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Posted: 7/19/2008 11:44:39 AM EST
Long story short; we have relatives in town and some of the distant in-law's are coming over. They are Prius-driving, birkenstock bald-in-the-front/ponytail-in-the-back, 50-going-on-60-something hippie throwbacks who are going to come driving their Toyota Prius.

They spend their whole time bashing Republicans on every conceivable issue, so I won't try to enumerate them here.

ANYWAY, I have heard many reasons NOT to buy a Prius, but I need to get them all together with documented proof (no Snopes BS). When they get around to their Prius (lib-tard dick extension) I need something to come back with.

1. No better mileage than many compacts including the Volkswagen diesel Jetta.

2. Toxic manufacturing process of the rechargeable batteries.

3. Electrocution hazard at accident scenes.

Any others would be GREATLY appreciated.
Link Posted: 7/19/2008 11:46:14 AM EST
Overall cost of the service life of the vehicle.
Link Posted: 7/19/2008 11:49:57 AM EST

Originally Posted By ziarifleman:
Overall cost of the service life of the vehicle.


Thanks,

Though they will probably come back with something like justification of the cost for saving energy, "When Barrack becomes president, some people are just going to have to give up their pie so that others can have some."
Link Posted: 7/19/2008 11:51:36 AM EST
Horrific ecological damage from manufacturing foam nickel battery (and shipping it around the world). Mediocre mileage.

Link Posted: 7/19/2008 11:53:38 AM EST
Electrocution hazard to first responders. I did a report on this, I know what I speak.
Link Posted: 7/19/2008 11:54:01 AM EST
[Last Edit: 7/19/2008 11:57:43 AM EST by Canned_Ham]
Well, a lot of the Pious' you see on the road are probably driven by people who sold a paid for car at a horrendous loss. They live four miles from work and think the Pious is worth it to save gas. Yeah, I'm really gonna come out ahead by buying $26K of overhyped car so I can save $20 a week on gas. Sign me up. My $1200 Escort gets within 10 MPG in the city of a Pious, and it's paid for. Wouldn't hurt to throw that in there.

EDIT: There's cars in Eurpoe that can go over 100 MPH and get 70 MPG+ while doing it, and that's using an engine that was developed over 100 years ago to run on peanut oil and coal dust. I'm pretty sure the "carbon footprint" on a super efficient diesel is lower than a Pious when you take into account the battery mining, the battery shipping, and all other related carbon expenses. Diesel is hands down way better than gasoline and I'll be forever pissed that we can't get any of the cool Euro spec diesels here.
Link Posted: 7/19/2008 11:54:20 AM EST
You're going to have a heard time to find something. Prius owners love them, they are reliable and the cost of ownership is no greater. The batteries aren't as bad as they are made out to be and they get the same mileage as the TDI. Using cheaper fuel.
Link Posted: 7/19/2008 11:54:36 AM EST
Aside from cost, I believe it uses more energy to manufacture the Prius, than it does a Civic, or whatever.
Link Posted: 7/19/2008 11:54:39 AM EST
It can't launch Patriot missiles.
It isn't built to last 300,000 miles.
You can't mount a .50 cal to the roof.
It can't ford 30 inches of water.
It probably can't tow for shit.
It probably has crap for payload.
Link Posted: 7/19/2008 11:54:43 AM EST
Interesting that you have already reached a conclusion and are now looking for evidence to back it up. Isn't that backwards?
Link Posted: 7/19/2008 11:58:31 AM EST
Honda has a hybrid car as well, but it looks like any other car so nobody buys it. People buy Piouses because they help announce to the world 'Hey! Look at my environmentally reposible car! Aren't I great?"

That is the real reason people drive Priuses, recycle, etc.
Link Posted: 7/19/2008 11:59:34 AM EST

Originally Posted By JustinOK34:
It can't launch Patriot missiles.
It isn't built to last 300,000 miles.
You can't mount a .50 cal to the roof.
It can't ford 30 inches of water.
It probably can't tow for shit.
It probably has crap for payload.

