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Posted: 9/24/2004 7:44:12 AM EST
I just heard on FOX that a Butler campus cop was killed in a shoot out. Anyone have more details?
Link Posted: 9/24/2004 7:45:55 AM EST

Originally Posted By TeuffelHunden1775:
I just heard on FOX that a Butler campus cop was killed in a shoot out. Anyone have more details?










Butler police officer shot, killed
Police searching for suspect after incident this morning in the parking lot at Hinkle Fieldhouse; area schools are locked down.


Star report
September 24, 2004


A Butler University Police Department officer was shot and killed this morning in the parking lot at Hinkle Fieldhouse.

Police dispatchers reported that an armed black male is being sought. The officer, who university officials identified as James Davis, 31, was pronounced dead at 11:08 a.m. from a single gunshot wound to the head. He had been with the Butler police department since January, 2003.

Police have set up a perimeter from 46th Street to 49th Street between Sunset and Boulevard as they search for the suspect.

At 11 a.m., a team of shotgun-wielding Indianapolis Police and Marion County Sheriff's deputies were going through garages on Cornelius Ave. north of 47th Street.

Schools in the area have also been locked down.

Shelley McFarland, a junior at Butler, was walking on 46th street just west of Cornelius Avenue at 10:45 a.m. as police cars were speeding by to set up road blocks. “I’m a little shocked," she said. "This is very scary. Not the best day to walk to school."

At International School of Indiana, adjacent to Hinkle Fieldhouse, teachers were at the front door peering out the window. They said, through the window, that the school was in lockdown and that the students are safe.

Police cars are at nearly every intersection in the area, with helicopters circling overhead.

Link Posted: 9/24/2004 7:46:51 AM EST
Guess you beat me to the punch........I just started a thread as well.
Link Posted: 9/24/2004 7:47:21 AM EST
Link Posted: 9/24/2004 7:49:07 AM EST
Thanks.
Link Posted: 9/24/2004 7:49:54 AM EST
Link Posted: 9/24/2004 7:51:35 AM EST
[Last Edit: 9/24/2004 7:51:47 AM EST by TeuffelHunden1775]
It appears he's still at large. I've yet to hear what his original intentions / reasons were.
Link Posted: 9/24/2004 7:54:07 AM EST
Any folks in Indy got up to minute info?
Link Posted: 9/24/2004 7:55:33 AM EST
How can this be? It is illegal for non LEOs to carry guns on a school campus. That can only mean one thing. The killer is a cop.
Link Posted: 9/24/2004 7:57:47 AM EST

Originally Posted By TeuffelHunden1775:
Any folks in Indy got up to minute info?



I'm in HQ. We're watching the CAD. So far we have two suspect descriptions. Both Black males, one 6' 200 and the other 5' 7" 170. Possibly named Kevin williams. NOT VERIFIED. Suspect believed to have officers gun.
Link Posted: 9/24/2004 8:00:41 AM EST
Conflicting descriptions or two individuals?
Link Posted: 9/24/2004 8:02:48 AM EST

Originally Posted By Maddogkiller:
How can this be? It is illegal for non LEOs to carry guns on a school campus. That can only mean one thing. The killer is a cop.



You deserve to be bitch slapped for that comment.
Link Posted: 9/24/2004 8:05:37 AM EST

Originally Posted By Maddogkiller:
How can this be? It is illegal for non LEOs to carry guns on a school campus. That can only mean one thing. The killer is a cop.

I guess we have a new in town!
Link Posted: 9/24/2004 8:06:03 AM EST
Two different individuals. They got the name because the officer was running a check on him. As should be expected, the name is pretty common and we have several in our records.
Link Posted: 9/24/2004 8:07:05 AM EST

Originally Posted By rn45:
Two different individuals. They got the name because the officer was running a check on him. As should be expected, the name is pretty common and we have several in our records.



