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Posted: 12/1/2007 11:57:52 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/1/2007 12:03:03 PM EDT by Bama-Shooter]
the LEO allows the person to dump/destroy them on the side of the road.

Did the LEO commit a crime?
Link Posted: 12/1/2007 11:58:30 AM EDT
Only if he pockets it aafter they leave.
Link Posted: 12/1/2007 11:58:38 AM EDT
If they're my drugs? Nope, he just made a buddy for life!
Link Posted: 12/1/2007 11:59:19 AM EDT
Sounds to me like that LEO needs a citation.
Link Posted: 12/1/2007 12:00:31 PM EDT
He has the ability to arrest people, but he also has discretion as to whether or not to make that arrest. Did he commit a crime? I would think not, but I was wrong once before.
Link Posted: 12/1/2007 12:00:42 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Bama-Shooter:
the LEO allows the person to dump/destroy them out on the side of the road.

Did the LEO commit a crime?


Good lord I hope not...
Link Posted: 12/1/2007 12:01:05 PM EDT
Seems like he'd be in violation of some law regarding destruction of evidence of a crime. I'm neither police nor a lawyer, though.
Link Posted: 12/1/2007 12:03:15 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/1/2007 12:04:12 PM EDT by BangStick1]
If I were sitting on that officers jury, I'd vote not guilty but that officer is not going to get promotions or pay raises very fast with that behavior


I've heard more than a few stories of officers doing that though.
Link Posted: 12/1/2007 12:03:58 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/1/2007 12:06:47 PM EDT by pale_pony]
I seen it happen a hundred times, at least.

If nothing else was wrong, (no outstanding warrants, the driver does not appear to be DUI/D, the officer execised their own discretion and dumped a bag of grass into the bar ditch, (neighboring lawn..etc.) gave them a good scolding on how their evening COULD be spent calling lawyers, bondsmen, and tow truck operators) and sent them on their way home.

I'd like to say that the officers in question were giving people a break, but usually it's done just because a simple possession charge just isn't worth the paperwork.

(But in answer to your question, the officer in fact was probably not performing their sworn duty when it happened...would his backup tattle on him? probably not...)
Link Posted: 12/1/2007 12:04:01 PM EDT
Link Posted: 12/1/2007 12:04:15 PM EDT
Destruction of evidence maybe?
Link Posted: 12/1/2007 12:04:22 PM EDT

Originally Posted By BangStick1:
If I were sitting on that officers jury, I'd vote not guilty but that officer is not going to get promotions or pay raises very fast with that behavior


You might be surprised...
Link Posted: 12/1/2007 12:04:33 PM EDT
no, officers are allowed to use their discretion.
Link Posted: 12/1/2007 12:04:41 PM EDT
Technically, probably YES.
Without more back story, hard to judge his actions.

If it was a dumb kid first offender, and a small amount obviously not for resale, the discretion the officer showed might get the message across anyway, without a criminal charge.

YMMV. In the circumstance I described, I don't see a problem with it.
Link Posted: 12/1/2007 12:04:49 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Bama-Shooter:
the LEO allows the person to dump/destroy them on the side of the road.

Did the LEO commit a crime?


No crime in my book.
Link Posted: 12/1/2007 12:05:00 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/1/2007 12:05:57 PM EDT by Barrelburner]
Are said drugs a felony?

LEO's are required to take action on any felony, AFAIK
Link Posted: 12/1/2007 12:05:09 PM EDT
It happened to me a few times a long time ago.
Link Posted: 12/1/2007 12:05:16 PM EDT
It depends.
Link Posted: 12/1/2007 12:05:30 PM EDT
Everyone is guilty of a crime at any time.

There's more laws on the books than common sense in America.
Link Posted: 12/1/2007 12:05:34 PM EDT
Does he commit a crime if he lets someone get away with speeding 5mph over the limit?
Link Posted: 12/1/2007 12:06:33 PM EDT
Depends.

If you believe he did commit a crime, then you must also believe that police officers shouldn't be allowed to use discretion in their jobs. By the same token, if I stop a speeder and let him/her go with a warning--have I committed a crime? They broke a law, after all.

Now, that said, I have personally not arrested numerous individuals I have caught with small amounts of pot on them. In Texas, 0-2 ounces is a Class B and that's a problem for folks or kids that might want a higher end job or a security clearance later on. It's also a minimum of 8 pages of report at my agency if I arrest, whereas a citation for possession of paraphernalia is a Class C, doesn't have any more "oomf" than a traffic cite, and the gubmint still gets it's share through the fine.