FTMFW!
Link Posted: 7/19/2008 12:14:42 PM EST

Originally Posted By raven:
Honda has a hybrid car as well, but it looks like any other car so nobody buys it. People buy Piouses because they help announce to the world 'Hey! Look at my environmentally reposible car! Aren't I great?"

That is the real reason people drive Priuses, recycle, etc.


Hondas hybrid gets 5 MPG less and costs three thousand dollars more, and is about 1/3 smaller.


Link Posted: 7/19/2008 12:16:12 PM EST

Originally Posted By Combat_Jack:

Originally Posted By raven:
Honda has a hybrid car as well, but it looks like any other car so nobody buys it. People buy Piouses because they help announce to the world 'Hey! Look at my environmentally reposible car! Aren't I great?"

That is the real reason people drive Priuses, recycle, etc.


Hondas hybrid gets 5 MPG less and costs three thousand dollars more, and is about 1/3 smaller.




Don't harsh my buzz, man
Link Posted: 7/19/2008 12:22:27 PM EST

Originally Posted By Combat_Jack:

Originally Posted By raven:
Honda has a hybrid car as well, but it looks like any other car so nobody buys it. People buy Piouses because they help announce to the world 'Hey! Look at my environmentally reposible car! Aren't I great?"

That is the real reason people drive Priuses, recycle, etc.


Hondas hybrid gets 5 MPG less and costs three thousand dollars more, and is about 1/3 smaller.




Doesn't Honda sell a hybrid civic now?

I'm off to look it up...
Link Posted: 7/19/2008 12:25:28 PM EST
Honda is also developing a new hybrid which looks like the Prius to compete. It should pull down a little over 50 MPG if they do it right, and it is projected to be much less expensive.
Link Posted: 7/19/2008 12:28:13 PM EST

Originally Posted By raven:

Originally Posted By Combat_Jack:

Originally Posted By raven:
Honda has a hybrid car as well, but it looks like any other car so nobody buys it. People buy Piouses because they help announce to the world 'Hey! Look at my environmentally reposible car! Aren't I great?"

That is the real reason people drive Priuses, recycle, etc.


Hondas hybrid gets 5 MPG less and costs three thousand dollars more, and is about 1/3 smaller.




Don't harsh my buzz, man


My brother's FIL has a hybrid Accord in his garage.
Link Posted: 7/19/2008 12:30:23 PM EST
Hit and miss mileage and uglier than a shithouse rat looks are really all you've got going for you.

About the electrocution hazard for first responders - it's a concern, yes, but one so small that it's not really worth mentioning. Hybrid vehicles have redundant safeties that engage in milliseconds to disable the high voltage system in the event of a crash. It's not like high voltage wiring runs all throughout the vehicle either; there's typically one or two HV cables going from the battery to the engine compartment, and they ain't exactly hanging out in the breeze, open and exposed.
Link Posted: 7/19/2008 12:31:16 PM EST
Don't talk politics or religion with extended family. It only leads to problems. Surely you are smart enough to be able to discuss other subjects without being as obvious as talking about the weather. Use sports or history. Everyone likes to talk about old grandmother such-and-such and what life was like in the olden days.
My point is just to avoid the topic of current politics, and especially avoid a convo about cars. People are irrational about cars, just like breeders of multiple children are irrational about that too.
Link Posted: 7/19/2008 12:36:05 PM EST
it has a ghey name
Link Posted: 7/19/2008 12:39:29 PM EST
The money saved at the pump does not offset the increased cost of ownership until 200,000 miles have been reached. And that is at current prices.

You can buy a comparable car for $8,000 less and it gets 15 fewer miles per gallon. Or the cheaper car uses 1700 gallons more over the 200 k mile lifespan. At $4.50 a gallon too. And that does NOT count in the time value of money. $8000 invested for 5 years at 5% APR with a zero end value is worth $151 a month. That will buy 33 gallons at $4.5 a gallon, getting a FREE 1200 miles a month on the cheaper car.

Are they going to keep it for 200,000 miles?

