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User Panel
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Posted: 5/1/2009 2:16:22 PM EDT
[#1]
Just the 1 AFAIK.
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Posted: 5/1/2009 2:21:04 PM EDT
[#2]
Some of the Texas LEOs have said that they take all you have access to. JIA said that if they were in a locked safe, probably wouldn't take those, but if they were available to you in your room they would take all of those to test to make sure they had the weapon that killed the bad guy.
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Posted: 5/1/2009 2:24:15 PM EDT
[#3]
Dunno.
I know a guy who was involved in shooting a burglar, the deputies didnt take anything. Of course that was ages ago... |
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Posted: 5/1/2009 2:26:00 PM EDT
[#4]
I think the fact they take even that one is dumb.
They should apologize for any inconvenience, get rid of the bad guy, and give you a 5.00 gift certificate to replace the ammo you had to use. |
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Posted: 5/1/2009 2:29:08 PM EDT
[#5]
When I shot the tires out of a paroled murderers car who was prowling my yard at 11PM, I gave the Sheriff the pistol I used. They ended up serving a search warrant on my house to take otherguns. The deputies that night were totally HUA. ALWAYS stash/secure some for a Plan B type situation. Link to article is:http://www.lodinews.com/articles/2009/04/11/news/2_beckman_090411.txt
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Posted: 5/1/2009 2:29:36 PM EDT
[#6]
If its a lawful shoot, they don't take anything but your personal info.
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Posted: 5/1/2009 2:29:41 PM EDT
[#7]
Quoted:
I think the fact they take even that one is dumb. They should apologize for any inconvenience, get rid of the bad guy, and give you a 5.00 gift certificate to replace the ammo you had to use. And send you an employment offer. |
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Posted: 5/1/2009 2:41:56 PM EDT
[#8]
Quoted:
When I shot the tires out of a paroled murderers car who was prowling my yard at 11PM, I gave the Sheriff the pistol I used. They ended up serving a search warrant on my house to take otherguns. The deputies that night were totally HUA. ALWAYS stash/secure some for a Plan B type situation. Link to article is:http://www.lodinews.com/articles/2009/04/11/news/2_beckman_090411.txt I just read the article, and I am FOOKING PISSED OFF for what you had to go through. I hate to say it, but nothing surprises me anymore what cops will do. |
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Posted: 5/1/2009 2:53:00 PM EDT
[#9]
Quoted:
When I shot the tires out of a paroled murderers car who was prowling my yard at 11PM, I gave the Sheriff the pistol I used. They ended up serving a search warrant on my house to take otherguns. The deputies that night were totally HUA. ALWAYS stash/secure some for a Plan B type situation. Link to article is:http://www.lodinews.com/articles/2009/04/11/news/2_beckman_090411.txt Not sure what to make of your situation - that linked article leaves me me with more questions than it answered and anyone with your LE experience shouldn't be calling a guy convicted of voluntary manslaughter a murderer. Brian |
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Posted: 5/1/2009 2:55:36 PM EDT
[#10]
Quoted:
I think the fact they take even that one is dumb. They should apologize for any inconvenience, get rid of the bad guy, and give you a 5.00 gift certificate to replace the ammo you had to use. I agree. but under the definition of a crime, more than one crime has been committed. 1 charge of robbery/Home invasion. 1 charge of assault with a deadly weapon< which would be easily overturned by Castle Doctrine/self defense. they will take your weapon, as a precautionary measure in securing the scene. If the weapon used during the act is present, it's a piece of real evidence linked to the crime. No jury in the world (save for a libtard CA, NY /Mass jury would rightly convict you) but let's get the parameters of SD correct. there is a high probability of retaliation in SD cases, especially if you did not kill the intruder. If there is even a miniscule portion of the act, that negated the threat displayed by the offender, S/D is out of the question and it's Aggravated Assault. I.E shooting someone in the back/fleeing. unless they have a search warrant, no dice on anything else. |
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Posted: 5/1/2009 2:57:30 PM EDT
[#11]
Bury the body and don't call the cops.
Just kidding of course. 