So, if officer pato catches you with a joint or two and you aint selling and are otherwise a fairly decent human being---you will most likely get off with a possession of paraphernalia cite, max.

That helps me not have to arrest and write, helps you because it keeps you out of jail, and it helps the agency/gubmint.

So, did I commit a crime? Some say yes, some say no. I say I was using discretion.

If I catch you with coke or heroin, etc.--you get to visit the bed and breakfast, period.

pato

Link Posted: 12/1/2007 12:08:34 PM EDT
Is it for a porn star in Nashville and is she willing to give a BJ in exchange while being filmed by a cell phone cam
Link Posted: 12/1/2007 12:08:38 PM EDT
In CA, if its pot and the driver has a doctor's permit, then yes he has.
Court says he has to give the 'medical marijuana' back to its owner.
sfgate.com
Link Posted: 12/1/2007 12:08:42 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/1/2007 12:09:51 PM EDT by pale_pony]

Originally Posted By pato:
Depends.

If you believe he did commit a crime, then you must also believe that police officers shouldn't be allowed to use discretion in their jobs. By the same token, if I stop a speeder and let him/her go with a warning--have I committed a crime? They broke a law, after all.

Now, that said, I have personally not arrested numerous individuals I have caught with small amounts of pot on them. In Texas, 0-2 ounces is a Class B and that's a problem for folks or kids that might want a higher end job or a security clearance later on. It's also a minimum of 8 pages of report at my agency if I arrest, whereas a citation for possession of paraphernalia is a Class C, doesn't have any more "oomf" than a traffic cite, and the gubmint still gets it's share through the fine.

So, if officer pato catches you with a joint or two and you aint selling and are otherwise a fairly decent human being---you will most likely get off with a possession of paraphernalia cite, max.

That helps me not have to arrest and write, helps you because it keeps you out of jail, and it helps the agency/gubmint.

So, did I commit a crime? Some say yes, some say no. I say I was using discretion.

If I catch you with coke or heroin, etc.--you get to visit the bed and breakfast, period.

pato



Didn't Tejas drop POM<2oz to Class C recently? (citation with OR bond and court appearance) Just asking...I live in OK.
Link Posted: 12/1/2007 12:10:29 PM EDT

Originally Posted By pale_pony:
I seen it happen a hundred times, at least.

If nothing else was wrong, the officer execised their own discretion and dumped a bag of grass into the bar ditch, (neighboring lawn..etc.) gave them a good scolding and sent them on their way home.

I'd like to say that the officers in question were giving people a break, but usually it's done just because a simple possession charge just isn't worth the paperwork.

(But in answer to your question, the officer in fact was probably not performing their sworn duty when it happened...would his backup tattle on him? probably not...)


+1 it's kind of like an officer giving you a warning for running a red light vs $129 ticket I'm not talking 1lb of crack cocaine, i'm talking a small baggie of pot or a cig etc..
Link Posted: 12/1/2007 12:12:14 PM EDT

Originally Posted By FedDC:
Is it for a porn star in Nashville and is she willing to give a BJ in exchange while being filmed by a cell phone cam


Iirc., in that case the trooper destroyed the evidence, not the offender and it was quid pro quo deal.
Link Posted: 12/1/2007 12:12:54 PM EDT
what KIND of drugs
Link Posted: 12/1/2007 12:13:01 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/1/2007 12:13:18 PM EDT by Tango7]
Crime? Depends on whether or not there was a quid pro quo involved.

Violation of departmental regulations? Probably.

But this is GD... did the JBT shoot a dog, taser someone or go to the wrong address?
Link Posted: 12/1/2007 12:17:29 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Tomislav:
It depends.


Always the best answer.
Link Posted: 12/1/2007 12:18:30 PM EDT

Originally Posted By pale_pony:

Originally Posted By pato:
Depends.

If you believe he did commit a crime, then you must also believe that police officers shouldn't be allowed to use discretion in their jobs. By the same token, if I stop a speeder and let him/her go with a warning--have I committed a crime? They broke a law, after all.

Now, that said, I have personally not arrested numerous individuals I have caught with small amounts of pot on them. In Texas, 0-2 ounces is a Class B and that's a problem for folks or kids that might want a higher end job or a security clearance later on. It's also a minimum of 8 pages of report at my agency if I arrest, whereas a citation for possession of paraphernalia is a Class C, doesn't have any more "oomf" than a traffic cite, and the gubmint still gets it's share through the fine.

