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Posted: 9/13/2004 9:59:29 AM EST
All I can say is, "wow." I just got off the phone with Kiesler's Wholesale to check prices on LEO marked ARs, and the saleman insisted they could not sell them until 12:00am tomorrow, Tuesday! Can't Americans read anymore? I argued with him and told him it actually was already expired as we spoke, but he wouldn't buy it. Besides, he wasn't too concerned about a few sales. He kinda laughed and told me they wouldn't be open at midnight (duh), so I'd just have to call back tomorrow. I know SteyrAug is selling some Colts at competitive prices, but anybody know where I can find a couple of complete Bushmaster's decently priced? Thanks much.
Link Posted: 9/13/2004 10:03:24 AM EST
everything I've seen on the news today says tonight at midight. WTF?

sorry I can't help on the BM though. good luck,

Chris
Link Posted: 9/13/2004 10:03:49 AM EST
Elmore's Firearms, 317-888-5400. Tell them I sent you.
Link Posted: 9/13/2004 10:05:32 AM EST
ohiofarmer: tell'em to check the ATF web site. The '94 AWB is gone.
Link Posted: 9/13/2004 10:06:39 AM EST
[Last Edit: 9/13/2004 10:08:28 AM EST by drobs]
Call the ATF on em!

It's over!
www.atf.gov/firearms/saw-faqs.htm
U.S. Department of Justice

Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco,
Firearms and Explosives

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Washington, DC 20226



Semiautomatic Assault Weapon (SAW) Ban

QUESTIONS & ANSWERS

September 13, 2004


Q: What was the semiautomatic assault weapon (SAW) ban?

A: The SAW ban was enacted on September 13, 1994, by PL 103-322, Title IX, Subtitle A, section 110105. The ban made it unlawful to manufacture, transfer, or possess SAWs. The law defines SAWs as 19 named firearms, as well as semiautomatic rifles, pistols, and shotguns that have certain named features. The ban was codified at 18 U.S.C. § 922(v). SAWs lawfully possessed on September 13, 1994 were not covered by the ban. There also were certain exceptions, such as possession by law enforcement.

Q: Was the SAW ban permanent?

A: No. The law enacting the ban provided that it would expire 10 years from the date of enactment, which was September 13, 1994. Therefore, effective 12:01 a.m. on September 13, 2004, the provisions of the law will cease to apply.

Q. What was the Large Capacity Ammunition Feeding Device (LCAFD) ban?

A: The LCAFD ban was enacted along with the SAW ban on September 13, 1994. The ban made it unlawful to transfer or possess LCAFDs. The law generally defined a LCAFD as a magazine, belt, drum, feed strip, or similar device manufactured after September 13, 1994 that has the capacity of, or can be readily restored or converted to accept, more than 10 rounds of ammunition. The ban was codified at 18 U.S.C.
§ 922(w). As with SAWs, there are certain exceptions to the ban, such as possession by law enforcement.

Q: Was the LCAFD ban permanent?

A: No. The LCAFD ban was enacted by the same law as the SAW ban. Therefore, like the SAW ban, it expires 10 years from the date of enactment. Therefore, effective 12:01 a.m. on September 13, 2004, the provisions of the law will cease to apply.

Q: What provisions of the Gun Control Act (GCA) besides the bans contained in sections 922(v) and (w) are no longer effective?

The definition provision for “semiautomatic assault weapon”, codified at 18 U.S.C. § 921(a)(30).


The penalty provision for violating 922(v), codified at 18 U.S.C. § 924(a)(1)(B).


The penalty provision for violating 922(v) during the commission of a crime of violence or drug trafficking offense, codified at 18 U.S.C. § 924(c)(1)(B);


The requirement that SAWs and LCAFDs manufactured after September 13, 1994, be marked with a date of manufacture next to the serial number, codified in 18 U.S.C. § 923(i). (ATF regulations (27 C.F.R. § 478.92(a)(2)) implement section 923(i) and require, effective July 5, 1995, SAWs and LCAFDs manufactured after September 13, 1994 to be marked “Restricted law enforcement/government use only” or, for weapons manufactured for export, “For export only”. These requirements also are no longer in effect.)
Q: Does expiration of the ban affect records maintained by licensed manufacturers, importers and dealers?

A. Yes. Federal firearms licensees are no longer required to collect special records regarding the sale or transfer of SAWs and LCAFDs for law enforcement or government sales. However, existing records on SAWs and LCAFDs must still be maintained for a period of 5 years. Moreover, records of importation and manufacture must be maintained permanently and licensees must maintain all other acquisition and disposition records for 20 years.

Q: Are SAWs and LCAFDs marked “Restricted law enforcement/government use only” or “For export only” legal to sell to civilians in the United States?

