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9/19/2017 7:27:10 PM
Posted: 6/27/2003 3:24:12 PM EDT
Just curious as to how such a small country with no apparent exports or industry can afford to exist. If you got rid of all the terrorists, it seems they would have a rather good quality of life going on. I know we give substantial military aid to Israel, but how do they afford everything else they have. Just wondering. Enlighten me.
Link Posted: 6/27/2003 3:26:23 PM EDT
Your tax dollars at work!
Link Posted: 6/27/2003 3:27:40 PM EDT
Ever hear of a country called the US? US Financial Aid To Israel: Figures, Facts, and Impact Summary Benefits to Israel of U.S. Aid Since 1949 (As of November 1, 1997) Foreign Aid Grants and Loans $74,157,600,000 Other U.S. Aid (12.2% of Foreign Aid) $9,047,227,200 Interest to Israel from Advanced Payments $1,650,000,000 Grand Total $84,854,827,200 Total Benefits per Israeli $14,630 Cost to U.S. Taxpayers of U.S. Aid to Israel Grand Total $84,854,827,200 Interest Costs Borne by U.S. $49,936,680,000 Total Cost to U.S. Taxpayers $134,791,507,200 Total Cost per Israeli $23,240
Link Posted: 6/27/2003 3:32:24 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 6/27/2003 3:34:45 PM EDT by raven]
You need serious enlightenment. Israel has a diverse economy that would be much more vibrant if it wasn't for their enemies trying to destroy them. First off, agriculture. This was Israel's economic mainstay when the zionists started settling. Israelis pioneered drip hydroponics, that allows the most efficient use of water for agriculture, very valuble in their climate. Second: Tourism. Religious, historical sites for Christians and Jews from all over the world. This alone is a multi-billion dollar industry. Third: High technology. Israel has a very strong hgih tech industry. Jews are smart, industrious, and have started many high tech companies, some of which are publicly traded in US markets. Checkpoint Software is the one that springs to mind. They also have a big military industry that specializes in upgrading the avionics of old Eastern-bloc aircraft. Israel was on its feet from agriculture, the Jewish diaspora, and diamond cutting/trading from the start. If anything hampered the Israeli economy up until the 1990's, it was that a large number of Zionists were also committed socialists who favored a command economy. It never began receiving US government aid on the scale its critics decry until the 1979 Camp David Accords.
Link Posted: 6/27/2003 3:33:52 PM EDT
[url]http://www.cia.gov/cia/publications/factbook/geos/is.html[/url] NsB
Link Posted: 6/27/2003 3:35:03 PM EDT
YOU NAZIS! You anti-semetic, Israel haters! Don't you know Israel is a [url=http://electronicintifada.net/v2/article1512.shtml]Democracy[/url]! [LOL]
Link Posted: 6/27/2003 3:35:13 PM EDT
Originally Posted By KODoc: Your tax dollars at work!
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Bingo.
Link Posted: 6/27/2003 3:45:19 PM EDT
Compare Israel to their neighbor, Jordan. A country with about the equivalent amount of natural resources, and same length of independence from Great Britain: [b]Jordan is a small Arab country with inadequate supplies of water and other natural resources such as oil. Debt, poverty, and unemployment are fundamental problems, but King ABDALLAH since assuming the throne in 1999 has undertaken some broad economic reforms in a long-term effort to improve living standards. Amman in the past three years has worked closely with the IMF, practiced careful monetary policy, and made significant headway with privatization. The government also has liberalized the trade regime sufficiently to secure Jordan's membership in the WTrO (2000), an association agreement with the EU (2000), and a free trade accord with US (2000). These measures have helped improve productivity and have put Jordan on the foreign investment map. The substantial trade deficit is covered by tourism receipts, worker remittances, and foreign assistance. Ongoing challenges include fiscal adjustment to reduce the budget deficit and broader investment incentives to promote job-creating ventures. GDP: purchasing power parity - $22.8 billion (2002 est.) GDP - per capita: purchasing power parity - $4,300 (2002 est.)[/b]
Link Posted: 6/27/2003 3:46:14 PM EDT
Thanks Titanium, Good info. didn't realize we gave so much aid to Israel. Thanks also to raven, very enlightening.
