How Do We "Fix" the Refugee Problem?

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[ARCHIVED THREAD] - How Do We "Fix" the Refugee Problem? (Page 1 of 2)

Posted: 9/11/2005 3:08:22 PM EDT

Several threads have touched on this subject, but I want input on another angle.

One poster links to a story of women using the $2,000 Debit Card to purchase a designer purse. Other stories abound.

If anyone truly thinks that throwing money at these people is going to "fix" the problem, they are dreaming.

You could give all of them a million bucks, and in a year or so, they would be broke and on welfare again, or dead from a drug overdose.

Money is not their problem and giving them money isn't going to fix it.

And, before someone soils this thread, this is not about Race. The vast majority of the New Orleans folks are black, but this is not a race issue.

It is an "Entitlement" issue. And that covers all races.

The US has raised a generation of folks that think that they are "entitled" to certain things. The government needs to "look out for them" and "take care of them", and they are entitled to welfare so that they can sit on their butts and drink Heiniken.

I don't know all the answers, but I know part of the solution.

Welfare ought to stop. Period.

If someone wants money, they should have to work for it. If they are "unable" to do hard labor, then some agency should find them jobs that they can do with their limited physical capacity. If people are suffering from a natural catastrophy like this flood, good people should help them get back on their feet. But they should work for the help.

At a local shelter near here, they are asking for helpers to clean up the place and do light work. What about all those folks sitting on the cots and mashing their butts? Why can't they do something to earn the food they are given?

This wonderful country was founded by a self-reliant folk that asked only for freedom to be left alone to work for themselves.

We have seen many degenerate into believers in "Entitlements". We must take action before it is too late.

Okay, I've said my piece. Am I wrong?

(Please keep it within the COC. Thanks.)

Posted: 9/11/2005 3:09:27 PM EDT

[#1]

Workfare.

Posted: 9/11/2005 3:09:32 PM EDT

[#2]

quick solution? Start a "refugee of truth" test.......

Posted: 9/11/2005 3:10:31 PM EDT

[#3]

Quoted:
quick solution? Start a "refugee of truth" test.......

Already rejected that one. They won't fit in the box.

Posted: 9/11/2005 3:20:44 PM EDT

[#4]

No you are not wrong,
the only way you can fix the problem is to quit giving out free(gov) money and make those people work.

Posted: 9/11/2005 3:20:56 PM EDT

[#5]

Quoted:
Several threads have touched on this subject, but I want input on another angle.

One poster links to a story of women using the $2,000 Debit Card to purchase a designer purse. Other stories abound.

If anyone truly thinks that throwing money at these people is going to "fix" the problem, they are dreaming.

You could give all of them a million bucks, and in a year or so, they would be broke and on welfare again, or dead from a drug overdose.

Money is not their problem and giving them money isn't going to fix it.

And, before someone soils this thread, this is not about Race. The vast majority of the New Orleans folks are black, but this is not a race issue.

It is an "Entitlement" issue. And that covers all races.

The US has raised a generation of folks that think that they are "entitled" to certain things. The government needs to "look out for them" and "take care of them", and they are entitled to welfare so that they can sit on their butts and drink Heiniken.

I don't know all the answers, but I know part of the solution.

Welfare ought to stop. Period.

If someone wants money, they should have to work for it. If they are "unable" to do hard labor, then some agency should find them jobs that they can do with their limited physical capacity. If people are suffering from a natural catastrophy like this flood, good people should help them get back on their feet. But they should work for the help.

At a local shelter near here, they are asking for helpers to clean up the place and do light work. What about all those folks sitting on the cots and mashing their butts? Why can't they do something to earn the food they are given?

This wonderful country was founded by a self-reliant folk that asked only for freedom to be left alone to work for themselves.

We have seen many degenerate into believers in "Entitlements". We must take action before it is too late.

Okay, I've said my piece. Am I wrong?

(Please keep it within the COC. Thanks.)

Amen ! and well said . I think there will always be people that feel "Entitled" to something from the goberment.

Posted: 9/11/2005 3:22:41 PM EDT

[#6]

End Welfare.

Next problem?

Posted: 9/11/2005 3:22:54 PM EDT

[#7]

Give them more money!

