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Posted: 7/2/2002 9:33:52 AM EDT
[#1]
Maybe he just wants to talk toys. Give us a follow up report.
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Posted: 7/2/2002 9:35:08 AM EDT
[#2]
Sorry, but this is pure BS. All your CLEO needs to sign off on is that you are legal to own an NFA item. If this is true you should simply verify your ID and tell him to either have your CLEO sign off or you'll get a writ of mandamus which simply forces him to do his friggin job. Personal interviews are not called for to get a form 4 CLEO signoff. [pyro]
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Posted: 7/2/2002 9:52:08 AM EDT
[#3]
I just went through this awhile back. I meet with the CLEO and he asked if I could come in and talk to him. He asked me why I wanted an M16, and I told him that I wanted one for my collection. I think he just wanted to see what I was like. He wanted to know if I knew the ramifications of using the gun in a improper manner, more specifically, he wanted to know if I knew what I was talking about. I chatted with him for about 10 min, then he signed off on the forms and I was on my way. I would not worry about it.
Edit: He never checked my ID. Which I thought was interesting. |
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Posted: 7/2/2002 10:20:31 AM EDT
[#4]
Quoted: Sorry, but this is pure BS. All your CLEO needs to sign off on is that you are legal to own an NFA item. Yes. It is pure BS. There is no part of the GCA of 1934, or federal regs that mentions a CLEO signoff... this is an ATF MANDATED regulation. It's nice when they can not only create their own regs... but enforce them at the same time. That is why you should all send your donation to The 1934 Group which is suing the ATF to have the CLEO Signoff requirement removed. If this is true you should simply verify your ID and tell him to either have your CLEO sign off or you'll get a writ of mandamus which simply forces him to do his friggin job. Sorry. That won't work. In as much as there is no mention of a CLEO Signoff requirement in the federal code. There is also no regulation that REQUIRES your CLEO to sign the form.... nice how that works isn't it?[rolleyes] My CLEO refused to sign and I ended up forming a non-profit corporation and registering my cans to the corp. This bypassed the need for the CLEO signoff, fingerprints, photo's, etc. I won't delve into the pro's/con's of corp vs. private ownership here. Needless to say it was my last option to obtain Class III toys legally. Personal interviews are not called for to get a form 4 CLEO signoff. [pyro] Again, much agreed. But the CLEO is kind of holding the "magic pen" on this one. If he wants you to hop on one foot and dance like a monkey before he'll sign your form.... well..... Just be friendly, appreciative if he signs your form. Politely dissappointed (and make your dissappointment known) if he won't... remember... in most places... Sheriff's are an ELECTED official. Politely remind him of that. Then... go over his head. Ask the county prosecutor. A trial judge with juridstiction over your area. A state judge. The cheif of the state police. The way the NFA Branch people of the ATF explained it to me, it can be any official who has jurisdiction over where you live and has the power to arrest someone, or have them jailed for more than a year (so no traffic court judges, small claims court judges, etc.) Basically what the ATF wants: An official who can do two things 1) Run a background check on you and make sure you have a clean record; 2) Certify that the photo's and fingerprint cards you are submitting with the Form 4 are really yours. That's all the ATF really wants to know. Try: - City Police Chief - County Sheriff - County Prosecutor - State Police Chief - County Court Judge - Stae Court Judge - State Attorney General If they refuse ask them to formally refuse in writing. Collect these refusals and send them to the ATF. Then, according to federal law, they MUST supply you with a list of other officials who's signature would "be acceptable to the Director of ATF." If no one on the list they provide you with will sign then start asking Federal officials if they will sign. - Director of local FBI Field Office - Director of local US Marshalls Office While the ATF WILL NOT specifically direct you to a federal official that will sign your form. If you go out and obtain the signature of a federal official the ATF MAY (emphasis on MAY) accept that as a CLEO signature. They are not required to accept it but it has been known to work in the past. OK. Enough typing for me.... Good luck! |
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Posted: 7/2/2002 10:39:17 AM EDT
[#5]
Wow! Hey, now. . .
