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Posted: 8/14/2011 3:53:31 PM EDT
LONDON, Ky. (AP) — For more than two decades, a pair of sisters in rural Kentucky have lived without Social Security numbers, doing odd jobs like bartending and making jewelry to earn cash under the table. One of them even posed as their mother to gain employment.

Now Raechel and Stephanie Schultz want steady, legitimate work, yet the federal government has refused to issue numbers to the women, saying they need more proof the pair were born in the U.S. The predicament prompted the women, who have lived for years on society’s fringes, to sue.

“I‘m proud to be American but they don’t want me,” 23-year-old Stephanie Schultz told The Associated Press in an interview at their lawyer’s office in southeastern Kentucky.

The earliest years for the Schultz sisters were nomadic. The family traveled through 42 states, never staying too long in one place. Their father found occasional work in construction or at restaurants and the children picked up cans to make a few bucks. They stayed in motels or camped and the sisters’ grandparents sent money to help.

“They didn’t have no life plan,” 29-year-old Raechel Schultz said of her parents, now in their 50s. “It was just all like free hippie style, do what you can to get by. Gypsies.”

Guess this covers my "weird story of the day" quota...
Link Posted: 8/14/2011 4:00:27 PM EDT
[#1]
So retirement is approaching and these hippy chics now want their social security and medicare.

ETA: Apparently it's their parents who are approaching retirement and who would have guessed that reading is fundamental.
Link Posted: 8/14/2011 4:01:27 PM EDT
[#2]



Quoted:


So retirement is approaching and these hippy chics now want their social security and medicare.


Age 23 & 29.  RIF



 
Link Posted: 8/14/2011 4:03:54 PM EDT
[#3]
They just need to go to California and then claim to be from Mexico.

Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile
Link Posted: 8/14/2011 4:06:27 PM EDT
[#4]
Same thing happens to the Amish who drop out



They have no birth certificates or ss numbers either
Link Posted: 8/14/2011 4:09:01 PM EDT
[#5]
All it takes is a birth certificate and a state issued i.d. card. There's obviously more to the story then what is in the article.
Link Posted: 8/14/2011 4:11:39 PM EDT
[#6]
Quoted:
All it takes is a birth certificate and a state issued i.d. card. There's obviously more to the story then what is in the article.


Home birth and never reported?

Link Posted: 8/14/2011 4:12:08 PM EDT
[#7]
Tell you what, pay back taxes into the system for all of the years you worked under the table without paying FICA and we'll hook you up.
Link Posted: 8/14/2011 4:13:33 PM EDT
[#8]
Man, that's messed up.

Even I have an SSN, and I was raised by wolves.

Link Posted: 8/14/2011 4:14:27 PM EDT
[#9]
Quoted:

Quoted:
So retirement is approaching and these hippy chics now want their social security and medicare.

Age 23 & 29.  RIF
 



I misread, apparently their parents are approaching retirement, they have many fruitful year ahead of them.
Link Posted: 8/14/2011 4:15:03 PM EDT
[#10]



Quoted:


Tell you what, pay back taxes into the system for all of the years you worked under the table without paying FICA and we'll hook you up.


No point - no one under 30 is going to be able to retire OR get SS!



 
Link Posted: 8/14/2011 4:15:21 PM EDT
[#11]
If they didn't have SSI#'s, their parents either never filed income taxes OR they never claimed the deductions. Considering these 2 have worked under the table all these years, I'm gonna go with the first option.



Why do these people share the same air with the rest of us?


Link Posted: 8/14/2011 4:16:25 PM EDT
[#12]
Quoted:

Quoted:
Tell you what, pay back taxes into the system for all of the years you worked under the table without paying FICA and we'll hook you up.

No point - no one under 30 is going to be able to retire OR get SS!
 


well, there is that.  

But if we're going to go under the pretense, then they need to play by the rules just like I do.
Link Posted: 8/14/2011 4:16:32 PM EDT
[#13]



Quoted:


So retirement is approaching and these hippy chics now want their social security and medicare.


23 years old?



There isn't going to be Social Security for them anyway.



 
Link Posted: 8/14/2011 4:17:10 PM EDT
[#14]


The IRS is never around for an audit when you need one.

Link Posted: 8/14/2011 4:19:09 PM EDT
[#15]
Quoted:

Quoted:
Tell you what, pay back taxes into the system for all of the years you worked under the table without paying FICA and we'll hook you up.

