Man shot dead had mental illness
Tuesday, October 31, 2006
CAROL ROBINSON
News staff writer
A knife-wielding man shot to death after attacking a Birmingham police officer Sunday night had a history of mental illness and threatened to kill his entire family in the hours before the shooting, relatives said.

Audie Alonzo Murphy, 42, suffered from schizophrenia for years, his sisters said, and lately wouldn't take his medication. The family planned Monday morning to petition a judge to confine him for treatment. Instead, they were left to cope with his death.

"I am very shocked," said one of his sisters, Shelvia Jolly. "I wouldn't think it would have taken all that to handle him."

The shooting death is under investigation by the Birmingham Police homicide unit and Internal Affairs Division, as well as the Jefferson County district attorney.

The wounded officer, North Precinct patrolman William Raymond, 29, remained in UAB Hospital Monday but is expected to survive. He had additional surgery Monday.

Police said Raymond, who will have been an officer for a year in December, lost a large amount of blood. He was stabbed in his shoulder and arm.

"We hate that it happened," Birmingham Police Chief Annetta Nunn said Monday.

Prayed on the way:

The chief, who has seen several officers and retired officers buried in recent weeks, said she prayed on her way to the hospital Sunday night. It was just a week ago that her friend, Fairfield police officer Mary Smith, was shot to death after being sent to investigate a suspicious vehicle. Nunn hoped this outcome would be different.

"It does cross your mind," she said. "I didn't know what condition he was in, but I just felt he was going to make it through."

While authorities said the shooting appears justified, Murphy's family members question the way the situation was handled. Police knew of his mental illness, they said, and had been able to successfully restrain and control him in the past.

"He's never attacked nobody," Jolly said.

Court records show Murphy had been convicted of driving under the influence, driving with a suspended license and theft of property, but had no history of violent crimes. He lived at the 15th Court North home with his mother and another sister, Doris Murphy.

Doris Murphy said she came out of her room Sunday morning to go to work and saw her brother fiddling with wires behind the television. She asked him what he was doing but he told her it wasn't any of her business. He had also been sticking wires in electrical outlets and police said he may have threatened to blow up the house.

"We was fussing and arguing and he left when I went out to work," said Doris Murphy.

Doris Murphy said the family didn't want Murphy back in the house until police arrived. At one point, she said, her brother tried to move an air conditioner to gain entry into the home. At another time during the day, the home's power went out.

In touch with police:

She said the family had been in touch with police throughout the day as his strange behavior continued.

"I wanted them to take him to get help," Doris Murphy said.

On Sunday evening, two officers arrived at the home to take a report from family members. Raymond offered to drive around the block and look for Murphy, Doris Murphy said, while another officer took her statement.

She said she was talking to the officer when she heard Raymond come over the police radio, saying the word "stabbed" over and over. The dispatcher asked the officer if he was stabbed or had stabbed the suspect and Raymond replied, "I've been stabbed," Doris Murphy said.

The next few moments were chaotic. The officer she was talking to jumped into his patrol car and took off. The neighborhood soon was flooded with police cruisers.

"They were ripping and running up and down the street," she said.

She said she was standing on the front porch and didn't hear any gunshots. She said she didn't initially think her brother was involved. "I thought it was somebody else," she said. "I was just hoping they had handcuffed my brother and already put him in the car."

Police said Raymond apparently found Murphy in a nearby alley just a block from his home, where friends and family said Murphy would retreat to calm down during "spells."

Struggled in alley:

The officer and Murphy struggled in the alley and eventually ended up in a small wooded area between the alley and apartments on 33rd Street North.

Police said Murphy attacked Raymond with a knife, stabbing him in the chest, the left arm and shoulder and head before the officer was able to pull his gun and fire two shots at Murphy. The officer's protective vest stopped a potentially grave chest wound.

Neighbors said they heard Murphy crying out "help me."

He was pronounced dead at the scene.

Police returned there Monday, using a bomb-sniffing dog to try to find shell casings from the bullets fired by the officer. The site of the shooting remained roped off with yellow crime scene tape, and dozens of Norwood residents gathered to watch the activity.

It was all too much for Doris Murphy, who erupted into sobs while on her front porch talking about the ordeal.

"We tried everything to get peace for him," she said. "I was asking for help - not for him to die like this."

Holy crap the popo done killed Audie Murphy.

Waaahh. Fucking idiot. Everybody is better off.

