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9/22/2017 12:11:25 AM
Posted: 10/7/2005 6:47:28 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 10/7/2005 6:51:03 AM EDT by garandman]



I think he was flipping of the prick with the camera , cuz he wouldn't pick up a rifle.

Or am I just hoping that is what he was doing?

Link Posted: 10/7/2005 6:58:54 AM EDT
Yea...either way it's uber-cool
Link Posted: 10/7/2005 7:00:14 AM EDT
Eloquent fellow, none-the-less.
Link Posted: 10/7/2005 7:03:52 AM EDT
that says more than words ever could.
Link Posted: 10/7/2005 7:13:39 AM EDT

Originally Posted By garandman:
i2.photobucket.com/albums/y10/SW0352/92405aaburghardt.jpg


I think he was flipping of the prick with the camera , cuz he wouldn't pick up a rifle.

Or am I just hoping that is what he was doing?




Yeah, but if you read the post on Michael Yon's blog, Gates of Fire....there is a journalist with balls, who picked up a weapon during a fire fight to try and save a couple of guys while a newbie LT and radioman stood by not re-acting.

He got his ass handed to him by some (probably) REMF POS Major, who told him if he ever did it again, he'd be going home.....

Not saying that most guys with the camera's aren't assholes, but there is an example of one who stepped up, and got in trouble for it.

The Major in question sounds like a fine candidate for General, where he can drop his PC rules BS from on high to the troops...like lets not wear T-shirts making fun of the enemy, so we don't offend them. Offend? Shit, I thought it was our job to kill them.....
Link Posted: 10/7/2005 7:28:09 AM EDT

He's transmitting rage Er. Bigtime.
Link Posted: 10/7/2005 8:10:32 AM EDT

Originally Posted By pzjgr:

He got his ass handed to him by some (probably) REMF POS Major, who told him if he ever did it again, he'd be going home.....

The Major in question sounds like a fine candidate for General, where he can drop his PC rules BS from on high to the troops...like lets not wear T-shirts making fun of the enemy, so we don't offend them. Offend? Shit, I thought it was our job to kill them.....



Reread the Yon article. He knows the officer in question well, appears to like him. He was merely doing his job, the journalists are expressly prohibited from being armed. Yon understands this.

NTM
Link Posted: 10/7/2005 8:12:54 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 10/7/2005 8:17:04 AM EDT by Cypher214]

Originally Posted By Manic_Moran:

Originally Posted By pzjgr:

He got his ass handed to him by some (probably) REMF POS Major, who told him if he ever did it again, he'd be going home.....

The Major in question sounds like a fine candidate for General, where he can drop his PC rules BS from on high to the troops...like lets not wear T-shirts making fun of the enemy, so we don't offend them. Offend? Shit, I thought it was our job to kill them.....



Reread the Yon article. He knows the officer in question well, appears to like him. He was merely doing his job, the journalists are expressly prohibited from being armed. Yon understands this.

NTM



If I remember correctly, the Major was not a "REMF POS" at all...

The type of PC stuff you are talking about (not wearing shirts that insult islam) is absolutely the right thing in a combat environment. Apparently you are not familiar with the concept of "winning their hearts and minds". If our troops are running around with clothing that insults the religion of the local civilians, it makes our job a lot tougher than it already is.

We need the civilians on our side for obvious reasons.

Link Posted: 10/7/2005 8:18:12 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Manic_Moran:

Originally Posted By pzjgr:

He got his ass handed to him by some (probably) REMF POS Major, who told him if he ever did it again, he'd be going home.....

The Major in question sounds like a fine candidate for General, where he can drop his PC rules BS from on high to the troops...like lets not wear T-shirts making fun of the enemy, so we don't offend them. Offend? Shit, I thought it was our job to kill them.....



Reread the Yon article. He knows the officer in question well, appears to like him. He was merely doing his job, the journalists are expressly prohibited from being armed. Yon understands this.

NTM



I'll re-read it...I know Yon knows the light colonel well, but I wasn't sure on the Major...still, like I said in a previous post...I don't give a shit about rules, I give him credit for doing SOMETHING to try and save two buddies in a bad place when the other two soldiers seemed to be immobilized for whatever reason.