Rn, which PD do you work for? I'm up in HCSD.
Link Posted: 9/24/2004 8:11:41 AM EST
IPD.
Link Posted: 9/24/2004 8:14:21 AM EST
Gotcha. Catch that bastard, ok?
Link Posted: 9/24/2004 8:14:41 AM EST
For those who don't know, the Fieldhouse is where they filmed many scenes for the movie Hoosiers.

I've been there many times.

Shithole neighborhood.
Link Posted: 9/24/2004 8:19:02 AM EST

Originally Posted By HeldHostage:

Originally Posted By rn45:
Two different individuals. They got the name because the officer was running a check on him. As should be expected, the name is pretty common and we have several in our records.



Rn, which PD do you work for? I'm up in HCSD.



Henry County? I used to be with Delaware County.
Link Posted: 9/24/2004 8:19:40 AM EST
Hamilton
Link Posted: 9/24/2004 8:20:24 AM EST
Link Posted: 9/24/2004 8:23:07 AM EST


Shelley McFarland, a junior at Butler, was walking on 46th street just west of Cornelius Avenue at 10:45 a.m. as police cars were speeding by to set up road blocks. “I’m a little shocked," she said. "This is very scary. Not the best day to walk to school."



Link Posted: 9/24/2004 8:24:03 AM EST
Link Posted: 9/24/2004 8:28:25 AM EST

Originally Posted By Maddogkiller:
How can this be? It is illegal for non LEOs to carry guns on a school campus. That can only mean one thing. The killer is a cop.



I wont be as quick on the trigger to call you a troll. I read this as sarcasm. I think you were being sarcastic about gun laws and how they do nothing to keep criminals from shooting ANYONE whether they be cops or civilians. I dont believe you intended your statement to be percieved as LEO bashing. Am I correct?
Link Posted: 9/24/2004 8:29:34 AM EST

Originally Posted By GUNGUY1911:

Originally Posted By Maddogkiller:
How can this be? It is illegal for non LEOs to carry guns on a school campus. That can only mean one thing. The killer is a cop.

I guess we have a new in town!



Hey dummy, he's making light of the stupid law that says you can't carry a gun on school property.
Link Posted: 9/24/2004 8:32:01 AM EST

Originally Posted By SNorman:

Originally Posted By GUNGUY1911:

Originally Posted By Maddogkiller:
How can this be? It is illegal for non LEOs to carry guns on a school campus. That can only mean one thing. The killer is a cop.

I guess we have a new in town!



Hey dummy, he's making light of the stupid law that says you can't carry a gun on school property.



Remember in such a serious situation where it is close to home for many people on this board, making light of any laws without obviously blatant sarcasm will get you deemed as a troll or bitch slapped by myself if I ever run into you. Nothing right now is very funny, this is the second officer we've lost in the last month! So, Pardon us for not finding his comment very amusing.
Link Posted: 9/24/2004 8:32:49 AM EST
So far, we have just one suspect at large. We have officers all over the place. Man, I really hate this shit.

As far as I know, the suspect was watching girls play basketball. The Butler officer was asked to check on him. He was running a check when the suspect shot him. We believe he may have the officer's gun as well as his own.

Butler is a fairly upscale university and specializes in pharmacology. It's a nice place. The neighborhood near it is not the best in the world.

As of 12:32, no suspect incustody.
Link Posted: 9/24/2004 8:35:29 AM EST
My condolences to the officers friends and family. I hope the shooter attempts to draw down on another cop and gives him/her an excuse to ventilate his sorry ass.
Link Posted: 9/24/2004 8:42:22 AM EST
Not to change the subject, but what's the story of the other officer that was killed?
Link Posted: 9/24/2004 8:45:19 AM EST
[Last Edit: 9/24/2004 8:48:41 AM EST by HeldHostage]
They're now releasing information that a 2nd person - unknown if an officer, citizen or suspect - may have been shot in this search.


The 2nd officer that was killed was by a man with an assault weapon shooting up a neighborhood. Here's a link so you can read it instead of me typing it.

home1.gte.net/joking1/laird.htm

Edited to add: They've now released the suspect has been shot. Nabbed!
Link Posted: 9/24/2004 8:49:35 AM EST
[Last Edit: 9/24/2004 8:53:41 AM EST by rn45]
Trying to confirm. Suspect shot near original location. Just a few blocks east. Information pending. This may be totally unrelated.

