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Posted: 3/3/2001 12:25:19 PM EST
It's looking like I might be changing LEO agencies and the one I might be going to allows officers to carry rifles for patrol use. If I change over to this new department how should I carry my ar15 for readiness. Should I carry it with a mag and one in the pipe and the safety on or safety off and one not in the pipe where I would have to charge a round in the pipe. How do you other LEO's carry your ar's on patrol?
Link Posted: 3/3/2001 1:19:09 PM EST
[Last Edit: 3/3/2001 1:28:43 PM EST by saleen]
How do you carry your pistol? My guess is that it has one in the tube and a full magazine with the safety on. That's the way I'd carry my AR in my patrol car as well. My agency has approved .223 for patrol carbines, but has not finalized qualification procedures, nor shown any indication of it being a priority. I have been told that they want the supervisors to have bean bag guns first, and after thats finished the officers will be qualified with carbines. Prior to the new policy manual coming into effect, I was able to carry my 9mm MP-5A3 on duty. I tried several ways and finally settled on a full mag with the carrier group locked to the rear. I rode with in stuck behind the equipment bag in my front seat with the pistol grip exposed and the stock partially retractable. The times I did have to exit the vehicle with it, it was pretty fast into action. At least it was no slower than a shotgun. What length AR are you going to carry? If you opt to regiser one as an SBR, it should work fine in an arraingement like I used for my MP-5. The only difference would be that I would go ahead and close the bolt since the equipment bag will most likely trip the release anyway. Just leave it on safe and you should be fine. HTH Saleen
Link Posted: 3/3/2001 2:56:17 PM EST
I carry mine with bolt closed, chamber empty, full magazine in place. Our current policy says I have to keep it in the trunk. So I figure if I have time to get to it, bypassing the ready shotgun in the rack behind my seat, then I have time to rack the bolt. I don't trust any weapon which is going to sit for a prolonged time to stay in the same position that I left it, so cycling the action does a couple of things: It gives me a proper heads up for my mind set - It's time to get serious. I also know know that the rifle is now ready and that I'm not depending on a safety which may be holding back a trigger on an empty (but I thought it was loaded when I pulled the trigger!) chamber.
Link Posted: 3/3/2001 3:03:51 PM EST
Our Manual of Directives require that the chamber be empty. Not sure which agency you are going to but I bet they have specific requirements for carry. The nice thing about our Directives is that while we are required to qualify four times a year with our sidearm, if you chose to carry your long arm, you are to qualify monthly with it (with Department issued ammo).
Link Posted: 3/3/2001 3:40:52 PM EST
[Last Edit: 3/3/2001 3:50:42 PM EST by Striker]
Link Posted: 3/3/2001 3:58:35 PM EST
Depends - :) In country - Locked and Loaded , safety off, (watch that trigger ) :) On Patrol - Full Mag - safety on- rack, flip, Fire for effect :D
Link Posted: 3/3/2001 4:09:51 PM EST
Saleen...I carry my pistol(H & K USP 40) with one in the pipe, mag full, and safety off. Also, I will be carrying a Bushmaster 16" carbine version. I don't have a need for a SBR.
Link Posted: 3/3/2001 5:03:16 PM EST
Chamber empty, hammer at rest (which puts the selector in the fire position), secured in a rack bolted to the cage (between the front seats). One 20 round mag inserted with several 30's handy. Condition of carry is per dept. policy. Pool cars are only equipped with Mini 14 racks, so the AR has to go in the trunk. Luckily I have an assigned vehicle with the AR rack installed.
Link Posted: 3/3/2001 5:08:02 PM EST
Link Posted: 3/3/2001 5:12:48 PM EST
Our Dept authorizes AR's for patrol use also. I am lucky since I have an assigned car so I have an electronic gun rack on the cage roll bar so my AR is readily available. I carry a 30 round mag locked in, chamber empty, hammer down and safety off. Also have a spare 30 in a stock pouch. ****IMPORTANT****: The AR has a "floating" firing pin which means if the muzzle gets a good hit the round in the chamber could easily fire. Think of how hard a squad car can impact something in a collision. Do you also want a .223 round flying in the midst of that mess?
Link Posted: 3/3/2001 8:24:32 PM EST
Originally Posted By tray: Our Manual of Directives require that the chamber be empty. Not sure which agency you are going to but I bet they have specific requirements for carry. The nice thing about our Directives is that while we are required to qualify four times a year with our sidearm, if you chose to carry your long arm, you are to qualify monthly with it (with Department issued ammo).
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DPS?
Link Posted: 3/3/2001 9:09:10 PM EST
I am not in law inforcement. But on my way to Prescott last weekend I saw a Sheriffs patrol car with an AR-15 sitting behind the Sheriffs deputy. It was hanging on the cage behind him. It made me smile. [:)] Yanqui
Link Posted: 3/4/2001 4:48:48 AM EST
I would think your department will dictate how the weapon is to be loaded and secured in the vehicle. The two departments that I have worked for specified that the chamber be empty, magazine loaded, hammer down with the safety on. If an electrically controlled rack was not available the weapon was carried in the trunk. Insist that every long gun you carry in a patrol car has a sling. Once you remove it from the car you're married to it.
Link Posted: 3/4/2001 7:54:12 AM EST
Basic rule: Never have a round in the chamber unless you're in an active engagement area and the weapon is in your hands. Rounds in the chamber and the hammer cocked is how LEO's or others get killed. NEVER, I say again, NEVER, carry a firearm that has a concealed hammer with a round in the chamber unless you're out of the car and using it. What happens if your safety notch is a little worn and you go through a big pothole or a really rough road or you forget to apply the safety? You have a uncontrolled discharge. And there is no excuse or reason for an uncontrolled discharge in any firearm, moreso a duty arm. Carry it with a full mag, and empty pipe, in the shotgun type mount for the ar, some even fit pretty nicely in the shotgun clamp as it is, or with minor modifications. It takes about 1/2 second to pull the chargng handle, and if you think you may not have time to do that you need to reasses your necessity and training in carrying M16/ar rifles in general. Too many officers just seem to think it's "cool" to have an AR hanging in the window, it's a tool that will kill you or someone else if it is used incorrectly and if those utilizing that tool are not trained fully by competant training people the department is making a mistake in putting them, the AR's, on the street.
Link Posted: 3/4/2001 8:41:47 AM EST
I was at the ford dealership in Houston a couple of years ago and their was a Montgomery County Sherrif there geting his Mustang 5.0 Squade car serviced and low and behold there in the front seat layed his AR with a grenade launcher attached. This guy was serious about his job!!! Better go the speed limit!!!!
Link Posted: 3/4/2001 9:10:33 AM EST
Can anyone recommend a good over the cage rack for the AR? We had enough trouble getting authorized to carry them, that we don't dare leave them in plain view. Might scare some liberal and have letters about deputys carring machinguns! Then back to SWAT carring and the rest of us not. (I'm ex-SWAT, too damn old and beat up now days) Mine rides to work in an assault systems nylon case in the trunk. 20 rounder in the well, empty chamber, on safe. Then there are 8 30rounders in the bag, and a 300 rd PVC battlepack next to it.
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