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Posted: 5/1/2009 2:59:29 PM EDT
[#12]
Quoted:
Quoted:
When I shot the tires out of a paroled murderers car who was prowling my yard at 11PM, I gave the Sheriff the pistol I used. They ended up serving a search warrant on my house to take otherguns. The deputies that night were totally HUA. ALWAYS stash/secure some for a Plan B type situation. Link to article is:http://www.lodinews.com/articles/2009/04/11/news/2_beckman_090411.txt Not sure what to make of your situation - that linked article leaves me me with more questions than it answered and anyone with your LE experience shouldn't be calling a guy convicted of voluntary manslaughter a murderer. Brian WTF would you do, Brian, if this guy drove up your driveway with his lights off and tried to run you over? "Vega was convicted of voluntary manslaughter in a 1998 homicide and sentenced to six years, according to court records. He then was convicted of assault while in prison and sentenced to another four years, according to California Department of Corrections and Rehabilitation records." "Five months after the incident at Beckman’s house, Stockton police arrested Vega in connection with a gang-related shooting. Now 28, Vega is currently back in prison after pleading no contest to being a felon in possession of a firearm." |
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Posted: 5/1/2009 2:59:58 PM EDT
[#13]
Quoted:
I think the fact they take even that one is dumb. They should apologize for any inconvenience, get rid of the bad guy, and give you a 5.00 gift certificate to replace the ammo you had to use. Yes, heaven forbid the police don't take people at their word and do a little investigating. |
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Posted: 5/1/2009 3:02:37 PM EDT
[#14]
Quoted: Quoted: I think the fact they take even that one is dumb. They should apologize for any inconvenience, get rid of the bad guy, and give you a 5.00 gift certificate to replace the ammo you had to use. Yes, heaven forbid the police don't take people at their word and do a little investigating. After taking every gun in the house, of course. |
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Posted: 5/1/2009 3:03:03 PM EDT
[#15]
If you live alone and they take you to jail they might take them all for "safe keeping."
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Posted: 5/1/2009 3:03:06 PM EDT
[#16]
To Brian- My experience led me to research the asshole myself, because the Sheriff's Dept. would not tell me anything about the bad guy. He was arrested for homicide with a firearm, and pled guilty to a plea bargain of voluntary manslaughter. He is also a documenmted gang member. Any other questions?
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Posted: 5/1/2009 3:03:34 PM EDT
[#17]
All what guns?
I only own this one! No, wait, I used this one, right? |
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Posted: 5/1/2009 3:05:36 PM EDT
[#18]
Quoted:
I think the fact they take even that one is dumb. They should apologize for any inconvenience, get rid of the bad guy, and give you a 5.00 gift certificate to replace the ammo you had to use. I want someone to come clean that mess up too. |
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Posted: 5/1/2009 3:08:39 PM EDT
[#19]
Quoted:
If you live alone and they take you to jail they might take them all for "safe keeping." They have to do a little investigating™ |
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Posted: 5/1/2009 3:09:24 PM EDT
[#20]
Quoted:
If its a lawful shoot, they don't take anything but your personal info. Not true... They'll at the very least take the gun used in the shoot. The investigation determines lawful or not. No way would they leave the gun there, they will keep it until the investigation is complete. Now I assume there will be some local cops that under various circumstances won't but those are corner cases and don't represent general policy so not interested in someone saying you are wrong my uncle in bum fuck where ever knows the PD Chief real well they didn't take his gun. I don't know why cops would ever know you had more guns in the house. If they ask obviously you want to be honest but I wouldn't volunteer info that was irrelevant. |
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Posted: 5/1/2009 3:10:05 PM EDT
[#21]
Well, if I have to shoot a bad guy, I'll have to use my POS glock because they ain't taking a $3k Nighthawk Custom
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Posted: 5/1/2009 3:14:15 PM EDT
[#22]
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
I think the fact they take even that one is dumb. They should apologize for any inconvenience, get rid of the bad guy, and give you a 5.00 gift certificate to replace the ammo you had to use. Yes, heaven forbid the police don't take people at their word and do a little investigating. After taking every gun in the house, of course. Yes, that's exactly what I meant. 
