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Posted: 4/18/2016 8:15:27 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 4/18/2016 8:17:54 PM EDT by Dunderway]

Just saw this in my email from Blue Force Gear.




















The following are some thoughts I would like to share based on traveling the world while training various military, law enforcement and civilian personnel in pistol and carbine marksmanship. Some of you may agree, some may disagree, but my goal is to really get you thinking about what I said when you’re done reading this.







Muzzle Brakes




Muzzle brakes are great in a three gun match, but almost completely worthless in the real world. If you ever need to use your carbine while in confined spaces, as part of a tactical entry team, or during nighttime fighting, then you have no business putting one of these on your gun. Period. If you just go to a class and pound a bunch of rounds down range trying to look cool then it is tailor-made for you. So are Ronald McDonald shoes.







Electronic Hearing Protection




I honestly still have people show up to classes without electronic ear protection if you can believe that. This creates a borderline dangerous situation as you have a student who isn't hearing half of what the instructor is saying. Bottom line: if you can't afford good electronic hearing protection then you can't afford to be in the class. Instead, you should stay home and scrounge the neighborhood for soda cans and bottles until you get enough pocket change to buy a pair.







Sacred Cows of Training




Two of these come to mind: students who do tactical reloads nonstop, and those who constantly close the ejection port cover on their carbine. These two techniques are valid at the right time and place, but many of the students I see who are proficient at these sacred cows actually suck as shooters. Here's a tip from your Uncle Larry: work on being able to hit your target first, and then worry about secondary tasks like closing your dust cover. You may find out that in the real world the first makes the second largely unnecessary.







Skill




You can't buy skill. This is where students put every accessory known to man on their carbine, or have the so called 'combat' pistol they are using tuned with a stupid light trigger or some other heinous modification. Try saving your money you spend on stupid gadgets and apply yourself in a more productive way, like mastering sight alignment and trigger control. You will be amazed at how well you can shoot with even a box stock weapon.







Quality Over Quantity




Try to get the most out of every round you fire. You are better off going to the range and shooting 150 rounds and executing well designed drills that hone your skills than shooting five times that amount in a high round count 'entertainment' class where you run around like you’re in a first person shooter video game. In the real world, you’re accountable for every round you fire and only effective hits on target count. The bad guys don't give out style points for your dynamic mag dump in their general direction; they just return the favor with lead.







And last but not least,







Competition Shooting




Competition shooting is fun and exciting, but can actually be hazardous to your long-term health should you ever get in a gun fight and apply some of the 'match winning' techniques to try and win the gunfight. You don't get a staged walk-through in a life-or-death situation, and there is no range officer to tell you to load and make ready. I bring this up because I have seen students in classes who shoot a lot of competition and repeatedly begin a drill with an empty weapon. This in an era when over 40 states have concealed carry! Unreal.







That's all for now. I'm sure I’ve ruffled some feathers with these comments and some of the people reading this are probably cussing me right now. I couldn't possibly care less. Where I came from, we trained to enter hijacked aircraft and save lives- not win matches or impress people with Ninja gun handling skills. My goal is to get you thinking about what I said and hopefully some of you will make changes in how you train that could make the key difference some day when you need it most.







Larry Vickers



Vickers Tactical Inc.


 
Link Posted: 4/18/2016 8:17:12 PM EDT
Always the salesman...

<---I have attended his 1911 gunbuilding class and went to two of his rifle classes.
Link Posted: 4/18/2016 8:19:07 PM EDT
Has a job a lot of people would kill for.

