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Posted: 5/24/2005 7:55:37 PM EDT
Okay guys, get your flamethrowers ready. Since many of these threads are about the wars we are now fighting, does anyone stop and think about how it has all started? Why haven't muslim terrorists shown hatred for Chile, Mexico, Canada, China, Japan, Iceland, Finland, etc, etc . . . almost every other country except the US? What did we do do deserve this? Did they throw a dart at a list of countries and it landed on the US? This doesn't count places like Russia or the Philippines because their fighting muslim extremists is strictly internal and started with indiginous muslims. And all of the "they hate freedom" talk. Does that really make sense? Didn't OBL even say that if he hated freedom, he'd have attack Sweden instead? I'm looking forward to some angry, irrational responses. I can't wait!
Link Posted: 5/24/2005 7:57:23 PM EDT
if you want to get into a good fight, may as well suckerpunch the biggest toughest guy in the room
Link Posted: 5/24/2005 7:59:13 PM EDT
Becuase America represents economic freedom, not hot tubs and Volvos.

That's why the WTC was the target of two separate attacks - because they were the symbol of American economic strength.

If they were going after "freedom" in terms of liberty, justice, etc, all the planes would have been targeted for Washington DC
Link Posted: 5/24/2005 7:59:53 PM EDT

Link Posted: 5/24/2005 8:01:10 PM EDT
Because we never finished the job during the crusades when we should have.

SGat1r5
Link Posted: 5/24/2005 8:01:52 PM EDT


OBL wanted U.S. troops out of Saudi Arabia. Didn't want unbelievers "occupying" the Holy Land.

Next question.
Link Posted: 5/24/2005 8:04:16 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 5/24/2005 8:05:20 PM EDT by Mauser101]
You know, prior to us going into Afghanistan and Iraq the evil summbitches seemd to enjoy blowing themselves up in Europe a lot more than against US targets.

They do hate freedom, specifically the freedom of religion. Their hate is brought on by envy.

They are an assbackwards culture that should have been flushed a long time ago.

EDIT: +1 on DK Prof. OBLs main beef was US troops stationed in the same country as Mecca during Gulf War 1.
Link Posted: 5/24/2005 8:05:57 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Mauser101:
You know, prior to us going into Afghanistan and Iraq the evil summbitches seemd to enjoy blowing themselves up in Europe a lot more than against US targets.



You obviously have not been paying attention.

Sgtar15
Link Posted: 5/24/2005 8:09:24 PM EDT

Originally Posted By DK-Prof:

OBL wanted U.S. troops out of Saudi Arabia. Didn't want unbelievers "occupying" the Holy Land.

Next question.



also America is a large supporter of Israel and the Jewish state so they hate us for that too.....



bastards.
Link Posted: 5/24/2005 8:11:03 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 5/24/2005 8:12:38 PM EDT by Mauser101]

Originally Posted By sgtar15:

Originally Posted By Mauser101:
You know, prior to us going into Afghanistan and Iraq the evil summbitches seemd to enjoy blowing themselves up in Europe a lot more than against US targets.



You obviously have not been paying attention.

Sgtar15



On the contrary. I pay rather close attention.
Link Posted: 5/24/2005 8:11:07 PM EDT

Originally Posted By jquillen1985:
Okay guys, get your flamethrowers ready. Since many of these threads are about the wars we are now fighting, does anyone stop and think about how it has all started? Why haven't muslim terrorists shown hatred for Chile, Mexico, Canada, China, Japan, Iceland, Finland, etc, etc . . . almost every other country except the US? What did we do do deserve this? Did they throw a dart at a list of countries and it landed on the US? This doesn't count places like Russia or the Philippines because their fighting muslim extremists is strictly internal and started with indiginous muslims. And all of the "they hate freedom" talk. Does that really make sense? Didn't OBL even say that if he hated freedom, he'd have attack Sweden instead? I'm looking forward to some angry, irrational responses. I can't wait!



There is a sizable faction in academia that suggest that the 9/11 attacks and OBL's movement are not a war of Islam against the US, but rather indicative of a massive internal rift in Islam itself between the extremists and the moderates. These people suggest that Al Queda is carrying out these attacks to gather support Whabbisit(sp) Islam. This is not to say they don't hate us - but that is not their primary motive in the attack. I am looking through my files trying to associate a name with this theory - I'll post when I find it. I’m not sure I agree with this but it is a convincing argument; I am sorry I have simplified in such a poor way I'll try to expand if anyone would like.
Link Posted: 5/24/2005 8:16:45 PM EDT
Link Posted: 5/24/2005 8:18:26 PM EDT
Alot of this was brewing in Africa and CHECHNYA long before this came to the light of most of the world. Also, you will not know what is happening in China but they have been dealing with this for a while.
Link Posted: 5/24/2005 8:23:52 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Mauser101:

Originally Posted By sgtar15:

Originally Posted By Mauser101:
You know, prior to us going into Afghanistan and Iraq the evil summbitches seemd to enjoy blowing themselves up in Europe a lot more than against US targets.



You obviously have not been paying attention.

Sgtar15



On the contrary. I pay rather close attention.
You're right Sarge...I missed that whole 9/11 thing.



Fixed
Link Posted: 5/24/2005 8:28:50 PM EDT

Originally Posted By krpind:

Originally Posted By Mauser101:

Originally Posted By sgtar15:

Originally Posted By Mauser101:
You know, prior to us going into Afghanistan and Iraq the evil summbitches seemd to enjoy blowing themselves up in Europe a lot more than against US targets.



