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10/20/2017 1:01:18 AM
9/22/2017 12:11:25 AM
Posted: 8/4/2005 11:14:06 AM EDT
Link Posted: 8/4/2005 1:46:46 PM EDT
Sounds like a charming area.... I'll have to pencil it in for a vacation weekend some time..... maybe beruit afterwards.
Link Posted: 8/4/2005 1:53:48 PM EDT
He got what he deserved.
Link Posted: 8/4/2005 1:56:58 PM EDT
But ... but ... but ... the pullout from Gaza was supposed to bring peace! They promised!
Link Posted: 8/4/2005 2:06:46 PM EDT
Hmmm. The trial will not be lengthy.
Link Posted: 8/4/2005 2:08:34 PM EDT
I bet he doesn't do that again.
Link Posted: 8/4/2005 2:10:13 PM EDT
So why can't we do that with criminals and terrorists?
Link Posted: 8/4/2005 2:12:10 PM EDT
What a surprise!
Link Posted: 8/4/2005 2:12:52 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Zaphod:
So why can't we do that with criminals and terrorists?




because of the bill of rights
Link Posted: 8/4/2005 2:13:38 PM EDT

Originally Posted By SoCalJBT:
He got what he deserved.



+1. There is no excuse for any actions by any side for this. Murder is still murder.
Link Posted: 8/4/2005 2:22:33 PM EDT
Link Posted: 8/4/2005 2:26:58 PM EDT

Originally Posted By TomJefferson:
Now that is one ironic damn story. Talk about misplaced loyalties.

BTW, Sounds like to me, the mob was going to kill his ass whether he opened up or not. 9plus against one isn't good odds.

Tj



There was no mob until he started shooting. He got onto a bus with his weapon after going ahwol and had planned to do something by the sounds of it. He than opened fire and than a mob killed him after he had opened fire.
Link Posted: 8/4/2005 2:28:51 PM EDT
Link Posted: 8/4/2005 2:29:39 PM EDT
Bummer
Link Posted: 8/4/2005 2:35:31 PM EDT

Originally Posted By TomJefferson:

Originally Posted By VTwin60:

Originally Posted By SoCalJBT:
He got what he deserved.



+1. There is no excuse for any actions by any side for this. Murder is still murder.



No my friend, there's a difference between killing and murder. Had this guy lived, he might have beat the charge for the odds were greatly against him. We'll never know since he never got a chance to explain what motivated his action. Two wrongs do not make a right no matter what.

All we know and which is ironic is that he deserted his unit to defend Arabs and was killed by Arabs after shooting a bunch. Doesn't sound like terrorist but a guy wearing the wrong uniform on the wrong bus.

Tj



And we know that how again?........I thought the article read like he wasn't gonna be part of his Countrys' giving the Gaza settlements to the "Palestinians". Sounds to me like he felt pretty strongly against the idea.
Link Posted: 8/4/2005 2:37:16 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/4/2005 2:38:18 PM EDT by VTwin60]

Originally Posted By TomJefferson:

Originally Posted By VTwin60:

Originally Posted By SoCalJBT:
He got what he deserved.



+1. There is no excuse for any actions by any side for this. Murder is still murder.



No my friend, there's a difference between killing and murder. Had this guy lived, he might have beat the charge for the odds were greatly against him. We'll never know since he never got a chance to explain what motivated his action. Two wrongs do not make a right no matter what.

All we know and which is ironic is that he deserted his unit to defend Arabs and was killed by Arabs after shooting a bunch. Doesn't sound like terrorist but a guy wearing the wrong uniform on the wrong bus.

Tj



Wrong my friend, refusing orders to remove Isreali settlers, going AWOL, getting on a bus with a loaded gun, and shooting people sitting there is murder. If you need a definition try Websters. BTW where are you coming up with this stuff?
Link Posted: 8/4/2005 2:37:55 PM EDT
Link Posted: 8/4/2005 2:40:26 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/4/2005 2:41:32 PM EDT by VTwin60]

Originally Posted By TomJefferson:

Originally Posted By olyarms:

Originally Posted By TomJefferson:
Now that is one ironic damn story. Talk about misplaced loyalties.

BTW, Sounds like to me, the mob was going to kill his ass whether he opened up or not. 9plus against one isn't good odds.