No point - no one under 30 is going to be able to retire OR get SS!
 




But they can get their SS Disability now.
Link Posted: 8/14/2011 4:20:23 PM EDT
[#16]

they look like meth heads
Link Posted: 8/14/2011 4:22:16 PM EDT
[#17]
1. Change their names to Ramirez and Gonzalez

2. ????

3. Profit
Link Posted: 8/14/2011 4:22:34 PM EDT
[#18]
I knew a guy like that.

It's hard to be a part of society without an SSN.

He's now engaged to an Air Force 2LT/Student MD and doing rather well.
Link Posted: 8/14/2011 4:22:43 PM EDT
[#19]
Quoted:
If they didn't have SSI#'s, their parents either never filed income taxes OR they never claimed the deductions. Considering these 2 have worked under the table all these years, I'm gonna go with the first option.

Why do these people share the same air with the rest of us?


I'm guessing they never made enough to have to file.

The question still stands - why should not being born in a hospital and not registering in various ways with the federal government (a variety of acts that are completely lawful) prevent a lawful American citizen from being unable to hold a job or various other functions?

SSNs were never supposed to be a unique identifier number, and were never supposed to be used for anything other than the SS program.  Our government obvious has done a fantastic job following and enforcing that law, but regardless, these two women are being treated as fringe crazies for not 'properly participating' in pretty much the same way that we gun enthusiasts get discriminated against for not wanting to disarm and be a wholly dependent integral part of a communal society.
Link Posted: 8/14/2011 4:26:28 PM EDT
[#20]
They will prolly vote for Rick Perry.  He has the undocumented worker vote, for sure.
Link Posted: 8/14/2011 4:30:23 PM EDT
[#21]
The comments section is a riot!

Get Barry's BC forger to make one for you  
Link Posted: 8/14/2011 4:30:37 PM EDT
[#22]
Quoted:
All it takes is a birth certificate and a state issued i.d. card.

Obviously you've never dealt with many bureaucrats whose only enjoyment they have in life is saying no.  Those type of people were why it took me more than a year to get my WA drivers license.z

Link Posted: 8/14/2011 4:31:39 PM EDT
[#23]
I see probably two of the only Americans in this country that actualy have liberty and they are willing to give it up for entitlements. Sad really.
Link Posted: 8/14/2011 4:36:09 PM EDT
[#24]
This is interesting... I have a two and a half year old son and he doesn't have a SS #.



I don't know if I want to make the choice to burden him with that. I think SS is still voluntary and

I don't know if I want to volunteer him.
Link Posted: 8/14/2011 4:41:40 PM EDT
[#25]
Quoted:
This is interesting... I have a two and a half year old son and he doesn't have a SS #.

I don't know if I want to make the choice to burden him with that. I think SS is still voluntary and
I don't know if I want to volunteer him.


So you aren't claiming him on your taxes?
Link Posted: 8/14/2011 4:42:44 PM EDT
[#26]




Quoted:



Quoted:

This is interesting... I have a two and a half year old son and he doesn't have a SS #.



I don't know if I want to make the choice to burden him with that. I think SS is still voluntary and

I don't know if I want to volunteer him.




So you aren't claiming him on your taxes?


Nope





Link Posted: 8/14/2011 4:45:04 PM EDT
[#27]
Link Posted: 8/14/2011 4:46:16 PM EDT
[#28]
Quoted:
I see probably two of the only Americans in this country that actualy liberty and they are willing to give it up for entitlements. Sad really.


Eh, my parents didn't have a Birth Certifacate for me until I needed it for a driveres licsense. IDK when they got my social security number, but I/they don't know where the card is. I finally had to file for my BC with the state because they couldn't find that either when I moved out. I needed the BC for a college course. Its almost imossible to live in a society that you're unfamiliar with. Thanks, dad.
Link Posted: 8/14/2011 4:48:38 PM EDT
[#29]
Quoted:
They Their parents wanted to live on the fringes of society; they got what they wanted.


FIFY

I can sympathize with their plight.


Link Posted: 8/14/2011 4:50:45 PM EDT
[#30]
Schultz eh? Sounds German, I say deport them back to Germania. Prolly illegal immigrants anyway. WE got a big problem in NYC with them coming up to you in the parking lot or sitting on the side of the road trying to sell you Westfälische Rinderwurst.
Link Posted: 8/14/2011 4:52:24 PM EDT
[#31]
Quoted:

Quoted:
Quoted:
This is interesting... I have a two and a half year old son and he doesn't have a SS #.

