutral on the Florida Hurricane victim taser case. But I have to say this one is hard to justify. I mean any cop who can't restrain a 66 year old woman probably doesn't need to be a cop to begin with. Good grief.

BTW, I listed my take on those other examples just to show that I'm neither a cop basher or a police apologist. I look at them all on a case by case basis and voice my opinion.




Agreed.

Agreed.



That is totally fucked up, those asshat cops should be charged with assault with a deadly weapon,that could of killed that old women,electrical currents can disrupt the heart rythem, if she would have had a pacemaker it probably would have fucked her up. They should at least be fired and never allowed to work in law enforcement again
Link Posted: 8/21/2004 4:27:47 AM EST
Link Posted: 8/21/2004 4:30:32 AM EST
Link Posted: 8/21/2004 4:30:34 AM EST
What a sick fucking world we live in!
Link Posted: 8/21/2004 4:31:35 AM EST
One cop hands his doughnut to another and says, "Watch this!"

C'mon guys, try to see it from the cops' perspective. What is the point in carrying all this neato-torpedo gear around unless you get to use it!

On the serious side, I see a not so distant future where the police will have the equivalent of a Star Trek phaser set on 'stun.' It will be used in almost all situations from 'mildly tense' on up the scale. This will be justified by the increasing cost of health care caused by scuffles and fights with the public. A single back injury inflicted on a LEO or alleged perp can cost the taxpayer's millions. Your city council (this means YOU!) will demand a policy of 'stun first, ask questions later.'

Link Posted: 8/21/2004 4:34:33 AM EST
Ok. Person honks their horn at you. Big whoop.

Some people get on a bit of a power trip and will arrest or fine upon slightest provocation. If you are incapable of smiling through an insult, then you don't need to be a cop. That simple.

All of this over a honked horn is rediculous.

A mature cop that had more brains than balls would have just ignored it and gone on about his day. Too bad they don't make many policemen like that anymore....
Link Posted: 8/21/2004 4:38:05 AM EST
Senior Citizens who probably haven't had many (or any) contacts with LEO's in their lives confronted by cops who develop an "us against them" mentality by having to deal with REAL assholes and criminals all day long.

It's not a good mix and it isn't likely to get better anytime in the future.

Common sense is SO dead in this world as is basic courtesy and basic respect for other humans.
Link Posted: 8/21/2004 4:42:31 AM EST
Link Posted: 8/21/2004 4:53:48 AM EST
Maybe she was a feral senior citizen.
Link Posted: 8/21/2004 4:54:22 AM EST
Link Posted: 8/21/2004 5:05:29 AM EST

Originally Posted By JohnnyEgo:
Maybe she was a feral senior citizen.



We have a lot of them down here in Florida don't we.
Link Posted: 8/21/2004 5:20:06 AM EST

Originally Posted By Sweep:
Note to self: Don't honk horn at police!



tell me about it
Link Posted: 8/21/2004 5:25:26 AM EST

Originally Posted By avengeusa:

Originally Posted By Sweep:
Note to self: Don't honk horn at police!



tell me about it



She was just using her horn to say Hi -=
Link Posted: 8/21/2004 8:34:32 AM EST

Originally Posted By JohnnyEgo:
Maybe she was a feral senior citizen.




Perhaps. She could have made a fine pet if she was offered some love and Old Lady Kibble.

Common sense died at the hands of both parties in this case.


1) Old lady shouldn't have honked at the police in the first place (do not invite the man into your life)
2) Cops should have just let it go anyway



This is probably the result of some fucked up department policies that say something like "Taser use is right above verbal commands on the force continuum!"


As a result of an internal investigation, the department has increased the threshold for when taser use is appropriate



"Oh crap! It's an old lady! Zap her!"
Link Posted: 8/22/2004 3:57:53 AM EST

Originally Posted By Ngog_Nrythrng:
One cop hands his doughnut to another and says, "Watch this!"

C'mon guys, try to see it from the cops' perspective. What is the point in carrying all this neato-torpedo gear around unless you get to use it!

On the serious side, I see a not so distant future where the police will have the equivalent of a Star Trek phaser set on 'stun.' It will be used in almost all situations from 'mildly tense' on up the scale. This will be justified by the increasing cost of health care caused by scuffles and fights with the public. A single back injury inflicted on a LEO or alleged perp can cost the taxpayer's millions. Your city council (this means YOU!) will demand a policy of 'stun first, ask questions later.'




Just a note. Do you realize there are folks that think Phasers are real, and police should be armed with them instead of those nasty old guns? It's even made it onto the city council agenda for discussion.