Complains that customers are stupid.
Link Posted: 4/18/2016 8:19:32 PM EDT
His ear pro comments are strange.  I chose not to wear them as I can't ever seem to get a good seal shooting a rifle.  I hear just fine and prefer not to be deaf.
Link Posted: 4/18/2016 8:21:15 PM EDT
Arfcom will not approve but he's spot on regarding muzzle brakes.  Just sayin'
Link Posted: 4/18/2016 8:21:43 PM EDT
That's nice, Larry.
Link Posted: 4/18/2016 8:21:59 PM EDT
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Sierra5:
His ear pro comments are strange.  I chose not to wear them as I can't ever seem to get a good seal shooting a rifle.  I hear just fine and prefer not to be deaf.
View Quote


+1
Link Posted: 4/18/2016 8:22:58 PM EDT
FUCK LAV.  That's all. Gotta go fix my printer and watch sponge bob.
Link Posted: 4/18/2016 8:23:02 PM EDT

Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Sierra5:


His ear pro comments are strange.  I chose not to wear them as I can't ever seem to get a good seal shooting a rifle.  I hear just fine and prefer not to be deaf.
View Quote




 
I wish he would have been more specific on that.  I don't know if that statement included things like the Surefire plugs, or was aimed at the dudes who show up with $5 WalMart muffs or foam plugs.
Link Posted: 4/18/2016 8:23:17 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By wiseanhyzer:
Arfcom will not approve but he's spot on regarding muzzle brakes.  Just sayin'
View Quote

Yeah, but they can make an SBR/pistol work when you've spent a week doing everything else short of putting a can on one.
Link Posted: 4/18/2016 8:23:41 PM EDT

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Originally Posted By Thallo:


FUCK LAV.  That's all. Gotta go fix my printer and watch sponge bob.
View Quote




 
Let the butt hurt flow.
Link Posted: 4/18/2016 8:24:44 PM EDT

Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Sierra5:


His ear pro comments are strange.  I chose not to wear them as I can't ever seem to get a good seal shooting a rifle.  I hear just fine and prefer not to be deaf.
View Quote




 
I guess me having a cochlear implant gives me the tactical advantage when it comes to listening to the instructor.
Link Posted: 4/18/2016 8:24:49 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By Sierra5:
His ear pro comments are strange.  I chose not to wear them as I can't ever seem to get a good seal shooting a rifle.  I hear just fine and prefer not to be deaf.
View Quote



That one surprised me to.  I struggle with electnonic ear pro and only use plugs now.
Link Posted: 4/18/2016 8:25:14 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By GreenBastard:
Always the salesman...

<---I have attended his 1911 gunbuilding class and went to two of his rifle classes.
View Quote


How was this though?
Link Posted: 4/18/2016 8:26:50 PM EDT
I agree with a lot of that if only he couldn't sound like a jerk while saying it.
Link Posted: 4/18/2016 8:27:18 PM EDT
Link Posted: 4/18/2016 8:27:25 PM EDT
Muzzle brakes are great in a three gun match, but almost completely worthless in the real world.
View Quote


Meh, I have a PWS TTO on a M16 and it does a heck of a job keeping the muzzle on target in full auto.

No benefit in semi auto though.
Link Posted: 4/18/2016 8:28:55 PM EDT
Trying to hard.
Link Posted: 4/18/2016 8:32:24 PM EDT
Any real world advice on the tactical application of physical fitness?
Link Posted: 4/18/2016 8:33:10 PM EDT
What the hell does he know!

Jeez.  You guys are, well, whatever.
Link Posted: 4/18/2016 8:33:29 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 4/18/2016 8:34:22 PM EDT by GreenBastard]
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Originally Posted By chase45:


How was this though?
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Originally Posted By chase45:
Originally Posted By GreenBastard:
Always the salesman...

<---I have attended his 1911 gunbuilding class and went to two of his rifle classes.


How was this though?

You essentially build and fit a 1911 out of oversize parts under the guidance of Mr. Snickers.

It's a good class and you get almost 6 days to build your gun.

It's low pressure and you'll get a lot out of it if you plan to have fun. I had two assholes in the class that made it somewhat irritating.

My gun had average fit and build quality but it ran 100%
Link Posted: 4/18/2016 8:34:02 PM EDT
I dont agree with the ear pro comment.

If your customers cant hear you when they are wearing proper hearing protection thats on you not them.

This is coming from someone who worked 8 years in a heavy industrial area wearing ear pro 99% of the time. I spent most every day for 2 years in a respirator and hearing protection. you figure out how to communicate real quick.

Its not hard to have a conversation with single hearing protection, possible with double. Its when there is a lot of background noise there is an issue, and even then its due to the surrounding noise, not the hearing protection.
Link Posted: 4/18/2016 8:38:12 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By Geohans:
What the hell does he know!