If I shoot someone, my dept takes the gun I used in the shooting - to expect otherwise is...I don't even have a word for it. When you have a shooting, the police will likely take the gun you used, as they should, in order to verify your story. They should not take all of your guns, and I doubt they would except under extreme circumstances. |
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Posted: 5/1/2009 3:15:06 PM EDT
[#23]
you didn't commit a crime.
they shouldn't take anything |
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Posted: 5/1/2009 3:15:59 PM EDT
[#24]
Quoted:
Well, if I have to shoot a bad guy, I'll have to use my POS glock because they ain't taking a $3k Nighthawk Custom Getting off topic, what is the point of owning such a fine firearm if you never intend to use it? Why not just standardize on the Glock (or another replaceable firearm) and spend that extra money on training and ammo? |
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Posted: 5/1/2009 3:16:01 PM EDT
[#25]
A good reason why one is none and two is one. A hidden gun is a good thing.
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Posted: 5/1/2009 3:16:56 PM EDT
[#26]
Quoted: Well, if I have to shoot a bad guy, I'll have to use my POS glock because they ain't taking a $3k Nighthawk Custom Good idea because in some jurisdictions you'll never see the gun again. |
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Posted: 5/1/2009 3:17:08 PM EDT
[#27]
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
When I shot the tires out of a paroled murderers car who was prowling my yard at 11PM, I gave the Sheriff the pistol I used. They ended up serving a search warrant on my house to take otherguns. The deputies that night were totally HUA. ALWAYS stash/secure some for a Plan B type situation. Link to article is:http://www.lodinews.com/articles/2009/04/11/news/2_beckman_090411.txt Not sure what to make of your situation - that linked article leaves me me with more questions than it answered and anyone with your LE experience shouldn't be calling a guy convicted of voluntary manslaughter a murderer. Brian WTF would you do, Brian, if this guy drove up your driveway with his lights off and tried to run you over? "Vega was convicted of voluntary manslaughter in a 1998 homicide and sentenced to six years, according to court records. He then was convicted of assault while in prison and sentenced to another four years, according to California Department of Corrections and Rehabilitation records." "Five months after the incident at Beckman’s house, Stockton police arrested Vega in connection with a gang-related shooting. Now 28, Vega is currently back in prison after pleading no contest to being a felon in possession of a firearm." First of all, at the time of the shooting Beckman had no idea who was behind the wheel of the car - nice try but no dice on that one. Second, if the driver tried to run me over I would be shooting at the driver - not the tires. I'd really like to read the police reports - we're not getting the full story on this one (yet). Something is off with someone's story when a retired cop, DA investigator, current probation dept investigator is arrested for ADW and a paroled/released felon is sent home w/o any charges....... Brian |
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Posted: 5/1/2009 3:19:36 PM EDT
[#28]
Quoted:
To 94- My experience led me to research the asshole myself, because the Sheriff's Dept. would not tell me anything about the bad guy. He was arrested for homicide with a firearm, and pled guilty to a plea bargain of voluntary manslaughter. He is also a documenmted gang member. Any other questions? What was your working relationship with the SO like? I find it really odd that the SO would stonewall a probation investigator in the same county. Brian |
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Posted: 5/1/2009 3:20:41 PM EDT
[#29]
I guess it depends on what state your in. here in SC. the cops come to your house after the shooting and give you a 12 pack and 3 boxes of ammo and thank you for saving them the trouble!
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Posted: 5/1/2009 3:21:26 PM EDT
[#30]
Quoted:
you didn't commit a crime. they shouldn't take anything How does an officer determine if crime was committed or not? Brian |
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Posted: 5/1/2009 3:25:36 PM EDT
[#31]
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
When I shot the tires out of a paroled murderers car who was prowling my yard at 11PM, I gave the Sheriff the pistol I used. They ended up serving a search warrant on my house to take otherguns. The deputies that night were totally HUA. ALWAYS stash/secure some for a Plan B type situation. Link to article is:http://www.lodinews.com/articles/2009/04/11/news/2_beckman_090411.txt Not sure what to make of your situation - that linked article leaves me me with more questions than it answered and anyone with your LE experience shouldn't be calling a guy convicted of voluntary manslaughter a murderer. Brian WTF would you do, Brian, if this guy drove up your driveway with his lights off and tried to run you over? "Vega was convicted of voluntary manslaughter in a 1998 homicide and sentenced to six years, according to court records. He then was convicted of assault while in prison and sentenced to another four years, according to California Department of Corrections and Rehabilitation records." "Five months after the incident at Beckman’s house, Stockton police arrested Vega in connection with a gang-related shooting. Now 28, Vega is currently back in prison after pleading no contest to being a felon in possession of a firearm." That is what I am confused about the article was written in a really bad way. The article makes it seem like you moved out of the way in a normal fashion and THEN realized he MAY have been trying to run you over so then you shot at him. Not calling you out on this at all, I wasn't there you were. But if you thought your life was in danger why shoot his tires? That isn't going to stop a determined attacker who is about to run you over. “I’m shining my light as he’s coming around the corner,” Beckman said, demonstrating his actions. “And I swear he looked like he was under the influence of something.” The car drove toward him, and Beckman made the decision to move out of the way. He said he realized the driver may have tried to run him over, so he opened fire, aiming at the tires to stop it from leaving. I am not a lawyer but man you outta know that kind of a shooting is not going to fly well. you fired a weapon not in dire defense of your life but to keep him there? Please tell me this article is just poorly written. |
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Posted: 5/1/2009 3:25:58 PM EDT
[#32]
Quoted:
Quoted:
Well, if I have to shoot a bad guy, I'll have to use my POS glock because they ain't taking a $3k Nighthawk Custom Getting off topic, what is the point of owning such a fine firearm if you never intend to use it? Why not just standardize on the Glock (or another replaceable firearm) and spend that extra money on training and ammo? Who says $3,000 pistols aren't replaceable? I had to move a half dozen of them out of my dresser when I went clothes shopping last year.
