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Posted: 11/18/2008 3:10:38 PM EDT


I just sent an e-mail to my representative urging him not to vote for any Detroit bailout.

Lets knock out the UAW while they are on the ropes. These guys will never stop at electing socialist parasites.

While many individual members are great people, there organization is terrible and completely self serving.

If we can stall a bail out for a few months they may very well go under.
Link Posted: 11/18/2008 3:53:27 PM EDT
THe IBEW tried to get into our company. We sent them packing with a 104 NO vote to 20 yes vote. Unions are the devil.
Link Posted: 11/18/2008 3:56:31 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 11/18/2008 4:08:54 PM EDT by eastTXhunter]
Unions Suck!! GM pays them 71 dollars an hour after benefits on average. There work is no where near worth that. They will soon discover they should not be making anywhere near that.
Link Posted: 11/18/2008 3:57:59 PM EDT
I'm all for it. They killed the Big 3. Plus they vote and fund demonrats
Link Posted: 11/18/2008 3:59:22 PM EDT
Unions are economic terrorists.

Their only power is their ability to threaten capital investment and intimidate other willing workers.
Link Posted: 11/18/2008 3:59:50 PM EDT
The UAW is going to kill themselves. We need to stop the dim-wit-craps from resuscitating it.
Link Posted: 11/18/2008 4:05:23 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Partisan:
The UAW is going to kill themselves.


Suicide by union. BTW, if .gov bails them out, we.the.people.com will be paying those union salaries for the Big3. Heck no!

Link Posted: 11/18/2008 4:08:53 PM EDT
Originally Posted By alaman:
I'm all for it. They killed the Big 3. Plus they vote and fund demonrats


If they killed the Big 3...who killed my baby?
Link Posted: 11/18/2008 4:15:55 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 11/18/2008 4:21:55 PM EDT by RhinelandArms]
Well, I really love some of the vehicles the big 3 makes. I will not drive anything else at this time either.

However, unions have fucked this country and the auto companies big time. They are nothing more than a legal form of a mafia that helps fund the democraps no less.

I am sticking with the GOP plan for restructuring the auto companies. Let them go bankrupt, ditch the unions and reorganize as a leaner meaner company. There is simply too much capacity that is no longer needed. Then and only then loan them money.

Edit to add, I was for the bail out until I read that the union did not think they had any responsibiity for the current mess and they were not going to help GM at all. Fuck them and fuck obama!

Whatever happens, viva Cadillac, GMC and Corvette!
Link Posted: 11/18/2008 4:25:04 PM EDT
I wish, but the democrats will more than likely push through some kind of bailout to repay their base.
Link Posted: 11/18/2008 4:27:19 PM EDT
Originally Posted By mnd:
Unions are economic terrorists.




Truth.

They have done far more to undermine America than Al-Qaeda ever dreamt of.

Link Posted: 11/18/2008 4:30:39 PM EDT
I agree the UAWs time has passed, but the domestic auto industry going under right now would not be a good thing.

Think all the mechanics that work in dealerships and stuff. They would also be out of work.

It grows big time beyond just guys putting ashtrays in cars on the assembly line.
Link Posted: 11/18/2008 4:33:59 PM EDT
They can get jobs in other dealerships.

The unions funded Obama, and now it is payback time. Anything they make or do, I will avoid if at all possible. Why fund your enemy?
Link Posted: 11/18/2008 4:37:31 PM EDT
On the ropes?!?! Gettlefucker says "no more concessions" because he knows it's a waiting game at this point.

After his royal highness takes office they will get whatever they want since the gun owning, deer hunting, beer swilling, overtime working UAW was a key factor in the victory.

The Repubs aren't holding out right now becasue it's the fiscally responsible thing to do you know. They are holding out becasue Union meatheads don't vote for them.

Listening to the "grilling" the Senate is dishing out, it's obvious these morans want the cash to continue business as usual until 2010, when we'll suddenly be blown away with fresh designs, fuel efficiency, lean manufacturing, competitive market structure...all the same bullshit they've been providing lip service about since 1974.

They won't go under. They are starting now to build a case for reorganization with the rest of the nation. It will be business as usual until the changing of the guard...then they get what they want.





Link Posted: 11/18/2008 4:42:30 PM EDT
Unions delivered their end of the deal a few weeks back, anyone who seriously thinks that they won't be getting a kickback is worryingly naive. Some in Congress will put up a fight, but get used to resistance being futile. The only question is if they get it passed right away, or have to wait until Jan.