This wasn't a case of some journalist picking up a weapon and going "Yeeeehaaaaaw, look at me fighting the insurgents", the CO was hit 3 times, and laying in the street in the line of fire, and the CSM appeared to be down and wounded. If I was one of the guys down, I sure as shit wouldn't care if someone who was trusted, and obviously considered part of the team enough to allow to go on a patrol, tried to save my ass.

In any case, I think the Major came off as a dick, considering Yon possibly contributed to saving the ass of the CO and a CSM....

Anyway, didn't you ever see "The Green Berets"? No bitched at that pansy reporter for picking up an M1 carbine and helping to defend the base!
Link Posted: 10/7/2005 8:22:28 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Cypher214:
If I remember correctly, the Major was not a "REMF POS" at all...

The type of PC stuff you are talking about (not wearing shirts that insult islam) is absolutely the right thing in a combat environment. Apparently you are not familiar with the concept of "winning their hearts and minds". If our troops are running around with clothing that insults the religion of the local civilians, it makes our job a lot tougher than it already is.

We need the civilians on our side for obvious reasons.




Well, I did say probably---but more accurate than REMF POS, how about PC bucking for General type...see post above

As far as hearts and minds...I have posted many times...I don't believe in winning hearts and minds. I believe in destroying hearts and minds. Completely and utterly destroying any will to fight by anyone.

We destroyed hearts and minds in WWII...we tried to win hearts and minds in Vietnam and look where it got us. If you fight and try to win hearts and minds, it is not conducive to victory in my book....

But that is a topic for another thread...I don't want to threadjack...
Link Posted: 10/7/2005 8:30:28 AM EDT

Originally Posted By garandman:
i2.photobucket.com/albums/y10/SW0352/92405aaburghardt.jpg


I think he was flipping of the prick with the camera , cuz he wouldn't pick up a rifle.

Or am I just hoping that is what he was doing?




I think he thought the bastard that blew the IED was still on station and was watching. I think this was his retort to a command actived IED. FU punk is what I read.
Link Posted: 10/7/2005 8:36:33 AM EDT
Link Posted: 10/7/2005 8:45:01 AM EDT


Yeah, but if you read the post on Michael Yon's blog, Gates of Fire....there is a journalist with balls, who picked up a weapon during a fire fight to try and save a couple of guys while a newbie LT and radioman stood by not re-acting.

He got his ass handed to him by some (probably) REMF POS Major, who told him if he ever did it again, he'd be going home.....

Not saying that most guys with the camera's aren't assholes, but there is an example of one who stepped up, and got in trouble for it.

The Major in question sounds like a fine candidate for General, where he can drop his PC rules BS from on high to the troops...like lets not wear T-shirts making fun of the enemy, so we don't offend them. Offend? Shit, I thought it was our job to kill them.....



To be fair it was probably a legal thing; can't have journalists picking up weapons and violating their neutrality, and if somebody sues there's a whole mess if an outsider was involved. Higher ups have to deal with crap the shooters don't.
Link Posted: 10/7/2005 8:48:47 AM EDT

Originally Posted By mmx1:
To be fair it was probably a legal thing; can't have journalists picking up weapons and violating their neutrality, and if somebody sues there's a whole mess if an outsider was involved. Higher ups have to deal with crap the shooters don't.



Conversely, I am sure it is something that is extremely rare...hell most of our press would be wringing their hands in glee over the sight of a couple of our guys getting shot up...If it bleeds, it leads as they say.

Hell, with a lot of press, it is probably more of a worry they will pick up a weapon and HELP the insurgents
Link Posted: 10/7/2005 9:11:49 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Sylvan:
One take is that he isn't a marine.



Why would you say that?

Gunney Burghart certainly is a Marine and is well known in EOD circles.
Link Posted: 10/7/2005 9:17:19 AM EDT
Link Posted: 10/7/2005 9:23:54 AM EDT

Originally Posted By EOD_Guy:

Originally Posted By Sylvan:
One take is that he isn't a marine.



Why would you say that?

Gunney Burghart certainly is a Marine and is well known in EOD circles.



+1

I didn't know him personally, but I'm pretty sure we went through NAVSCOLEOD at about the same time.