This may be the suspect.

It's him. He has been shot. Still alive as far as I know. They're taking him to the same hospital that they took the officer to.
Link Posted: 9/24/2004 8:53:47 AM EST

Originally Posted By rn45:
Trying to confirm. Suspect shot near original location. Just a few blocks east. Information pending. This may be totally unrelated.

This may be the suspect.

It's him. He has been shot. Still alive as far as I know.



Keep us informed, if you will.
Link Posted: 9/24/2004 8:55:13 AM EST
They have released the perimeter. The dead officer's gun was recovered from the wounded suspect.
Link Posted: 9/24/2004 8:56:13 AM EST
Congrats on the arrest for your department. You guys really earned your pay today.
Link Posted: 9/24/2004 8:56:25 AM EST

Originally Posted By HeldHostage:
They're now releasing information that a 2nd person - unknown if an officer, citizen or suspect - may have been shot in this search.


The 2nd officer that was killed was by a man with an assault weapon shooting up a neighborhood. Here's a link so you can read it instead of me typing it.

home1.gte.net/joking1/laird.htm

Edited to add: They've now released the suspect has been shot. Nabbed!



Now I recall the incident, thanks.
Link Posted: 9/24/2004 8:59:08 AM EST
[Last Edit: 9/24/2004 9:03:19 AM EST by Maddogkiller]

Originally Posted By HeldHostage:

Originally Posted By SNorman:

Originally Posted By GUNGUY1911:

Originally Posted By Maddogkiller:
How can this be? It is illegal for non LEOs to carry guns on a school campus. That can only mean one thing. The killer is a cop.

have in town!hr


Hey dummy, he's making light of the stupid law that says you can't carry a gun on school property.



Remember in such a serious situation where it is close to home for many people on this board, making light of any laws without obviously blatant sarcasm will get you deemed as a troll or bitch slapped by myself if I ever run into you. Nothing right now is very funny, this is the second officer we've lost in the last month! So, Pardon us for not finding his comment very amusing.



My comments were not intended to be funny. I was indeed pointing a sarcastic finger at the stupidity of anti gun laws by applying liberal logic( an oxymoron if there ever was one). That fine, brave officer was murdered as a DIRECT result of anit gun laws. There were no armed citizens around to come to his aid. It pisses me off to no friggin end to read/hear/learn of brave men being murdered by punk ass criminals that can act with impunity DIRECTLY because of anti gun laws that guarantee that they have guns and most citizens do not. Anti gun laws that are ENFORCED by police officers.


ETA: I just read the updates that posted while I was typing. Excellent work on getting that POS. It doesn't bring the brave officer back, but maybe it saved others.
Link Posted: 9/24/2004 9:03:19 AM EST
[Last Edit: 9/24/2004 9:05:09 AM EST by HeldHostage]

Originally Posted By Maddogkiller:

My comments were not intended to be funny. I was indeed pointing a sarcastic finger at the stupidity of anti gun laws by applying liberal logic( an oxymoron if there ever was one). That fine, brave officer was murdered as a DIRECT result of anit gun laws. There were no armed citizens around to come to his aid. It pisses me off to no friggin end to read/hear/learn of brave men being murdered by punk ass criminals that can act with impunity DIRECTLY because of anti gun laws that guarantee that they have guns and most citizens do not. Anti gun laws that are ENFORCED by police officers.



These anti-gun laws are enforced by them to keep the people like the one that just shot him from obtaining guns to do this very thing with. I can't say I blame them. Until I hear this guy had a legal CCW permit, he's the scum that the laws pertain to. Unfortunately, not everyone wants to obey the law...which is why law enforcement is required to ENFORCE those laws!