1st, I do appreciate the advice. It is very helpful for others reading like I was, who are in other counties/states where a CLEO signoff is a problem. Fortunatly for me, my county (and Sherrif's Dept) is VERY pro-NFA stuff, and they sign off these things left and right. He said it should take about 10 minuits. He said he'll wanna see my I.D., ask me a couple off the questions that are on the form, and ask me if I'm planning on doing anything unlawful with it. Then he signs, we shake hands, and say "see ya next time." He was very nice, and I look forward to meeting him. I origionally called the county Sherrif, and he refered me to this guy, his LT, whom he says now handles CLOE sign-offs to take the load off him. Both are very nice and proffessional, as well as pro-gun. That's why I voted for teh Sherrif, and why I refeuse to move out of the county. I also know many of the Sherrif Deputies have their own NFA items, as I see them in some of the local gunshops frequently. I found it very interesting though, when I was refered to this guy, I was thinking he would be a paper pusher or something:-). Thanks! -Justin P.S. Maybe info like Darkhelmets could be intered into a FAQ or stick here or in the class III forumn. I have seen many people post abuot not being able to get an CLEO sign-off. I'f I moved a mile east, I'd be in the same boat. |
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Posted: 7/2/2002 11:01:11 AM EDT
[#6]
I too am having problems with a CLEO signoff. I am interested in buying my first class 3 item, I used to live in IL.
I moved to WI, got setteled in and BAM! Walworth county does not allow Class 3. City CLEO will not sign, county sherrif will not sign, it's VERY fustrating! Av. |
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Posted: 7/2/2002 11:34:27 AM EDT
[#7]
I'm told that in Houston, Harris County Texas that no CLEO will sign one.
Anyone in Houston have any luck with someone besides HPD or Harris County Sheriff? I wonder if Constables will sign? I am wondering now if my FFL application will get signed..... |
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Posted: 7/2/2002 11:41:21 AM EDT
[#8]
I say look at it as a chance to interview him.
Ya might have more in common that you think. Congratulation [beer] |
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Posted: 7/2/2002 11:55:10 AM EDT
[#9]
Quoted: Wow! Hey, now. . . 1st, I do appreciate the advice. It is very helpful for others reading like I was, who are in other counties/states where a CLEO signoff is a problem. Fortunatly for me, my county (and Sherrif's Dept) is VERY pro-NFA stuff, and they sign off these things left and right. He said it should take about 10 minuits. He said he'll wanna see my I.D., ask me a couple off the questions that are on the form, and ask me if I'm planning on doing anything unlawful with it. Then he signs, we shake hands, and say "see ya next time." He was very nice, and I look forward to meeting him. I origionally called the county Sherrif, and he refered me to this guy, his LT, whom he says now handles CLOE sign-offs to take the load off him. Both are very nice and proffessional, as well as pro-gun. That's why I voted for teh Sherrif, and why I refeuse to move out of the county. I also know many of the Sherrif Deputies have their own NFA items, as I see them in some of the local gunshops frequently. I found it very interesting though, when I was refered to this guy, I was thinking he would be a paper pusher or something:-). Thanks! -Justin Lucky bastard! Glad to here there are a few good guys in the CLEO position out there. Wish the ones around here were like yours. P.S. Maybe info like Darkhelmets could be intered into a FAQ or stick here or in the class III forumn. I have seen many people post abuot not being able to get an CLEO sign-off. I'f I moved a mile east, I'd be in the same boat. All your NFA Questions answered here: [url]http://www.titleii.com/[/url] and [url]http://www.titleii.com/Bardwell/index.html[/url] Info about the CLEO Signoff Lawsuit: [url]http://www.titleii.com/Bardwell/index-7.html[/url] |
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Posted: 7/2/2002 12:51:01 PM EDT
[#10]
Just wear the body armor and bring a videorecorder to get his reponse to your responses. [;)]
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Posted: 7/2/2002 1:18:56 PM EDT
[#11]
Quoted: All your NFA Questions answered here: [url]http://www.titleii.com/[/url] and [url]http://www.titleii.com/Bardwell/index.html[/url] Info about the CLEO Signoff Lawsuit: [url]http://www.titleii.com/Bardwell/index-7.html[/url] Thanks |
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Posted: 7/2/2002 1:28:22 PM EDT
[#12]
You don't indicate what county you are in, but from your second post, I'll assume it's not Multnomah or Lane. If you're in Coos county, give me a shout, and we'll pop some caps sometime. Lots of class III folks in Oregon....
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