90S-89
Link Posted: 10/7/2005 9:30:05 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 10/7/2005 9:30:30 AM EDT by ctprelude]

Originally Posted By Sylvan:
I was referring to the fact that most of the guys around him is in ACUs.
His uniform is a little difficult to discern.
looks like one marine desert uniform and two soldiers in ACUs
I don't know the story, I am just looking at the picture.
The HMMWVs are a mixed bag as well.
One has the fording kit and the other doesn't.



The article says he was being treated by army medics. He is definitely a Marine.
Link Posted: 10/7/2005 9:37:41 AM EDT

Originally Posted By pzjgr:
Hell, with a lot of press, it is probably more of a worry they will pick up a weapon and HELP the insurgents


Yep.
Link Posted: 10/7/2005 9:48:12 AM EDT

Originally Posted By u-baddog:

Originally Posted By garandman:
i2.photobucket.com/albums/y10/SW0352/92405aaburghardt.jpg


I think he was flipping of the prick with the camera , cuz he wouldn't pick up a rifle.

Or am I just hoping that is what he was doing?




I think he thought the bastard that blew the IED was still on station and was watching. I think this was his retort to a command actived IED. FU punk is what I read.



Heard this too via some email. Who knows.
Link Posted: 10/7/2005 9:49:55 AM EDT
Kudos to the man who picked up a rifle, especially when others are inactive. Give that man a medal
Link Posted: 10/7/2005 9:58:14 AM EDT

Originally Posted By pzjgr:
As far as hearts and minds...I have posted many times...I don't believe in winning hearts and minds. I believe in destroying hearts and minds. Completely and utterly destroying any will to fight by anyone.



That's a big difference in fighting a total war and fighting an insurgency. Vietnam and Iraq are both insurgencies. The enemy is not/was not in uniform and you need the civilian populace to help identify the bad guys.

Conversely, you piss off the civilian populace and they become the bad guys.

My take on the gesture is he's saying, "F you, Butch, I'm still walking."
Link Posted: 10/7/2005 10:38:21 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Da_Bunny:
Eloquent fellow, none-the-less.





Right up there with "Nuts!"
Link Posted: 10/7/2005 10:40:38 AM EDT
Link Posted: 10/7/2005 10:42:58 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 10/7/2005 11:00:48 AM EDT by garandman]

Originally Posted By NonConformist:
Kudos to the man who picked up a rifle, especially when others are inactive. Give that man a medal



+1

ANYONE who stays neutral in this war is a collaborator.

Anyone who holds onto a camera in this war is a well trained collaborator.



Link Posted: 10/7/2005 10:47:20 AM EDT

Originally Posted By pzjgr:
In any case, I think the Major came off as a dick, considering Yon possibly contributed to saving the ass of the CO and a CSM....




I read it more as a CYA statement by the Major, than a real reprimand.
Link Posted: 10/7/2005 11:00:11 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 10/7/2005 11:01:28 AM EDT by EOD_Guy]

Originally Posted By Sylvan:
I was referring to the fact that most of the guys around him is in ACUs.
His uniform is a little difficult to discern.
looks like one marine desert uniform and two soldiers in ACUs
I don't know the story, I am just looking at the picture.
The HMMWVs are a mixed bag as well.
One has the fording kit and the other doesn't.



Security for the EOD team was being provided by the 167th Cavalry of the Nebraska National Guard.
When I was in, it was not uncommon for EOD teams from one service to support other services. We have a common bond since all EOD techs attend the Naval EOD School, now located at Eglin AFB, FL.


EODS Class 1S-66.
Link Posted: 10/7/2005 11:50:16 AM EDT

Originally Posted By EOD_Guy:

Originally Posted By Sylvan:
I was referring to the fact that most of the guys around him is in ACUs.
His uniform is a little difficult to discern.
looks like one marine desert uniform and two soldiers in ACUs
I don't know the story, I am just looking at the picture.
The HMMWVs are a mixed bag as well.
One has the fording kit and the other doesn't.



Security for the EOD team was being provided by the 167th Cavalry of the Nebraska National Guard.
When I was in, it was not uncommon for EOD teams from one service to support other services. We have a common bond since all EOD techs attend the Naval EOD School, now located at Eglin AFB, FL.


EODS Class 1S-66.






I know I should respect my elders, but I had to do it.


Link Posted: 10/7/2005 12:52:38 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 10/7/2005 12:52:58 PM EDT by EOD_Guy]
Smart ass young punk!
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