I keep expecting a deal like this with my ex-sister-in-law. Schizophrenia is a wicked bitch.

Quoted: "He's never attacked nobody," Jolly said.

And he never will again.

Quoted: Holy crap the popo done killed Audie Murphy.

That's exactly what I thought too!

Good shoot.

I hope the officer recovers.  This is a sad thing for his family.  No winners here, but what else were the police supposed to do?  

Quoted: Quoted: "He's never attacked nobody," Jolly said. And he never will again.

There is always a first time, just in this instance it was also the last time.

Quoted: Waaahh. Fucking idiot. Everybody is better off.

+1

Quoted: Quoted: Holy crap the popo done killed Audie Murphy. That's exactly what I thought too!

All the medals and all the movies, only to be shot down like a dog in the streets of Birmingham.

So the stupid fuck stabbed the LEO 3 times and got ventilated by said stabbed LEO and he family thinks it was overboard? The dumb fuck tried to murder a cop! WTF do they think happens? The assaulted officer should give the would be killer flowers and candy to try and make them stop attacking?

Quoted:   Police said Murphy attacked Raymond with a knife, stabbing him in the chest, the left arm and shoulder and head before the officer was able to pull his gun and fire two shots at Murphy. The officer's protective vest stopped a potentially grave chest wound.

How is this the cop's fault?

If he's that unstable, it sounds like the family should have put him in a hospital.  

I don't care if the guy thought he was the tooth fairy. Stab a cop 3 times and you deserve to die.

"I wanted them to take him to get help," Doris Murphy said.

"I was asking for help - not for him to die like this."

What part of the term Law Enforcement Officer entails anything about being a social worker?  Since when is "tak[ing] him to get help" an LEO's job?

Two Men Enter... One Man Leaves!


sorry... that was just wrong on so many levels..

Quoted: "I wanted them to take him to get help," Doris Murphy said. "I was asking for help - not for him to die like this." What part of the term Law Enforcement Officer entails anything about being a social worker?  Since when is "tak[ing] him to get help" an LEO's job?

But if the police don't do it, who will?

You can't expect people to take care of their own problems.

From the sound of it, the man should have been institutionalized years ago. Where was his family's concern then?

Quoted: "I wanted them to take him to get help," Doris Murphy said. "I was asking for help - not for him to die like this." What part of the term Law Enforcement Officer entails anything about being a social worker?  Since when is "tak[ing] him to get help" an LEO's job?

Well, the sad thing is, the cop probably would much rather have been able to get the guy some treatment than shoot him, had he not been STABBED THREE FUCKING TIMES FIRST!

Oh for fuck's sake!  The cop was stabbed, there isn't even a story here.  Should the officer have died instead?  Would the world have been more right and good then?

Idiots.  Your relative attacked and tried to kill a man with a knife the other man did what any other human would do.

Quoted: But if the police don't do it, who will? You can't expect people to take care of their own problems. From the sound of it, the man should have been institutionalized years ago. Where was his family's concern then?

You have absolutely no idea how difficult it is to "institutionalize" someone. We've been trying to get my ex-sister-in-law hospitalized for 8 years. It's not against the law to be crazy, Stalin.

Why is it sooo hard for some people to understand, crazy people will kill you faster than sane people will.

Quoted: Quoted: "I wanted them to take him to get help," Doris Murphy said. "I was asking for help - not for him to die like this." What part of the term Law Enforcement Officer entails anything about being a social worker?  Since when is "tak[ing] him to get help" an LEO's job? But if the police don't do it, who will? You can't expect people to take care of their own problems. From the sound of it, the man should have been institutionalized years ago. Where was his family's concern then?

I hope you're being facetious.

People are responsible for handling personal matters and I expect them to act accordingly.  Am I surprised when the vast majority invariably don't?  Not in the least.

Quoted: I don't care if the guy thought he was the tooth fairy. Stab a cop 3 times and you deserve to die.

Maybe the poor loon was just trying to let some of the air out.

Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: "I wanted them to take him to get help," Doris Murphy said. "I was asking for help - not for him to die like this." What part of the term Law Enforcement Officer entails anything about being a social worker?  Since when is "tak[ing] him to get help" an LEO's job? But if the police don't do it, who will? You can't expect people to take care of their own problems. From the sound of it, the man should have been institutionalized years ago. Where was his family's concern then? I hope you're being facetious. People are responsible for handling personal matters and I expect them to act accordingly.  Am I surprised when the vast majority invariably don't?  Not in the least.