I don't know if I want to make the choice to burden him with that. I think SS is still voluntary and
I don't know if I want to volunteer him.


So you aren't claiming him on your taxes?

Nope




Well good luck.  Hope you plan on homeschooling.
Link Posted: 8/14/2011 4:54:39 PM EDT
[#32]
Quoted:
Quoted:
If they didn't have SSI#'s, their parents either never filed income taxes OR they never claimed the deductions. Considering these 2 have worked under the table all these years, I'm gonna go with the first option.

Why do these people share the same air with the rest of us?


I'm guessing they never made enough to have to file.

The question still stands - why should not being born in a hospital and not registering in various ways with the federal government (a variety of acts that are completely lawful) prevent a lawful American citizen from being unable to hold a job or various other functions?

SSNs were never supposed to be a unique identifier number, and were never supposed to be used for anything other than the SS program.  Our government obvious has done a fantastic job following and enforcing that law, but regardless, these two women are being treated as fringe crazies for not 'properly participating' in pretty much the same way that we gun enthusiasts get discriminated against for not wanting to disarm and be a wholly dependent integral part of a communal society.

I must say - You are one hundred percent correct.  Well said.
Link Posted: 8/14/2011 4:55:53 PM EDT
[#33]
Quoted:
All it takes is a birth certificate and a state issued i.d. card. There's obviously more to the story then what is in the article.


Yeah something is rotten in Denmark, surely they have birth certificates? There's got to be more to this story.
Link Posted: 8/14/2011 4:59:56 PM EDT
[#34]




Quoted:



Quoted:





Quoted:



Quoted:

This is interesting... I have a two and a half year old son and he doesn't have a SS #.



I don't know if I want to make the choice to burden him with that. I think SS is still voluntary and

I don't know if I want to volunteer him.




So you aren't claiming him on your taxes?


Nope









Well good luck. Hope you plan on homeschooling.
Funny you should say that, because we are. At least through the elementary school. The reason (I think) that they require a

ss number is so that they can apply for federal funding. So I guess I could send him to a private school but some of them also

receive federal funding if I am not mistaken. I think we'll cross that bridge when we come to it. I just didn't want to burden my

child with having to pay for something he will never see the benefit from.  As far as I know you are not required by law to have a

SS # to work anyway.



I didn't have a SS# until I was almost 18. I turned out ok I guess.
Link Posted: 8/14/2011 5:08:56 PM EDT
[#35]
Raechel was born at a home in Madison County, Ky., near where the family lives now; Stephanie was delivered in the back of a Dodge van in southern Alabama. The births were recorded in a family Bible but were otherwise undocumented.

Link Posted: 8/14/2011 5:09:21 PM EDT
[#36]
Quoted:
Quoted:

Quoted:
Tell you what, pay back taxes into the system for all of the years you worked under the table without paying FICA and we'll hook you up.

No point - no one under 30 is going to be able to retire OR get SS!
 




But they can get their SS Disability now.


Ding Ding Ding!
Link Posted: 8/14/2011 5:15:11 PM EDT
[#37]
Quoted:
I see probably two of the only Americans in this country that actualy liberty and they are willing to give it up for entitlements. Sad really.


I was thinking the same thing.
Link Posted: 8/14/2011 5:16:32 PM EDT
[#38]
You aren't bartending in most of rural kentucky first off.

Dry map
Link Posted: 8/14/2011 5:19:51 PM EDT
[#39]



Quoted:



Quoted:

If they didn't have SSI#'s, their parents either never filed income taxes OR they never claimed the deductions. Considering these 2 have worked under the table all these years, I'm gonna go with the first option.



Why do these people share the same air with the rest of us?





I'm guessing they never made enough to have to file.



The question still stands - why should not being born in a hospital and not registering in various ways with the federal government (a variety of acts that are completely lawful) prevent a lawful American citizen from being unable to hold a job or various other functions?



SSNs were never supposed to be a unique identifier number, and were never supposed to be used for anything other than the SS program.  Our government obvious has done a fantastic job following and enforcing that law, but regardless, these two women are being treated as fringe crazies for not 'properly participating' in pretty much the same way that we gun enthusiasts get discriminated against for not wanting to disarm and be a wholly dependent integral part of a communal society.