Expect the bailout to be rolled up with heathcare and pension politics too. Maybe taxpayer-funded credits for the purchase of vehicles > ## miles per gallon. Those with incomes that suggest the ability to repay won't be eligible.
Link Posted: 11/18/2008 4:46:01 PM EDT
Link Posted: 11/18/2008 4:49:44 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Merrell:
They can get jobs in other dealerships.

The unions funded Obama, and now it is payback time. Anything they make or do, I will avoid if at all possible. Why fund your enemy?


Really?

I doubt there is enough work for hundreds of thousands of mechanics to be absorbed into other dealerships.

Christ, GD get more simplified every day.
Link Posted: 11/18/2008 4:49:56 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Garand_Shooter:
As I have posted before, I hope all those fuckwits end up having to burn all those pro-Obama leaflets, posters, and vote guides they paid for the heat their homes through the MI winter.



All they had to do was look at the imports that the Obots drove and realize that their customers were older conservative Americans. But they were too damned stupid.

Payback time!
Link Posted: 11/18/2008 4:50:03 PM EDT
What happens if GM fails though? How much will that cost in unemployment, medical expenses and lost tax revenue?


Can we just pop the pimple of the UAW without also killing the patient?
Link Posted: 11/18/2008 4:51:03 PM EDT
Originally Posted By capnrob97:
Originally Posted By Merrell:
They can get jobs in other dealerships.

The unions funded Obama, and now it is payback time. Anything they make or do, I will avoid if at all possible. Why fund your enemy?


Really?

I doubt there is enough work for hundreds of thousands of mechanics to be absorbed into other dealerships.

Christ, GD get more simplified every day.


Maybe that's because other car companies aren't cranking out crap that needs constant shop time...

Link Posted: 11/18/2008 4:54:41 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Merrell:
Originally Posted By capnrob97:
Originally Posted By Merrell:
They can get jobs in other dealerships.

The unions funded Obama, and now it is payback time. Anything they make or do, I will avoid if at all possible. Why fund your enemy?


Really?

I doubt there is enough work for hundreds of thousands of mechanics to be absorbed into other dealerships.

Christ, GD get more simplified every day.


Maybe that's because other car companies aren't cranking out crap that needs constant shop time...



Now you are just posting nonsense.

Any Honda / Toyota dealer has 4 or 5 mechanics on site, always busy, just like any domestic dealer.

Link Posted: 11/18/2008 4:59:57 PM EDT
I was against the bailout for the banks and I'm definately against the bailout for the car companies.

Let them fail, file bankruptcy, and then rebuild. They dont need to waste our money.
Link Posted: 11/18/2008 5:02:24 PM EDT
Link Posted: 11/18/2008 5:04:15 PM EDT
Why stop at killing the UAW? I say we violate its corpse in front of its children and leave it in a field for the carrion birds to dine on. These unions have scammed the American people for damn near a century. Its high time those employees were paid a freee market rate for thier labor, not some grossly inflated amount based on goverment intervention and threat of thuggish violence.
Link Posted: 11/18/2008 5:05:40 PM EDT
I refuse to buy ANY American made vehicles. Now, I know there are some Japanese cars made in America. I'm not talking about them. I'm all about buying Honda's.

See, when I buy a car, its to transport me, others, and property. I'm not plunking down 15k-20k for patriotic charity. You buy something good, I'll buy it. If not, I'll go elsewhere. I can't afford to get nickel and dimed to death by Detroit's GARBAGE anymore.

My dad bought a 1995 Dodge Intrepid, brand spankin' new. By 1999, the car was dead. Around 97 or so, it started absolutely nickel and diming him to death, so he got rid of it. I had 2 Chevy's and they nickel and dimed me to death also. One of them just went kaput on the street and went to the junkyard.

Ford products, I've had better luck with. Between my wife and I, we've owned 3 Fords. They all seemed to require frequent service for the EKG valve. What is it? I don't know, but it causes the check engine light to go off. No other car I've owned has this problem.

Link Posted: 11/18/2008 5:11:41 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 11/18/2008 5:15:02 PM EDT by RhinelandArms]
I have had many GM cars and not a problem with any of them. I do avoid the cheap ones, as they have imported parts or are cars from Japan.

Its funny that the above poster was complaining about the Dodge Intrepid. That engine that you claim was junk, was a japanese designed and built Mitsubishi, most likely. I suspect your chevies were most likely japanese built as well?