Link Posted: 7/19/2008 12:39:41 PM EST
this is all you need to know about a Prius


when you hear one go by with a man in it, it sounds like this:



IMMMMMMMMMMMM GHHHHHHHHHHHHEEEEEEEEEYYYYYYYYYYYYY
Link Posted: 7/19/2008 12:40:39 PM EST
My .02 - just go after their lib-tard ideas instead of their car. LOTS more ammo there, if you want a love-vest with the relatives. So what if they buy the car they want, that's capitalism. Just ask them how much of their pay-check they are going to be giving up when Obama makes them buy everyone else a Prius, and how happy will they be about it.

jd1
Link Posted: 7/19/2008 12:42:55 PM EST

Originally Posted By Keith_J:
The money saved at the pump does not offset the increased cost of ownership until 200,000 miles have been reached. And that is at current prices.

You can buy a comparable car for $8,000 less and it gets 15 fewer miles per gallon. Or the cheaper car uses 1700 gallons more over the 200 k mile lifespan. At $4.50 a gallon too. And that does NOT count in the time value of money. $8000 invested for 5 years at 5% APR with a zero end value is worth $151 a month. That will buy 33 gallons at $4.5 a gallon, getting a FREE 1200 miles a month on the cheaper car.

Are they going to keep it for 200,000 miles?



No.

A Corolla or Civic is not a comparable car. They are smaller and don't have HID headlights, navigation systems, etc.

The Chevy Malibu has the same interior space as the Prius, and starts at 3,000 dollars less than a base Prius.

You're a smart guy Keith, you can do better than that.
Link Posted: 7/19/2008 12:45:49 PM EST
[Last Edit: 7/19/2008 4:05:54 PM EST by 762DM]
Link Posted: 7/19/2008 2:25:28 PM EST

Originally Posted By KUpolo:
Interesting that you have already reached a conclusion and are now looking for evidence to back it up. Isn't that backwards?




It's not backwards at all. If one would read the original post then they would know that I already have 3 solid reasons that completely negate the car as good for one's individual economy or the "environment". I am asking for MORE information from the hivemind because of the immense power of thousands of intelligent minds in addition to my own.

Thanks so much for crapping in my thread. Please wipe your ass on the way out.
Link Posted: 7/19/2008 2:29:58 PM EST
I parked my F150 4x4 next to a Pius at the hardware store yesterday. I didn't notice it until I was getting back in my truck. I don't know why, but I laughed out loud. The owners of these make me laugh for some reason. They pay a shitload of money for them, more than sitcker and the gas mileage savings will probably never recover the difference over the life of the car.
Link Posted: 7/19/2008 2:31:33 PM EST
[Last Edit: 7/19/2008 2:33:45 PM EST by PhilipPeake]
See HERE
Link Posted: 7/19/2008 2:35:41 PM EST

Originally Posted By PhilipPeake:
See HERE


Link Posted: 7/19/2008 2:37:40 PM EST
As others have mentioned, the biggest thing is driving the damn thing long enough to recoup the money that could have been spent for fuel driving a conventional gasoline powered vehicle.

It's akin to buying a motorcycle with the idea that you're saving fuel. Yes, you're saving some, but you're spending a lot and it's gonna take a while (if ever) to break even.
Link Posted: 7/19/2008 2:41:58 PM EST

Originally Posted By PhilipPeake:
See HERE

Beat me to it
Link Posted: 7/19/2008 2:43:41 PM EST
[Last Edit: 7/19/2008 2:46:50 PM EST by TearsInRain]

Originally Posted By pale_pony:
Long story short; we have relatives in town and some of the distant in-law's are coming over. They are Prius-driving, birkenstock bald-in-the-front/ponytail-in-the-back, 50-going-on-60-something hippie throwbacks who are going to come driving their Toyota Prius.

They spend their whole time bashing Republicans on every conceivable issue, so I won't try to enumerate them here.

ANYWAY, I have heard many reasons NOT to buy a Prius, but I need to get them all together with documented proof (no Snopes BS). When they get around to their Prius (lib-tard dick extension) I need something to come back with.

