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9/22/2017 12:11:25 AM
Posted: 8/6/2005 7:17:52 PM EDT
Really. How did the Ruskie sub hit their own antennae? They must have known where it was.
Link Posted: 8/6/2005 7:19:15 PM EDT
Hell, they can't keep track of their own nukes. What makes you think a measly antenna matters?
Link Posted: 8/6/2005 7:28:33 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/6/2005 7:29:51 PM EDT by GarethB]

Originally Posted By captainpooby:
Really. How did the Ruskie sub hit their own antennae? They must have known where it was.



What antennae? Didn't the reports say the sub got snagged on fishing nets?

The only type of antennae I can think of that could foul a sub is a sonar towed array (it's a long cable with special underwater microphones in it. It's pulled behind the sub to increase the sensitivity of the passive sonar. Surface ships can have them as well) or ELF (extremely low frequency radio) antennae, but the reports I've heard is that the sub is a small deep sea model with a crew of 7. Towed arrays are normal for combat subs but not small rescue/research subs.
Link Posted: 8/6/2005 7:32:50 PM EDT
Lets make fun of them when they are breathing fresh air.
Link Posted: 8/6/2005 7:34:04 PM EDT
I was wondering the same thing. They don't have a great submarine track record do they.


Sgat1r5
Link Posted: 8/6/2005 7:34:06 PM EDT
Not a submariner, so all I know is what I've read.

Based on what I've read, its possible to turn tight enough to tangle or otherwise hit your own towed array.

Likewise, forgetting to reel it in and then having to back up might also cause them to tangle with their own towed array.

But I thought the research sub had tangled on a net, not its own towed array?
Link Posted: 8/6/2005 7:35:29 PM EDT

Originally Posted By captainpooby:
Really. How did the Ruskie sub hit their own antennae? They must have known where it was.



Do a tight turn?

Reverse engines?

I would imagine it could be done.
Link Posted: 8/6/2005 7:35:47 PM EDT
Cant they do an emergeny ascent? You know, the whole "Blow ballast" type thing?
How does getting your prop tangled prevent you from going up and down??
Link Posted: 8/6/2005 7:36:29 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/6/2005 7:36:43 PM EDT by MachinegunManiac]
I guess all that we needed during the Cold War were fishing boats when it came to submarine warfare.

Hopefully the Chinese subs are based on Russian design.
Link Posted: 8/6/2005 7:37:05 PM EDT

Originally Posted By GarethB:

Originally Posted By captainpooby:
Really. How did the Ruskie sub hit their own antennae? They must have known where it was.



What antennae? Didn't the reports say the sub got snagged on fishing nets?The only type of antennae I can think of that could foul a sub is a sonar towed array (it's a long cable with special underwater microphones in it. It's pulled behind the sub to increase the sensitivity of the passive sonar. Surface ships can have them as well) or ELF (extremely low frequency radio) antennae, but the reports I've heard is that the sub is a small deep sea model with a crew of 7. Towed arrays are normal for combat subs but not small rescue/research subs.



That's what the reports said but they are stuck on their own sub detection antennae.
Link Posted: 8/6/2005 7:50:13 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Max_Mike:

Originally Posted By captainpooby:
Really. How did the Ruskie sub hit their own antennae? They must have known where it was.



Do a tight turn?

Reverse engines?

I would imagine it could be done.



They did a Crazy Ivan. . . .
Link Posted: 8/6/2005 7:57:43 PM EDT
How could that prevent them from surfacing unless they screwed up the dive planes? All subs sink and float using ballast of water, if their screws are tangled than then wouldnt be able to go anywhere but up and down.
Link Posted: 8/6/2005 7:58:35 PM EDT
i think it some type of permant antenna that is used to track enemy vessels around russia.it is anchor to the bottom of the ocean with 60 ton concrete anchors.
Link Posted: 8/6/2005 8:01:46 PM EDT

Originally Posted By MachinegunManiac:
I guess all that we needed during the Cold War were fishing boats when it came to submarine warfare.

Hopefully the Chinese subs are based on Russian design.