But seriously. I don't know how other weapons could be seized. The officers would have to be able to articulate probable cause that they are evidence. |
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Posted: 5/1/2009 3:27:03 PM EDT
[#33]
Quoted:
Quoted:
you didn't commit a crime. they shouldn't take anything How does an officer determine if crime was committed or not? Brian How do you know a crime is not being committed in your neighbor's home right now? I really don't even understand this attitude. If you don't have a reason to suspect a crime was committed, then why do seize property? |
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Posted: 5/1/2009 3:28:12 PM EDT
[#34]
Quoted:
Quoted:
I think the fact they take even that one is dumb. They should apologize for any inconvenience, get rid of the bad guy, and give you a 5.00 gift certificate to replace the ammo you had to use. I want someone to come clean that mess up too. They should make their next of kin do it |
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Posted: 5/1/2009 3:29:17 PM EDT
[#35]
Friend of mine shot himself in the stomach with a .45 1911 2-3wks ago. He met the police/ambulance in the street & handed the pistol & his house phone to the officer, asked the officer to toss the phone into the house & pull the door to (he already locked the handle).
He later learned the police dug the projectile out of the wall, and went thru his house and collected all his guns and took them. While recovering in the hospital, his wife retrieved all the guns, including the 1911 - they wouldn't give her the projectile, though - called it biohazzerdous material. He's pretty pturbed & figures it was probably illegal. (Occured in a small town - Plant City FL) |
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Posted: 5/1/2009 3:30:21 PM EDT
[#36]
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
When I shot the tires out of a paroled murderers car who was prowling my yard at 11PM, I gave the Sheriff the pistol I used. They ended up serving a search warrant on my house to take otherguns. The deputies that night were totally HUA. ALWAYS stash/secure some for a Plan B type situation. Link to article is:http://www.lodinews.com/articles/2009/04/11/news/2_beckman_090411.txt Not sure what to make of your situation - that linked article leaves me me with more questions than it answered and anyone with your LE experience shouldn't be calling a guy convicted of voluntary manslaughter a murderer. Brian WTF would you do, Brian, if this guy drove up your driveway with his lights off and tried to run you over? "Vega was convicted of voluntary manslaughter in a 1998 homicide and sentenced to six years, according to court records. He then was convicted of assault while in prison and sentenced to another four years, according to California Department of Corrections and Rehabilitation records." "Five months after the incident at Beckman’s house, Stockton police arrested Vega in connection with a gang-related shooting. Now 28, Vega is currently back in prison after pleading no contest to being a felon in possession of a firearm." First of all, at the time of the shooting Beckman had no idea who was behind the wheel of the car - nice try but no dice on that one. Second, if the driver tried to run me over I would be shooting at the driver - not the tires. I'd really like to read the police reports - we're not getting the full story on this one (yet). Something is off with someone's story when a retired cop, DA investigator, current probation dept investigator is arrested for ADW and a paroled/released felon is sent home w/o any charges....... Brian Soak it all in...get that brain in gear: from the article: "As deputies wrote a search warrant, Beckman was driven half an hour away to the county jail in French Camp. There he was booked and strip searched — something he said was very humiliating." "He [Beckman] remained there until 36 hours had passed, when prosecutors decided not to file charges". |
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Posted: 5/1/2009 3:30:54 PM EDT
[#37]
all depends on your local authorties. no federal law on what they have to do.
