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Posted: 11/14/2008 11:17:27 PM EDT
This has dominated the local news but I searched a bit and did not see a thread here

6 people supposedly involved in a murder local police think the DA's/sheriff's theory is bullshit but go along anyway

threatened and cohered in interrogation to admit shit that never happened to save them selves from death

video turned on and off through interrogation

police had the right guy back in 85 but lab fucks up the blood tests real killer died in 1992
same lab in OK that has fucked up numerous cases back in the same time period

new tests confirm the right guy this year

supposedly guy has NO recourse against the state nor do the others that all served similar terms


http://www.journalstar.com/articles/2008/11/09/news/local/doc49161feed92eb566142942.txt
Link Posted: 11/14/2008 11:23:23 PM EDT
He has recourse against the State.

Cruel and unusual punishment is prohibited in the Bill of Rights.

Innocent people being punished is cruel and unusual, thus gets Federal District Court authority to proceed.
Link Posted: 11/15/2008 2:26:02 AM EDT
Originally Posted By 2fewtoys:
He has recourse against the State.

Cruel and unusual punishment is prohibited in the Bill of Rights.

Innocent people being punished is cruel and unusual, thus gets Federal District Court authority to proceed.


He does have a remedy under federal law, but it is not based on the 8th Amendment.
Link Posted: 11/15/2008 2:29:47 AM EDT
I think you meant "coerced", and IIRC the state
will give him $10,000 a year for the time he served
Link Posted: 11/15/2008 4:11:39 AM EDT
Originally Posted By 22bad:
I think you meant "coerced", and IIRC the state
will give him $10,000 a year for the time he served


Reminds me of that scene in the remake of Cape Fear where Nick Nolte tries to buy off Robert DeNiro's character.

Link Posted: 11/15/2008 6:31:43 AM EDT
Link Posted: 11/15/2008 6:44:24 AM EDT
Link Posted: 11/15/2008 7:09:54 AM EDT
Sounds like the Innocence Project has a place to check out if they're ever able to finish in Dallas.
Link Posted: 11/15/2008 7:15:39 AM EDT
Originally Posted By Bama-Shooter:
I don't understand how you get five people to concot the same story.


where there's a will there's a way.

Link Posted: 11/15/2008 7:28:24 AM EDT
Do not admit to anything you didn't do , ever.
Link Posted: 11/15/2008 7:55:03 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 11/15/2008 7:56:25 AM EDT by jbombelli]
Originally Posted By Bama-Shooter:
What’s the first thing an innocent man wants for dinner when he gets out of prison?

That was an easy decision for Joseph White: fried green tomatoes and chicken livers.

Yep, he's from Alabama. Good eating.




I don't understand how you get five people to concot the same story.





I imagine it's not that hard when the interrogators don't have to tell the truth, the suspects are fed pertinent details, and only have to fill in the blanks, especially when you take into account that people's recollections always differ regarding the same event, and so the details don't have to all match up exactly.

First, you interrogate them all separately. Then, start with maybe something like: "We know you 5 people did this. We think XXXX pulled the trigger. Your friend says YOU just watched the door. We don't think you pulled the trigger. Now confess what you did, and we won't seek the death penalty."

Then they go to the next guy and say "YYYY already admitted to watching the door. He also says YOU were the one that did <fill in the blank>" and so on down the line until everybody's story matches up for the most part. Then they talk to the last guy... "all of your friends have already sold you out. They all said YOU pulled the trigger. Now if you don't want a needle in your arm, you'd better confess what you did."

And everybody has now confessed to taking part in a crime none of them had anything to do with in order to avoid being executed.
Link Posted: 11/15/2008 8:04:24 AM EDT
Originally Posted By Bama-Shooter:
What’s the first thing an innocent man wants for dinner when he gets out of prison?

That was an easy decision for Joseph White: fried green tomatoes and chicken livers.

Yep, he's from Alabama. Good eating.




I don't understand how you get five people to concot the same story.


pretty damn easy - you just threaten to take their liberty...happens all the time whether we can admit it or not.

Link Posted: 11/15/2008 8:12:47 AM EDT
Link Posted: 11/15/2008 8:21:30 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 11/15/2008 8:22:22 AM EDT by jbombelli]
Originally Posted By Bama-Shooter:
Originally Posted By jbombelli:
Originally Posted By Bama-Shooter:
What’s the first thing an innocent man wants for dinner when he gets out of prison?

That was an easy decision for Joseph White: fried green tomatoes and chicken livers.

Yep, he's from Alabama. Good eating.




I don't understand how you get five people to concot the same story.





I imagine it's not that hard when the interrogators don't have to tell the truth, the suspects are fed pertinent details, and only have to fill in the blanks, especially when you take into account that people's recollections always differ regarding the same event, and so the details don't have to all match up exactly.