1. No better mileage than many compacts including the Volkswagen diesel Jetta.

2. Toxic manufacturing process of the rechargeable batteries.

3. Electrocution hazard at accident scenes.

Any others would be GREATLY appreciated.


Bash them, not their vehicle. The Prius isn't the end-all car but it's still a great value.

You could just rag on them for even HAVING a car
Link Posted: 7/19/2008 2:46:17 PM EST

Originally Posted By Tim_the_enchanter:
I parked my F150 4x4 next to a Pius at the hardware store yesterday. I didn't notice it until I was getting back in my truck. I don't know why, but I laughed out loud. The owners of these make me laugh for some reason. They pay a shitload of money for them, more than sitcker and the gas mileage savings will probably never recover the difference over the life of the car.


At today's gas prices, they recover the sticker-loss after 1.5 years...
Link Posted: 7/19/2008 2:46:47 PM EST

Originally Posted By Combat_Jack:

Originally Posted By Keith_J:
The money saved at the pump does not offset the increased cost of ownership until 200,000 miles have been reached. And that is at current prices.

You can buy a comparable car for $8,000 less and it gets 15 fewer miles per gallon. Or the cheaper car uses 1700 gallons more over the 200 k mile lifespan. At $4.50 a gallon too. And that does NOT count in the time value of money. $8000 invested for 5 years at 5% APR with a zero end value is worth $151 a month. That will buy 33 gallons at $4.5 a gallon, getting a FREE 1200 miles a month on the cheaper car.

Are they going to keep it for 200,000 miles?



No.

A Corolla or Civic is not a comparable car. They are smaller and don't have HID headlights, navigation systems, etc.

The Chevy Malibu has the same interior space as the Prius, and starts at 3,000 dollars less than a base Prius.

You're a smart guy Keith, you can do better than that.


Did I make that claim?

When Nissan licensed the Synergy drive from Toyota and put it in the Altima, it improved the highway mileage by 1 mile per gallon. Yeah, city went up considerably as this is natural.
Link Posted: 7/19/2008 2:49:48 PM EST

Originally Posted By Keith_J:

Originally Posted By Combat_Jack:

Originally Posted By Keith_J:
The money saved at the pump does not offset the increased cost of ownership until 200,000 miles have been reached. And that is at current prices.

You can buy a comparable car for $8,000 less and it gets 15 fewer miles per gallon. Or the cheaper car uses 1700 gallons more over the 200 k mile lifespan. At $4.50 a gallon too. And that does NOT count in the time value of money. $8000 invested for 5 years at 5% APR with a zero end value is worth $151 a month. That will buy 33 gallons at $4.5 a gallon, getting a FREE 1200 miles a month on the cheaper car.

Are they going to keep it for 200,000 miles?



No.

A Corolla or Civic is not a comparable car. They are smaller and don't have HID headlights, navigation systems, etc.

The Chevy Malibu has the same interior space as the Prius, and starts at 3,000 dollars less than a base Prius.

You're a smart guy Keith, you can do better than that.


Did I make that claim?

When Nissan licensed the Synergy drive from Toyota and put it in the Altima, it improved the highway mileage by 1 mile per gallon. Yeah, city went up considerably as this is natural.


So what is the "comparable car" that costs $8K less?
Link Posted: 7/19/2008 2:53:49 PM EST

Originally Posted By Combat_Jack:

Originally Posted By Keith_J:
The money saved at the pump does not offset the increased cost of ownership until 200,000 miles have been reached. And that is at current prices.

You can buy a comparable car for $8,000 less and it gets 15 fewer miles per gallon. Or the cheaper car uses 1700 gallons more over the 200 k mile lifespan. At $4.50 a gallon too. And that does NOT count in the time value of money. $8000 invested for 5 years at 5% APR with a zero end value is worth $151 a month. That will buy 33 gallons at $4.5 a gallon, getting a FREE 1200 miles a month on the cheaper car.

Are they going to keep it for 200,000 miles?



No.

A Corolla or Civic is not a comparable car. They are smaller and don't have HID headlights, navigation systems, etc.