A: Yes. SAWs and LCAFDs are no longer prohibited. Therefore firearms with the restrictive markings are legal to transfer to civilians in the United States and it will be legal for non-prohibited civilians to possess them. All civilians may possess LCAFDs.

Q: Does the expiration of the SAW ban and the LCAFD ban affect importation?

A: LCAFDs are no longer prohibited from importation but they are still subject to the provisions of the Arms Export Control Act. An approved Form 6 import permit is still required. Non-sporting firearms are still prohibited from importation under sections 922(l) and 925(d)(3) of the GCA. Because the vast majority of SAWs are nonsporting, they generally cannot be imported.

If an importer has an approved Form 6 import permit for LCAFDs with a restriction stamp on it related to the ban, the importer may import LCAFDs using the permit and disregard the restriction stamp. Importers may apply for a new permit if they prefer. If an importer has an approved Form 6 import permit for SAWs with a restriction stamp on it related to the ban, the importer should comply with the restriction because the firearms most likely are nonsporting.

Temporary importation of SAWs and LCAFDs is now lawful under the provisions of Title 27, CFR, section 478.115(d) because firearms that are temporarily imported are not required to meet sporting purpose requirements.

Q: Does the expiration of the SAW ban change laws regarding assembly of nonsporting shotguns and semiautomatic rifles from imported parts?

A: No. The provisions of section 922(r) of the GCA and the regulations in 27 CFR 478.39 regarding assembly of non-sporting shotguns and semiautomatic rifles from imported parts still apply.

Q. Does the expiration of the SAW ban affect firearms under the National Firearms Act?

A: All provisions of the National Firearms Act (NFA) relating to registration and transfer of machineguns, short barreled rifles, weapons made from rifles, short barreled shotguns, weapons made from shotguns, any other weapons as defined in 26 USC section 5845(e), silencers, and destructive devices still apply. However, it is now lawful to possess NFA firearms that are also semiautomatic assault weapons, as long as all provisions of the NFA are satisfied.

USAS-12 and Striker12/Streetsweeper shotguns are still classified as destructive devices under ATF Rulings 94-1 and 94-2 and must be possessed and transferred in accordance with the NFA.

Q: Can tribal law enforcement entities now possess SAWs and LCAFDs?

A: Yes.

Q: Does the expiration of the ban affect State law?

A: Expiration of the federal law will not change any provisions of State law or local ordinances. Questions concerning State assault weapons restrictions should be referred to State and local authorities.

Q: Whom should I call if I have a question?

A: Your local ATF office.


Link Posted: 9/13/2004 10:07:53 AM EST
direct from the ATF website


September 13, 2004

OPEN LETTER TO FEDERALLY LICENSED FIREARMS IMPORTERS
AND REGISTERED IMPORTERS OF U.S. MUNITIONS IMPORT LIST
ARTICLES

The Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms, and Explosives (ATF) is committed to keeping industry members informed of statutory and regulatory developments affecting them. In furtherance of this commitment, we have prepared this open letter, which contains information about recent changes that may affect your day-to-day operations and/or long range plans.

Sunset of Bans on Semiautomatic Assault Weapons and Large Capacity Ammunition Feeding Devices

On September 13, 1994, Congress passed the Violent Crime Control and Law Enforcement Act of 1994, Public Law 103-322. Title IX, Subtitle A, Section 110105 of this Act generally made it unlawful to manufacture, transfer, and possess semiautomatic assault weapons (SAWs) and to transfer and possess large capacity ammunition feeding devices (LCAFDs). The law also required importers and manufacturers to place certain markings on SAWs and LCAFDs, designating they were for export or law enforcement/government use. Significantly, the law provided that it would expire 10 years from the date of enactment. Accordingly, effective 12:01 a.m. on September 13, 2004, the provisions of the law will cease to apply. This open letter is to advise the import community of the effect of this on importations.




you expect the news media to do research or what?!?!
Link Posted: 9/13/2004 10:08:37 AM EST
Thanks QuietShootr. I'll give them a call in a bit. Warlord, I offered to give him the website if he wanted it, but he wouldn't have any of it. Oh well, my business can go elsewhere.
Link Posted: 9/13/2004 10:50:43 AM EST
Let's shut down Kiesler's Email!

I just sent them the following:

Hey!

What's this I hear you won't sell hicap leo mags till tomorrow? Please advise.

Thanks.

Dan R.

www.atf.gov/firearms/saw-faqs.htm
U.S. Department of Justice

Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco,
Firearms and Explosives

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Washington, DC 20226



Semiautomatic Assault Weapon (SAW) Ban

QUESTIONS & ANSWERS

September 13, 2004


Q: What was the semiautomatic assault weapon (SAW) ban?

