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Posted: 5/31/2001 10:58:15 AM EST
Ok, I know I am walking a fine line with this topic, but I really want to know. I live in PA where we are not required to register rifles, shotguns or handguns. (taken from NRA site on PA laws) Anyone in PA already knows that as soon as you want to purchase a weapon a registration form and pen are slapped on the counter for you. Now, without starting a registration arguement; can I just say "No thanks" to the staff and not register without a problem? Do you think that I may not get my purchase or that they might be a little pissed? Anyone done this? I am just worried about trying this without knowing if I am going to have to defend my actions. Thanks!
Link Posted: 5/31/2001 11:02:48 AM EST
Are you talking about the NICS check? That is required or they can't sell it to you. It isn't a registration, the FBI throws it away after 90 days(supposedly)
Link Posted: 5/31/2001 11:09:45 AM EST
Here is PA, you must also fill out paperwork for the PA State Police. Refusing either that or NICS will nix your purchase. The State Police form is clearly illegal and is being contested by some members of the state legislature. About the only reisistance you can put up is to refuse to show your social security number. They have it anyway.
Link Posted: 5/31/2001 11:10:55 AM EST
So maybe I am totally talking about the wrong thing here. I have only ever purchased 2 rifles (all the rest were my parents') I thought the NICS check was what was called in. I am talking about filling out the form. Is this part of NICS too? My last rifle I purchased the guy started talking about how he thought registration was important because sometimes they recall firearms. He did this as I filled out the form so I figured thats what the form was. I may be confused, I don't have a lot of experience here yet.
Link Posted: 5/31/2001 11:11:31 AM EST
Or are you talking about the yellow BATF form 4473 that is a FEDERAL requirement that you fill out prior to the NICS check? The dealer you purchase from is required to keep these, and in the event he goes out of business, he has to forward them to the BATF. Yes, this is a [i]form[/i] of registration (it can be used to identify someone who has purchased one or more firearms) but with private party transactions (now under attack under cover of the "gunshow loophole") it doesn't really have more meaning than that. Anyway, it isn't a STATE registration - it's Federal. [sniper]
Link Posted: 5/31/2001 11:15:27 AM EST
[Last Edit: 5/31/2001 11:18:31 AM EST by Phantom68c]
ATF 4473 is what I am talking about (I just found that sheet we were supposed to read in my old box) So basically I can't say no to filling out this form of registration becuase it is federal. I thought it was a state form originally. Well I guess its good that my state doesn't require registration (sarcasm)...
Link Posted: 5/31/2001 11:15:29 AM EST
hg112 is exactly right. They won't get pissed but they can't sell you a weapon if you don't do the form. Dealers don't give you those forms to fill out because we have nothing better to do with our time; we do it because its the law. ...and if you're thinking of lying on the forms to get a gun, just remember its a felony and can get you a five year all expense paid vaccation at Bubba's Federal Butt Pirate Vaseline Festival.
Link Posted: 5/31/2001 11:23:46 AM EST
I would never lie on one of those forms. Thats just pushing it a little too far. I was just wondering because I heard that PA has been "illegally" registering weapons when they really aren't allowed to. I guess it doesn't matter though, I don't have anything to hide so I am not worried yet. I was just interested. Thanks for the help!
Link Posted: 5/31/2001 11:27:17 AM EST
I know a few people that won't but a gun from a dealer because of the NICS check. I don't worry about it. As far as the gov't knows you bought the gun and sold it to someone else the next day. How are they going to confiscate a gun that you don't have? [;)]
Link Posted: 5/31/2001 11:30:30 AM EST
3 words: private party sale.
Link Posted: 5/31/2001 12:52:36 PM EST
3 words: private party sale.
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3 more words: illegal in PA Actually I'm not 100% sure, but from what I understand all private party sales in PA must still go through a NICS check.
Link Posted: 5/31/2001 12:52:45 PM EST
On the NICS, they don't submit the serial number on the background check. As was stated, the form stays with the dealer. Now a mysterious fire could eliminate those in case of national consfication. It would probably happen a lot. As for recalls, your warranty card that you send in is supposed to take care of that. But hey, that is registration also if you listen to some people. "Mr. agent, I went deep sea fishing and all my guns fell overboard. Oh, I had them with me in case a shark attacked."
Link Posted: 5/31/2001 4:52:55 PM EST
One thing in NY because we are so heavily regulated I don't have to do the nics check cause of my pistol license. Rifle,shotgun and handguns walk in walk out. Fill out yellow paper show license and go home. I get 1 perk from being very restricted. Handguns you have to do some running around to police chief but can be done within 1 or 2 hours total. No 3day wait no 5 day wait no worry about computers down. Like I said I get 1 perk.
Link Posted: 5/31/2001 5:19:11 PM EST
Phantom68c, FYI: Please read Allege handgun control master plan for TOTAL Global Gun Confiscation /Citizen Dis-Armament. [url]www.RKBA.org/antis/hci-master[/url] Registration is their Pre-Text for Confiscation. ^ [url]www.DigitalAngel.net/da_patent/index.htm[/url] Never Again, Never Forget Seek the Truth Liberate Your Mind FIXED BAYONETS VX
Link Posted: 5/31/2001 6:23:21 PM EST
How do you say no? "N -O", what part of that don't you understand?
Link Posted: 5/31/2001 7:20:48 PM EST
Originally Posted By oldeschool:How do you say no? "N -O", what part of that don't you understand?
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Here here!! that's what I was thinking![:)]
Link Posted: 5/31/2001 9:16:50 PM EST
a five year all expense paid vaccation at Bubba's Federal Butt Pirate Vaseline Festival.
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Hey shaggy, quit lying! They don't allow Vaseline in Federal Prison! [sex]
Link Posted: 6/1/2001 4:51:05 AM EST
[Last Edit: 6/1/2001 4:49:16 AM EST by M4A3]
Originally Posted By dnra:
Originally Posted By hg112: Are you talking about the NICS check? That is required or they can't sell it to you. It isn't a registration, the FBI throws it away after 90 days(supposedly)
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....[size=5]R_I_G_H_T[[moon]
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My thoughts exactly! Why would they have these laws and then toss the records after 90 days?
Link Posted: 6/1/2001 6:26:17 AM EST
Hey Phantom, In PA a long gun only requires the BATF 4473 form. The state requires you to fill out an additional form for a handgun. You get to keep a copy of this. I just had to deal with this last week when I got my 92FS. My FFL also required me to have the seller ship from an FFL. I didn't think this was needed but he said it was a state law. Some BS about guaranteeing the handgun's origin. Anyway, I would consider this a registration of handguns regardless of what the NRA site says. The form has the model, serial # and other pertinent info and there's a copy for you, the FFL, and the State.
Link Posted: 6/1/2001 6:29:25 AM EST
[moon] [%(] "MOLON LABE"
Link Posted: 6/2/2001 12:17:43 PM EST
It is true that there are no more private-party transfers allowed in PA. The State Police are the group that is keeping the illegal registration roles.
Link Posted: 6/2/2001 12:37:47 PM EST
what the cov't don't know cannot hurt ne. freedom at all cost....
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