Edited to add: No guns on campus, sorry. You can't honestly tell me even if there were 5 people with guns on their hips right there 'n then they would've acted, not to mention that could have direclty resulted in more deaths due to friendly fire with one idiot hitting another in crossfire.
Link Posted: 9/24/2004 9:07:30 AM EST

Originally Posted By HeldHostage:

Originally Posted By Maddogkiller:

My comments were not intended to be funny. I was indeed pointing a sarcastic finger at the stupidity of anti gun laws by applying liberal logic( an oxymoron if there ever was one). That fine, brave officer was murdered as a DIRECT result of anit gun laws. There were no armed citizens around to come to his aid. It pisses me off to no friggin end to read/hear/learn of brave men being murdered by punk ass criminals that can act with impunity DIRECTLY because of anti gun laws that guarantee that they have guns and most citizens do not. Anti gun laws that are ENFORCED by police officers.



These anti-gun laws are enforced by them to keep the people like the one that just shot him from obtaining guns to do this very thing with. I can't say I blame them. Until I hear this guy had a legal CCW permit, he's the scum that the laws pertain to. Unfortunately, not everyone wants to obey the law...which is why law enforcement is required to ENFORCE those laws!

Edited to add: No guns on campus, sorry. You can't honestly tell me even if there were 5 people with guns on their hips right there 'n then they would've acted, not to mention that could have direclty resulted in more deaths due to friendly fire with one idiot hitting another in crossfire.



I think he's saying that a more well-armed and educated population would deter these things or be met with a quicker ending.

And, civillians who are armed doesn't an idiot make, BTW.
Link Posted: 9/24/2004 9:08:47 AM EST
The deceased officer had three children. 8, 4 and 1. He'd only been on since January of 2003.

Jesus please take him into heaven.

Amen.
Link Posted: 9/24/2004 9:10:04 AM EST

Originally Posted By TeuffelHunden1775:


I think he's saying that a more well-armed and educated population would deter these things or be met with a quicker ending.

And, civillians who are armed doesn't an idiot make, BTW.



Arming them and educating them are two whooole different issues. You can arm anyone, but doesn't mean you can teach 'em anything.

No, but armed civilians doesn't a smarter or braver person make either.

Also, law enforcement generally wishes the public to remain out of these situations as they are properly trained to deal with armed criminals, while civilians are not.
Link Posted: 9/24/2004 9:10:25 AM EST

Originally Posted By HeldHostage:

Originally Posted By Maddogkiller:

My comments were not intended to be funny. I was indeed pointing a sarcastic finger at the stupidity of anti gun laws by applying liberal logic( an oxymoron if there ever was one). That fine, brave officer was murdered as a DIRECT result of anit gun laws. There were no armed citizens around to come to his aid. It pisses me off to no friggin end to read/hear/learn of brave men being murdered by punk ass criminals that can act with impunity DIRECTLY because of anti gun laws that guarantee that they have guns and most citizens do not. Anti gun laws that are ENFORCED by police officers.



These anti-gun laws are enforced by them to keep the people like the one that just shot him from obtaining guns to do this very thing with. I can't say I blame them. Until I hear this guy had a legal CCW permit, he's the scum that the laws pertain to. Unfortunately, not everyone wants to obey the law...which is why law enforcement is required to ENFORCE those laws!

Edited to add: No guns on campus, sorry. You can't honestly tell me even if there were 5 people with guns on their hips right there 'n then they would've acted, not to mention that could have direclty resulted in more deaths due to friendly fire with one idiot hitting another in crossfire.



HH, your blue panties are showin' on this one. Might want to rethink your position - you're right in line with the anti-ccw folks.
Link Posted: 9/24/2004 9:11:08 AM EST

Originally Posted By HeldHostage:

Originally Posted By TeuffelHunden1775:


I think he's saying that a more well-armed and educated population would deter these things or be met with a quicker ending.

And, civillians who are armed doesn't an idiot make, BTW.



Arming them and educating them are two whooole different issues. You can arm anyone, but doesn't mean you can teach 'em anything.

No, but armed civilians doesn't a smarter or braver person make either.