Jeez.  You guys are, well, whatever.
View Quote

There are better ways to get the point across then the hey dipshit method.
Link Posted: 4/18/2016 8:38:28 PM EDT

Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By GreenBastard:





You essentially build and fit a 1911 out of oversize parts under the guidance of Mr. Snickers.



It's a good class and you get almost 6 days to build your gun.



It's low pressure and you'll get a lot out of it if you plan to have fun. I had two assholes in the class that made it somewhat irritating.



My gun had average fit and build quality but it ran 100%
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Originally Posted By GreenBastard:



Originally Posted By chase45:


Originally Posted By GreenBastard:

Always the salesman...



<---I have attended his 1911 gunbuilding class and went to two of his rifle classes.




How was this though?


You essentially build and fit a 1911 out of oversize parts under the guidance of Mr. Snickers.



It's a good class and you get almost 6 days to build your gun.



It's low pressure and you'll get a lot out of it if you plan to have fun. I had two assholes in the class that made it somewhat irritating.



My gun had average fit and build quality but it ran 100%




 
If you boil it, it will tighten up the tolerances. This is what the teir 1 of custom gun makers do.
Link Posted: 4/18/2016 8:41:04 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By dangerdan:

  If you boil it, it will tighten up the tolerances. This is what the teir 1 of custom gun makers do.
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Originally Posted By dangerdan:
Originally Posted By GreenBastard:
Originally Posted By chase45:
Originally Posted By GreenBastard:
Always the salesman...

<---I have attended his 1911 gunbuilding class and went to two of his rifle classes.


How was this though?

You essentially build and fit a 1911 out of oversize parts under the guidance of Mr. Snickers.

It's a good class and you get almost 6 days to build your gun.

It's low pressure and you'll get a lot out of it if you plan to have fun. I had two assholes in the class that made it somewhat irritating.

My gun had average fit and build quality but it ran 100%

  If you boil it, it will tighten up the tolerances. This is what the teir 1 of custom gun makers do.

Or deep fry it in Fireclean
Link Posted: 4/18/2016 8:41:56 PM EDT

Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Sierra5:


His ear pro comments are strange.  I chose not to wear them as I can't ever seem to get a good seal shooting a rifle.  I hear just fine and prefer not to be deaf.
View Quote


He's the type of hard charger that would blow a gasket if you told him that at a class.



 
Link Posted: 4/18/2016 8:50:32 PM EDT

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Originally Posted By fatcat4620:





There are better ways to get the point across then the hey dipshit method.
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Originally Posted By fatcat4620:



Originally Posted By Geohans:

What the hell does he know!



Jeez.  You guys are, well, whatever.


There are better ways to get the point across then the hey dipshit method.




 
I had no problem with the infamous Daniel Defense ad, but this one is a little harsh.




Some of you guys have some fucking soft feelz though.
Link Posted: 4/18/2016 8:50:54 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By Sierra5:
His ear pro comments are strange.  I chose not to wear them as I can't ever seem to get a good seal shooting a rifle.  I hear just fine and prefer not to be deaf.
View Quote


I double up plugs and muffs and crank the volume to 11.  I get great hearing protection when shooting, even if one seal is iffy, and I can still hear range commands loud and clear.
Link Posted: 4/18/2016 8:51:19 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By Dunderway:

  I wish he would have been more specific on that.  I don't know if that statement included things like the Surefire plugs, or was aimed at the dudes who show up with $5 WalMart muffs or foam plugs.
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Originally Posted By Dunderway:
Originally Posted By Sierra5:
His ear pro comments are strange.  I chose not to wear them as I can't ever seem to get a good seal shooting a rifle.  I hear just fine and prefer not to be deaf.

  I wish he would have been more specific on that.  I don't know if that statement included things like the Surefire plugs, or was aimed at the dudes who show up with $5 WalMart muffs or foam plugs.