Link Posted: 6/27/2003 3:52:04 PM EDT
Originally Posted By ARgue: YOU NAZIS! You anti-semetic, Israel haters! Don't you know Israel is a [url=http://electronicintifada.net/v2/article1512.shtml]Democracy[/url]! [LOL]
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I love it when Arabs criticize Israeli democracy. How long has Mubarak been president? 20+ years, I believe. Jordan's a hereditary monarchy, Syria's a hereditary tyranny, Iraq was being groomed for another tyrannical dynasty. The Gulf States are all ruled by corrupt family rackets. Then we have jackholes like you, quoting Palestinaian propaganda sites, criticizing the quality of Israel's 50+ year old democracy? Why do you sympathize with such worthless, irredeemable people? Do you see something of yourself in them?
Link Posted: 6/27/2003 3:54:28 PM EDT
Originally Posted By raven:
Originally Posted By ARgue: YOU NAZIS! You anti-semetic, Israel haters! Don't you know Israel is a [url=http://electronicintifada.net/v2/article1512.shtml]Democracy[/url]! [LOL]
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I love it when Arabs criticize Israeli democracy. How long has Mubarak been president? 20+ years, I believe. Jordan's a hereditary monarchy, Syria's a hereditary tyranny, Iraq was being groomed for another tyrannical dynasty. The Gulf States are all ruled by corrupt family rackets. Then we have jackholes like you, quoting Palestinaian propaganda sites, criticizing the quality of Israel's 50+ year old democracy? Why do you sympathize with such worthless, irredeemable people? Do you see something of yourself in them?
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IBTL - I can see it coming already! Someone isn't capable of engaging in a discussion without throwing insults at another. [slap] TT
Link Posted: 6/27/2003 3:55:55 PM EDT
Originally Posted By raven:
Originally Posted By ARgue: YOU NAZIS! You anti-semetic, Israel haters! Don't you know Israel is a [url=http://electronicintifada.net/v2/article1512.shtml]Democracy[/url]! [LOL]
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I love it when Arabs criticize Israeli democracy. How long has Mubarak been president? 20+ years, I believe. Jordan's a hereditary monarchy, Syria's a hereditary tyranny, Iraq was being groomed for another tyrannical dynasty. The Gulf States are all ruled by corrupt family rackets. Then we have jackholes like you, quoting Palestinaian propaganda sites, criticizing the quality of Israel's 50+ year old democracy? Why do you sympathize with such worthless, irredeemable people? Do you see something of yourself in them?
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Propaganda?!?!? What greater purveyor of bullshit than the Israel Lobby?
Link Posted: 6/27/2003 3:56:33 PM EDT
Link Posted: 6/27/2003 3:58:24 PM EDT
Quit trying to hijack my post! You know who you are. Keep the propaganda to yourself please. thanks for all the serious replies.
Link Posted: 6/27/2003 3:59:52 PM EDT
Originally Posted By KODoc:
Originally Posted By raven:
Originally Posted By ARgue: YOU NAZIS! You anti-semetic, Israel haters! Don't you know Israel is a [url=http://electronicintifada.net/v2/article1512.shtml]Democracy[/url]! [LOL]
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I love it when Arabs criticize Israeli democracy. How long has Mubarak been president? 20+ years, I believe. Jordan's a hereditary monarchy, Syria's a hereditary tyranny, Iraq was being groomed for another tyrannical dynasty. The Gulf States are all ruled by corrupt family rackets. Then we have jackholes like you, quoting Palestinaian propaganda sites, criticizing the quality of Israel's 50+ year old democracy? Why do you sympathize with such worthless, irredeemable people? Do you see something of yourself in them?
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Propaganda?!?!? What greater purveyor of bullshit than the Israel Lobby?
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I'm not stating my positions or assertions on Israeli propaganda sites.
Link Posted: 6/27/2003 3:59:54 PM EDT
i believe Egypt,Israel and Jordan recieve the same amount of financial aid per yr. and Egypt and Jordon are still 3rd world countries.
Link Posted: 6/27/2003 4:04:55 PM EDT
Originally Posted By raven:
Originally Posted By ARgue: YOU NAZIS! You anti-semetic, Israel haters! Don't you know Israel is a [url=http://electronicintifada.net/v2/article1512.shtml]Democracy[/url]! [LOL]
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I love it when Arabs criticize Israeli democracy. How long has Mubarak been president? 20+ years, I believe. Jordan's a hereditary monarchy, Syria's a hereditary tyranny, Iraq was being groomed for another tyrannical dynasty. The Gulf States are all ruled by corrupt family rackets. Then we have jackholes like you, quoting Palestinaian propaganda sites, criticizing the quality of Israel's 50+ year old democracy? Why do you sympathize with such worthless, irredeemable people? Do you see something of yourself in them?