Also, law enforcement generally wishes the public to remain out of these situations as they are properly trained to deal with armed criminals, while civilians are not.



you're diggin deeper..you should probably quit before you strike water.
Link Posted: 9/24/2004 9:13:18 AM EST

Originally Posted By rn45:
The deceased officer had three children. 8, 4 and 1. He'd only been on since January of 2003.

Jesus please take him into heaven.

Amen.



Condolences to all and prayers sent!

Semper Fi!
Link Posted: 9/24/2004 9:16:54 AM EST
Alas, I'm not here to argue.

Prayers and condolences sent to the family of the fallen officer and his friends!
Link Posted: 9/24/2004 9:16:57 AM EST
[Last Edit: 9/24/2004 9:17:49 AM EST by GUNGUY1911]

Originally Posted By SNorman:

Originally Posted By GUNGUY1911:

Originally Posted By Maddogkiller:
How can this be? It is illegal for non LEOs to carry guns on a school campus. That can only mean one thing. The killer is a cop.

I guess we have a new in town!



Hey dummy, he's making light of the stupid law that says you can't carry a gun on school property.

No he, in my opinion, is bringing sarcasm into a situation that CLEARLY none is called for!
Link Posted: 9/24/2004 9:17:07 AM EST

Originally Posted By HeldHostage:
They're now releasing information that a 2nd person - unknown if an officer, citizen or suspect - may have been shot in this search.


The 2nd officer that was killed was by a man with an assault weapon shooting up a neighborhood. Here's a link so you can read it instead of me typing it.

home1.gte.net/joking1/laird.htm

Edited to add: They've now released the suspect has been shot. Nabbed!



Excuse me, but an SKS is not a so-called "assault weapon", even by the definition of that fucked up law. I love how the article compared the SKS to an AK, when there is no comparison except caliber.

I am not making light of the officer being shot, and my condolences go out to the families of both officers, but we don't need members here labeling everything an "assault weapon" in the same manner that the media does.
Link Posted: 9/24/2004 9:17:54 AM EST

Originally Posted By rn45:
Trying to confirm. Suspect shot near original location. Just a few blocks east. Information pending. This may be totally unrelated.

This may be the suspect.

It's him. He has been shot. Still alive as far as I know. They're taking him to the same hospital that they took the officer to.



Good. Too bad he is still alive.
Link Posted: 9/24/2004 9:19:49 AM EST

Originally Posted By QuietShootr:

Originally Posted By HeldHostage:

Originally Posted By TeuffelHunden1775:


I think he's saying that a more well-armed and educated population would deter these things or be met with a quicker ending.

And, civillians who are armed doesn't an idiot make, BTW.



Arming them and educating them are two whooole different issues. You can arm anyone, but doesn't mean you can teach 'em anything.

No, but armed civilians doesn't a smarter or braver person make either.

Also, law enforcement generally wishes the public to remain out of these situations as they are properly trained to deal with armed criminals, while civilians are not.



you're diggin deeper..you should probably quit before you strike water.



Well, this probably isn't the best place for this discussion, however, it is my thread. You are correct, sir, arming and educating is two different things. And, I know all about LEO's not wanting others involved, BTDT.

Instead of advocating the masses to follow like sheep, LE org's should be advocating the "re"arming of its population and working side-by-side with them, and other organizations, in education and firearms training. This Nation would see a huge decrease in crime and less need for the numbers of LEO's.
Link Posted: 9/24/2004 9:22:10 AM EST

Originally Posted By HeldHostage:

Originally Posted By Maddogkiller:

My comments were not intended to be funny. I was indeed pointing a sarcastic finger at the stupidity of anti gun laws by applying liberal logic( an oxymoron if there ever was one). That fine, brave officer was murdered as a DIRECT result of anit gun laws. There were no armed citizens around to come to his aid. It pisses me off to no friggin end to read/hear/learn of brave men being murdered by punk ass criminals that can act with impunity DIRECTLY because of anti gun laws that guarantee that they have guns and most citizens do not. Anti gun laws that are ENFORCED by police officers.