You obviously have not been paying attention.

Sgtar15



On the contrary. I pay rather close attention.
You're right Sarge...I missed that whole 9/11 thing.



Fixed



9/11 what's that?

EDIT: OMG, what have I been missing?!

Link Posted: 5/24/2005 8:31:06 PM EDT

Originally Posted By krpind:

Originally Posted By Mauser101:

Originally Posted By sgtar15:

Originally Posted By Mauser101:
You know, prior to us going into Afghanistan and Iraq the evil summbitches seemd to enjoy blowing themselves up in Europe a lot more than against US targets.



You obviously have not been paying attention.

Sgtar15



On the contrary. I pay rather close attention.
You're right Sarge...I missed that whole 9/11 thing '93 WTC attack, USS Cole. US Embassy bombings..



Fixed



Fixed.
Link Posted: 5/24/2005 8:32:55 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 5/24/2005 8:33:52 PM EDT by Tango7]

Originally Posted By Ardenner:
There is a sizable faction in academia that suggest that the 9/11 attacks and OBL's movement are not a war of Islam against the US, but rather indicative of a massive internal rift in Islam itself between the extremists and the moderates. These people suggest that Al Queda is carrying out these attacks to gather support Whabbisit(sp) Islam. This is not to say they don't hate us - but that is not their primary motive in the attack. I am looking through my files trying to associate a name with this theory - I'll post when I find it. I’m not sure I agree with this but it is a convincing argument; I am sorry I have simplified in such a poor way I'll try to expand if anyone would like.



It's Wahabiism... Basically a group of Muslim fundamentalists that believe in the literal translation of theQuran... not the interpretation of the religious leaders.


They relied entirely on interpretations based on the literal meaning of the texts, and thus they contradicted basic tenets and ijam, the consensus of religious scholars. This is why the Egyptian religious scholar of the last century, Muhammad Abdo, described them as worse than those who follow others blindly because they "believe that the literal meanings must be endorsed and adhered to without paying heed to the basic tenets on which religion is based.

From http://biphome.spray.se/hyla/wahabia/03.htm



So they could use Islam to disregard the basic beliefs of Islam Dontcha love fundamentalists than disregard the basic beliefs of their own religion to further their own religious beliefs?

(Yes, I know it doesn't make sense.


It's not supposed to, sadly.)

Here's a bitching overview of wahhabism from Globalsecurity.org...


Excerpt:
Wahhabism [Wahabism] is a reform movement that began 200 years ago to rid Islamic societies of cultural practices and interpretation that had been acquired over the centuries. The followers of Abdul Wahab (1703-1792) began as a movement to cleanse the Arab bedouin from the influence of Sufism. Wahhabis are the followers of Ibn 'Abd ul-Wahhab, who instituted a great reform in the religion of Islam in Arabia in the 18th century. Mahommed ibn 'Abd ul-Wahhab was born in 1691 (or 1703) at al-Hauta of the Nejd in central Arabia, and was of the tribe of the Bani Tamim. He studied literature and jurisprudence of the Hanifite school. After making the pilgrimage with his father, he spent some further time in the study of law at Medina, and resided for a while at Isfahan, whence he returned to the Nejd to undertake the work of a teacher.

Aroused by his studies and his observation of the luxury in dress and habits, the superstitious pilgrimages to shrines, the use of omens and the worship given to Mahomet and Mahommedan saints rather than to God, he began a mission to proclaim the simplicity of the early religion founded on the Koran and Sunna (i.e. the manner of life of Mahomet).



Ed 4 board code
Link Posted: 5/24/2005 8:43:55 PM EDT

Originally Posted By jquillen1985:
Okay guys, get your flamethrowers ready. Since many of these threads are about the wars we are now fighting, does anyone stop and think about how it has all started? Why haven't muslim terrorists shown hatred for Chile, Mexico, Canada, China, Japan, Iceland, Finland, etc, etc . . . almost every other country except the US? What did we do do deserve this? Did they throw a dart at a list of countries and it landed on the US? This doesn't count places like Russia or the Philippines because their fighting muslim extremists is strictly internal and started with indiginous muslims. And all of the "they hate freedom" talk. Does that really make sense? Didn't OBL even say that if he hated freedom, he'd have attack Sweden instead? I'm looking forward to some angry, irrational responses. I can't wait!



You have asked some well thought out questions which leads me to believe that with a bit of effort on your part you will be intelligent enough to find the answers.

Kinda funny. I'm an agnostic. I've never persecuted, crucified or beheaded anyone because they didn't share my belief system.

How's that for an irrational response?
Link Posted: 5/24/2005 8:45:02 PM EDT
Thanks Tango7. This last semester one of my Sociology Profs was almost attacked by this Arab kid in the class for saying less than flattering things about al-Wahhab. The kid stood up - "Dr. xxxx are you saying that Muhammad Ibn Abd al-Wahhab is a bad person are you, are you, cuz he isn't, he isn't!!!!" I almost hit the floor. I certainly didn't sit next to that kid the rest of the semester.
Link Posted: 5/24/2005 8:50:57 PM EDT
If you ask me they were waiting for a downturn in our economy so that when they attacked our economy they could inflict the most amount of damage. They realize that they cannot beat us militarily, but the only reason we are what we are (militarily) is because of our economy. This would be the "other way to skin the cat".

The attacks on the WTC were their targets. The Pentagon and the attempt on the White House were nothing more than a slap in the face.

That being said, they inflicted a hell of a lot of damage, but fell short of toppleing our economy...so far anyway.
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