I wear foam plugs as they give me a great seal, and I can still hear.  Weird If he thinks foam ear pro is good enough for OSHA and their crazy practices sometimes but not the firing line.
Link Posted: 4/18/2016 8:54:23 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By Mal_means_bad:


I double up plugs and muffs and crank the volume to 11.  I get great hearing protection when shooting, even if one seal is iffy, and I can still hear range commands loud and clear.
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Originally Posted By Mal_means_bad:
Originally Posted By Sierra5:
His ear pro comments are strange.  I chose not to wear them as I can't ever seem to get a good seal shooting a rifle.  I hear just fine and prefer not to be deaf.


I double up plugs and muffs and crank the volume to 11.  I get great hearing protection when shooting, even if one seal is iffy, and I can still hear range commands loud and clear.


I've done that also if shooting on a baffled range or the shoot house.  But standard range, Howard Leight Max plugs work just fine.  I wear them running the line also and have zero issues hearing the class, or when I'm on the line shooting as part of a clas.  

Whatever floats his boat.
Link Posted: 4/18/2016 8:55:13 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By GreenBastard:

Yeah, but they can make an SBR/pistol work when you've spent a week doing everything else short of putting a can on one.
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Originally Posted By GreenBastard:
Originally Posted By wiseanhyzer:
Arfcom will not approve but he's spot on regarding muzzle brakes.  Just sayin'

Yeah, but they can make an SBR/pistol work when you've spent a week doing everything else short of putting a can on one.

If you're shooting a pistol or SBR with a brake on it in a course, you're going to likely cause hearing damage to those next to you, as well as exacerbate the overpressure-induced symptoms that the instructors already likely suffer from.
Link Posted: 4/18/2016 8:55:30 PM EDT
Photoshop



Don't try to operate until you've been passed through photoshop. Operating without proper photoshopping can lead to a loss of slots being filled in your course. People can make fun your weight, but you get passed that, but then you just bring it on yourself by calling many potential customers printer repairmen. Make sure your computer rig can operate your system in order to photoshop the assets. Only a complete chump would leave their source materials out for others to see. More lens flair.


















Link Posted: 4/18/2016 8:55:42 PM EDT
If you just go to a class and pound a bunch of rounds down range trying to look cool then it is tailor-made for you. So are Ronald McDonald shoes.
View Quote


I'd take him a lot more seriously if he didn't think he was OMG so fucking clever, and say shit like this all the time. Good instructors don't need to tear their students down to make themselves seem taller.
Link Posted: 4/18/2016 8:59:39 PM EDT
Did he cover burrito avoidance?
Link Posted: 4/18/2016 9:03:09 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By fatcat4620:
Trying to hard.
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Clearly you are not.

Trying to hard.
Link Posted: 4/18/2016 9:04:12 PM EDT
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By GreenBastard:
Always the salesman...

<---I have attended his 1911 gunbuilding class and went to two of his rifle classes.
View Quote


How was the 1911 class?
Link Posted: 4/18/2016 9:04:38 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By fatcat4620:

There are better ways to get the point across then the hey dipshit method.
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Originally Posted By fatcat4620:
Originally Posted By Geohans:
What the hell does he know!

Jeez.  You guys are, well, whatever.

There are better ways to get the point across then the hey dipshit method.


I'm thinking you are retired .mil?
Link Posted: 4/18/2016 9:05:24 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By Mal_means_bad:


I double up plugs and muffs and crank the volume to 11.  I get great hearing protection when shooting, even if one seal is iffy, and I can still hear range commands loud and clear.
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Originally Posted By Mal_means_bad:
Originally Posted By Sierra5:
His ear pro comments are strange.  I chose not to wear them as I can't ever seem to get a good seal shooting a rifle.  I hear just fine and prefer not to be deaf.


I double up plugs and muffs and crank the volume to 11.  I get great hearing protection when shooting, even if one seal is iffy, and I can still hear range commands loud and clear.



Same here.
Link Posted: 4/18/2016 9:05:35 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By MMcCall:


I'd take him a lot more seriously if he didn't think he was OMG so fucking clever, and say shit like this all the time. Good instructors don't need to tear their students down to make themselves seem taller.
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Originally Posted By MMcCall:
If you just go to a class and pound a bunch of rounds down range trying to look cool then it is tailor-made for you. So are Ronald McDonald shoes.