When databases came into being they had to have a unique key and since everyone already had a SSN, why reinvent the wheel.



 
Link Posted: 8/14/2011 5:20:21 PM EDT
[#40]
Quoted:

they look like meth heads


Ridden hard, put away wet................

Brian
Link Posted: 8/14/2011 5:24:39 PM EDT
[#41]
Quoted:
Quoted:
If they didn't have SSI#'s, their parents either never filed income taxes OR they never claimed the deductions. Considering these 2 have worked under the table all these years, I'm gonna go with the first option.

Why do these people share the same air with the rest of us?


I'm guessing they never made enough to have to file.

The question still stands - why should not being born in a hospital and not registering in various ways with the federal government (a variety of acts that are completely lawful) prevent a lawful American citizen from being unable to hold a job or various other functions?
SSNs were never supposed to be a unique identifier number, and were never supposed to be used for anything other than the SS program.  Our government obvious has done a fantastic job following and enforcing that law, but regardless, these two women are being treated as fringe crazies for not 'properly participating' in pretty much the same way that we gun enthusiasts get discriminated against for not wanting to disarm and be a wholly dependent integral part of a communal society.


This sort of situation is the type of thing that P&I should, unquestionably, cover.
Link Posted: 8/14/2011 5:27:59 PM EDT
[#42]
Some of the comments in this thread are, quite frankly, disgusting.

I have zero doubt that if we were living in communist Russia, some of you people would be informing on your neighbors for their illegal private potato patch.
Link Posted: 8/14/2011 5:29:13 PM EDT
[#43]


No "I'd Hit It!" yet???

Apparently Arfom has standards after all.

Link Posted: 8/14/2011 5:30:59 PM EDT
[#44]
Quoted:

Quoted:
Quoted:
This is interesting... I have a two and a half year old son and he doesn't have a SS #.

I don't know if I want to make the choice to burden him with that. I think SS is still voluntary and
I don't know if I want to volunteer him.


So you aren't claiming him on your taxes?

Nope




That makes no economic sense unless you are fairly well off.  You could be collecting $1000 tax credit for your child each year, and investing that on his behalf.  SS is "voluntary" in the sense that you don't have to participate if you don't work, or work for someone who has an alternative retirement system.  The reality is that you're very likely to have to get him a SSN at some point, and every year you wait you leave $1000 on the table.  If you were to ask your child at age 18 whether they'd rather be "social security number free" or have $30+k saved for college (assuming you invest the $1k tax credit), what do you think he'd want?

Living completely "off grid" is possible in the US, but you're going to pay a price for it.


Link Posted: 8/14/2011 5:32:52 PM EDT
[#45]
Quoted:
Quoted:

Quoted:
Quoted:
This is interesting... I have a two and a half year old son and he doesn't have a SS #.

I don't know if I want to make the choice to burden him with that. I think SS is still voluntary and
I don't know if I want to volunteer him.


So you aren't claiming him on your taxes?

Nope




That makes no economic sense unless you are fairly well off.  You could be collecting $1000 tax credit for your child each year, and investing that on his behalf.  SS is "voluntary" in the sense that you don't have to participate if you don't work, or work for someone who has an alternative retirement system.  The reality is that you're very likely to have to get him a SSN at some point, and every year you wait you leave $1000 on the table.  If you were to ask your child at age 18 whether they'd rather be "social security number free" or have $30+k saved for college (assuming you invest the $1k tax credit), what do you think he'd want?

Living completely "off grid" is possible in the US, but you're going to pay a price for it.




I am assuming you do not see what is wrong with your thinking. As I said before almost all Americans are heavily invested in the entitlement mentality. This is proof of that.

Link Posted: 8/14/2011 5:36:45 PM EDT
[#46]
I lived in the area known as Lily, KY for many years. That whole part of SE KY is full of pill and meth heads. Only one road runs through there and that's Hwy 552. At either end of it are burned out meth houses. One had quite a history before the local FD let it burn to the ground

 
Link Posted: 8/14/2011 5:49:15 PM EDT
[#47]
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:

Quoted:
Quoted:
This is interesting... I have a two and a half year old son and he doesn't have a SS #.