So, if officer pato catches you with a joint or two and you aint selling and are otherwise a fairly decent human being---you will most likely get off with a possession of paraphernalia cite, max.

That helps me not have to arrest and write, helps you because it keeps you out of jail, and it helps the agency/gubmint.

So, did I commit a crime? Some say yes, some say no. I say I was using discretion.

If I catch you with coke or heroin, etc.--you get to visit the bed and breakfast, period.

pato



Didn't Tejas drop POM<2oz to Class C recently? (citation with OR bond and court appearance) Just asking...I live in OK.


If they did, I didn't hear it.

From the Health and Safety Code...

"§ 481.121. OFFENSE: POSSESSION OF MARIHUANA. (a) Except
as authorized by this chapter, a person commits an offense if the
person knowingly or intentionally possesses a usable quantity of
marihuana.
(b) An offense under Subsection (a) is:
(1) a Class B misdemeanor if the amount of marihuana
possessed is two ounces or less
;
(2) a Class A misdemeanor if the amount of marihuana
possessed is four ounces or less but more than two ounces;
(3) a state jail felony if the amount of marihuana
possessed is five pounds or less but more than four ounces;
(4) a felony of the third degree if the amount of
marihuana possessed is 50 pounds or less but more than 5 pounds;
(5) a felony of the second degree if the amount of
marihuana possessed is 2,000 pounds or less but more than 50 pounds;
and
(6) punishable by imprisonment in the institutional
division of the Texas Department of Criminal Justice for life or for
a term of not more than 99 years or less than 5 years, and a fine not
to exceed $50,000, if the amount of marihuana possessed is more than
2,000 pounds."


pato
Link Posted: 12/1/2007 12:28:06 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Current-Resident:
Everyone is guilty of a crime at any time.

There's more laws on the books than common sense in America.


Huge +1
Link Posted: 12/1/2007 12:32:27 PM EDT

Originally Posted By badfish274:

Originally Posted By Tomislav:
It depends.


Always the best answer.


Who determines the answer?
Link Posted: 12/1/2007 12:39:14 PM EDT

Originally Posted By pato:

Originally Posted By pale_pony:

Originally Posted By pato:
Depends.

If you believe he did commit a crime, then you must also believe that police officers shouldn't be allowed to use discretion in their jobs. By the same token, if I stop a speeder and let him/her go with a warning--have I committed a crime? They broke a law, after all.

Now, that said, I have personally not arrested numerous individuals I have caught with small amounts of pot on them. In Texas, 0-2 ounces is a Class B and that's a problem for folks or kids that might want a higher end job or a security clearance later on. It's also a minimum of 8 pages of report at my agency if I arrest, whereas a citation for possession of paraphernalia is a Class C, doesn't have any more "oomf" than a traffic cite, and the gubmint still gets it's share through the fine.

So, if officer pato catches you with a joint or two and you aint selling and are otherwise a fairly decent human being---you will most likely get off with a possession of paraphernalia cite, max.

That helps me not have to arrest and write, helps you because it keeps you out of jail, and it helps the agency/gubmint.

So, did I commit a crime? Some say yes, some say no. I say I was using discretion.

If I catch you with coke or heroin, etc.--you get to visit the bed and breakfast, period.

pato



Didn't Tejas drop POM<2oz to Class C recently? (citation with OR bond and court appearance) Just asking...I live in OK.


If they did, I didn't hear it.

From the Health and Safety Code...

"§ 481.121. OFFENSE: POSSESSION OF MARIHUANA. (a) Except
as authorized by this chapter, a person commits an offense if the
person knowingly or intentionally possesses a usable quantity of
marihuana.
(b) An offense under Subsection (a) is:
(1) a Class B misdemeanor if the amount of marihuana
possessed is two ounces or less
;
(2) a Class A misdemeanor if the amount of marihuana
possessed is four ounces or less but more than two ounces;
(3) a state jail felony if the amount of marihuana
possessed is five pounds or less but more than four ounces;
(4) a felony of the third degree if the amount of
marihuana possessed is 50 pounds or less but more than 5 pounds;
(5) a felony of the second degree if the amount of
marihuana possessed is 2,000 pounds or less but more than 50 pounds;
and
(6) punishable by imprisonment in the institutional
division of the Texas Department of Criminal Justice for life or for
a term of not more than 99 years or less than 5 years, and a fine not
to exceed $50,000, if the amount of marihuana possessed is more than
2,000 pounds."


pato


They have not lessened the charge they have changed ghe way cities can deal with it. Basically allows cities to issue a citation for a Class B and forces the municipal judge to complete an OR bond and forward it to the county.