I'd take him a lot more seriously if he didn't think he was OMG so fucking clever, and say shit like this all the time. Good instructors don't need to tear their students down to make themselves seem taller.

I think that was targeted towards Tactical Response.
Link Posted: 4/18/2016 9:07:28 PM EDT
The best teachers I've ever had in anything came across as competent, humble, unpretentious, pros.
Link Posted: 4/18/2016 9:07:30 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By writerdeluxe2006:


How was the 1911 class?
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Originally Posted By writerdeluxe2006:
Originally Posted By GreenBastard:
Always the salesman...

<---I have attended his 1911 gunbuilding class and went to two of his rifle classes.


How was the 1911 class?

See above. It wasn't bad. I learned more about making a 1911 work/troubleshooting than building one, and haven't built one since.

It's a big financial investment and you really do get a lot of info in a short amount of time and wind up with a gun that's a bit above RIA quality (at least in my case). There's a lot of fitting and filing.

I had two massive assholes in my class who wouldn't shut the fuck up and had "constructive criticism" for everyone.
Link Posted: 4/18/2016 9:07:46 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By Geohans:


Clearly you are not.

Trying to hard.
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Originally Posted By Geohans:
Originally Posted By fatcat4620:
Trying to hard.


Clearly you are not.

Trying to hard.

All my Grahamer Crackers are stale
Link Posted: 4/18/2016 9:09:10 PM EDT
Just learn what you can from the guy.

If his tone bothers you, tune it out.  He's been there.  He's retired and fat-- so what.
Link Posted: 4/18/2016 9:10:53 PM EDT
I just don't get why he feels it necessary to constantly say only do it this way, that way sucks type statements. People like Pat McNamara and Tu Lam share their thoughts without ever being one sided.
Link Posted: 4/18/2016 9:10:58 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By Geohans:
Just learn what you can from the guy.

If his tone bothers you, tune it out.  He's been there.  He's retired and fat-- so what.
View Quote




Yes and unless he loses weight he's going to have a heart attack.
Link Posted: 4/18/2016 9:11:11 PM EDT
Link Posted: 4/18/2016 9:11:28 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By wiseanhyzer:
Arfcom will not approve but he's spot on regarding muzzle brakes.  Just sayin'
View Quote

Unfortunately there are those of us who have no choice about that
Link Posted: 4/18/2016 9:12:23 PM EDT
Larry Snickers is serious business.
Link Posted: 4/18/2016 9:12:39 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By LRRPF52:

If you're shooting a pistol or SBR with a brake on it in a course, you're going to likely cause hearing damage to those next to you, as well as exacerbate the overpressure-induced symptoms that the instructors already likely suffer from.
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Originally Posted By LRRPF52:
Originally Posted By GreenBastard:
Originally Posted By wiseanhyzer:
Arfcom will not approve but he's spot on regarding muzzle brakes.  Just sayin'

Yeah, but they can make an SBR/pistol work when you've spent a week doing everything else short of putting a can on one.

If you're shooting a pistol or SBR with a brake on it in a course, you're going to likely cause hearing damage to those next to you, as well as exacerbate the overpressure-induced symptoms that the instructors already likely suffer from.

I don't. I like them for range toys, tho.
Link Posted: 4/18/2016 9:12:53 PM EDT
I'd love to use electronic muffs. . .but can't find any that dampen sound as well as my NON-electronic muffs.

Maybe somebody can point me in the right direction.

Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile
Link Posted: 4/18/2016 9:14:09 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By Aimless:
I have had many electronic muffs, I don't think they provide good hearing protection
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Originally Posted By Aimless:
Originally Posted By 2ndamendmentknights:
Originally Posted By Sierra5:
His ear pro comments are strange.  I chose not to wear them as I can't ever seem to get a good seal shooting a rifle.  I hear just fine and prefer not to be deaf.


+1
I have had many electronic muffs, I don't think they provide good hearing protection

Your head is just the wrong shape, clearly.

You should feel bad, and get your head stretched to the correct size.
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