Tj



There was no mob until he started shooting. He got onto a bus with his weapon after going ahwol and had planned to do something by the sounds of it. He than opened fire and than a mob killed him after he had opened fire.



Sorry, don't care to debate how many people make a mob but 11 shot is a pretty good size number. Nor do I care speculate reading the guys mind especially contrary to his actions which were supportive to Muslims.

The media slant of that story using the quote from some police spokesman admittedly not knowing fact by using the word "sounds like" simply isn't going to influence my opinion. As soon as I read "sounds like", I dsgarded it as fact.

Tj



Well hell if we're going to make stuff up as we go along.....I bet he was really a nihilistic white Supremisist who was wearing a his KKK uniform and tried converting the muslims into good Christians where upon once the heathens refused he shot them all in the Good Lords name.....

Jewish Extremist Opens Fire Inside Bus

By KRISTEN STEVENS, Associated Press Writer 59 minutes ago

SHFARAM, Israel - A 19-year-old Israeli soldier opened fire inside a bus Thursday, killing four Israeli Arabs in the deadliest attack on Arabs in
Israel by a Jewish extremist since 1990. An angry crowd then killed the gunman.
ADVERTISEMENT

Thirteen people, including bus passengers and two policemen, were wounded in the shooting, which appeared linked to tensions over the upcoming Israeli pullout from the
Gaza Strip and parts of the
West Bank.

After the attack, the bruised and bloodied body of the gunman lay on the floor of the bus surrounded by stones — raising the possibility he had been stoned to death.

The military identified the dead soldier as Pvt. Eden Natan-Zada, a resident of the Jewish settlement of Tapuah in the West Bank. Natan-Zada's father, Yitzhak, told The Associated Press his son ran away from his army unit several weeks ago after being told he would have to participate in the Gaza pullout.

Israel Radio said the gunman was bludgeoned to death by the crowd. After the attack, the gunman's body lay on the floor of the bus, and police had covered his head with a black plastic bag. His shirtless upper torso was heavily bruised.

Israeli Prime Minister
Ariel Sharon denounced the shooting as "a despicable act by a bloodthirsty terrorist." Settler leaders also condemned the attack.

Palestinian leader Mahmoud Abbas called on Israel to prevent Jewish settlers from carrying weapons "because they (the settlers) are dangerous to the security and peace." Many settlers carry arms, which they say they need to protect themselves.

Security officials have been warning for months that Jewish militants, desperate to sabotage Israel's pullout, might attack Arabs to deflect Israeli forces away from the Gaza pullout. The police commissioner, Moshe Karadi, warned the shooting could trigger more violence.

The attack took place on the No. 165, which shuttles between the Arab town of Shfaram in northern Israel and nearby communities. At around 6 p.m., the bearded gunman, who wore an Israeli army uniform, boarded the bus and opened fire. Police said the attacker wore a skullcap, identifying him as an Orthodox Jew.

Four people were killed, including the driver. Police said the four apparently were all residents of Shfaram.

The windows of the bus were shattered. Blood covered the floor and seats of the bus, and stones lay on the floor. A policeman with a bullhorn, standing near the body, addressed a crowd of thousands at the scene.

Several hours later, police slowly drove the bus away as hundreds of Shfaram residents ran alongside the vehicle. Investigators kept collecting evidence inside the bus as it was driven out of town.

Yitzhak Natan-Zada, 49, said he had asked the army to find his son, who fled from his unit after refusing to take part in the Gaza pullout. The elder Natan-Zada said he was worried his son's weapons would fall into the hands of fanatics in Tapuah.

"I wasn't afraid that he would do something. I was afraid of the others," Natan-Zada said by telephone. "I spoke to him two days ago and he was a happy and good-hearted boy and he told me he would find the time to return the weapon."

Tapuah is one of the most extreme Jewish settlements, dominated by followers of U.S.-born Rabbi Meir Kahane, who advocated expelling Arabs from Israel and the West Bank. Kahane was assassinated in New York in 1990.

Israel TV said Natan-Zada was a deserter from his army unit who grew up in the Israeli city of Rishon Letzion and moved to the settlement recently.

There have been several incidents of Jewish extremists attacking Arabs over the years, but rarely inside Israel. In 1990, during the first Palestinian uprising, an Israeli opened fire at a bus stop where Palestinians gathered for job placements, killing seven.