Posted: 9/11/2005 3:24:17 PM EDT

[#8]

Quoted:
Quoted:
quick solution? Start a "refugee of truth" test.......

Already rejected that one. They won't fit in the box.

Two words: BIGGER BOX

Posted: 9/11/2005 3:24:49 PM EDT

[#9]

What are you going to say to the Michael Moore groupies, when they try to suggest that making poor people go to work fuels the cycle of violence?

Posted: 9/11/2005 3:36:20 PM EDT

[#10]

Zyklon-B

Posted: 9/11/2005 3:38:54 PM EDT

[#11]

Quoted:
What are you going to say to the Michael Moore groupies, when they try to suggest that making poor people go to work fuels the cycle of violence?

As senseless as this statement is, it will surely be made by liberals.

They don't understand that work makes people proud of themsleves.

They presently have nothing to be proud of. That could change.

Posted: 9/11/2005 3:42:17 PM EDT

[#12]

Quoted:
Quoted:
What are you going to say to the Michael Moore groupies, when they try to suggest that making poor people go to work fuels the cycle of violence?

As senseless as this statement is, it will surely be made by liberals.

They don't understand that work makes people proud of themsleves.

They presently have nothing to be proud of. That could change.

You are quite right that it will be made by liberals.
Expounding: Making single parents leave their kids and go to work leaves them without guidance, at which time they get into a LOT of trouble.

Posted: 9/11/2005 3:44:39 PM EDT

[#13]

I hate to say it, but with the current bias, it's not fixable.

We have created a permanant underclass, that expects, nay DEMANDS that they are entitled to a paycheck for doing nothing from the cradle to the grave.

I fear that the America that our forefathers dreamed of then crafted is a thing of the past

echo6

Posted: 9/11/2005 3:45:58 PM EDT

[#14]

I wish you would concentrate more on how to fix the Illegal Immigrant problem and how to advance the position of our own citizens.

Posted: 9/11/2005 3:48:06 PM EDT

[#15]

Quoted:
I wish you would concentrate more on how to fix the Illegal Immigrant problem and how to advance the position of our own citizens.

How to advance the position of our citizens is a decision best left to each one of them, wouldn't you say?

Posted: 9/11/2005 3:48:09 PM EDT

[#16]

Quoted:

You could give all of them a million bucks, and in a year or so, they would be broke and on welfare again, or dead from a drug overdose.

At least they would have a Benz parked in front of their project.

Posted: 9/11/2005 3:48:21 PM EDT

[#17]

Quoted:
I hate to say it, but with the current bias, it's not fixable.

We have created a permanant underclass, that expects, nay DEMANDS that they are entitled to a paycheck for doing nothing from the cradle to the grave.

I fear that the America that our forefathers dreamed of then crafted is a thing of the past

echo6

I agree. The funny thing is hearing guys on this board talk about revolution or whatever when they try to take our guns, but the reality is these people would revolt far sooner if we cut off the welfare. Bet on it.

Posted: 9/11/2005 3:51:14 PM EDT

[#18]

my grandparents house was built in the 20-30's under a national work project designed to put men to work during the depression. the houses were built and then sold to the public at the governments cost. at that time 4500 for new home.

today they are given housing, food, medical for free. no need to repay society for it. that needs to stop. i have ZERO problem giving someone on hard times a helping hand so long as they are trying to improve.

want to sit around and not work? fine, starve. we will have a city worker that HAS A JOB come scrpae your rotted lazy corpse off the street so i can drive to my job.

Posted: 9/11/2005 3:51:17 PM EDT

[#19]

One Word: Sterilization

Posted: 9/11/2005 3:51:26 PM EDT

[#20]

Quoted:
Quoted:
I hate to say it, but with the current bias, it's not fixable.

We have created a permanant underclass, that expects, nay DEMANDS that they are entitled to a paycheck for doing nothing from the cradle to the grave.

I fear that the America that our forefathers dreamed of then crafted is a thing of the past

echo6

I agree. The funny thing is hearing guys on this board talk about revolution or whatever when they try to take our guns, but the reality is these people would revolt far sooner if we cut off the welfare. Bet on it.

People lament the influence of money in our culture, mainly because they do not understand how it works for bad and good.
What kind of revolution would you see from the former welfare slaves? Certainly none nearly so eloquent and effective as the American Revolution.