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First of all, the "Palestinian propaganda site" is simply publicizing the findings of the "Israel Democracy Institute (IDI), a non-partisan Israeli research institute founded in 1991 and based in Jerusalem, [which] has been studying the quality of Israeli democracy and how well it functions..." The results are very interesting. I suggest you check it out. Secondly, "Jordan's hereditary monarchy, Syria's a hereditary tyranny, Iraq [which] was being groomed for another tyrannical dynasty[, and] The Gulf States [which] are all ruled by corrupt family rackets" and all have something in common with Israel, i.e., they are all supported and kept in place by our gov and tax dollars.
Link Posted: 6/27/2003 4:06:44 PM EDT
Originally Posted By walttx: i believe Egypt,Israel and Jordan recieve the same amount of financial aid per yr. and Egypt and Jordon are still 3rd world countries.
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That is an incorrect assumption. Israel gets more than the next 10 countries combined.
Link Posted: 6/27/2003 4:09:56 PM EDT
Originally Posted By ARgue: Secondly, "Jordan's hereditary monarchy, Syria's a hereditary tyranny, Iraq [which] was being groomed for another tyrannical dynasty[, and] The Gulf States [which] are all ruled by corrupt family rackets" and all have something in common with Israel, i.e., they are all supported and kept in place by our gov and tax dollars.
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Right. We have kept Saddam Hussein in place by our government and tax dollars. Syria's rule is maintained by the United States? News to me.
Link Posted: 6/27/2003 4:12:34 PM EDT
Originally Posted By fireguy: Quit trying to hijack my post! You know who you are. Keep the propaganda to yourself please. thanks for all the serious replies.
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Sorry, fireguy, I was just trying to preempt any name calling by uttering the most popular kneejerk responses before anyone else could, in an attempt to keep the discussion moving forward. So far, I've seen some good info from TT, Raven and Jarhead_22. (KODoc, too)
Link Posted: 6/27/2003 4:26:03 PM EDT
Link Posted: 6/27/2003 4:32:24 PM EDT
Originally Posted By ARgue:
Originally Posted By walttx: i believe Egypt,Israel and Jordan recieve the same amount of financial aid per yr. and Egypt and Jordon are still 3rd world countries.
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That is an incorrect assumption. Israel gets more than the next 10 countries combined.
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Bullshit! Do some independent research on depend on Arafat for your info.
Link Posted: 6/27/2003 4:34:33 PM EDT
Virtually all US aid to Israel is spent either directly on the military or on industry and infrastructure that support the military. It is sad that they have such enormous military and police expenses. The country itself is a small version of California. Instant Eden-just add water. If it werent for the fighting they could be for Europe what Southern California or Florida are to American agriculture. Year round vegtables and fruit. And, like California, they have a vibrant high tech industry as well as their agriculture. If it werent for the Arabs they would be making a comfortable living for themselves without US aid.
Link Posted: 6/27/2003 4:39:46 PM EDT
Those financial figures are obviously propaganda, everyone knows there is NO "Zionist" lobby in Washington!! [rolleyes]
Link Posted: 6/27/2003 4:40:03 PM EDT
can anyone site a reliable source showing exactly which countries are receiving US financial aid and how much they are receiving?
Link Posted: 6/27/2003 4:53:50 PM EDT
Originally Posted By fireguy: can anyone site a reliable source showing exactly which countries are receiving US financial aid and how much they are receiving?