I am.

Quoted: Quoted: I don't care if the guy thought he was the tooth fairy. Stab a cop 3 times and you deserve to die. Maybe the poor loon was just trying to let some of the air out from the officer's lungs.

Fixed it.

EDIT:

Quoted: I am.

OK.  Just checking.

Quoted: Quoted: "I wanted them to take him to get help," Doris Murphy said. "I was asking for help - not for him to die like this." What part of the term Law Enforcement Officer entails anything about being a social worker?  Since when is "tak[ing] him to get help" an LEO's job? Well, the sad thing is, the cop probably would much rather have been able to get the guy some treatment than shoot him, had he not been STABBED THREE FUCKING TIMES FIRST!

Yep I would bet you're right on that one.    

Mental illness is hard to work with.   Deal with someone off meds and they can be ok and then sometimes be violent.   Many times they don't feel pain like normal people.  It's scary.   Sad story all the way around.

Quoted: "I wanted them to take him to get help," Doris Murphy said. "I was asking for help - not for him to die like this." What part of the term Law Enforcement Officer entails anything about being a social worker?  Since when is "tak[ing] him to get help" an LEO's job?

Answer: most of it.(the job)

Taking people to the hospital for mental health reasons is part of the deal. Usually in a case of non-voluntary  "assessment" they have a choice to ride in that ambulance or ride in the the back seat of the squad car, cuffed. Most take the ambulance route. This is practiced by LE throughout my state.

In GA, only deputies serve no-voluntary committal papers, though.

Quoted: Quoted: But if the police don't do it, who will? You can't expect people to take care of their own problems. From the sound of it, the man should have been institutionalized years ago. Where was his family's concern then? You have absolutely no idea how difficult it is to "institutionalize" someone. We've been trying to get my ex-sister-in-law hospitalized for 8 years. It's not against the law to be crazy, Stalin.

Institutionalized may have been the wrong word. Hospitalized might have worked better in that post.

Whatever. The guy was crazy and violent. He had no business on the street. I've seen plenty just like him end up in prison and at the state hospital where they belong.

Nice job on the name calling. Do you see me here calling for crazy people to be rounded up and shot or sent to Siberia?  

"I am very shocked," said one of his sisters, Shelvia Jolly. "I wouldn't think it would have taken all that to handle him."

Then why didnt the family 'handle' it themselves?

Quoted: Institutionalized may have been the wrong word. Hospitalized might have worked better in that post. Whatever. The guy was crazy and violent. He had no business on the street. I've seen plenty just like him end up in prison and at the state hospital where they belong. Nice job on the name calling. Do you see me here calling for crazy people to be rounded up and shot or sent to Siberia?

Here's how the cycle works:

Person goes bonkers.

Person eventually acts up in a manner that results in an arrest, usually disorderly conduct or disturbing the peace or something similar.

Person gets sent to County Mental Health for evaluation.

Person is found to be incompetent to stand trial, and ordered to undergo treatment. Overworked DA drops charges.

Person refuses treatment, and leaves Mental Health facility AMA. Since there are no charges, the person is not a fugitive.

Repeat several time, over several years, but each time the nature of the action resulting in the arrest gets a little more serious. All the while, the person's family is exhausting every resource, financial and otherwise, trying to get the person into some sort of treatment.

Eventually, the person gets arrested for something severe, like assault on a police officer, as was the case with my ex-sister-in-law. Now the DA has no choice but to petition the judge for mandatory treatment.

Person goes to State Mental Health facility. This place is Hell-on-Earth. Person is remanded to facility's custody pending further evaluation. Meanwhile, person undergoes forced chemical treatment. Think about that one for a second.

You know what happens to crazy people when they get chemical treatment for their bi-polar disorder? They get better.

Person gets State evaluation, and is declared competent to stand trial. However, since there is now a State record of treatment for mental disorder, and has probably been in State custody for 90 days or so, the person either gets acquitted, or gets "time served" in case of a conviction. Person is released, on the condition that person continues treatment.

Person returns to "normal" way of life, and in treatment. You know who else is in treatment? Crazy people. You know what crazy people and "normal" people talk about? Crazy shit.

Person starts skipping meds. Why? Well, they're expensive, for starters. You know why else? "Well" people don't need medicine, right?

Person starts having delusional episodes. To the bi-polar, these delusional episodes are clear evidence that "they" are trying to "poison" the person. Person stops taking meds altogether.

Cycle repeats.