These anti-gun laws are enforced by them to keep the people like the one that just shot him from obtaining guns to do this very thing with. I can't say I blame them. Until I hear this guy had a legal CCW permit, he's the scum that the laws pertain to. Unfortunately, not everyone wants to obey the law...which is why law enforcement is required to ENFORCE those laws!

Edited to add: No guns on campus, sorry. You can't honestly tell me even if there were 5 people with guns on their hips right there 'n then they would've acted, not to mention that could have direclty resulted in more deaths due to friendly fire with one idiot hitting another in crossfire.




Come on HH you can't honestly believe that a LAW will stop a CRIMINAL from doing something. Please tell me you don't think that, god if thats something the libs/dems would argue in fighting for stricter gun laws and bans.

Laws don't do shit but provide for a punishmnet for breaking them, they won't deter criminals from commiting these acts, not if they really want to. This guy obviously had no porblem putting one in this officers head, no law period would have stopped that from happening. In fact I'd put $20 on it that this guy has something on his record already that would disqualify him from legally purchesing or possesing a gun.

And another thing the other officer that was shot and killed back in august, that was NOT an ASSAULT WEAPON. Also he was killed IIRC by somone who was mentaly unbalanced and should not have had his guns in the first place, and in fact 6 months before the shooting happened the PD gave the guy his guns back, and that the reason he got them back was because of poor(actually no) sharing of mental health info for background checks, thats a fault in the STATE LAWS. That officer died as a direct result of a BAD LAW that prevented anyone that needed to know(the PD and the people who do the NICS checks/background checks for firearms purcheses) from knowing that the guy had mental problems and had been placed in a psych ward and was ineleigable to posses or own weapons. Again it was a BAD LAW that led to that guy getting his guns back and eventualy the situation that resulted in the officers death.

Link Posted: 9/24/2004 9:22:31 AM EST

Originally Posted By HeldHostage:

Originally Posted By Maddogkiller:

My comments were not intended to be funny. I was indeed pointing a sarcastic finger at the stupidity of anti gun laws by applying liberal logic( an oxymoron if there ever was one). That fine, brave officer was murdered as a DIRECT result of anit gun laws. There were no armed citizens around to come to his aid. It pisses me off to no friggin end to read/hear/learn of brave men being murdered by punk ass criminals that can act with impunity DIRECTLY because of anti gun laws that guarantee that they have guns and most citizens do not. Anti gun laws that are ENFORCED by police officers.



These anti-gun laws are enforced by them to keep the people like the one that just shot him from obtaining guns to do this very thing with. I can't say I blame them. Until I hear this guy had a legal CCW permit, he's the scum that the laws pertain to. Unfortunately, not everyone wants to obey the law...which is why law enforcement is required to ENFORCE those laws!

Edited to add: No guns on campus, sorry. You can't honestly tell me even if there were 5 people with guns on their hips right there 'n then they would've acted, not to mention that could have direclty resulted in more deaths due to friendly fire with one idiot hitting another in crossfire.



I must disagree. Laws don't keep punks like this from getting any guns. Laws only keep the law abiding from getting or carrying guns. Your statement lacks any logic whatsoever.

You sound like an elitist, calling legally armed citizens "idiots". Yes, I can honestly tell you that having armed citizens around might have been enough of a deterrent to keep this idiot away in the first place. Do you think that the highest crimes occur in cities with the toughest gun laws is a coincidence?
Link Posted: 9/24/2004 9:23:42 AM EST

Originally Posted By HeldHostage:

Originally Posted By TeuffelHunden1775:


I think he's saying that a more well-armed and educated population would deter these things or be met with a quicker ending.

And, civillians who are armed doesn't an idiot make, BTW.



Arming them and educating them are two whooole different issues. You can arm anyone, but doesn't mean you can teach 'em anything.

No, but armed civilians doesn't a smarter or braver person make either.

Also, law enforcement generally wishes the public to remain out of these situations as they are properly trained to deal with armed criminals, while civilians are not.

Damn, you are an elitist. BTW, YOU are a civilian.
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