I don't know if I want to make the choice to burden him with that. I think SS is still voluntary and
I don't know if I want to volunteer him.


So you aren't claiming him on your taxes?

Nope




That makes no economic sense unless you are fairly well off.  You could be collecting $1000 tax credit for your child each year, and investing that on his behalf.  SS is "voluntary" in the sense that you don't have to participate if you don't work, or work for someone who has an alternative retirement system.  The reality is that you're very likely to have to get him a SSN at some point, and every year you wait you leave $1000 on the table.  If you were to ask your child at age 18 whether they'd rather be "social security number free" or have $30+k saved for college (assuming you invest the $1k tax credit), what do you think he'd want?

Living completely "off grid" is possible in the US, but you're going to pay a price for it.




I am assuming you do not see what is wrong with your thinking. As I said before almost all Americans are heavily invested in the entitlement mentality. This is proof of that.



I'm thinking in terms of economic reality and tax bills.  This has nothing to do with any entitlement program (unless you are arguing that the child tax credit is an entitlement program, but I'm fairly sure you aren't advocating an end to that).  If being able to say "I'm not signing up for a number!" is worth paying the government an extra $1000 a year to you, then more power to you.  The reality is that there's no way to live in our society without being subject to some level of regulation by the government.  Not registering your kid for a SSN seems a weird (and expensive) place to draw a line in the sand.

Link Posted: 8/14/2011 5:50:19 PM EDT
[#48]
For those who couldn't read the full article:

Their father told them they couldn't get SSN's if they were too young. They believed him. They have another sister with a SSN who applied for it as a teenager.

Both their parents have college degrees.

They live where they do now because that's where the family car broke down......14 years ago.

They sued to get Birth Certificates in 2009 and won after taking DNA tests to prove they were their parents' children.

Social Security Administration refuses to accept their new Birth Certificates claiming they're "too new". (If the Federal Gov't won't accept a brand new BC as proof of citizenship, why should we accept Oblammo's?).

They're not asking for a SSN to get free cheese, they're asking for SSN so they can get legitimate jobs. Their parents' lifestyle had them scrounging their entire lives, now they're looking to become tax paying, wage earning productive members of society. Good for them. You need a SSN to get a legitimate job.
Link Posted: 8/14/2011 6:50:41 PM EDT
[#49]




Quoted:



Quoted:



Quoted:



Quoted:





Quoted:



Quoted:

This is interesting... I have a two and a half year old son and he doesn't have a SS #.



I don't know if I want to make the choice to burden him with that. I think SS is still voluntary and

I don't know if I want to volunteer him.




So you aren't claiming him on your taxes?


Nope









That makes no economic sense unless you are fairly well off. You could be collecting $1000 tax credit for your child each year, and investing that on his behalf. SS is "voluntary" in the sense that you don't have to participate if you don't work, or work for someone who has an alternative retirement system. The reality is that you're very likely to have to get him a SSN at some point, and every year you wait you leave $1000 on the table. If you were to ask your child at age 18 whether they'd rather be "social security number free" or have $30+k saved for college (assuming you invest the $1k tax credit), what do you think he'd want?



Living completely "off grid" is possible in the US, but you're going to pay a price for it.









I am assuming you do not see what is wrong with your thinking. As I said before almost all Americans are heavily invested in the entitlement mentality. This is proof of that.







I'm thinking in terms of economic reality and tax bills. This has nothing to do with any entitlement program (unless you are arguing that the child tax credit is an entitlement program, but I'm fairly sure you aren't advocating an end to that). If being able to say "I'm not signing up for a number!" is worth paying the government an extra $1000 a year to you, then more power to you. The reality is that there's no way to live in our society without being subject to some level of regulation by the government. Not registering your kid for a SSN seems a weird (and expensive) place to draw a line in the sand.





I do ok and he already has about 10K for college and he is 2 and a half so that's covered. If you stretch your numbers out a little bit he would pay approx 6k a year for the rest of his earning life with no return if he participates in SS. That comes out to 192K. It makes the 30 he had for college seem and the 18k I paid extra to the government seem inconsequential. Like I said I don't want to put him in debt to the government when he is only 2 years old. If it cost me a grand a year so be it.

Link Posted: 8/14/2011 6:52:41 PM EDT
[#50]
Besides everyone "KNOWING" you have to have a SS card to have a job. Can anyone point me to the law that says so?
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