In 1994, Baruch Goldstein, an American-born Jewish settler entered a holy site in the West Bank city of Hebron and opened fire on Muslim worshippers, killing 29 — the bloodiest attack by a Jewish extremist against Palestinians.

Israeli Arabs make up about 20 percent of Israel's population of 6.9 million. They remained in their homes during the 1948-49 war that followed creation of the state of Israel, while hundreds of thousands of others fled or were driven out.

Though Israeli Arabs are full citizens, they have suffered from discrimination by Jewish-dominated governments. Many of their towns and villages lack basic infrastructure, and Arab localities are usually at the top of Israel's unemployment lists.

Anger spilled over in October 2000, when thousands of Arabs rioted in support of the Palestinian uprising, which erupted the month before. Israeli police shot and killed 13 Arabs, further infuriating and alienating many Arab citizens.

In southern Israel, meanwhile, opponents of the pullout ended their second mass protest Thursday, after police blocked their plan to march to Gaza to reinforce the settlements. A few hundred protesters remained behind in the town of Ofakim, including settlers' council head Bentsi Lieberman, who denounced the shooting.

"Murder is murder is murder, and there can be no other response but to denounce it completely and express revulsion," he said.

Karadi said forces had been diverted to deal with the demonstrators, leaving the north of Israel short-handed. "We have sent forces from the center and those from the south who were supposed to be going home have now been diverted to the north," he said.
Link Posted: 8/4/2005 2:42:20 PM EDT
We really don't know what happened here. The only witnesses I've seen are Palestinians (w/ Israeli citizenship). I don't exactly take those folks at their word. I'll wait for more information.
Link Posted: 8/4/2005 2:43:49 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/4/2005 2:49:42 PM EDT by TomJefferson]
Link Posted: 8/4/2005 2:49:43 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Red_Beard:

Originally Posted By Zaphod:
So why can't we do that with criminals and terrorists?




because of the bill of rights




Doesn't apply to terrorists.

Besides, we're talking the people, not the government!
Link Posted: 8/4/2005 2:50:47 PM EDT

Originally Posted By SoCalJBT:
He got what he deserved.



+1

Sounds like a murderer to me.
Link Posted: 8/4/2005 2:51:56 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/4/2005 3:01:35 PM EDT by raven]

Originally Posted By TomJefferson:

Originally Posted By VTwin60:

Originally Posted By SoCalJBT:
He got what he deserved.



+1. There is no excuse for any actions by any side for this. Murder is still murder.



No my friend, there's a difference between killing and murder. Had this guy lived, he might have beat the charge for the odds were greatly against him. We'll never know since he never got a chance to explain what motivated his action. Two wrongs do not make a right no matter what.

All we know and which is ironic is that he deserted his unit to defend Arabs and was killed by Arabs after shooting a bunch. Doesn't sound like terrorist but a guy wearing the wrong uniform on the wrong bus.

Tj



If he was angry, why did he shoot Arabs? He should have vented against Sharon. Pulling out of Gaza is his idea.

Israel never extended the propect of standing trial to the various terrorists they killed by bomb and hellfire missile over the last 5 years. But that is war.

This guy was a civilian, who killed ISRAELI civilians, who happened to be Arab. Maybe vigilante justice is wrong, but if this guy did what he did (and I have no reason to think he didn't) he got what he deserved, even if it was a lynching.
Link Posted: 8/4/2005 2:56:18 PM EDT

Originally Posted By TomJefferson:


BTW, I just may be tainted for I don't trust a Palistinian Lynch Mob nor a media intent on keeping the peace to tell the facts.



They weren't Palestinian pos' these were Arab Israeli's. You may want take that reading course again.
Link Posted: 8/4/2005 3:08:57 PM EDT
Link Posted: 8/4/2005 3:12:21 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/4/2005 3:12:46 PM EDT by VTwin60]

Originally Posted By TomJefferson:

You really think Arabs with Isrelli citizenship consider themselves Isrelli and not Palistinian?



Tj



Arabs are not Palestinians, once again I beseech you to do your reading. Incidentally I work with three Arab Isrealis along with several American Jews. Neither have the hatred you speak of. Its what happens when you're born in country. Your name sake would be dissapointed in learning your hanging out and conversing with radicals.
Link Posted: 8/4/2005 3:13:23 PM EDT
Link Posted: 8/4/2005 3:17:44 PM EDT

Originally Posted By VTwin60:

Originally Posted By TomJefferson:

You really think Arabs with Isrelli citizenship consider themselves Isrelli and not Palistinian?