The Chevy Malibu has the same interior space as the Prius, and starts at 3,000 dollars less than a base Prius.

You're a smart guy Keith, you can do better than that.


The HID and Nav systems are not standard on the Prius, they are part of a package, and no one is going to miss the 4 cuft difference between the Corolla and Prius or the Focus and the Prius.

Also, Keith is pointing out that buying the Prius for economic reasons does not compute, and things like the HID and Nav systems do not factor in to that equation. That and no one buys the Prius for those reasons. IF it is a necessity to get them just about any car can be retroed for around $1k.
Link Posted: 7/19/2008 3:03:58 PM EST

Originally Posted By TearsInRain:

Originally Posted By Tim_the_enchanter:
I parked my F150 4x4 next to a Pius at the hardware store yesterday. I didn't notice it until I was getting back in my truck. I don't know why, but I laughed out loud. The owners of these make me laugh for some reason. They pay a shitload of money for them, more than sitcker and the gas mileage savings will probably never recover the difference over the life of the car.


At today's gas prices, they recover the sticker-loss after 1.5 years...


So I replace my 96 Tacoma with a Prius and I break even when? Beyond the usable life of the Prius?

Link Posted: 7/19/2008 3:18:45 PM EST
[Last Edit: 7/19/2008 4:10:02 PM EST by AeroE]
Link Posted: 7/19/2008 3:32:40 PM EST

Originally Posted By IAMLEGEND:

Originally Posted By TearsInRain:

Originally Posted By Tim_the_enchanter:
I parked my F150 4x4 next to a Pius at the hardware store yesterday. I didn't notice it until I was getting back in my truck. I don't know why, but I laughed out loud. The owners of these make me laugh for some reason. They pay a shitload of money for them, more than sitcker and the gas mileage savings will probably never recover the difference over the life of the car.


At today's gas prices, they recover the sticker-loss after 1.5 years...


So I replace my 96 Tacoma with a Prius and I break even when? Beyond the usable life of the Prius?



Depending on how much you drive and how long you intend to keep the vehicle, you should break even after 1.5 years.

Not all hybrids are like that though. A Saturn hybrid would take like 20-something years to break even .

Link Posted: 7/19/2008 3:35:06 PM EST

Originally Posted By pale_pony:

Originally Posted By PhilipPeake:
See HERE




I like the way he says Buh-Boon! LOL
Link Posted: 7/19/2008 3:42:18 PM EST

Originally Posted By TearsInRain:

Originally Posted By IAMLEGEND:

Originally Posted By TearsInRain:

Originally Posted By Tim_the_enchanter:
I parked my F150 4x4 next to a Pius at the hardware store yesterday. I didn't notice it until I was getting back in my truck. I don't know why, but I laughed out loud. The owners of these make me laugh for some reason. They pay a shitload of money for them, more than sitcker and the gas mileage savings will probably never recover the difference over the life of the car.


At today's gas prices, they recover the sticker-loss after 1.5 years...


So I replace my 96 Tacoma with a Prius and I break even when? Beyond the usable life of the Prius?



Depending on how much you drive and how long you intend to keep the vehicle, you should break even after 1.5 years.

Not all hybrids are like that though. A Saturn hybrid would take like 20-something years to break even .



You're telling me that if I took a truck, that I assume is paid for considering the age, that get anywhere from 17-26 MPG depending on engine, and I dump that and spend $26K on a Prius, I'll break even in a year and a half? What are you smoking and where can I get some? Even if I got $6K for the truck and put it towards the Prius, it'll be a lot longer than a year and a half. If my commute was to the moon and back, I could see that, but at an average of 12K miles a year, the difference between 25 MPG and 45 MPG isn't that much, in a monetary sense. $1064 a year for fuel compared to $1900 a year. At that rate, break even is 28 years, and that's assuming the Prius doesn't need insurance or maintenance. I think you fail at math.
Link Posted: 7/19/2008 3:50:06 PM EST

Originally Posted By Canned_Ham:

Originally Posted By TearsInRain:

Originally Posted By IAMLEGEND:

Originally Posted By TearsInRain:

Originally Posted By Tim_the_enchanter:
I parked my F150 4x4 next to a Pius at the hardware store yesterday. I didn't notice it until I was getting back in my truck. I don't know why, but I laughed out loud. The owners of these make me laugh for some reason. They pay a shitload of money for them, more than sitcker and the gas mileage savings will probably never recover the difference over the life of the car.