I think they bought a few from the French.
Link Posted: 8/6/2005 8:13:08 PM EDT
Are they getting those dudes out, or what? I haven't watched TV lately.
Link Posted: 8/6/2005 8:13:11 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/6/2005 8:14:00 PM EDT by sixgunsblazing]

Originally Posted By hanau:
i think it some type of permant antenna that is used to track enemy vessels around russia.it is anchor to the bottom of the ocean with 60 ton concrete anchors.



That's what yahoo news is saying..


ETA:subs up and all seven are alive
Link Posted: 8/6/2005 8:13:13 PM EDT
It's on the surface now. Brit sub with US personel got it loose.
Link Posted: 8/6/2005 8:15:48 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Attman:
It's on the surface now. Brit sub with US personel got it loose.



Thank God!
Link Posted: 8/6/2005 8:20:13 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Attman:
It's on the surface now. Brit sub owned, US designed and constructed ROV with US personel got it loose.




It is a United States Navy designed remotely operated vehicle. Even if it uses an Allstrom Schilling manipulator, it is still a USN designed ROV.


Link Posted: 8/6/2005 8:20:21 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Attman:
It's on the surface now. Brit sub with US personel got it loose.

Link Posted: 8/6/2005 8:24:50 PM EDT

Originally Posted By hanau: i think it some type of permant antenna that is used to track enemy vessels around russia.it is anchor to the bottom of the ocean with 60 ton concrete anchors.
Must be a pretty big antenna. I guess it must be net-like to catch that sub, right? I've glanced at the animations on TV, but I haven't seen a pic of the real thing.
Link Posted: 8/6/2005 8:35:26 PM EDT
Water doesn't carry RF well. Low freq is the key and this requires a long antenna.

Unlikely as this was a rescue sub. I bet they got tangled in sub nets or entangled in a subsea acoustical tracking array that they were working on...after Pollard et al let our subsea surveilence operational secrets out, Russia has been trying to prevent such a drop.

Link Posted: 8/6/2005 8:37:38 PM EDT

They did a Crazy Ivan. . . .
He must've done it at the top of the hour, that's why he got tangled.
Link Posted: 8/6/2005 8:39:22 PM EDT
Sounds like they got really luck after one hummer of a dumb manuver.
Link Posted: 8/6/2005 8:40:11 PM EDT
The Ruskies owe the USA and the UK a big debt of gratitude.
Link Posted: 8/6/2005 8:47:27 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Keith_J:

Originally Posted By Attman:
It's on the surface now. Brit sub owned, US designed and constructed ROV with US personel got it loose.






That is my understanding too.
Link Posted: 8/6/2005 8:49:44 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/6/2005 8:51:18 PM EDT by Max_Mike]

Originally Posted By warlord:
The Ruskies owe the USA and the UK a big debt of gratitude.



Naw, just read this BBC report... apparently the US was not involved.

news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/europe/4128614.stm


Russian submarine and crew saved
The unmanned Scorpio craft helped free the vessel

A Russian mini-submarine stranded for three days beneath the Pacific Ocean has been brought to the surface after an international rescue effort.

The seven-man crew, who had faced low temperatures and dwindling oxygen, are all alive and were able to climb out of their submarine unaided.

The vessel, trapped 190m (620 ft) down, surfaced at 1626 (0326 GMT).

A British underwater robot helped rescue the craft, slicing through nets and debris entangling the submarine.

Russian military medics were on standby to treat the men, who had faced temperatures as low as 6C (43F) and a faltering oxygen supply.

Pinned to seabed

Senior navy official Vladimir Pepelayayev said all the men were in a satisfactory condition, according to the news agency Interfax.

The British Scorpio craft had been working for several hours to cut the vessel free of the debris pinning it to the seabed off the Kamchatka peninsula.

Initial reports said the vessel was trapped in vast fishing nets but later it emerged that the sub may have also been snagged by an underwater antenna, said to be part of a coastal monitoring system.

The sub's very heavy anchors also hampered rescue efforts.

The Russian Priz submersible - itself a rescue vehicle - was on a training exercise when it became trapped underwater on Thursday.

Earlier Russian efforts to rescue the sub's crew, which included looping a cable onto the vessel to drag it to higher waters, had failed.

The BBC's Sarah Rainsford in Moscow says the rescue is something few in Russia had dared hope for.

For many this episode revived memories of the sinking of the Kursk submarine almost exactly five years ago, when all 118 men on board died.

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