Too much paperwork for most judges so cities are still hookin and bookin ofenders or, as the case with large cities, the officers are just tossin the pot writin PODP and releasing on scene,

Hope this helps

P
Link Posted: 12/1/2007 12:40:14 PM EDT
Destruction of evidence.
Link Posted: 12/1/2007 12:42:07 PM EDT
Discretion is a beautiful and powerful thing..
Link Posted: 12/1/2007 12:42:27 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Lefthandpath:
no, officers are allowed to use their discretion.


The correct way to handle that is write a report documenting where the drugs came from, recomending against proseution of the owner then book the dope into the evidence locker for destruction.

Not destroying evidence in public.
Link Posted: 12/1/2007 12:45:11 PM EDT

Originally Posted By -Apocalypto-:
+1 it's kind of like an officer giving you a warning for running a red light vs $129 ticket.


No. We are not talking about the warning for the violation. We are talking about the destruction of the evidence of the violation.

I can warn someone for a kilo of cocaine if i choose to. But there is still a legal process i have to follow reguarding the seizure and destruction of that evidence.
Link Posted: 12/1/2007 12:46:48 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/1/2007 12:52:08 PM EDT by --bullseye--]
While I personally am completely against the legalization of drugs, I will answer your question this way-

The officer, trooper, or deputy is just the first step in the funnel that is our CJ system. Discretion plays a major role in that. If there was no discretion, the court system would be a giant over crowded mess. So to answer your question with another question...

If a prosecutor decides to not charge someone with a drug charge when they did in fact posses drugs, did the prosecutor commit a crime?
Link Posted: 12/1/2007 12:48:58 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Bama-Shooter:

Originally Posted By FedDC:
Is it for a porn star in Nashville and is she willing to give a BJ in exchange while being filmed by a cell phone cam


Iirc., in that case the trooper destroyed the evidence, not the offender ...


Doesnt really matter who carries out the crime when the two of you have conspired. Plus the offender will claim later that he was deprived of his property without due process.


Link Posted: 12/1/2007 12:50:33 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Current-Resident:
Everyone is guilty of a crime at any time.

There's more laws on the books than common sense in America.


"Did you really think that we want those laws to be observed?" said Dr.
Ferris. "We want them broken. You'd better get it straight that it's not a
bunch of boy scouts you're up against - then you'll know that this is not
the age for beautiful gestures.

We're after POWER and we mean it. You fellows were pikers, but we know the real trick, and you'd better get wise to it.

There's no way to rule innocent men. The only power any government has is the power to crack down on criminals.

Well, when there aren't enough criminals, one makes them. One declares so many things to be a crime that it becomes impossible for men to live without breaking laws.

Who wants a nation of law-abiding citizens?

What's there in that for anyone?

But just pass the kind of laws that can neither be observed nor enforced nor objectively interpreted - and you create a nation of law-breakers - and then you cash in on guilt.

Now, that's the system, Mr. Rearden, that's the game and once you understand it, you'll be much easier to deal with."

~Ayn Rand, Atlas Shrugged
Link Posted: 12/1/2007 12:51:20 PM EDT

Originally Posted By --bullseye--:
While I personally am completely against the legalization of drugs, I will answer your question this way-

The officer, trooper, or deputy is just the first step in the funnel that is our CJ system. Discretion plays a major role in that. If there was no discretion, the court system would be a giant over crowded system. So to answer your question with another question...

If a prosecutor decides to not charge someone with a drug charge when they did in fact posses them, did he commit a crime?


No. Because the offense was brought before the judical process.
Link Posted: 12/1/2007 12:51:25 PM EDT

Originally Posted By cruze5:
what KIND of drugs


Doesnt matter really. Contraband is contraband. Hell change it to an illegally carried Microtech or 1911.
Link Posted: 12/1/2007 12:56:15 PM EDT

Originally Posted By AR15fan:

Originally Posted By Bama-Shooter:

Originally Posted By FedDC:
Is it for a porn star in Nashville and is she willing to give a BJ in exchange while being filmed by a cell phone cam


Iirc., in that case the trooper destroyed the evidence, not the offender ...


Doesnt really matter who carries out the crime when the two of you have conspired. Plus the offender will claim later that he was deprived of his property without due process.





Does such evidence in your location get sent to forensics for confimation without charges being filed?
Link Posted: 12/1/2007 12:57:07 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Bama-Shooter:

Originally Posted By badfish274:

Originally Posted By Tomislav:
It depends.