At today's gas prices, they recover the sticker-loss after 1.5 years...


So I replace my 96 Tacoma with a Prius and I break even when? Beyond the usable life of the Prius?



Depending on how much you drive and how long you intend to keep the vehicle, you should break even after 1.5 years.

Not all hybrids are like that though. A Saturn hybrid would take like 20-something years to break even .



You're telling me that if I took a truck, that I assume is paid for considering the age, that get anywhere from 17-26 MPG depending on engine, and I dump that and spend $26K on a Prius, I'll break even in a year and a half? What are you smoking and where can I get some? Even if I got $6K for the truck and put it towards the Prius, it'll be a lot longer than a year and a half. If my commute was to the moon and back, I could see that, but at an average of 12K miles a year, the difference between 25 MPG and 45 MPG isn't that much, in a monetary sense. $1064 a year for fuel compared to $1900 a year. At that rate, break even is 28 years, and that's assuming the Prius doesn't need insurance or maintenance. I think you fail at math.


Exactly. You fucking nailed it.

The Prius will not last long enough to reach the hypothetical break even point.

Besides...reduce, reuse, recycle...I'm better off getting another 12 years out of the Tacoma considering all the energy, materials, pollution etc that went into making it. Buying a trendy new vehicle in an attempt to absolve my guilty conscience is ecologically unsound.

Link Posted: 7/19/2008 3:51:35 PM EST
I the famous words of a comedian the sound it makes as it drives by, "IMMMMMMMMMMMMMMM GAY"
Link Posted: 7/19/2008 3:56:56 PM EST
what y'all doing the cost benefit analysis fail to account for is the fact that, by virtue of using less fuel, the owner is doing their part (albeit trivial) to reduce demand.

I don't thenk many people buy them for the direct economic benefit.
Link Posted: 7/19/2008 3:57:45 PM EST
[Last Edit: 7/19/2008 3:59:40 PM EST by TearsInRain]

Originally Posted By Canned_Ham:

Originally Posted By TearsInRain:

Originally Posted By IAMLEGEND:

Originally Posted By TearsInRain:

Originally Posted By Tim_the_enchanter:
I parked my F150 4x4 next to a Pius at the hardware store yesterday. I didn't notice it until I was getting back in my truck. I don't know why, but I laughed out loud. The owners of these make me laugh for some reason. They pay a shitload of money for them, more than sitcker and the gas mileage savings will probably never recover the difference over the life of the car.


At today's gas prices, they recover the sticker-loss after 1.5 years...


So I replace my 96 Tacoma with a Prius and I break even when? Beyond the usable life of the Prius?



Depending on how much you drive and how long you intend to keep the vehicle, you should break even after 1.5 years.

Not all hybrids are like that though. A Saturn hybrid would take like 20-something years to break even .



You're telling me that if I took a truck, that I assume is paid for considering the age, that get anywhere from 17-26 MPG depending on engine, and I dump that and spend $26K on a Prius, I'll break even in a year and a half? What are you smoking and where can I get some? Even if I got $6K for the truck and put it towards the Prius, it'll be a lot longer than a year and a half. If my commute was to the moon and back, I could see that, but at an average of 12K miles a year, the difference between 25 MPG and 45 MPG isn't that much, in a monetary sense. $1064 a year for fuel compared to $1900 a year. At that rate, break even is 28 years, and that's assuming the Prius doesn't need insurance or maintenance. I think you fail at math.