My neighbors 5 year old chevy is more reliable ad better in every way than his 1 year old honda, some have luck, some dont I guess.
Link Posted: 11/18/2008 5:13:37 PM EDT
Originally Posted By capnrob97:
Originally Posted By Merrell:
They can get jobs in other dealerships.

The unions funded Obama, and now it is payback time. Anything they make or do, I will avoid if at all possible. Why fund your enemy?


Really?

I doubt there is enough work for hundreds of thousands of mechanics to be absorbed into other dealerships.

Christ, GD get more simplified every day.


assembly line workers are NOT MECHANICS! Never have been. Never WILL be.

All they know how to do is put a part on another part and do it over and over all day long.

Technicians/Mechanics know how to diagnose, repair, and maintain the vehicles.
Link Posted: 11/18/2008 5:14:02 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Apollos:
Originally Posted By alaman:
I'm all for it. They killed the Big 3. Plus they vote and fund demonrats


If they killed the Big 3...who killed my baby?


White Stripes. Awesome.
Link Posted: 11/18/2008 5:16:20 PM EDT
Originally Posted By GeorgiaBII:
Originally Posted By capnrob97:
Originally Posted By Merrell:
They can get jobs in other dealerships.

The unions funded Obama, and now it is payback time. Anything they make or do, I will avoid if at all possible. Why fund your enemy?


Really?

I doubt there is enough work for hundreds of thousands of mechanics to be absorbed into other dealerships.

Christ, GD get more simplified every day.


assembly line workers are NOT MECHANICS! Never have been. Never WILL be.

All they know how to do is put a part on another part and do it over and over all day long.

Technicians/Mechanics know how to diagnose, repair, and maintain the vehicles.


No shit. Read my post.

Link Posted: 11/18/2008 5:26:12 PM EDT
Can we put a hiatus on CAFE standards too? This is the other wound that is hurting the car companies.
Link Posted: 11/18/2008 5:27:47 PM EDT

"Pay back time"
Link Posted: 11/18/2008 5:30:45 PM EDT
Originally Posted By capnrob97:
Think all the mechanics that work in dealerships and stuff. They would also be out of work.


Huh? Cars still need serviced. There's already millions of them on the road.
Link Posted: 11/18/2008 5:33:26 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 11/18/2008 5:36:03 PM EDT by ORIGINAL-Waterdog]
US automakers build and sell crap, because Americans buy them. For the last 40 years Americans have been brainwashed into believing they need a new car every 3 years.

So the Big 3, builds shit that lasts 3 to 5 years without major repairs.
I was in auto shop in the early 70s and was told about Planned Obsolesence
by our shop teacher, this the same time frame as the Pinto, Vega, Monza and the Mopar crap I don't remember. Unfortunately American autos was the only thing available. Today it's different, though I don't like the idea of buying foreign cars, it is the foreign cars that are creating the problems for Big 3.

My point, these corporate entities like many others got greedy and decided making money at any cost, was more important than building a quality product and making a little less money. The whole sysytem sucks and we are going to pay for the greed these entities having been enjoying for decades.

The UAW is a big probelm, but not the major problem.



Link Posted: 11/18/2008 5:33:45 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Ciph:
Can we put a hiatus on CAFE standards too? This is the other wound that is hurting the car companies.

And all the crash safety mandates.

And all the crazy emission controls.

Pessimising the operation of the engine for slightly reduced emissions during warm-up is just dumb.

Let the market decide what mix of safety and fuel economy is right for them.
Link Posted: 11/18/2008 5:33:53 PM EDT
Originally Posted By SevenMaryThree:
On the ropes?!?! Gettlefucker says "no more concessions" because he knows it's a waiting game at this point.

After his royal highness takes office they will get whatever they want since the gun owning, deer hunting, beer swilling, overtime working UAW was a key factor in the victory.

The Repubs aren't holding out right now becasue it's the fiscally responsible thing to do you know. They are holding out becasue Union meatheads don't vote for them.

Listening to the "grilling" the Senate is dishing out, it's obvious these morans want the cash to continue business as usual until 2010, when we'll suddenly be blown away with fresh designs, fuel efficiency, lean manufacturing, competitive market structure...all the same bullshit they've been providing lip service about since 1974.

They won't go under. They are starting now to build a case for reorganization with the rest of the nation. It will be business as usual until the changing of the guard...then they get what they want.







Brother, you got it right on the money.
Link Posted: 11/18/2008 5:37:40 PM EDT
I've never owned a foreign vehicle. I've never contemplated it. I buy Ford trucks, Ford cars, GM cars, and once mistakenly a Dodge truck. I've bought brand new vehicles off the lot, and newer used off the lot, and will buy quite a few more new vehicles in my lifetime.