First, you interrogate them all separately. Then, start with maybe something like: "We know you 5 people did this. We think XXXX pulled the trigger. Your friend says YOU just watched the door. We don't think you pulled the trigger. Now confess what you did, and we won't seek the death penalty."

Then they go to the next guy and say "YYYY already admitted to watching the door. He also says YOU were the one that did <fill in the blank>" and so on down the line until everybody's story matches up for the most part. Then they talk to the last guy... "all of your friends have already sold you out. They all said YOU pulled the trigger. Now if you don't want a needle in your arm, you'd better confess what you did."

And everybody has now confessed to taking part in a crime none of them had anything to do with in order to avoid being executed.


Getting five people to false confess to a capital crime is almost impossible. Let alone stand up to a jury trial.





But apparently still possible. A large number of people out there will ultimately do what they have to do to save their own lives, and sometimes LEOs take advantage of that.
Link Posted: 11/15/2008 8:24:18 AM EDT
Originally Posted By 22bad:
I think you meant "coerced", and IIRC the state
will give him $10,000 a year for the time he served


minus taxes im sure.

lol.
Link Posted: 11/15/2008 8:31:04 AM EDT
It's a trick called confabulation. You take a person who saw A and C but missed B. As pressure is applied to them they will concoct how B should have been and in most people will make up the almost same logical story. Then the interrogator asks exactly what they want and you suddenly have 5 usable stories.
Link Posted: 11/15/2008 8:35:38 AM EDT
And the truth shall set you free.
Link Posted: 11/15/2008 8:58:11 AM EDT
Originally Posted By threefeathers:
It's a trick called confabulation. You take a person who saw A and C but missed B. As pressure is applied to them they will concoct how B should have been and in most people will make up the almost same logical story. Then the interrogator asks exactly what they want and you suddenly have 5 usable stories.
And it's not even a conscious all of the time. See "recovered memories".
Link Posted: 11/15/2008 4:05:52 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Journy:
Originally Posted By 22bad:
IIRC the state will give him $10,000 a year for the time he served


minus taxes im sure.

lol.


I dunno, generally awards of that type are tax-free
Link Posted: 11/15/2008 4:13:07 PM EDT
I'd expect a lot more than 10K a year.
Link Posted: 11/15/2008 4:17:25 PM EDT
Originally Posted By ridewaves:
I'd expect a lot more than 10K a year.


I've heard of it happening before, the ones I heard about all got that amount
Link Posted: 11/15/2008 4:27:40 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Bama-Shooter:
What’s the first thing an innocent man wants for dinner when he gets out of prison?


I would want something my Mom cooked for me.

Unfortunately, she's 73 now and in 19 years she won't be cooking much of anything.

Someone would pay for that.
Link Posted: 11/15/2008 4:29:44 PM EDT
I'd want 100 mil a for every year I was locked up, or Id be spending my 10k they gave me on Guns/armor/ammo.... Maybe get a loan and buy some plates of steel and a bulldozer
Link Posted: 11/15/2008 4:30:19 PM EDT
It is because of shit like this that reminds me why I am against the STATE executing people.
Link Posted: 11/15/2008 4:33:24 PM EDT
Originally Posted By JellyBelly:
Originally Posted By Bama-Shooter:
What’s the first thing an innocent man wants for dinner when he gets out of prison?


I would want something my Mom cooked for me.

Unfortunately, she's 73 now and in 19 years she won't be cooking much of anything.

Someone would pay for that.




In my case it would be someones blood, I think Id take the 19 years thing somewhat personal.
Link Posted: 11/15/2008 4:40:02 PM EDT
Originally Posted By AmericanPatriot1776:
It is because of shit like this that reminds me why I am against the STATE executing people.



This!!
Link Posted: 11/15/2008 4:52:54 PM EDT
Originally Posted By david_g17:
Originally Posted By Bama-Shooter:
I don't understand how you get five people to concot the same story.


where there's a will there's a way.




One possible way:

Tip of night-stick rammed into your kidneys over and over will just about get you to say anything and won't show up on camera.
Link Posted: 11/15/2008 4:53:56 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Thealien:
Originally Posted By AmericanPatriot1776:
It is because of shit like this that reminds me why I am against the STATE executing people.



This!!



As long as you are willing to make an exception for those caught in the act.....

Link Posted: 11/15/2008 5:25:13 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 11/15/2008 5:27:08 PM EDT by Det0nate]
Originally Posted By jbombelli:
But apparently still possible. A large number of people out there will ultimately do what they have to do to save their own lives, and sometimes LEOs take advantage of that.


How dare you.
Isolated incident

Originally Posted By BangStick1:
Originally Posted By Thealien:
Originally Posted By AmericanPatriot1776:
It is because of shit like this that reminds me why I am against the STATE executing people.

This!!

As long as you are willing to make an exception for those caught in the act.....