I think your equation is flawed. When I say "break even" I'm talking about the difference in price between a hybrid and a similar, non-hybrid vehicle. In that case, yes, you will make up the higher cost of the hybrid , vs. the non-hybrid, in 1.5-2 years, assuming you get a quality hybrid (i.e. Toyota/Honda). Breaking even any other way is impossible with ANY vehicle, except maybe a bike.
Link Posted: 7/19/2008 3:58:00 PM EST

Originally Posted By IAMLEGEND:
Exactly. You fucking nailed it.

The Prius will not last long enough to reach the hypothetical break even point.

Besides...reduce, reuse, recycle...I'm better off getting another 12 years out of the Tacoma considering all the energy, materials, pollution etc that went into making it. Buying a trendy new vehicle in an attempt to absolve my guilty conscience is ecologically unsound.



That's something else to consider. I love how all those self righteous green fucks in a Prius think they're holier than thou and they're enlightened and aware, but the amount of energy, none of which is "green" and materials, not much green there either, that go into a Prius is staggering. Just the batteries get sent around the world a couple of times before they wind up on an American road. Not to mention the pristine nature preserve(sarcasm) where the nickel is mined from. The Prius is a joke and I can double the MPG with a diesel, an engine that's been around a hundred years and was designed to run on peanut oil and coal dust, and my carbon footprint would still be smaller.
Link Posted: 7/19/2008 3:59:46 PM EST

Originally Posted By TearsInRain:

Originally Posted By Canned_Ham:

Originally Posted By TearsInRain:

Originally Posted By IAMLEGEND:

Originally Posted By TearsInRain:

Originally Posted By Tim_the_enchanter:
I parked my F150 4x4 next to a Pius at the hardware store yesterday. I didn't notice it until I was getting back in my truck. I don't know why, but I laughed out loud. The owners of these make me laugh for some reason. They pay a shitload of money for them, more than sitcker and the gas mileage savings will probably never recover the difference over the life of the car.


At today's gas prices, they recover the sticker-loss after 1.5 years...


So I replace my 96 Tacoma with a Prius and I break even when? Beyond the usable life of the Prius?



Depending on how much you drive and how long you intend to keep the vehicle, you should break even after 1.5 years.

Not all hybrids are like that though. A Saturn hybrid would take like 20-something years to break even .



You're telling me that if I took a truck, that I assume is paid for considering the age, that get anywhere from 17-26 MPG depending on engine, and I dump that and spend $26K on a Prius, I'll break even in a year and a half? What are you smoking and where can I get some? Even if I got $6K for the truck and put it towards the Prius, it'll be a lot longer than a year and a half. If my commute was to the moon and back, I could see that, but at an average of 12K miles a year, the difference between 25 MPG and 45 MPG isn't that much, in a monetary sense. $1064 a year for fuel compared to $1900 a year. At that rate, break even is 28 years, and that's assuming the Prius doesn't need insurance or maintenance. I think you fail at math.


I think your equation is flawed. When I say "break even" I'm talking about the difference in price between a hybrid and a similar, non-hybrid vehicle. Breaking even any other way is impossible with ANY vehicle, except maybe a bike.


So it beats a VW TDI?


Link Posted: 7/19/2008 4:02:07 PM EST
[Last Edit: 7/19/2008 4:07:11 PM EST by TearsInRain]

Originally Posted By IAMLEGEND:

Originally Posted By TearsInRain:

Originally Posted By Canned_Ham:

Originally Posted By TearsInRain:

Originally Posted By IAMLEGEND:

Originally Posted By TearsInRain:

Originally Posted By Tim_the_enchanter:
I parked my F150 4x4 next to a Pius at the hardware store yesterday. I didn't notice it until I was getting back in my truck. I don't know why, but I laughed out loud. The owners of these make me laugh for some reason. They pay a shitload of money for them, more than sitcker and the gas mileage savings will probably never recover the difference over the life of the car.


At today's gas prices, they recover the sticker-loss after 1.5 years...


So I replace my 96 Tacoma with a Prius and I break even when? Beyond the usable life of the Prius?



Depending on how much you drive and how long you intend to keep the vehicle, you should break even after 1.5 years.

Not all hybrids are like that though. A Saturn hybrid would take like 20-something years to break even .