Always the best answer.


Who determines the answer?


Dude, I'm a law student. Professor asks me a question, the first thing out of my mouth is 'Well, it depends...'

And I havent gone though crim pro yet.
Link Posted: 12/1/2007 12:59:44 PM EDT
Well if it is a crime, then I had a sergeant order me to commit a crime early on in my career. One evening I pulled a guy over who had a warrant with another jurisdiction. After I cuffed him, I found a small baggie of weed on him. In some cases we can issue a summons instead of making them post bond, but he did not meet the criteria. Since I was new, the sergeant showed up and told me to throw out the dope and just turn him over to the agency the had the warrant on him.
This happens more frequently then some of you realize. It is NOT a crime to destroy the dope. Old-timers call it the "wind test." You dump the bag out into the breeze and if it blows away, it was weed. Discretion such as this is allowed in some agencies.
Link Posted: 12/1/2007 1:00:58 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/1/2007 1:04:23 PM EDT by RangerJoe11]
I dont know the actual laws behind the situation but to me he didnt. Officers have a lot of discretion when it come to who they want to arrest or pull over. To me this just seems like he was being nice to the "bad guy".

When I was under 21 I got got with a fifth of Jack in my car (after being pulled over for speeding, was not drinking it at the time) The cop just made me poor it out and let me go.

ETA: If I was a cop and pulled someone over and they seemed like decent people and had no warrants or anything and I found a small bag of weed on them I would just throw it out and let them be on their way. Specially if they were like 16, 17, or 18, everyone fucks up a little at that age.
Link Posted: 12/1/2007 1:01:16 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/1/2007 1:03:30 PM EDT by -Apocalypto-]
Originally Posted By AR15fan:
Originally Posted By -Apocalypto-:
+1 it's kind of like an officer giving you a warning for running a red light vs $129 ticket.[/quote/]

No. We are not talking about the warning for the violation. We are talking about the destruction of the evidence of the violation.

I can warn someone for a kilo of cocaine if i choose to. But there is still a legal process i have to follow reguarding the seizure and destruction of that evidence.[/quote

Your right, but I just don't see the logic of tieing up an officer for over an hour just to dispose of BS amount of weed when he could be doing more important stuff.
Link Posted: 12/1/2007 1:02:13 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Bama-Shooter:

Originally Posted By AR15fan:

Originally Posted By Bama-Shooter:

Originally Posted By FedDC:
Is it for a porn star in Nashville and is she willing to give a BJ in exchange while being filmed by a cell phone cam


Iirc., in that case the trooper destroyed the evidence, not the offender ...


Doesnt really matter who carries out the crime when the two of you have conspired. Plus the offender will claim later that he was deprived of his property without due process.





Does such evidence in your location get sent to forensics for confimation without charges being filed?


The officer decides what tests are done if any. If i dont fill out a request for evidence examination it doesnt get tested. Rehguardless of my recommendations for the case.
Link Posted: 12/1/2007 1:13:34 PM EDT

Originally Posted By RangerJoe11:
I dont know the actual laws behind the situation but to me he didnt. Officers have a lot of discretion when it come to who they want to arrest or pull over. To me this just seems like he was being nice to the "bad guy".

When I was under 21 I got got with a fifth of Jack in my car (after being pulled over for speeding, was not drinking it at the time) The cop just made me poor it out and let me go.

ETA: If I was a cop and pulled someone over and they seemed like decent people and had no warrants or anything and I found a small bag of weed on them I would just throw it out and let them be on their way. Specially if they were like 16, 17, or 18, everyone fucks up a little at that age.



If you are allowed to pour the beer out, don't spray the officer when you pop the top.
Link Posted: 12/1/2007 1:14:16 PM EDT

Originally Posted By badfish274:

Originally Posted By Bama-Shooter:

Originally Posted By badfish274:

Originally Posted By Tomislav:
It depends.


Always the best answer.


Who determines the answer?


Dude, I'm a law student. Professor asks me a question, the first thing out of my mouth is 'Well, it depends...'

And I havent gone though crim pro yet.


You are one of them.

Link Posted: 12/1/2007 1:16:16 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Old_Painless:
Let me offer a great quote that ought to be used by the vast majority of posters:

"I don't know the law, so my "opinion" doesn't really matter."




But this is ARFCOM GD where everyone has no house payment, no car payment, has sex with multiple super models and makes 10% on all their investments.


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