A: The SAW ban was enacted on September 13, 1994, by PL 103-322, Title IX, Subtitle A, section 110105. The ban made it unlawful to manufacture, transfer, or possess SAWs. The law defines SAWs as 19 named firearms, as well as semiautomatic rifles, pistols, and shotguns that have certain named features. The ban was codified at 18 U.S.C. § 922(v). SAWs lawfully possessed on September 13, 1994 were not covered by the ban. There also were certain exceptions, such as possession by law enforcement.

Q: Was the SAW ban permanent?

A: No. The law enacting the ban provided that it would expire 10 years from the date of enactment, which was September 13, 1994. Therefore, effective 12:01 a.m. on September 13, 2004, the provisions of the law will cease to apply.

Q. What was the Large Capacity Ammunition Feeding Device (LCAFD) ban?

A: The LCAFD ban was enacted along with the SAW ban on September 13, 1994. The ban made it unlawful to transfer or possess LCAFDs. The law generally defined a LCAFD as a magazine, belt, drum, feed strip, or similar device manufactured after September 13, 1994 that has the capacity of, or can be readily restored or converted to accept, more than 10 rounds of ammunition. The ban was codified at 18 U.S.C.
§ 922(w). As with SAWs, there are certain exceptions to the ban, such as possession by law enforcement.

Q: Was the LCAFD ban permanent?

A: No. The LCAFD ban was enacted by the same law as the SAW ban. Therefore, like the SAW ban, it expires 10 years from the date of enactment. Therefore, effective 12:01 a.m. on September 13, 2004, the provisions of the law will cease to apply.

Q: What provisions of the Gun Control Act (GCA) besides the bans contained in sections 922(v) and (w) are no longer effective?

The definition provision for “semiautomatic assault weapon”, codified at 18 U.S.C. § 921(a)(30).


The penalty provision for violating 922(v), codified at 18 U.S.C. § 924(a)(1)(B).


The penalty provision for violating 922(v) during the commission of a crime of violence or drug trafficking offense, codified at 18 U.S.C. § 924(c)(1)(B);


The requirement that SAWs and LCAFDs manufactured after September 13, 1994, be marked with a date of manufacture next to the serial number, codified in 18 U.S.C. § 923(i). (ATF regulations (27 C.F.R. § 478.92(a)(2)) implement section 923(i) and require, effective July 5, 1995, SAWs and LCAFDs manufactured after September 13, 1994 to be marked “Restricted law enforcement/government use only” or, for weapons manufactured for export, “For export only”. These requirements also are no longer in effect.)
Q: Does expiration of the ban affect records maintained by licensed manufacturers, importers and dealers?

A. Yes. Federal firearms licensees are no longer required to collect special records regarding the sale or transfer of SAWs and LCAFDs for law enforcement or government sales. However, existing records on SAWs and LCAFDs must still be maintained for a period of 5 years. Moreover, records of importation and manufacture must be maintained permanently and licensees must maintain all other acquisition and disposition records for 20 years.

Q: Are SAWs and LCAFDs marked “Restricted law enforcement/government use only” or “For export only” legal to sell to civilians in the United States?

A: Yes. SAWs and LCAFDs are no longer prohibited. Therefore firearms with the restrictive markings are legal to transfer to civilians in the United States and it will be legal for non-prohibited civilians to possess them. All civilians may possess LCAFDs.
Q: Does the expiration of the SAW ban and the LCAFD ban affect importation?

A: LCAFDs are no longer prohibited from importation but they are still subject to the provisions of the Arms Export Control Act. An approved Form 6 import permit is still required. Non-sporting firearms are still prohibited from importation under sections 922(l) and 925(d)(3) of the GCA. Because the vast majority of SAWs are nonsporting, they generally cannot be imported.

If an importer has an approved Form 6 import permit for LCAFDs with a restriction stamp on it related to the ban, the importer may import LCAFDs using the permit and disregard the restriction stamp. Importers may apply for a new permit if they prefer. If an importer has an approved Form 6 import permit for SAWs with a restriction stamp on it related to the ban, the importer should comply with the restriction because the firearms most likely are nonsporting.

Temporary importation of SAWs and LCAFDs is now lawful under the provisions of Title 27, CFR, section 478.115(d) because firearms that are temporarily imported are not required to meet sporting purpose requirements.

Q: Does the expiration of the SAW ban change laws regarding assembly of nonsporting shotguns and semiautomatic rifles from imported parts?

A: No. The provisions of section 922(r) of the GCA and the regulations in 27 CFR 478.39 regarding assembly of non-sporting shotguns and semiautomatic rifles from imported parts still apply.