Posted: 9/11/2005 3:55:22 PM EDT

[#21]

the welfare rats will not revolt. new orleans proved that.

they will sit at home starving to death waiting on someone to deliver them a cheeseburger and super size coke.

fuck 'em. it would be a tax break for the rest of us.

Posted: 9/11/2005 3:56:47 PM EDT

[#22]

Quoted:
Quoted:

You could give all of them a million bucks, and in a year or so, they would be broke and on welfare again, or dead from a drug overdose.

At least they would have a Benz parked in front of their project.

I would have to respectfully disagree.

The Benz would have long since been sold to buy drugs.

Posted: 9/11/2005 3:57:57 PM EDT

[#23]

Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
I hate to say it, but with the current bias, it's not fixable.

We have created a permanant underclass, that expects, nay DEMANDS that they are entitled to a paycheck for doing nothing from the cradle to the grave.

I fear that the America that our forefathers dreamed of then crafted is a thing of the past

echo6

I agree. The funny thing is hearing guys on this board talk about revolution or whatever when they try to take our guns, but the reality is these people would revolt far sooner if we cut off the welfare. Bet on it.
People lament the influence of money in our culture, mainly because they do not understand how it works for bad and good.
What kind of revolution would you see from the former welfare slaves? Certainly none nearly so eloquent and effective as the American Revolution.

Certainly not. Sloppy, criminal behavior on a mass scale and rioting would describe what would happen IMHO. It would be an excuse to riot/rob/rape/burn/assault/victimize whomever the welfare class considered to be their "oppressors" This behavior would continue until they got their checks again.

Posted: 9/11/2005 3:58:46 PM EDT

[#24]

Quoted:
Quoted:
I wish you would concentrate more on how to fix the Illegal Immigrant problem and how to advance the position of our own citizens.

How to advance the position of our citizens is a decision best left to each one of them, wouldn't you say?

So, corporate welfare is more important than social welfare?

Give all the breaks to the richest and let the poorest fend for themselves?

Posted: 9/11/2005 3:59:37 PM EDT

[#25]

Quoted:
the welfare rats will not revolt. new orleans proved that.

I disagree. New Orleans was "relieved" so to speak a matter of days after the hurricane. Given slightly more time the welfare recipients would have rioted IMHO.

Posted: 9/11/2005 4:00:36 PM EDT

[#26]

Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
I wish you would concentrate more on how to fix the Illegal Immigrant problem and how to advance the position of our own citizens.

How to advance the position of our citizens is a decision best left to each one of them, wouldn't you say?

So, corporate welfare is more important than social welfare?

Give all the breaks to the richest and let the poorest fend for themselves?

Thanks.

Anyone that uses the term "corporate welfare" has "outed" themselves.

Thanks, Comrade.

Posted: 9/11/2005 4:06:14 PM EDT

[#27]

Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
I wish you would concentrate more on how to fix the Illegal Immigrant problem and how to advance the position of our own citizens.

How to advance the position of our citizens is a decision best left to each one of them, wouldn't you say?

So, corporate welfare is more important than social welfare?

Give all the breaks to the richest and let the poorest fend for themselves?

Where in the world do you folks come up with your conclusions?

I don't want to give breaks to anybody, beyond what is earned. Isn't that the point: that each man is free to run his life as he chooses, without either oppression or special favors?
I don't like corporate welfare any more than you do, but I figure I understand why it exists. How long do you think the current system of rules and regulations, with the accompanying fines and fees, would last if the corporations didn't get something back from the government? I hazard to say that there would be a corporate revolt, which would consist of simply refusing to comply wiht the rules, if the government demanded they give and receive nothing in return.

Posted: 9/11/2005 4:06:37 PM EDT

[#28]

I say put 'em all to work building the levees.
Keep the project running forever, anyone who wants welfare goes to the levee. Pay them a decent wage too, make them proud of themselves and the good they are doing.
Bulid those levees so fucking big a Cat12 storm couldnt bust them. Build them triple deep and triple high!

Posted: 9/11/2005 4:10:21 PM EDT

[#29]

Quoted:
I say put 'em all to work building the levees.
Keep the project running forever, anyone who wants welfare goes to the levee. Pay them a decent wage too, make them proud of themselves and the good they are doing.
Bulid those levees so fucking big a Cat12 storm couldnt bust them. Build them triple deep and triple high!