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For 2002: Senate Gives Final Passage to 2002 Foreign Aid Bill (Legislation cleared for signature by president) (670) By Kathryn McConnell Washington File Staff Writer Washington -- The Senate has passed by voice vote a $15,400 million bill for foreign aid and other international programs in fiscal year 2002, which began October 1. The conference-cleared measure passed in the Senate December 20 had won approval in the House of Representatives 357-66 the previous day. It now goes to President Bush for signature. The bill would relax restrictions on aid to Azerbaijan to allow U.S. military and intelligence agencies to work more closely with the mostly Muslim state. It would suspend drug-trafficking penalties to make it easier for the Bush administration to work with Central Asian nations. It includes $446.5 million for international family planning, including $34 million for the U.N. Population Fund, an increase of $9 million. Opponents had objected to the UNFPA funding, arguing the agency's programs support abortions in China. The bill, $403 million over last year's total, would also provide: -- $2,239.5 million in economic support including $720 million for Israel, $655 million of Egypt, $150 million for Jordan, $25 million for East Timor, $12 million for Mongolia and $10 million to the National Democratic Alliance of Sudan. -- $3,674 million in military assistance, including $2,040 million for Israel, $1,300 million for Egypt and $75 million for Jordan. -- $140 million for peacekeeping operations. -- $318.5 million for non-proliferation anti-terrorism and de-mining programs. -- $75 million to provide military training to civilians. -- $235 million for debt restructuring. -- $615 million for assistance for Eastern Europe and the Baltic States. -- $795.5 million for the independent states of the former Soviet Union of which $180 million will be for Ukraine and $90 million each for Armenia and Georgia. The measure says funds may be withheld from Russia until the president determines the country has terminated arrangements to provide Iran with nuclear-related technology or training, is cooperating with international efforts to investigate war crimes in Chechnya and is providing nongovernmental organizations (NGOs) access to internally displaced persons in Chechnya. -- $275 million for the Peace Corps. -- $727.3 million for the Export-Import Bank for loans, loan guarantees and tied-aid grants through fiscal year 2005. -- $50 million for the Trade and Development Agency (TDA). -- $38.6 million for the Overseas Private Investment Corporation (OPIC) to carry out credit and insurance programs. -- $1,430 million for child survival and health programs, $371 million more than in fiscal year 2001 and $443 million more than the administration's request. -- $435 million for HIV/AIDS programs, $160 million more than in 2001. -- $660 million for counter-narcotics operations in Latin America, $71 million less than the president's request. -- $735 million for migration and refugee assistance. -- $6 million to provide technical assistance. -- $30 million for biotechnology research and development. --- $5 million to reintegrate child-soldiers and other war affected youth in Central Asia. -- $10 million for programs aimed at stopping trafficking in persons. -- $295 million to protect tropical forests and biodiversity and to promote the sustainable use of natural resources. -- $109.5 million for the U.S. contribution to the Global Environment Facility. -- $775 million for payment to the International Development Association. -- $35.8 million for the European Bank for Reconstruction and Development, $103 million for the Asian Development Fund, $20 million for the Inter-American Investment Corporation and $5.1 million for the African Development Bank. -- $218 million for the United Nations Environment Program and $6 million for the U.N.'s World Food Program. -- $16.5 million for the African Development Fund and $13.1 million for the Inter-American Fund. -- $135 million in economic support for Indonesia, $15 million for projects aimed at the reunification of Cyprus, $35 million for education support for Lebanon and $6.5 million to support democracy and humanitarian activities in Burma and $5 million for Laos. -- $52.5 million to support countries in transition to democracy and countries in crisis. (The Washington File is a product of the Office of International Information Programs, U.S. Department of State. Web site: http://usinfo.state.gov) [url]http://usembassy-australia.state.gov/hyper/2001/1221/epf511.htm[/url]
Link Posted: 6/27/2003 4:54:13 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 6/27/2003 5:34:55 PM EDT by ARgue]
Originally Posted By LARRYG: Bullshit! Do some independent research on depend on Arafat for your info.
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Ummm.. yeah. Airfart gets more $$$ than Israel. [rolleyes] Were talkin' millions vs. Billions... C'mon. In addition to the Billions in military and financial aid, (and unlike other countries, Israel gets its US aid in one chunk at the beginning of the distribution year, instead of quarterly installments. This allows Israel to further make interest on that money over other aid-receiving countries!) Israel gets [url=http://www.us-israel.org/jsource/US-Israel/Loan_Guarantees_for_Israel.html]Loan Guarantees[/url] which are just forgiven, meaning, they're just another direct hand out, in disguise. I'm not trying to hijack. What most have stated about Israel's economy and the aid we give them is correct. I am only addressing those who think we give "more" money to other countries (or any combination of countries.) [Edited to say: Raven's source puts official Israeli aid at $2760mil vs. Egypt/Jordanian aid at $2180mil. And Fireguy's numbers put Egypt/Jordanian aid at $2,308,814,000 and Israel's at $3,000,000,000. (and that's just the official 'aid' numbers, not including the loans, Israeli bonds, etc.) Again, if you support your tax dollars going to Israel, for whatever reason, that's fine. Just don't kid yourself into believing that any other other countries (or combinations of other countries) get [i]more[/i] of your tax doallars than Israel.]
Link Posted: 6/27/2003 5:00:57 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 6/28/2003 4:12:56 AM EDT by fireguy]
Originally Posted By fireguy: can anyone site a reliable source showing exactly which countries are receiving US financial aid and how much they are receiving?