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Posted: 5/1/2009 3:32:54 PM EDT
[#38]
Quoted:
How do you know a crime is not being committed in your neighbor's home right now? I don't I really don't even understand this attitude. If you don't have a reason to suspect a crime was committed, then why do seize property? If I don't suspect a crime was committed why would I seize property? Investigating to determine if a crime was in fact actually committed takes time and isn't completed in an hour like on TV. Brian |
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Posted: 5/1/2009 3:32:55 PM EDT
[#39]
Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: I think the fact they take even that one is dumb. They should apologize for any inconvenience, get rid of the bad guy, and give you a 5.00 gift certificate to replace the ammo you had to use. Yes, heaven forbid the police don't take people at their word and do a little investigating. After taking every gun in the house, of course. Yes, that's exactly what I meant. If I shoot someone, my dept takes the gun I used in the shooting - to expect otherwise is...I don't even have a word for it. When you have a shooting, the police will likely take the gun you used, as they should, in order to verify your story. They should not take all of your guns, and I doubt they would except under extreme circumstances. I'm curious as to what "extreme circumstances" would be? I was upset that LEOs confiscated the Ohio pizza shop owner's pistol after he shot a robber in his store effectively leaving him defenseless. There were eyewitnesses in the shop at the time who more than likely corroborated the owner's account of what happened and why he felt needed to defend himself but they still took his pistol. Not all people have more than one gun and some people don't have the means to turn around and buy another if they have to use it in a self defense scenario. The policy of confiscating guns used in shootings where the accounts point to it being a righteous shoot seems to be punitive and not in the best interest of the citizen. |
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Posted: 5/1/2009 3:34:19 PM EDT
[#40]
Quoted:
Well, if I have to shoot a bad guy, I'll have to use my POS glock because they ain't taking a $3k Nighthawk Custom My pet peeve is when I see someone say this. It makes no sense and now it has become gun legend. I see this all the time on forums. I use the best firearm for the job. If that were a 500K collectors piece and all my other firearms were unavailable I'll use that. In our home that is my Wilson and my G21 for my wife and a Benelli M4. If I kill the intruders they can take them all they want don't care. I mean I care but my priorities are using the best I can to defend us. Plus as I stand there gently crying and a pee stain on my bugs bunny Pjs I'll look less goofy if I have a nice custom 1911 in my hands |
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Posted: 5/1/2009 3:35:47 PM EDT
[#41]
Quoted:
Quoted:
How do you know a crime is not being committed in your neighbor's home right now? I don't I really don't even understand this attitude. If you don't have a reason to suspect a crime was committed, then why do seize property? If I don't suspect a crime was committed why would I seize property? Investigating to determine if a crime was in fact actually committed takes time and isn't completed in an hour like on TV. Brian Again, if you have no reason to suspect a crime was committed, why do you seize property? You said you don't know if your neighbor is committing a crime. Shouldn't you go investigate him? Or anyone you see? |
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Posted: 5/1/2009 3:36:12 PM EDT
[#42]
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
I think the fact they take even that one is dumb. They should apologize for any inconvenience, get rid of the bad guy, and give you a 5.00 gift certificate to replace the ammo you had to use. Yes, heaven forbid the police don't take people at their word and do a little investigating. After taking every gun in the house, of course. Yes, that's exactly what I meant.
If I shoot someone, my dept takes the gun I used in the shooting - to expect otherwise is...I don't even have a word for it. When you have a shooting, the police will likely take the gun you used, as they should, in order to verify your story. They should not take all of your guns, and I doubt they would except under extreme circumstances. Can you imagine if the cops said yeah go ahead keep your pistol as we investigate. And about 10 hours later they realize there is a huge inconsistency in your story and things just aren't adding up and they go back and you magically "lost" your firearm? |
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Posted: 5/1/2009 3:38:06 PM EDT
[#43]
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
I think the fact they take even that one is dumb. They should apologize for any inconvenience, get rid of the bad guy, and give you a 5.00 gift certificate to replace the ammo you had to use. Yes, heaven forbid the police don't take people at their word and do a little investigating. After taking every gun in the house, of course. Yes, that's exactly what I meant.