By this time, the person has become extremely dissociative. They are incapable of rational behavior in any controlled sense. The person's family is as unable to reach out to the person as anyone else.

It's not illegal to be crazy.

Oh for fuck's sake! The cop was stabbed, there isn't even a story here.

Exactly.  What is supposed to be the story?

In my opinion the only thing the cop did wrong was waiting too long before defending himself.z

I'm afraid I am firmly in the "Man stabbed police officer, ploice responded appropriately, why is this even a story?" crowd.

Quoted: I'm afraid I am firmly in the "Man stabbed police officer, ploice responded appropriately, why is this even a story?" crowd.

Me too. I am never without a firearm when I'm around my ex-sister-in-law is around. I love her, and pray for her, but if she ever poses a physical threat to my family or myself, I will use deadly force to stop her, crazy or not.

Quoted: Quoted: Institutionalized may have been the wrong word. Hospitalized might have worked better in that post. Whatever. The guy was crazy and violent. He had no business on the street. I've seen plenty just like him end up in prison and at the state hospital where they belong. Nice job on the name calling. Do you see me here calling for crazy people to be rounded up and shot or sent to Siberia?   Here's how the cycle works: Person goes bonkers. Person eventually acts up in a manner that results in an arrest, usually disorderly conduct or disturbing the peace or something similar. Person gets sent to County Mental Health for evaluation. Person is found to be incompetent to stand trial, and ordered to undergo treatment. Overworked DA drops charges. Person refuses treatment, and leaves Mental Health facility AMA. Since there are no charges, the person is not a fugitive. Repeat several time, over several years, but each time the nature of the action resulting in the arrest gets a little more serious. All the while, the person's family is exhausting every resource, financial and otherwise, trying to get the person into some sort of treatment. Eventually, the person gets arrested for something severe, like assault on a police officer, as was the case with my ex-sister-in-law. Now the DA has no choice but to petition the judge for mandatory treatment. Person goes to State Mental Health facility. This place is Hell-on-Earth. Person is remanded to facility's custody pending further evaluation. Meanwhile, person undergoes forced chemical treatment. Think about that one for a second. You know what happens to crazy people when they get chemical treatment for their bi-polar disorder? They get better. Person gets State evaluation, and is declared competent to stand trial. However, since there is now a State record of treatment for mental disorder, and has probably been in State custody for 90 days or so, the person either gets acquitted, or gets "time served" in case of a conviction. Person is released, on the condition that person continues treatment. Person returns to "normal" way of life, and in treatment. You know who else is in treatment? Crazy people. You know what crazy people and "normal" people talk about? Crazy shit. Person starts skipping meds. Why? Well, they're expensive, for starters. You know why else? "Well" people don't need medicine, right? Person starts having delusional episodes. To the bi-polar, these delusional episodes are clear evidence that "they" are trying to "poison" the person. Person stops taking meds altogether. Cycle repeats. By this time, the person has become extremely dissociative. They are incapable of rational behavior in any controlled sense. The person's family is as unable to reach out to the person as anyone else. It's not illegal to be crazy.

What are you, resident shink?

You are correct, nevertheless.  Most times Bipolar and schizoswill stop taking meds once they have things under control and functioning fine.  They "feel" like they no longer need the because all is well. Then, they stop and the cycle repeats itself...

Here comes "The Watts Wail"...

Quoted: What are you, resident shink? You are correct, nevertheless.  Most times Bipolar and schizoswill stop taking meds once they have things under control and functioning fine.  They "feel" like they no longer need the because all is well. Then, they stop and the cycle repeats itself...

Hardly.

I've been living through this shit since 1998 with my ex-wife's sister. I've been to so many hearings, I can't even count. I have been in the DA's office, pleading with him to not drop the charges against the woman. I've stayed awake many nights at y ex-in-laws' house because she was on the lam, and had made random threats against them. Her favorite trick was to come by her parents' house and cut the phone lines. Nothing like having two elderly folks with no phone service.

There are no easy answers when it comes to mental illness. Although the pattern I quickly described above may have applicability to many cases, every person is different, and every disorder affects those persons differently.

I am sorry for the loss of the subject in the story, but the fact of the matter is that he stabbed a cop, most likely while the cop was trying desperatly to avoid a physical confrontation. Crazy or not, the subject had to be dealt with immediately. Like I said in my original reply to this thread, I fully expect a similar outcome inolving my ex-sister-in-law some day. Sad but true.