Q. Does the expiration of the SAW ban affect firearms under the National Firearms Act?

A: All provisions of the National Firearms Act (NFA) relating to registration and transfer of machineguns, short barreled rifles, weapons made from rifles, short barreled shotguns, weapons made from shotguns, any other weapons as defined in 26 USC section 5845(e), silencers, and destructive devices still apply. However, it is now lawful to possess NFA firearms that are also semiautomatic assault weapons, as long as all provisions of the NFA are satisfied.

USAS-12 and Striker12/Streetsweeper shotguns are still classified as destructive devices under ATF Rulings 94-1 and 94-2 and must be possessed and transferred in accordance with the NFA.

Q: Can tribal law enforcement entities now possess SAWs and LCAFDs?

A: Yes.

Q: Does the expiration of the ban affect State law?

A: Expiration of the federal law will not change any provisions of State law or local ordinances. Questions concerning State assault weapons restrictions should be referred to State and local authorities.

Q: Whom should I call if I have a question?

A: Your local ATF office.


Link Posted: 9/13/2004 10:54:51 AM EST

Originally Posted By drobs:
Let's shut down Kiesler's Email!



Why harass a gun distributor that sells the types of firearms you are interested in? Just take a deep breath and wait until tomorrow.

Link Posted: 9/13/2004 11:08:11 AM EST
Supply and demand.

I'll go else where.

By the way their email is:

service@firepowertv.us
Link Posted: 9/13/2004 11:08:50 AM EST
Just cuz they sell guns does not mean they are smart.
Link Posted: 9/13/2004 11:42:10 AM EST
For Pete's sake, is it going to kill anyone if you happen to purchase it tomorrow?

I've done plenty of business with Kieslers, good bunch of folks. They support the NRA and 2A 100%. Just becuase they didn't read the newpaper lately does mean you shouldn't do business with them. So they are ill - informed. Big F'ing deal.

They are one of the good guys. They support us shooters 100%. They offer good prices on 5.56 and run many sales.

Complete Bushy's why not from them Bushmaster. Not bad pricing on their AR's. I'm sure most of the supporters on this sight will help you out.



Link Posted: 9/13/2004 11:45:47 AM EST
Fox News has now changed their reporting to say that the ban has expired.
Link Posted: 9/13/2004 12:05:51 PM EST
I'm thinking the best deals price wise won't be found this week anyways...wait till Bush wins or at least the House is still under control of Tom Delay for another 2 years...then you will get the good deals when the demand goes down and the supply is ample...
Link Posted: 9/13/2004 12:21:37 PM EST

Originally Posted By sterling18:
For Pete's sake, is it going to kill anyone if you happen to purchase it tomorrow?

I've done plenty of business with Kieslers, good bunch of folks. They support the NRA and 2A 100%. Just becuase they didn't read the newpaper lately does mean you shouldn't do business with them. So they are ill - informed. Big F'ing deal.

They are one of the good guys. They support us shooters 100%. They offer good prices on 5.56 and run many sales.

Complete Bushy's why not from them Bushmaster. Not bad pricing on their AR's. I'm sure most of the supporters on this sight will help you out.






sterling18, your right, but only to a point. I agree they have in the past taken good care of the AR community. . .and I love their ammo sales, but I was simly dismissed as if I knew nothing and could not possibly be right. Combined with the sarcasm about not being open at midnight, it would suffice to say I was left with a bad taste in my mouth. Go ahead and do business with them. I'm not bad-mouthing them, just pointing out their ignorance in this situation. At such a (trying not to sound too dramatic) watershed, monumental, etc. time for American gun rights, I would have expected them to be in the loop of things. Heaven knows one need not have read a newspaper recently to know what was going on.
Link Posted: 9/13/2004 12:30:16 PM EST

Originally Posted By ohiofarmer:

sterling18, your right, but only to a point. I agree they have in the past taken good care of the AR community. . .and I love their ammo sales, but I was simly dismissed as if I knew nothing and could not possibly be right. Combined with the sarcasm about not being open at midnight, it would suffice to say I was left with a bad taste in my mouth. Go ahead and do business with them. I'm not bad-mouthing them, just pointing out their ignorance in this situation. At such a (trying not to sound too dramatic) watershed, monumental, etc. time for American gun rights, I would have expected them to be in the loop of things. Heaven knows one need not have read a newspaper recently to know what was going on.



I agree, sarcasm to a customer is never good. Maybe just a bad day for them. Not saying it's ok to take it out on a customer.

You are a customer if you spend .25 cents or 25K. Treat everyone the same is my opinion.
Link Posted: 9/13/2004 12:47:08 PM EST
I hear Lonewolf is selling them to the general public $19.95

www.lonewolfdist.com/featured.asp

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