If I shoot someone, my dept takes the gun I used in the shooting - to expect otherwise is...I don't even have a word for it. When you have a shooting, the police will likely take the gun you used, as they should, in order to verify your story. They should not take all of your guns, and I doubt they would except under extreme circumstances. Can you imagine if the cops said yeah go ahead keep your pistol as we investigate. And about 10 hours later they realize there is a huge inconsistency in your story and things just aren't adding up and they go back and you magically "lost" your firearm? What if they find out 10 years from now there's holes in your story? It would probably be best to take your other possessions just in case. |
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Posted: 5/1/2009 3:39:55 PM EDT
[#44]
Quoted:
I think the fact they take even that one is dumb. They should apologize for any inconvenience, get rid of the bad guy, and give you a 5.00 gift certificate to replace the ammo you had to use. This |
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Posted: 5/1/2009 3:39:55 PM EDT
[#45]
Quoted:
you didn't commit a crime. they shouldn't take anything They have to investigate to come to that conclusion. I am sure more than a few people shoot someone in their home claim it was a robbery or invasion and it was a drug deal gone bad. A cop would have to be a complete fool and negligent in his duties to not investigate this properly. I don't want cops seizing anyhting wrongfully but you gotta understand there is some legit reasoning here. |
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Posted: 5/1/2009 3:40:02 PM EDT
[#46]
OK, I'm the shooter in this (20shooter, as in Glock 20––-which was used)––-let's clear some things up. The reason I went to the newspaper was because this was such a cluster-fuck. My previous 20+ years was in a whole different county four hours away. It might as well been 4,000 miles away. I worked with the S.O.'s background investigators, but I knew no patrol deputies. My old contacts had retired, like I had.
As for the driver at the time of the shooting, my background as a cop, training officer, firearms instructor, city dweller and country bumpkin, not to mention handling several thousand calls for service over the years, led me to believe this asshole was up yo no good. Cut to the chase, if you hold your ground one on one with a car, you will lose. I've seen it, and I have been involved in two other shootings involving suspects in vehicles (both resulting in felony arrests with no injured cops––-and one shot up suspect). He committed an ADW on me, I shot out his tires to facilitate his arrest. As a civilian, I'm no longer bound to follow a "policy", but applicable laws. I expected an intelligent and measured police response––––I did not get it. Brian, I would guess I was fighting PCP dealers when you were shiitin' your diapers. Get some life experience under your belt! |
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Posted: 5/1/2009 3:40:28 PM EDT
[#47]
Quoted:
you didn't commit a crime. they shouldn't take anything In most states, killing someone is a crime. Period. Self-defense is usually an "affirmative defense." In other words, you're guilty until proven innocent, and the gun used is evidence. |
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Posted: 5/1/2009 3:40:43 PM EDT
[#48]
Quoted:
Friend of mine shot himself in the stomach with a .45 1911 2-3wks ago. He met the police/ambulance in the street & handed the pistol & his house phone to the officer, asked the officer to toss the phone into the house & pull the door to (he already locked the handle). He later learned the police dug the projectile out of the wall, and went thru his house and collected all his guns and took them. While recovering in the hospital, his wife retrieved all the guns, including the 1911 - they wouldn't give her the projectile, though - called it biohazzerdous material. He's pretty pturbed & figures it was probably illegal. (Occured in a small town - Plant City FL) Sounds like the police took the guns to prevent another suicide attempt. |
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Posted: 5/1/2009 3:40:51 PM EDT
[#49]
Quoted:
Quoted:
Well, if I have to shoot a bad guy, I'll have to use my POS glock because they ain't taking a $3k Nighthawk Custom Good idea because in some jurisdictions you'll never see the gun again. no its a really bad idea. Anyone that would use a what they consider a POS protect their family is derelict in his or her duties |
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Posted: 5/1/2009 3:41:12 PM EDT
[#50]
Quoted:
Quoted:
you didn't commit a crime. they shouldn't take anything How does an officer determine if crime was committed or not? Brian He doesn't, courts do. I would be interested in seeing how the officers articulated their belief that the weapons were evidence of a crime, particularly if the weapons seized were not of the type used in the shooting. |
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