If the Big 3 get this bailout, without massive UAW concessions, I will never, ever again purchase a domestic vehicle.

Never.
Link Posted: 11/18/2008 5:38:23 PM EDT
Originally Posted By capnrob97:
Originally Posted By Merrell:
Originally Posted By capnrob97:
Originally Posted By Merrell:
They can get jobs in other dealerships.

The unions funded Obama, and now it is payback time. Anything they make or do, I will avoid if at all possible. Why fund your enemy?


Really?

I doubt there is enough work for hundreds of thousands of mechanics to be absorbed into other dealerships.

Christ, GD get more simplified every day.


Maybe that's because other car companies aren't cranking out crap that needs constant shop time...



Now you are just posting nonsense.

Any Honda / Toyota dealer has 4 or 5 mechanics on site, always busy, just like any domestic dealer.




I've got two vehicles in my driveway.

One's a Chevy, one is a Toyota.

Approximately the same age.

One has spent MONTHS in the shop, they other just regular service.

Wanna guess which one? Need any hints?

Link Posted: 11/18/2008 5:42:41 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 11/18/2008 5:43:09 PM EDT by capnrob97]
Originally Posted By Merrell:
Originally Posted By capnrob97:
Originally Posted By Merrell:
Originally Posted By capnrob97:
Originally Posted By Merrell:
They can get jobs in other dealerships.

The unions funded Obama, and now it is payback time. Anything they make or do, I will avoid if at all possible. Why fund your enemy?


Really?

I doubt there is enough work for hundreds of thousands of mechanics to be absorbed into other dealerships.

Christ, GD get more simplified every day.


Maybe that's because other car companies aren't cranking out crap that needs constant shop time...



Now you are just posting nonsense.

Any Honda / Toyota dealer has 4 or 5 mechanics on site, always busy, just like any domestic dealer.




I've got two vehicles in my driveway.

One's a Chevy, one is a Toyota.

Approximately the same age.

One has spent MONTHS in the shop, they other just regular service.

Wanna guess which one? Need any hints?




The domestic one.

But I always take my Saturn to the dealer for service, mostly an oil change and regular tire rotation.

Not every service call is a major malfuction in the car assembly.
Link Posted: 11/18/2008 5:44:45 PM EDT
Pull the plug.
Link Posted: 11/18/2008 5:47:51 PM EDT
Originally Posted By kikomax:
Pull the plug.



This
Link Posted: 11/18/2008 5:51:05 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 11/18/2008 5:53:00 PM EDT by RhinelandArms]
Are you sure that your chevy is made by GM and not a japanese company? Most shitty ones are.

We do some work for japanese suppliers. Those parts are seriously substandard and nothing to brag about.
Link Posted: 11/18/2008 5:51:29 PM EDT
Originally Posted By FredM:
What happens if GM fails though? How much will that cost in unemployment, medical expenses and lost tax revenue?


The Unions are a BIG part of the problem.........but so is the quality issue of the vehicles.

The answer is BUILD A BETTER VEHICLE!!!

Link Posted: 11/18/2008 6:18:05 PM EDT
Originally Posted By capnrob97:
Originally Posted By Merrell:
They can get jobs in other dealerships.

The unions funded Obama, and now it is payback time. Anything they make or do, I will avoid if at all possible. Why fund your enemy?


Really?

I doubt there is enough work for hundreds of thousands of mechanics to be absorbed into other dealerships.

Christ, GD get more simplified every day.


Nope, just the good ones. As it should be.
Link Posted: 11/18/2008 6:29:31 PM EDT
Obama will save the UAW.
They elected him. Union members, even gun owners, overwhelmingly voted for this nut.

Payback time!
Link Posted: 11/18/2008 6:31:33 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 11/18/2008 6:31:49 PM EDT by DragoMuseveni]
Originally Posted By capnrob97:

Think all the mechanics that work in dealerships and stuff. They would also be out of work.


Dealership work is WAY OVER priced!


Fuck em.
Link Posted: 11/18/2008 6:32:37 PM EDT
Originally Posted By RhinelandArms:
Well, I really love some of the vehicles the big 3 makes. I will not drive anything else at this time either.

However, unions have fucked this country and the auto companies big time. They are nothing more than a legal form of a mafia that helps fund the democraps no less.

I am sticking with the GOP plan for restructuring the auto companies. Let them go bankrupt, ditch the unions and reorganize as a leaner meaner company. There is simply too much capacity that is no longer needed. Then and only then loan them money.