Tj



Arabs are not Palestinians, once again I beseech you to do your reading. Incidentally I work with three Arab Isrealis along with several American Jews. Neither have the hatred you speak of. Its what happens when you're born in country. Your name sake would be dissapointed in learning your hanging out and conversing with radicals.



Well then its settled. All Arab Israelis are as reasonable as your friends, which is why peace is about to descend on the middle-east. Incidentially, I have several Russian friends and, since they are all nice, I can't for the life of me figure out why we had the Cold War?

Link Posted: 8/4/2005 3:34:47 PM EDT
Link Posted: 8/4/2005 3:56:33 PM EDT
From Arutz Sheva:

Jew Kills 4 Arabs; Media Links Murder with Protests
23:27 Aug 04, '05 / 28 Tammuz 5765
By Tzvi Ben Gedalyahu



A Jewish soldier who went AWOL from the IDF one month ago killed four people and wounded 12 others when he opened fire inside a bus in an Arab town in the Galilee.

Angry residents lynched the 19-year-old following the shooting. He was identified as Eden Natan Zada from Rishon L'tzion, a city south of Tel Aviv. Israeli media reported that he recently moved to the Kfar Tapuach community in northeast Samaria after turning to religion and becoming involved in extreme political activism, but the administrator of the community said he never heard of the man.

The killer's parents, worried over their son's radical change, said they had asked the army to take away their son's weapon but were told by officers there was no need to do so.

Israel media tried to link the murder with anti-expulsion protests and pointed out that the murderer had refused to take part in the planned expulsion. Former MK Rabbi Chanan Porat told questioning interviewers there is absolutely no connection to be made between the anti-expulsion protests and the murder.

The bus reached the town of Shfaram, which is made up of Christians and Moslems, from Haifa when Tzuberi, dressed in a Border Police uniform, opened fire and killed the driver, another man and two girls. He continued to shoot at people inside and outside the bus as the bus continued to roll down the residential street. The bus came to a halt and at least one bus passenger managed to disarm the gunman.

Police fanned out throughout Arab towns to ward off riots.

Many questions remained unanswered following the murder, which occurred shortly before 6 p.m., particularly concerning events immediately after the shooting. Police approached the bus in the town of Shafarm after the shooting and removed an angry mob from the bus and reportedly tried to protect the vehicle from hundreds of angry Arab residents. Five officers were injured as the mob pelted them with stones and bottles. Several people got past police, but it was not clear whether the shooter was killed following the police intervention or whether he died from the initial mob attack.

Tzuberi was in an IDF unit other than the Border Police and it is not known how or why he obtained the Border Police uniforms.

MK Uri Ariel (National Union) said the IDF must investigate why the murderer had his weapon with him after having been on AWOL for an extended period of time.

Prime Minister Ariel Sharon said, "This was a reprehensible act by a bloodthirsty Jewish terrorist who sought to attack innocent Israeli citizens.... I send condolences to the families of those who were murdered and my best wishes for a quick recovery to those who were wounded. The entire State of Israel, regardless of race, religion or sex, strongly condemns this act of terrorism."

The Council of Jewish Communities in Judea and Samaria (Yesha Council) announced its shock, denouncing the murder as being committed by someone "crazy." Yesha spokesmen criticized "the cynical use of the incident by certain political entities to try to make a connection between the serious incident and the democratic, legitimate and nonviolent protest against the expulsion from Gush Katif being waged.

"Repeatedly referring to him as 'a settler' even though he was not a resident of any settlement is an attempt to slander a whole population who is leading a democratic protest in an exemplary way. It would be better to act with more responsibility instead of criticizing only in order to gain dubious political benefits."


Click here for our free Daily News Report from Israel



Published: 19:37 August 04, 2005
Last Update: 23:27 August 04, 2005
Link Posted: 8/4/2005 5:50:14 PM EDT
I love this shit.



For years real terrorists i.e. Arabs have been blowing up entire bus loads of innocent Israelis.

Today one Jew kills a couple of Arabs and everbody in the liberal media AND many here feel it's the travesty of our lifetime.

I say welcome to the party assholes, this guy learned about terrorism from the best.
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