What's the average airspeed velocity of a Cat12 hurricane?

Posted: 9/11/2005 4:13:14 PM EDT

[#30]

Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
I wish you would concentrate more on how to fix the Illegal Immigrant problem and how to advance the position of our own citizens.

How to advance the position of our citizens is a decision best left to each one of them, wouldn't you say?

So, corporate welfare is more important than social welfare?

Give all the breaks to the richest and let the poorest fend for themselves?

Want to explain exactly what "corprate welfare" is? Want to thnk about where all your "poorest" would be if the "Rich People" were not paying them to sit home and get their welefare checks?

Schmeg, Do yourself and the rest of us a favor and read "Atlas Shrugged" by Ann Rand. When you finish the book think about what you have just read.

Then think about how our current society relates to the one in the book.

It might just open your eyes.

echo6

Posted: 9/11/2005 4:13:31 PM EDT

[#31]

Quoted:
Quoted:
I say put 'em all to work building the levees.
Keep the project running forever, anyone who wants welfare goes to the levee. Pay them a decent wage too, make them proud of themselves and the good they are doing.
Bulid those levees so fucking big a Cat12 storm couldnt bust them. Build them triple deep and triple high!
What's the average airspeed velocity of a Cat12 hurricane?

Really bad!!!!

Posted: 9/11/2005 4:16:20 PM EDT

[#32]

Here is how "Corprate Welfare" and taxes work in terms everyone should be able to understand

Today's Economic Lesson in Taxation

Let's put tax cuts in terms everyone can understand. Suppose that every day, ten men go out for dinner. The bill for all ten comes to $100. If they paid their bill the way we pay our taxes, it would go something like this:

* The first four men (the poorest) would pay nothing.

* The fifth would pay $1.

* The sixth would pay $3.

* The seventh $7.

* The eighth $12.

* The ninth $18.

* The tenth man (the richest) would pay $59.

So, that's what they decided to do. The ten men ate dinner in the restaurant every day and seemed quite happy with the arrangement, until one day, the owner threw them a curve.

"Since you are all such good customers," he said, "I'm going to reduce the cost of your daily meal by $20." So, now dinner for the ten only cost $80. The group still wanted to pay their bill the way we pay our taxes.

So, the first four men were unaffected. They would still eat for free.

But what about the other six, the paying customers? How could they divvy up the $20 windfall so that everyone would get his 'fair share'?

The six men realized that $20 divided by six is $3.33. But if they subtracted that from everybody's share, then the fifth man and the sixth man would each end up being 'PAID' to eat their meal.

So, the restaurant owner suggested that it would be fair to reduce each man's bill by roughly the same amount, and he proceeded to work out the amounts each should pay.

And so:

* The fifth man, like the first four, now paid nothing (100% savings).

* The sixth now paid $2 instead of $3 (33% savings).

* The seventh now paid $5 instead of $7 (28% savings).

* The eighth now paid $9 instead of $12 (25% savings).

* The ninth now paid $14 instead of $18 (22% savings).

* The tenth now paid $49 instead of $59 (16% savings).

Each of the six was better off than before. And the first four continued to eat for free. But once outside the restaurant, the men began to compare their savings.

"I only got a dollar out of the $20," declared the sixth man. He pointed to the tenth man "but he got $10!"

"Yeah, that's right," exclaimed the fifth man. "I only saved a dollar, too. It's unfair that he got ten times more than me!"

"That's true!!" shouted the seventh man. "Why should he get $10 back when I got only $2? The wealthy get all the breaks!"

"Wait a minute," yelled the first four men in unison. "We didn't get anything at all. The system exploits the poor!"

The nine men surrounded the tenth and beat him up

echo6

Posted: 9/11/2005 4:22:09 PM EDT

[#33]

Quoted:
Here is how "Corprate Welfare" and taxes work in terms everyone should be able to understand

echo6

Good explination, except the first few would actually be paid to eat their dinner (earned income tax credit).

