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Posted: 1/16/2015 8:04:01 AM EST
IRS Says You Have No Right to Email Privacy
By Julie Borowski
“The Fourth Amendment does not protect communications held in electronic storage, such as email messages stored on a server, because internet users do not have a reasonable expectation of privacy in such communications.”

That’s a direct quote from an internal IRS handbook obtained by the Americans Civil Liberties Union under the Freedom of Information Act.

Scary, right?

The truth is that government officials reading citizens’ private emails without a warrant is a clear violation of the 4th Amendment. However, believe it or not, the current privacy laws on the books do not protect your email privacy. IRS officials can legally read any of your emails that are over 180 days—and you probably won’t know they’re doing it.
View Quote


More at the link: http://www.freedomworks.org/content/irs-says-you-have-no-right-email-privacy
Link Posted: 1/16/2015 8:13:47 AM EST
Fuck em. I lost all my emails when the server went down.
Link Posted: 1/16/2015 8:17:44 AM EST
I wonder if the ruling about police accessing smart phones applies here.


And FPNI
Link Posted: 1/16/2015 8:18:13 AM EST
Originally Posted By Shqype:
IRS Says You Have No Right to Email Privacy
By Julie Borowski
“The Fourth Amendment does not protect communications held in electronic storage, such as email messages stored on a server, because internet users do not have a reasonable expectation of privacy in such communications.”

That’s a direct quote from an internal IRS handbook obtained by the Americans Civil Liberties Union under the Freedom of Information Act.

Scary, right?

The truth is that government officials reading citizens’ private emails without a warrant is a clear violation of the 4th Amendment. However, believe it or not, the current privacy laws on the books do not protect your email privacy. IRS officials can legally read any of your emails that are over 180 days—and you probably won’t know they’re doing it.
View Quote


More at the link: http://www.freedomworks.org/content/irs-says-you-have-no-right-email-privacy
View Quote



So the IRS can read your email because other people can hack into it to?

I don't expect email to be private, but I do expect goverment agencies to make up bullshit reasons/ways to make more people "criminals".

All of this is just one big circle jerk, the news reports it, we get pissed off and nobody gets punished. Politicians say they'll fix it, but it continues, welcome to the new normal.

Link Posted: 1/16/2015 8:18:40 AM EST
Fuck the IRS. Fuck 'em! You've already taken everything else we have so fuck you!
Link Posted: 1/16/2015 8:19:32 AM EST
How the fuck does the IRS have access to emails that are NOT on their servers!!??
Link Posted: 1/16/2015 8:19:52 AM EST
Lost all mine in a boating accident.
Link Posted: 1/16/2015 8:21:40 AM EST
[Last Edit: 1/16/2015 8:22:11 AM EST by Ironhandjohn]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By RDak:
How the fuck does the IRS have access to emails that are NOT on their servers!!??
View Quote





This..



And the only emails I get anymore are spam, so they can read them to their heart's content. Maybe that faithless bitch Adrianna from Facebook will pester them for awhile and leave me alone.
Link Posted: 1/16/2015 8:24:14 AM EST


Statists love their totalitarianism.





Link Posted: 1/16/2015 8:24:16 AM EST
Who says they aren't on "Their" servers?

What's that big ass facility in Utah for?
Link Posted: 1/16/2015 8:26:24 AM EST
my hard drive had crashed, i guess they can't get them anymore
Link Posted: 1/16/2015 8:27:26 AM EST
Anybody can open up a envelope with a knife. That doesn't mean the government is free to do so.

Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile
Link Posted: 1/16/2015 8:29:26 AM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Coltman77:
Fuck em. I lost all my emails when the server went down.
View Quote


Yes, Fuck the IRS with a grenade.
Link Posted: 1/16/2015 8:29:28 AM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Coltman77:
Fuck em. I lost all my emails when the server went down.
View Quote

They didn't.
Link Posted: 1/16/2015 8:29:36 AM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By RDak:
How the fuck does the IRS have access to emails that are NOT on their servers!!??
View Quote


LOL
They apparently don't have access to their own e-mails is what Lerner said
Link Posted: 1/16/2015 8:30:30 AM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Nailcrusher:


LOL
They apparently don't have access to their own e-mails is what Lerner said
View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Nailcrusher:
Originally Posted By RDak:
How the fuck does the IRS have access to emails that are NOT on their servers!!??


LOL
They apparently don't have access to their own e-mails is what Lerner said

Good point.

Link Posted: 1/16/2015 8:31:26 AM EST
this recent idea that the 4th Amend is mainly about privacy, instead of being secure in ones person, house, papers and effects, needs to go away...now
Link Posted: 1/16/2015 8:31:48 AM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Top_Secret:
Anybody can open up a envelope with a knife. That doesn't mean the government is free to do so.

Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile
View Quote


Email isn't like an envelope, it's more like a post card. Anyone who handles it can look at it plain as day. If you want an envelope, use encryption.
Link Posted: 1/16/2015 8:33:50 AM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Coltman77:
Fuck em. I lost all my emails when the server went down.
View Quote

in a boating accident
Link Posted: 1/16/2015 8:34:00 AM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By mikelachoy:
Fuck the IRS. Fuck 'em! You've already taken everything else we have so fuck you!
View Quote


It's not just the IRS.

I just watched that Frontline special on Netflix called "United States of Secrets." It's downright scary the justifications the statists being interviewed gave for breaking the law. Oh, wait....they were given permission by the ki..president.
Link Posted: 1/16/2015 8:38:36 AM EST
[Last Edit: 1/16/2015 8:40:08 AM EST by packingXDs]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By xerxes2695:


Email isn't like an envelope, it's more like a post card. Anyone who handles it can look at it plain as day. If you want an envelope, use encryption.
View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By xerxes2695:
Originally Posted By Top_Secret:
Anybody can open up a envelope with a knife. That doesn't mean the government is free to do so.

Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile


Email isn't like an envelope, it's more like a post card. Anyone who handles it can look at it plain as day. If you want an envelope, use encryption.

Perhaps while its in transit. Once delivered, its a postcard, in a locked box, on private property. At which point I do have every expectation of privacy as I wouldn't bother securing that "lock box" with credentials only I know.
Link Posted: 1/16/2015 8:40:57 AM EST
Hmm no secret here, Fuck the IRS.
Link Posted: 1/16/2015 8:47:05 AM EST
Link Posted: 1/16/2015 8:48:30 AM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By RDak:
How the fuck does the IRS have access to emails that are NOT on their servers!!??
View Quote

This is a really good question. I can think of 2 possible answers:

1) the IRS does have them on their servers, they have a division that reads people's emails
2) a different government agency (NSA, anyone?) shares your emails with the IRS .... we know the NSA has them, and we know the IRS shares information with other parts of the government (targeting conservatives and sharing info with the White House)

FreedomWorks has a letter in support of the Email Privacy Act that should protect us against this sort of thing. But I think the best medicine is encryption.

How are you guys encrypting your emails?
Link Posted: 1/16/2015 8:51:39 AM EST
That's some bullshit right there.
Link Posted: 1/16/2015 8:53:48 AM EST
Link Posted: 1/16/2015 8:54:20 AM EST
I'm sure the new congress will get right on this with some appropriate legislation and clean up the mess that the tax code is..........
Link Posted: 1/16/2015 8:56:11 AM EST
Paging dmnoid!!
Link Posted: 1/16/2015 8:56:27 AM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By RDak:
How the fuck does the IRS have access to emails that are NOT on their servers!!??
View Quote

Better question is why the IRS would want to read emails in the first place.
Link Posted: 1/16/2015 8:56:45 AM EST
so they cant charge you for hacking their emails and reading them correct?
Link Posted: 1/16/2015 8:57:50 AM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By jm0502:
so they cant charge you for hacking their emails and reading them correct?
View Quote

I guess it is like John Wayne said above that it is a criminal investigation but the article doesn't say much as to details.

Fuck, I don't know.
Link Posted: 1/16/2015 8:58:44 AM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By packingXDs:

Perhaps while its in transit. Once delivered, its a postcard, in a locked box, on private property. At which point I do have every expectation of privacy as I wouldn't bother securing that "lock box" with credentials only I know.
View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By packingXDs:
Originally Posted By xerxes2695:
Originally Posted By Top_Secret:
Anybody can open up a envelope with a knife. That doesn't mean the government is free to do so.

Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile


Email isn't like an envelope, it's more like a post card. Anyone who handles it can look at it plain as day. If you want an envelope, use encryption.

Perhaps while its in transit. Once delivered, its a postcard, in a locked box, on private property. At which point I do have every expectation of privacy as I wouldn't bother securing that "lock box" with credentials only I know.


Additionally, I'm fairly certain the Founders would have frowned upon the Gov't copying every single post card that passed through the postal system. I wasn't aware there was a "postcard" exemption to the 4th too.
Link Posted: 1/16/2015 9:02:44 AM EST
So the IRS can't find their old emails, but want to read ours?
Link Posted: 1/16/2015 9:04:54 AM EST
Clearly from a right-wing bigoted zealot website. I'll only believe it if MSNBC reports it.

/liberal
Link Posted: 1/16/2015 9:06:29 AM EST
But....no one cares. So carry on Fed.
Link Posted: 1/16/2015 9:16:08 AM EST
So the IRS had expanded into Constitutional law now?
Link Posted: 1/16/2015 9:17:45 AM EST
Dammit man, where's Lee Greenwood when you need him.