That was a REALLY entertaining city council meeting.
Link Posted: 8/22/2004 4:12:00 AM EST
Link Posted: 8/22/2004 4:18:17 AM EST

Originally Posted By flashlegs:

Originally Posted By Charging_Handle:
I was in favor of the cops ramming the speeding car in GA that they had chased 76 miles at speeds of over 100 mph. I remained neutral on the Florida Hurricane victim taser case. But I have to say this one is hard to justify. I mean any cop who can't restrain a 66 year old woman probably doesn't need to be a cop to begin with. Good grief.

BTW, I listed my take on those other examples just to show that I'm neither a cop basher or a police apologist. I look at them all on a case by case basis and voice my opinion.




Agreed.

Agreed.



+1
Link Posted: 8/22/2004 4:34:07 AM EST

Less than safe?

The ''taser'' gun is one of a new generation of electro-shock weapons. Developed and produced in the USA, tasers shoot fishhook darts which attach themselves to the victims body and through which the user can deliver a 50,000-volt shock at the press of a button. A US company claims that its new version of the taser gun has been marketed to police forces in Australia, Argentina, Brazil, Canada, France, Germany, Israel, Mexico, New Zealand, Paraguay, Peru, the Philippines, Poland, South Africa, South Korea, Slovenia, Sweden, the United Kingdom (UK) and Venezuela. None of these governments has published detailed studies of the effects and suitability of Taser guns for use in law enforcement.

Amnesty International has for years highlighted the way in which devices using more recent technological developments, such as high-voltage electro-shock stun weapons, have been used around the world to facilitate torture and ill-treatment.

In its first report, a UK government Steering Group examining ongoing research in several countries into less potentially lethal alternatives to plastic bullets, has underscored a number of the medical concerns raised by Amnesty International, stating: ''[a]lthough electrical incapacitation devices (EID) such as ''tasers'' have been used for many years by law-enforcement agencies in the US, the biophysical and physiological basis of their effectiveness and safety does not appear to be well understood''.

All states have an obligation to avoid the arbitrary and excessive use of force by law enforcement officials, including force that tends to inflict unwarranted injury or pain. The fact that the effects of tasers can vary according to a number of factors, raises serious concerns about the safety of these devices and about the ability of the user to ensure that they apply only the minimum amount of force necessary. For example, tests on the new taser show that the darts often missed their target and hit more vulnerable parts of the body; the electrical output varies according to whether the battery is fully charged or depleted; the effects may vary according to what kind of clothing the victim is wearing; and there is some evidence that climatic conditions can also have an effect.

However, despite the lack of basic knowledge about whether its effects are arbitrary in many instances, the taser is being promoted as a ''safe'' less than lethal device. Once in the global marketplace, there is also a very real danger that devices will find their way to countries with persistent patterns of human rights violations. In recent years US taser guns have been promoted at international arms and security fairs in Poland, Qatar, Germany, France, Mexico, Spain and the Russian Federation.

The US government is encouraging US companies to design and produce new so-called ''less than lethal'' devices which can be used by the security forces to paralyse or incapacitate individuals. The companies involved in making and promoting these devices claim that they provide safe alternative methods of control. Critics, however, have cast doubt on their safety and questioned the use of some devices which are so easy to misuse that they can encourage torture or ill-treatment.

There is an arsenal of new products at the design or prototype stage for immobilizing and incapacitating human beings. Radio frequency weapons, for example, use microwaves to zap anyone straying in an irradiated area to temperatures of up to 55oC. Malodorant systems are based on stench chemicals, such as human excrement and rotting carcasses, which can be stored in containers that release the agent when someone walks over them. Immobilizing chemicals can also be released in this way, although such indiscriminate targeting would breach both the Geneva and the Convention on the Prohibition of the Development, Production and Stockpiling of Bacteriological (Biological) and Toxin Weapons and on their Destruction. Other devices which could be used in a similarly indiscriminate way against vulnerable populations, for example against fleeing refugees at borders, include perimeter fences with electro-shock stun and kill options and the new taser mine that is activated by the victim via a trip device or other sensors and shoots out darts some 15-30 feet through which 50,000 volts are pulsed for up to an hour.

Despite the claims of companies promoting such devices as a new generation of ''safe'' alternatives, there has been very little independent research into the effects these sorts of weapons can have in real-life situations. Amnesty International continues to receive reports of improperly tested weapons being used to inflict excruciating pain and serious injuries. Fatalities have been reported following the use of electro-shock weapons. Are these devices ''non-lethal''? Do they lend themselves to the arbitrary and excessive use of force? Right now, these questions cannot be answered with any degree of certainty. All we do know is that these immensely powerful weapons are being developed, manufactured or deployed without effective public oversight while the research into their effects and controls over their use and proliferation remain woefully inadequate.

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