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found something that shows US aid, also very interesting UN info. [img]http://us.f1.yahoofs.com/users/69460f7f/bc/__hr_foreign+aid.gif?bcxnY_.AEN3kkDqa[/img]
Link Posted: 6/27/2003 6:18:18 PM EDT
Originally Posted By ARgue: Were talkin' millions vs. Billions... C'mon. In addition to the Billions in military and financial aid, (and unlike other countries, Israel gets its US aid in one chunk at the beginning of the distribution year, instead of quarterly installments. This allows Israel to further make interest on that money over other aid-receiving countries!) Israel gets [url=http://www.us-israel.org/jsource/US-Israel/Loan_Guarantees_for_Israel.html]Loan Guarantees[/url] which are just forgiven, meaning, they're just another direct hand out, in disguise.
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Uh, I thought that israel had "god's chosen people". If that is the case, they don't need any of the U.S. tax dollars to exist.
Link Posted: 6/28/2003 1:02:21 AM EDT
in a word .....DIAMONDS diamond trade is HUGE in israel, all the best diamond cutters are there. prolly most of the worlds diamonds are imported there in a raw form, cut, evaluated, and shipped out.
Link Posted: 6/28/2003 2:56:40 AM EDT
Originally Posted By Imbroglio:
Originally Posted By ARgue: Were talkin' millions vs. Billions... C'mon. In addition to the Billions in military and financial aid, (and unlike other countries, Israel gets its US aid in one chunk at the beginning of the distribution year, instead of quarterly installments. This allows Israel to further make interest on that money over other aid-receiving countries!) Israel gets [url=http://www.us-israel.org/jsource/US-Israel/Loan_Guarantees_for_Israel.html]Loan Guarantees[/url] which are just forgiven, meaning, they're just another direct hand out, in disguise.
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Uh, I thought that israel had "god's chosen people". If that is the case, they don't need any of the U.S. tax dollars to exist.
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LMFAO! [LOL] Also very insightful.
Link Posted: 6/28/2003 3:08:11 AM EDT
Insightful my ass. For being "god's chosen people", Hebrews have endured an incredible amount of shit. Being god's chosen people has never once in their entire history entailed living on easy street. Fucking morons.
Link Posted: 6/28/2003 4:02:45 AM EDT
I'm one of god's children, too.. where the hell is my check? I say cut em loose and have em fend for themselves. We could use $1B at home yearly. Same goes for Egypt, Jordan, and everyone else. These countries are interested in themselves, not us. Put the US first.
Link Posted: 6/28/2003 4:11:18 AM EDT
Originally Posted By Not_A_Llama: I'm one of god's children, too.. where the hell is my check? I say cut em loose and have em fend for themselves. We could use $1B at home yearly. Same goes for Egypt, Jordan, and everyone else. These countries are interested in themselves, not us. Put the US first.
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Exactly. The reason Isreal has the problems they do is that they are an artificially propped up country. Just like any person, or group of persons, who cannot exist without outside help, they are never going to be stable. I say pull the plug on them and everyone else over there and let them fight it out. We shoulde be fighting off any outside influences, not taking sides in the fight. I had a friend when I was younger, and he and I were always getting into fights, whether with each other or with other kids around the neighborhood. Whenever his dad saw a fight, he simply watched over it, kept he other kids from interfering, and let whoever was fighting settle their differences. The US should be taking the same role my friend's dad did.
Link Posted: 6/28/2003 3:10:30 PM EDT
Originally Posted By norman74:
Originally Posted By Not_A_Llama: I'm one of god's children, too.. where the hell is my check? I say cut em loose and have em fend for themselves. We could use $1B at home yearly. Same goes for Egypt, Jordan, and everyone else. These countries are interested in themselves, not us. Put the US first.
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Exactly. The reason Isreal has the problems they do is that they are an artificially propped up country. Just like any person, or group of persons, who cannot exist without outside help, they are never going to be stable. I say pull the plug on them and everyone else over there and let them fight it out. We shoulde be fighting off any outside influences, not taking sides in the fight. I had a friend when I was younger, and he and I were always getting into fights, whether with each other or with other kids around the neighborhood. Whenever his dad saw a fight, he simply watched over it, kept he other kids from interfering, and let whoever was fighting settle their differences. The US should be taking the same role my friend's dad did.
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[conditioned response] You god damn nazi's! [/conditioned response] That makes perfect sense. Why the hell we should be responsible for propping up a country because its residents "have had a hard time" is beyond me.
Link Posted: 6/28/2003 3:29:56 PM EDT
Motorola has a huge manufacturing plant over there. They export a boatload of commercial two-way radio, voice, and data gear. Bob
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