Link Posted: 1/16/2015 9:19:48 AM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By RDak:
How the fuck does the IRS have access to emails that are NOT on their servers!!??
View Quote


This. I am thinking it is out of context and was actually talking about their own employees emails at work.
Link Posted: 1/16/2015 9:19:54 AM EST
So, they FOUND all of Lois Lerner's emails, right?
Link Posted: 1/16/2015 9:25:12 AM EST

The truth is that government officials reading citizens’ private emails without a warrant is a clear violation of the 4th Amendment.
View Quote


Perhaps it's clear in the opinion of the person writing that, but I don't believe it's clear at all in a legal sense. Seems like the public has one understanding and the government another, and it seems like something that's just begging for a big hairy zillion dollar supreme court case.
Link Posted: 1/16/2015 9:25:51 AM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By RUM:



So the IRS can read your email because other people can hack into it to?

I don't expect email to be private, but I do expect goverment agencies to make up bullshit reasons/ways to make more people "criminals".

All of this is just one big circle jerk, the news reports it, we get pissed off and nobody gets punished. Politicians say they'll fix it, but it continues, welcome to the new normal.

View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By RUM:
Originally Posted By Shqype:
IRS Says You Have No Right to Email Privacy
By Julie Borowski
“The Fourth Amendment does not protect communications held in electronic storage, such as email messages stored on a server, because internet users do not have a reasonable expectation of privacy in such communications.”

That’s a direct quote from an internal IRS handbook obtained by the Americans Civil Liberties Union under the Freedom of Information Act.

Scary, right?

The truth is that government officials reading citizens’ private emails without a warrant is a clear violation of the 4th Amendment. However, believe it or not, the current privacy laws on the books do not protect your email privacy. IRS officials can legally read any of your emails that are over 180 days—and you probably won’t know they’re doing it.


More at the link: http://www.freedomworks.org/content/irs-says-you-have-no-right-email-privacy



So the IRS can read your email because other people can hack into it to?

I don't expect email to be private, but I do expect goverment agencies to make up bullshit reasons/ways to make more people "criminals".

All of this is just one big circle jerk, the news reports it, we get pissed off and nobody gets punished. Politicians say they'll fix it, but it continues, welcome to the new normal.



Nothing to do with hacking. Google can read your emails, so you already don't expect them to be truly private, goes the logic.
Link Posted: 1/16/2015 9:27:14 AM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Ironhandjohn: Maybe that faithless bitch Adrianna from Facebook will pester them for awhile and leave me alone.
View Quote




You too?
Link Posted: 1/16/2015 9:28:04 AM EST
Then all the IRS criminals involved in the scandals have the same right to no privacy. Whats good for the goose is good for the gander.
Link Posted: 1/16/2015 9:28:27 AM EST
Lois Lerner...
Link Posted: 1/16/2015 9:34:53 AM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By WinstonSmith:


Perhaps it's clear in the opinion of the person writing that, but I don't believe it's clear at all in a legal sense. Seems like the public has one understanding and the government another, and it seems like something that's just begging for a big hairy zillion dollar supreme court case.
View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By WinstonSmith:

The truth is that government officials reading citizens’ private emails without a warrant is a clear violation of the 4th Amendment.


Perhaps it's clear in the opinion of the person writing that, but I don't believe it's clear at all in a legal sense. Seems like the public has one understanding and the government another, and it seems like something that's just begging for a big hairy zillion dollar supreme court case.

Government agencies don't care what the Constitution says or really means. All they care about is what they can get away with. The Supreme Court wouldn't have a full schedule of government officials toeing and just stepping over the line if those agents really cared about the idea of the 4th amendment.
Link Posted: 1/16/2015 9:36:46 AM EST
How about this idea:

Imagine a local software package that works with your webpage-based gmail/yahoomail/whatever that abstracts the en/de cryption process from the webpage such that only encrypted data is ever on the gmail/yahoo/whatever servers?

does such a thing already exist?
Link Posted: 1/16/2015 9:36:59 AM EST
Link Posted: 1/16/2015 9:38:20 AM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By jm0502:
so they cant charge you for hacking their emails and reading them correct?
View Quote


This is a one way street here bucko! You best do an about face right freakin' now and get with the program!

Now, pick up that can on your way out.
Link Posted: 1/16/2015 9:40:05 AM EST
[Last Edit: 1/16/2015 9:42:48 AM EST by SmilingBandit]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By LinkedM4:
How about this idea:

Imagine a local software package that works with your webpage-based gmail/yahoomail/whatever that abstracts the en/de cryption process from the webpage such that only encrypted data is ever on the gmail/yahoo/whatever servers?

does such a thing already exist?
View Quote

http://www.instructables.com/id/Encrypt-your-Gmail-Email/

ETA: The tough part, perhaps tough at least, is getting your friends to use PGP too. And you need to use it for more than just important stuff. If it's just the important stuff then the fact that it was encrypted becomes interesting in and of itself.
Link Posted: 1/16/2015 9:44:06 AM EST
Yet they don't even have access to their own emails. I'm looking at you Lois Lerner
Link Posted: 1/16/2015 9:47:50 AM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Rustler:
Yet they don't even have access to their own emails. I'm looking at you Lois Lerner
View Quote



And she is probably looking right back at you via the built in webcam on your computer.
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