Posted: 9/11/2005 4:24:09 PM EDT

[#34]

Quoted:
Here is how "Corprate Welfare" and taxes work in terms everyone should be able to understand

Today's Economic Lesson in Taxation
<snip>

echo6

And the counterargument is that the rich man TAKES more than the poor one. I see that "logic" even on this site.

Posted: 9/11/2005 4:25:44 PM EDT

[#35]

Quoted:
Quoted:
Here is how "Corprate Welfare" and taxes work in terms everyone should be able to understand

echo6

Good explination, except the first few would actually be paid to eat their dinner (earned income tax credit).

This gives me heartburn. (Because it's true.)

Posted: 9/11/2005 4:31:37 PM EDT

[#36]

Workfare would be the best solution for all able bodied persons.

Posted: 9/11/2005 4:33:40 PM EDT

[#37]

Quoted:
Workfare would be the best solution for all able bodied persons.

I fully agree.

But should it be administered by the Federal Gooberment?

If not, how do we do it?

Posted: 9/11/2005 4:35:28 PM EDT

[#38]

Posted: 9/11/2005 4:49:10 PM EDT

[#39]

Quoted:
I say put 'em all to work building the levees.
Keep the project running forever, anyone who wants welfare goes to the levee. Pay them a decent wage too, make them proud of themselves and the good they are doing.
Bulid those levees so fucking big a Cat12 storm couldnt bust them. Build them triple deep and triple high!

This would work if, and only if, those that still refused to work had their kids permanently and irrevocably taken from them, and allow them to literally starve to death on the street.

Posted: 9/11/2005 4:49:22 PM EDT

[#40]

Quoted:
www.darlington.ac.uk/images/plate.gif

"A Modest Proposal".

Posted: 9/11/2005 4:54:58 PM EDT

[#41]

Quoted:
Quoted:
quick solution? Start a "refugee of truth" test.......

Already rejected that one. They won't fit in the box.

Then get a bigger box!

Posted: 9/11/2005 4:55:52 PM EDT

[#42]

Quoted:
Quoted:
I say put 'em all to work building the levees.
Keep the project running forever, anyone who wants welfare goes to the levee. Pay them a decent wage too, make them proud of themselves and the good they are doing.
Bulid those levees so fucking big a Cat12 storm couldnt bust them. Build them triple deep and triple high!
What's the average airspeed velocity of a Cat12 hurricane?

Atlantic or Pacific tropical cyclone?

Posted: 9/11/2005 4:57:54 PM EDT

[#43]

Quoted:

This would work if, and only if, those that still refused to work had their kids permanently and irrevocably taken from them, and allow them to literally starve to death on the street.

And, therein lies the problem.

Can you imagine the howling of the left as these lazy bums started starving?

It will never happen.

Posted: 9/11/2005 4:59:02 PM EDT

[#44]

Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
I say put 'em all to work building the levees.
Keep the project running forever, anyone who wants welfare goes to the levee. Pay them a decent wage too, make them proud of themselves and the good they are doing.
Bulid those levees so fucking big a Cat12 storm couldnt bust them. Build them triple deep and triple high!
What's the average airspeed velocity of a Cat12 hurricane?

Atlantic or Pacific tropical cyclone?

Ah, a Pythonite!

Posted: 9/11/2005 5:03:34 PM EDT

[#45]

The " Refugee " Problem was always there, way before HK (Hurricane Katrina) showed up. I'm afraid society will never be rid of the welfare class, they're the democrats' cream of the crop voters.

Posted: 9/11/2005 5:06:17 PM EDT

[#46]

Quoted:
www.darlington.ac.uk/images/plate.gif

hmmm hadn't thought of that. i don't know that they would taste that good though.

Posted: 9/11/2005 5:08:20 PM EDT

[#47]

Quoted:
Quoted:
www.darlington.ac.uk/images/plate.gif

hmmm hadn't thought of that. i don't know that they would taste that good though.

Posted: 9/11/2005 5:12:48 PM EDT

[#48]

Quoted:
The " Refugee " Problem was always there, way before HK (Hurricane Katrina) showed up. I'm afraid society will never be rid of the welfare class, they're the democrats' cream of the crop voters.

That is the ultimate irony.

Democrats pretend to "love" the poor.

The truth is that they want to keep them in poverty so that they can exploit them and assure their votes.

Their actions show that they actually "hate" them, and do not truly care for their well-being.