I don't see what the problem here is other than a family full of idiots.  If I try to stab someone who has a gun, I fully expect them to try to shoot me... which is why you don't bring knives to gun fights. hoot,

Quoted: Person returns to "normal" way of life, and in treatment. You know who else is in treatment? Crazy people. You know what crazy people and "normal" people talk about? Crazy shit.

I'm sorry, but that paragraph struck me as funny as hell.  Crazy shit...

Quoted: Quoted: Person returns to "normal" way of life, and in treatment. You know who else is in treatment? Crazy people. You know what crazy people and "normal" people talk about? Crazy shit. I'm sorry, but that paragraph struck me as funny as hell.  Crazy shit...

I'm not saying crazy can't be funny ...

When she says "He never hurt nobody" Does that include the cop he stabbed three times or was he only "goofing around"?

Hope the Officer makes it through okey...and without to much bullshit from the media.

I answered a call once to the house of a man described a "disturbed" by the neighbors. He was just doing random stuff, like leaving bibles on his neighbors' property. I talked to him, he seemed calm and mostly coherent. About two weeks later another officer was dispatched to the same house and was attactked by this guy with a ball peen hammer. Said officer shot him to death. As he should have.

I am just damned glad I wasn't the one that had to pull the trigger on the poor SOB, and I feel badly for the officer that did. A bad time all around.  

Quoted: When she says "He never hurt nobody" Does that include the cop he stabbed three times or was he only "goofing around"? Hope the Officer makes it through okey...and without to much bullshit from the media.

+1, no shit, too bad, they should have taken better care of him.

So What!  He was a danger to Society and he was taken out.  I say good for the cop.

Quoted: I'm afraid I am firmly in the "Man stabbed police officer, ploice responded appropriately, why is this even a story?" crowd.

/join #The_Camp_Ninja

When I worked as a Sheriff's Deputy, we served Mental Warrants.

I hated it.

Crazy people do crazy things.  But you hate the thought that you might be forced to kill them over something like that.

When he stabbed the police officer, he sealed his own fate.

Hope the officer is okay.

Quoted: When I worked as a Sheriff's Deputy, we served Mental Warrants. I hated it. Crazy people do crazy things.  But you hate the thought that you might be forced to kill them over something like that. When he stabbed the police officer, he sealed his own fate. Hope the officer is okay.

Never had to serve a mental warrant.

Glad I didn't.

It just sounds to me like the family wished the police could have restrained him somehow, not that they are blaming the police for his death.

In hindsight the best thing the officer could have done would be to stay far enough away from the guy, and taze him if he tried anything. Of course the family would have likely bitched about that too!

I can't blame the cop for NOT doing that. After all, the family even said he was never violent. I'm sure the cop felt the chance of him doing something like this was little to none. I guess it just goes to show how unpredictable that particular condition can be.

Bottom line is the guy attacked the cop with a knife. He didn't brandish it. He didn't threaten the cop with it. He stabbed his ass! REPEATEDLY!!...and your ass gets shot for that!

I feel bad for the officers family It's just a shitty situation all the way around

What's the protocol for using a tazer?  Could the cop have tazed the crazy much sooner for not obeying commands?  
I'm assuming lethal threats are met with lethal force (the way it should be).  It sounds like the cop didn't know that the crazy posed a real threat until he was being stabbed.

Quoted: What's the protocol for using a tazer?  Could the cop have tazed the crazy much sooner for not obeying commands?   I'm assuming lethal threats are met with lethal force (the way it should be).  It sounds like the cop didn't know that the crazy posed a real threat until he was being stabbed.

#1, you're assuming the Taser was an option to begin with..many agencies just dont have them, and in at least one state (NJ) they are completely prohibited.

#2, if they had dealt with this guy before, they probably DIDNT expect an attack..i've found myself doing the same thing.. "Oh it's just Carzy Mary..tell her you'll jeep the aliens away, and she'll go with us without a problem"...Until she decides YOU are one of the aliens, and starts kicking, luckily in my case, she wasnt armed.

Quoted: What's the protocol for using a tazer?  Could the cop have tazed the crazy much sooner for not obeying commands?   I'm assuming lethal threats are met with lethal force (the way it should be).  It sounds like the cop didn't know that the crazy posed a real threat until he was being stabbed.

Yeah, If I had to guess, I would say that all of this happened really fast and unexpected.
I can't see the cop staying close to a crazy person acting crazy with his firearm holstered.