Because certainly nobody would lie under oath or encourage others to do so. Especially not the protected class.




/// sarcasm.
Link Posted: 11/15/2008 5:32:56 PM EDT
yeah if that happened to me id definetely be violating the coc.
Link Posted: 11/15/2008 5:41:44 PM EDT
$10k per year is not sufficient compensation for time wrongly served. Should be $50k per year at the least.
Link Posted: 11/15/2008 10:00:07 PM EDT
Originally Posted By 22bad:
I think you meant "coerced", and IIRC the state
will give him $10,000 a year for the time he served



yep coerced not sure wtf happened with spell check there


Link Posted: 11/17/2008 9:11:31 PM EDT
Link Posted: 11/19/2008 5:22:30 PM EDT
Originally Posted By glockfan45:
$10k per year is not sufficient compensation for time wrongly served. Should be $50k per year at the least.


And it should come from the pockets of the leo's and other liars lawyers who set him up.
Link Posted: 11/19/2008 5:28:34 PM EDT
Originally Posted By BangStick1:
Originally Posted By Thealien:
Originally Posted By AmericanPatriot1776:
It is because of shit like this that reminds me why I am against the STATE executing people.



This!!



As long as you are willing to make an exception for those caught in the act.....



Time and scene of the crime, preferably at the hands of the intended victim.
Link Posted: 11/19/2008 5:36:19 PM EDT
Originally Posted By www-glock19-com:
state still refusing to pay them a dime


http://journalstar.com/articles/2008/11/16/news/nebraska/doc4920aaf960705860564643.txt


Then the gloves should come off –– wrongful prosecution, wrongful imprisonment, throw the book. Actual damages should be the wage they were earning at the time of the arrest, for every hour they were wrongfully imprisoned. Punitive damages of a million per year on top of that.

What really should happen is that everyone involved should serve the same amount of time in prison these innocent people served. Everyone. Cops, prosecutor, crime lab tech, judge, everyone. No excuse for this.
Link Posted: 11/19/2008 5:47:30 PM EDT

Getting five people to false confess to a capital crime is almost impossible. Let alone stand up to a jury trial.


the cornbread mafia of se kaintuck disagrees with you in practice, AND in theory my friend.

With a legitimate threat against that which you most care for i'll get you to confess to ass raping rainbow bright and my little pony while forging false bank statements regarding the sale of clean air to dead people.....

and if you are smart, you'll do it, or see that which you love destroyed while a low level fall guy is burned for the crime.
Link Posted: 11/19/2008 5:55:00 PM EDT
There is one esay way to avoid this.

"LAWYER".

That one word will stop the cleverest, trickiest interrogation known to man, or toss the results out of court later.

If you are ever in an adversarial encounter with the police, that word is the only one that should cross your lips.
Link Posted: 11/19/2008 8:45:48 PM EDT
I still say that I've heard of at least three people awarded $10,000 per year

but, when I was looking for something to back that up I found this article


25 states compensate the wrongfully convicted
The Associated Press
http://www.statesman.com/news/content/gen/ap/Exonerated_Inmates_States.html
Twenty-five states and the District of Columbia have laws that provide compensation for the wrongfully convicted:

_ Alabama: $50,000 minimum per year of wrongful incarceration

_ California: $100 maximum per day

_ Connecticut: No prescribed amount or limit

_ District of Columbia: No prescribed amount or limit

_ Florida: $50,000 per year, up to $2 million

_ Illinois: $85,350 for those who served up to 5 years, $170,000 for 5 to 14 years and $199,150 for more than 14 years

_ Iowa: $50 per day, up to $25,000 a year

_ Louisiana: $15,000 per year, with a $150,000 limit

_ Maine: $300,000 limit

_ Maryland: No prescribed amount or limit

_ Massachusetts: $500,000 limit

_ Missouri: $50 per day

_ Montana: Money for education only

_ New Hampshire: $20,000 limit

_ New Jersey: Twice the annual income in year prior to incarceration or $20,000 per year, whichever is greater

_ New York: No prescribed amount or limit

_ North Carolina: $50,000 per year, with a $750,000 limit

_ Ohio: $40,330, or other amount decided by state auditor, per year

_ Oklahoma: $175,000 total

_ Tennessee: $1 million total

_ Texas: $50,000 per year; $100,000 per year if on death row

_ Utah: State's average annual wage per year, for up to 15 years of incarceration

_ Vermont: $30,000 to $60,000 per year

_ Virginia: 90 percent of state's per capita personal income per year for up to 20 years

_ West Virginia: No prescribed amount or limit

_ Wisconsin: $25,000 limit

In some states, exonerated inmates must meet specific requirements, such as receiving a government pardon, to be eligible for compensation.

___

Source: The Innocence Project, Florida Legislature, Utah Legislature
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