Edit to add, I was for the bail out until I read that the union did not think they had any responsibiity for the current mess and they were not going to help GM at all. Fuck them and fuck obama!

Whatever happens, viva Cadillac, GMC and Corvette!

Right on.
Link Posted: 11/18/2008 6:37:14 PM EDT
Originally Posted By capnrob97:
Originally Posted By Merrell:
Originally Posted By capnrob97:
Originally Posted By Merrell:
Originally Posted By capnrob97:
Originally Posted By Merrell:
They can get jobs in other dealerships.

The unions funded Obama, and now it is payback time. Anything they make or do, I will avoid if at all possible. Why fund your enemy?


Really?

I doubt there is enough work for hundreds of thousands of mechanics to be absorbed into other dealerships.

Christ, GD get more simplified every day.


Maybe that's because other car companies aren't cranking out crap that needs constant shop time...



Now you are just posting nonsense.

Any Honda / Toyota dealer has 4 or 5 mechanics on site, always busy, just like any domestic dealer.




I've got two vehicles in my driveway.

One's a Chevy, one is a Toyota.

Approximately the same age.

One has spent MONTHS in the shop, they other just regular service.

Wanna guess which one? Need any hints?




The domestic one.

But I always take my Saturn to the dealer for service, mostly an oil change and regular tire rotation.

Not every service call is a major malfuction in the car assembly.


Correct. The Chevy has spent months AT THE DEALER for both in-warranty and out of warranty repair. 8 years old and 80,000 miles. Oil changed every 3K. Not driven offroad or abused. Not just mechanical but also body and electrical issues. The extended warranty (at a cost of ~$2K) saved me a good $7K in bills. Paint is now starting to go. The Toyota has been flawless.

Shame because I like the style of it (S-series Blazer) and plan to run it as long as possible. Their new pimp-mobiles (hey, want 20" wheels on that Tahoe?) do NOTHING for me.

No more UAW product for me ever again. Enough is enough.
Link Posted: 11/18/2008 6:39:25 PM EDT
Originally Posted By RhinelandArms:
Are you sure that your chevy is made by GM and not a japanese company? Most shitty ones are.

We do some work for japanese suppliers. Those parts are seriously substandard and nothing to brag about.


If your post is addressed to me, yes my Chevy is GM (S-10 Blazer)

I have a nice fat file of all the receipts for work done over the years.

Link Posted: 11/18/2008 6:43:48 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 11/18/2008 6:45:44 PM EDT by RhinelandArms]
I never trusted the S10 series GM vehicles. I would not have bought one.

I dont know anything about them, who is really suppling the engine, tranny?
Link Posted: 11/18/2008 6:56:34 PM EDT
I purchased a Ford Mustang in 2000 with 8 miles on it from the dealership, and an extended five year warranty on it for about $18,000 total.

In eight years I put 110,000 miles on that car. Want to guess how much went into that vehicle to keep it running? $8,000. yes, you read that right. That is just the stuff I had repaired, about $5,000 under warranty . It does not include fun stuff like 2 years after getting the car the seatbelts would no longer auto retract when released, that the gear shift knob decided to start unscrewing itself, that the CD player eats CDs and won't kick them back out and the tape player has killed several cassettes, or the ABS/Traction control circuit that just up and decides to routinely stop working every once in a while. 1,200 miles after my nifty 5 year 60,000 mile warranty expired the transmission case cracked.

The best part? Someone forgot to install one of the two bolts that holds down the rear seat, and Ford had the balls to charge me $18.75 for parts and labor to install it after the fact. Oh wait, no that wasn't the best part. The best part is when the fuel gauge broke, Ford Blue Oval certified 'mechanics' replaced it, and the next time I go to fill up with gas a couple of gallons come gushing out from under the back of the car right onto me. "The seal must have rotted out" according to their 'mechanics.' Funny, you guys told me how you have to pull the whole gas tank to change out the fuel gauge not two days before.

I have a Honda CR-V now and the only money I have put into it in is oil changes and an air filter. How is it that honda employees get paid less, and can make a better product?

For $71 fucking dollars an hour in pay and benefits I expect PERFECTION on my American made car, not the Friday afternoon I don't give a shit build! Build me a crap car and make me sink my money into it so you can live high on the hog? Welcome to motherfucking capitalism! People going to the best value for the money is going to be a real bitch, isn't it?

Link Posted: 11/18/2008 6:57:21 PM EDT
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