You're telling me that if I took a truck, that I assume is paid for considering the age, that get anywhere from 17-26 MPG depending on engine, and I dump that and spend $26K on a Prius, I'll break even in a year and a half? What are you smoking and where can I get some? Even if I got $6K for the truck and put it towards the Prius, it'll be a lot longer than a year and a half. If my commute was to the moon and back, I could see that, but at an average of 12K miles a year, the difference between 25 MPG and 45 MPG isn't that much, in a monetary sense. $1064 a year for fuel compared to $1900 a year. At that rate, break even is 28 years, and that's assuming the Prius doesn't need insurance or maintenance. I think you fail at math.


I think your equation is flawed. When I say "break even" I'm talking about the difference in price between a hybrid and a similar, non-hybrid vehicle. Breaking even any other way is impossible with ANY vehicle, except maybe a bike.


So it beats a VW TDI?




If you'll bother to read my earlier post, you'll note I didn't say it was the end-all car. However, it's not the epitomy-of-stupidity that you are trying to force it to be.

Edit: I'm ignorant of the price difference between the two, but if you're just looking at MPG, it depends on how you drive..
Link Posted: 7/19/2008 4:04:36 PM EST
[Last Edit: 7/19/2008 4:05:35 PM EST by IAMLEGEND]

Originally Posted By TearsInRain:

Originally Posted By IAMLEGEND:

Originally Posted By TearsInRain:
...


So it beats a VW TDI?




If you'll bother to read my earlier post, you'll note I didn't say it was the end-all car. However, it's not the epitomy-of-stupidity that you are trying to force it to be.


Depends whether or not you include the ecological damage the foam nickel battery does (as I mentioned earlier).

Link Posted: 7/19/2008 4:05:27 PM EST

Originally Posted By Keith_J:

Originally Posted By Combat_Jack:

Originally Posted By Keith_J:
The money saved at the pump does not offset the increased cost of ownership until 200,000 miles have been reached. And that is at current prices.

You can buy a comparable car for $8,000 less and it gets 15 fewer miles per gallon. Or the cheaper car uses 1700 gallons more over the 200 k mile lifespan. At $4.50 a gallon too. And that does NOT count in the time value of money. $8000 invested for 5 years at 5% APR with a zero end value is worth $151 a month. That will buy 33 gallons at $4.5 a gallon, getting a FREE 1200 miles a month on the cheaper car.

Are they going to keep it for 200,000 miles?



No.

A Corolla or Civic is not a comparable car. They are smaller and don't have HID headlights, navigation systems, etc.

The Chevy Malibu has the same interior space as the Prius, and starts at 3,000 dollars less than a base Prius.

You're a smart guy Keith, you can do better than that.


Did I make that claim?

When Nissan licensed the Synergy drive from Toyota and put it in the Altima, it improved the highway mileage by 1 mile per gallon. Yeah, city went up considerably as this is natural.


What car are you comparing it to? The Chevy Aveo is about 10,000 dollars cheaper than my Corolla. But that really isn't a savings. Shit, a Ruckus is cheaper and gets better mileage...
Link Posted: 7/19/2008 4:06:50 PM EST

Originally Posted By TearsInRain:
I think your equation is flawed. When I say "break even" I'm talking about the difference in price between a hybrid and a similar, non-hybrid vehicle. Breaking even any other way is impossible with ANY vehicle, except maybe a bike.


Okay, I'll play that game too. I'd say the 2008 Malibu is comparable to the Prius, in size, class, etc. The Malibu MSRP is about $19K. Prius is selling for about $26K. The Malibu with the 3.5L is rated at 29 MPG highway. A Prius will do about 45 MPg on the highway. 12K miles a year with gas at $4 a gallon. Malibu- $1655 a year for fuel. Prius, $1066. The Prius will save you a whopping $49 a month on fuel. By spending $7K more on the Prius, it'll take you 11 years to recoup the difference. That's a far cry from 1.5, sir. Again, you fail. The Prius is a loser, in every sense of the word.
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